Non winnable situations are a pain...

Started by Auriodk, July 27, 2016, 08:24:30 AM

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Mese

Since when was Rimworld fair :)

For an easier game play Phoebe basebuilder

Listen1

Yeah, I changed my mind, I would add an acid rain that could be preventable, but keep the blight because "This is Rimworld, and that's why."

I like being able to control stuff, but some thing should just kick you in the nuts while you are down.

Zombra

#17
Quote from: Flying Rockbass on July 29, 2016, 08:22:50 AMI have no problem on the tales of hardship, I enjoy this challange. But the way things happened, I was left powerless, and this is not a good gaming experience.

Well, yeah, that's the thing with procedural escalation I guess.  The place where it quote unquote "should" stop is going to be different for every player.  For some of us the six hives would have been enough of a story all by itself.  I'm sure there a few out there who could somehow have survived the melee raid at the end.  You certainly made it farther than I could have ... and I certainly would have felt "powerless" once the tribal raid hit after the bugs and fire mortars ... but you proved it wasn't unwinnable yet, not for you.

I guess what I'm saying is: that powerless feeling isn't great, but it's a necessary risk in a game with this kind of structure.  Tynan has already provided 15 different difficulty settings; it's up to us to feel out which one is right for the playthrough we want.

Quote from: ThiIsMe007 on July 29, 2016, 12:18:42 PMSome players probably will object ("dumbing down", "making it too easy", etc.), and that is when the storyteller feature could chime in, making such random one-line events exclusive to Randy.

No exclusive "Randy Only" content please.   :(

ThiIsMe007

#18
Quote from: Zombra on July 29, 2016, 02:22:07 PMNo exclusive "Randy Only" content please.   :(

Why not ?

As long as all "random one-line events" can be modded out, I would be content too.

Quote from: Mese on July 29, 2016, 12:56:51 PM
Since when was Rimworld fair :)

For an easier game play Phoebe basebuilder

Except that I would argue that Phoebe is probably the most challenging mode (once you're out of your first year), since she limits your colonists to the lowest number.

Quote from: Flying Rockbass on July 29, 2016, 01:05:40 PMI like being able to control stuff, but some thing should just kick you in the nuts while you are down.

That is cool, except that here also I would like to argue that where you see difficulty and challenge, I see non-sense and waste of time.

If I had to draw a metaphore, I would pick a general who fights an opponent against terrible odds (Germans in 1944, Napoleon in 1815, Lee during the Civil War). (side note : I love to play such games, in the position of the "underdogs").

A messager (a random "one-line" event) that makes the general suddenly aware that his whole left flank just disappeared into thin air, because "Alienz!", does not add more challenge to the situation, and certainly does not become suddenly more fun to play out for me, than a spy that warns the general of impending reinforcements to the right flank of my enemy on the next morning.

At least, as player, in the latter situation, I get to keep some agency (the general can change tactics, abandon the left flank to seek a better result elsewhere, mine or scorch the whole the left flank to leave nothing of value to the enemy, etc.), and the challenge remains the same in the end.

By extension, a game that relies heavily on throwing a couple of dice to "challenge" the player is not an interesting game to me. I might as well pull a dumb lever for hours at a casino instead of playing Rimworld.

Zombra

Quote from: ThiIsMe007 on July 29, 2016, 02:27:30 PM
Quote from: Zombra on July 29, 2016, 02:22:07 PMNo exclusive "Randy Only" content please.   :(
Why not ?

Don't take game content away from the rest of us just because you don't like certain events.

Quote from: ThiIsMe007 on July 29, 2016, 02:27:30 PMAs long as all "random one-line events" can be modded out, I would be content too.

I'm sure they can.

ThiIsMe007

Quote from: Zombra on July 29, 2016, 02:51:32 PM
Quote from: ThiIsMe007 on July 29, 2016, 02:27:30 PMAs long as all "random one-line events" can be modded out, I would be content too.

I'm sure they can.

If that's the case, it's all cool.

You play the game how you enjoy it best, and I play the game how I enjoy it best.

juanval

#21
Some players like me, like to see that their efforts are not in vain. It's frustrating when you play correctly and you know you are going to fail or you are very far from the happy end.

Rimworld is one of the best games I've played, but it would be nice to see other winnable conditions instead of only building the spaceship.

A mid-winnable condition could be to buy a passage (from a space trader) to one pawn in order that he can return to his homeland.
Another winnable condition could be to create a way to establish comunications to the homeland or another planet in order to wait for a ship that can rescue some of the colonists.

What do you think?


Zombra

#22
Quote from: juanval on July 30, 2016, 11:14:56 AMRimworld is one of the best games I've played, but it would be nice to see other winnable conditions instead of only building the spaceship.
What do you think?

I would definitely love to be able to set victory conditions.  There have been quite a few suggestions on this.  I know we can set conditions in our heads and just stop playing if we succeed at whatever we wanted, but there's something about seeing the end credits that makes it feel "real".

We can set our game start parameters (which is fantastic by the way); why not set end game parameters as well?