Ice Shelf? really the Hardest?

[RemingtonRyder]

I think one of the interesting things about the ice sheet is that it takes much longer to travel across the terrain.

You can't just go stripping and looting every single corpse, because by the time colonists have made a few trips, the stuff which is still out there can deteriorate to the point of not being worth hauling.

Injuries or ailments which affect movement are more limiting on the ice sheet, because the colonist is slowed to a crawl.

Resources which might have been easy to gather in other biomes take much longer to haul from other parts of the map.

[Kaballah]

-Outside of very early game few people use trees.  And regardless of where you land you get starting wood which does a fair amount for initial building supplies.  Wood is simply a junk material, even in forest maps everyone switches to stone once they can.

- it's a really quick to construct 100% speed flooring material and a very fast construction material for all other purposes
- it makes doors that open the fastest (120% iirc, vs 100% for steel)
- it makes beds that provide the most rest in the shortest time (better than steel)
- it's a quicker production material for sculpture

I mean whatever, write it off, I don't know how Tynan can make wood feel more valuable than it already is.

-Many people do not bother with hunting because of the time cost, and yea you don't have animals for emergency food source but that's normally only a very early game problem.

If you do not have meat then you can only ever make simple meals and a lot of labor and time is required to farm, unless you're OK with the massive mood penalty for cannibalism.  Also leather is a good resource whether for trade or for using for your own colonists.  Again I don't see how you can just write off animals, they have huge value.  How does not having these things make ice sheet easier?

[RickyMartini]

How does not having these things make ice sheet easier?

Now that you mention it, it's even worse. No leather, other meals than simple meals, no comfy beds and nice construction material.

[Kaballah]

I mean you absolutely can survive and even make a very strong colony, but if you play on the seriously cold maps at all and then go back to any other biome with farmable soil, wood, animals and whatever - you think those warm maps are harder? seriously?

[keylocke]

Those are some really edgy arguments to reason with, none of that wouldn't be possible in other biomes too.

If indoor fighting is so beneficial you can do this in every other biome too. Jesus christ.

no. i'm just pointing out the difference in battles in warm maps vs cold maps.

ie : in warm maps, it's easy to get large colonies and accumulate large wealth, which in turn skyrockets the challenge rating.

in cold biomes, fighting large battles outdoors is practically impossible, compared to warm biomes. large open field battles for large colonies tend to be the norm. as compared to cold biomes where indoor fighting is the norm.

which means, having superior melee for cold biomes is the best tactical choice. same thing does not apply to warm biomes.

[keylocke]

I mean you absolutely can survive and even make a very strong colony, but if you play on the seriously cold maps at all and then go back to any other biome with farmable soil, wood, animals and whatever - you think those warm maps are harder? seriously?

well, the main challenge for cold biomes is logistics. (particularly at the early game) but if you use mods like EDB prep carefully, that challenge for early startup can be further downgraded by er... preparing carefully..

when it comes to battles, the harsh weather usually does the killing, plus hypothermia defensive strategies are more enhanced in cold biomes. of course the player may choose NOT to use those things and just fight indoors. but then, as i said, melee is king indoors. just wait for a raider to get distracted, send a couple of swordsmen to hack them dead, rinse and repeat. the only real problem is fire.

of course there's also the option of making a traditional killbox. 

anyways, i'm curious about your tactics in fighting raiders. most i hear about ice shelfs are about logistics.. not enough stories about battles.

[Kaballah]

Having both your legs amputated is really an advantage because you save money on shoes!

in cold biomes, fighting large battles outdoors is practically impossible, compared to warm biomes. large open field battles for large colonies tend to be the norm. as compared to cold biomes where indoor fighting is the norm.

This is complete nonsense.  I guess if you carefully build an indoor fighting room that supports melee and for some reason doesn't support ranged?   Why would you do this, why not just build some sandbags or whatever in this hypothetical indoor battlefield, or why not just go outside (briefly) and then come back in?  I take it your method is having a door held open until the invaders are inside some large heated space (which is now cold because the door is open) and then ordering a dude to close the door and then having your melee dudes attack?  Is everyone riding a unicycle and juggling at the same time?  Why not have a dozen dudes step outside a door, shoot a bit and then ok we can go back inside?

I dunno it sounds like you don't actually play on ice sheet so maybe you should.

[keylocke]

indoor fighting room.. like what? 12x12?

that size of room, burst fire weapons might be good, at least until a brawler rushes in and forces your to go melee or accidentally friendly fire.

go and fight outside? pop out and pop back in on a -140c winter against 50+ raiders with doomsday rockets? are you seriously kidding me? lolwut?

i'd like to see you fight large prolonged outdoor battles in the middle of winter on an ice shelf. without mods. lel.

edit :

point is, hypothermia is a logistical challenge, yes. however, hypothermia is also an exploit.

(players don't go "outside" in the middle of winter on an ice shelf to fight against 50+ raiders. instead, they'll bunker inside and let most of the enemies die from hypothermia and then slowly pick-off the weakened ones one at a time)

this is what i meant about exploitative, which is why i agree with the OP.

not that i really consider ice shelfs as "bad". i just think it's overrated.

[Kaballah]

Ok!

[Menuhin]

I think one of the interesting things about the ice sheet is that it takes much longer to travel across the terrain.

I agree that is an interesting thing about ice sheet, how it is more confining on the colony then what one may initially think.  However I don't think this is necessarily something that increases difficulty, as the slower movement affects attackers also.  All in all i think Ice Sheet mostly just encourages you to turtle, which is somewhat funny since Tynan has put in a lot of things to try and stop people from holing up.

*snip*
this is what i meant about exploitative, which is why i agree with the OP.

What he said, its not that ice shelf is easy mode, or not fun to play, or presents no challenges.  Its more that sometimes the difficulty of ice shelf biome is exaggerated.

[Kruisboog]

Just finished an ice sheet that was listed as -95C on the worldmap on casandra-rough.
Can say that the beginning is hard, but once you get setup it's very doable. Some things are even easier on ice sheet. Like sieges during winter time don't do anything because the raiders die before they can shoot shells. Same goes for sappers.

This is the base i ended up with:

[Sorenzo]

I don't find cold biomes to be extremely hard, but I think the OP is being silly when he says meat and trees aren't useful.

Stonecutting takes a hell of a lot more time than grabbing a few trees. And assuming you don't hunt squirrels, hunting is a fast source of food (which gives a happiness bonus) and leather for durable clothing and for selling.

Also, farming takes a lot more resources on cold maps since you have to do it indoors (or spend more time on it during summer).

All that said, I don't disagree that some desert maps can be harder.

And I also tend to think farming is a little overpowered right now... I produce so much corn in the first two months of a game that it lasts two years.

[Axelios]

That's a lot of mountain.

And a lot of corn.

Mod idea: corn mountain.
You have to mine to eat.

[lord rabies]

Last ice biome I played on hardest (randy) I had plenty of raiders in parkas.
Don't they always spawn with parkas?

How do they freeze to death before the siege? Never seen that happen even.

[Kruisboog]

You have to find an ice shelf that goes below -90C or something. Raiders won't survive that.