Its rare, but I have lost people due to hunger/darkness during a solar flare day. Since there is NOTHING I can do about that, it seems relatively pointless.
If something is planned, great! If not, how about knocking out outside generators and devices, but leaving those buried deep in mountains functional? The mountain should protect the devices - if the flare was strong enough to penetrate the mountain, it would kill all living things! (Something like what happened in the "Knowing" movie (think that was the title)).
This is a good point. N.O.R.A.D. is built into Cheyenne Mountain for a reason, after all. Even nuclear EMP blasts can blocked by enough tonnage of good, solid rocks.
And additionally, solar flares should not happen while in an eclipse too ;-)
Quote from: ThomasA on November 08, 2013, 02:46:50 AM
And additionally, solar flares should not happen while in an eclipse too ;-)
I don't understand. An Eclipse does not turn the Sun off, merely prevents light from reaching the Earth. Solar radiation can still effect electrical devices.
Also, how about a Solar-flare detector? It shouldn't be too hard to build something that can detect forming solar flares before they happen.
I agree with nerfing solar flare, but limiting it to outdoors makes it puny and barely important compared to the horror it is now.
But taking into account we'll have much, much, much more storyteller incidents, this will all get reworked I believe :)
Quote from: Cyclops on November 08, 2013, 03:04:34 AM
Quote from: ThomasA on November 08, 2013, 02:46:50 AM
And additionally, solar flares should not happen while in an eclipse too ;-)
I don't understand. An Eclipse does not turn the Sun off, merely prevents light from reaching the Earth. Solar radiation can still effect electrical devices.
The dangerous part of a solar flare are the fast and loaded particles (ionized gas/plasma) thrown torward the little moon which in case of an eclipse is hidden behind a huge gas giant so straight traveling particles can't easily reach your base. At least it would get heavily weakened by the heavy magnetic field of an gas gigant between your base and the sun.
But a +1 for a Sun-Telescope for predicting solar flaressome hours before it happens
Or, just use steam engines? Though joking aside, it has been mentioned these planets consist of all sorts of technical generations. So maybe in the future steam generators or another kind of fuel generator could be plausible.
Quote from: Galileus on November 08, 2013, 06:18:12 AM
I agree with nerfing solar flare, but limiting it to outdoors makes it puny and barely important compared to the horror it is now.
But taking into account we'll have much, much, much more storyteller incidents, this will all get reworked I believe :)
Well.... here is a thought, but I have no idea how one would implement it... If you experience a solar flare, you somehow get "horror credit" and nothing else bad will happen to you for a few days.
Quote from: Produno on November 08, 2013, 08:35:35 AM
Or, just use steam engines? Though joking aside, it has been mentioned these planets consist of all sorts of technical generations. So maybe in the future steam generators or another kind of fuel generator could be plausible.
It does seem strange that solar flares knock out my geothermal generators. Unrealistic, too, to be honest: Any EMP effect strong enough to knock out all of the power in a base is strong enough to kill human beings as well. The human body has it's own electrical field, after all (look at how pacemakers work) and shutting down that field will shut down the person real quick and real permanently.
I agree. I have been puzzled by the effect of solar flares on geothermal generators (at least those inside rock). Outside, exposed to a flare, I can understand not working. How is it that a geothermal generator, inside of rock, can be knocked out by a solar flare?
I'd vote for some advanced tech that allows you to either harden individual rooms against solar flare effects and/or allow you to continue to use some equipment at an increased risk of fires or shorts.
Right now the flares are pretty crippling - as the game develops there will presumably be a lot more stuff dependent on power, and they'll get far worse.
Perhaps the addition of adding a layer of shielding over individual items makes it less susceptible to EMF's however makes it more prone to fire or less susceptible to repairs in turn?
At the very least if your base is buried inside a mountain where electromagnetic frequencies can't even penetrate.. :(
But yeah a "faraday cage" upgrade for like a more expensive wall (and vicariously your roof)... I don't know.
Honestly I don't mind it having teeth, because they all can kill you in combination with other factors. But at the same time I think there needs to be like, "yes you're emp'ed... and a ship is crashing down to drop crap for you" or something like that. :P
Why doesn't it EMP with a ship in orbit so I can get freeee stuff! :) Anyway this was a fun thought. I didn't come here to talk about this but it would be really cool!
Seems, liek it would completely remove the point of solar flares, which is to provide a unique challenge.
Removing it in the games current state would only serve to make the game easier, nothing more.
And currently if you play well the game gets ridiculously easy once you have blasting charges/killbox with turrets.
So no, do not nerf them until we have other threats.
Quote from: Untrustedlife on February 10, 2014, 12:28:20 AM
Seems, liek it would completely remove the point of solar flares, which is to provide a unique challenge.
Removing it in the games current state would only serve to make the game easier, nothing more.
And currently if you play well the game gets ridiculously easy once you have blasting charges/killbox with turrets.
So no, do not nerf them until we have other threats.
Not as much easier, as fair. I was wiped by "boom! no power, know what? eclipse! Done... or is it? FLARE IN THE FACE!" combo, and being able to barely do anything to help poor sods. Its pointless in the end, if you have a threat that you can do nothing against.
Eh, I understand your point but I still think they are interesting because it dramatically effects game-play. (Just as a season would) and still do not want them nerfed (nor able to be dealt with) at the moment.
Perhaps at some point, but not right now.
(This is my opinion)
Hey,
Suspension of disbelief only goes so far. Some people are able to do so more then others. Those who can't throw ALL logic and reason aside, have a hard time coping with things that kinda just mock logic and reason. Especially since these scientific principles are becoming so readily available through media and entertainment, I.e: I didn't know about wormholes until I saw the movie Stargate for the first time when I was like... nine. Now, the facts behind real concepts that are used in science fiction might not always be one hundred percent accurate, but we the consumers get a basic understanding of the principles (some even more through research out of curiosity).
Rambling. Sorry.
Cheers,
Michael
Intense solar flares can knock out technology, they do (sometimes) but the earth has a shield called the "Magnetic Field" that pretty much acts as a shield from these.
The moon we are on in game (and yes, it is a moon orbiting a gas giant) perhaps has NO magnetic field. And therefore the solar flares have extreme effects.
If you want to be realistic, the gas giant we orbit around perhaps would have even more extreme effects on our planet, radiation for example that kills everything not in rock. And its gravity causing structure-destroying earthquakes.
Really it just depends on how critical power becomes as the game's development progresses. If the tech levels in the game remain low enough that we're never totally reliant on power for survival, then the occasional flare is simply a hazard to be weathered.
If however we reach the stage where you really can't imagine your base functioning at all without power, then there will have to be at least some limited remedies to the event (or it'll have to be really short and relatively infrequent).
Even as it stands now, a 3-day flare would basically drive everyone in your base completely insane from raw food penalties and there isn't jack-all you could do about it. Luckily they seem to be limited to 24 hours.
Quote from: Vastin on February 10, 2014, 07:55:23 PM
Really it just depends on how critical power becomes as the game's development progresses. If the tech levels in the game remain low enough that we're never totally reliant on power for survival, then the occasional flare is simply a hazard to be weathered.
If however we reach the stage where you really can't imagine your base functioning at all without power, then there will have to be at least some limited remedies to the event (or it'll have to be really short and relatively infrequent).
Even as it stands now, a 3-day flare would basically drive everyone in your base completely insane from raw food penalties and there isn't jack-all you could do about it. Luckily they seem to be limited to 24 hours.
Yes, same thing with eclipses. If for whatever planetary rotational reason eclipses were like "2 days" it'd be a pretty much instant gg.
I see eclipses and solar flares not so much as game enders by themselves, and not so much as to keep someone on their toes, but as combos.
For example solar flare + raid, eclipse + plague, Eclipse + short delay + raid, mad boomrat + rescue + fog, dry lightning storms (and staying dry for 2-3 days after, with mad boomrats). Stuff like that.
So solar flares shouldn't be independently crippling (maybe even toned down slightly so they balance better early on) but they need to maintain a sort of "combination" effect where they play off the other hazards and weather effects to devastating ends. I'd almost consider adding more, like "dry season" where pretty much the whole zone can burn up. It gets close now but I've only seen it once and it still petered out. I'm talking like extreme dry spell, which makes the whole area combustible combined with maybe people eating double rations (to try to stay "hydrated."
I want the game to be as "strong" as possible but also "smart" as possible, if that makes sense. Maybe early on the solar flares are actually even shorter (6 hour?). Just to give you a scary taste of what to expect. ;) Then as the "director AI" gets more testy, ramp up to the 12 hour. Same thing with the plagues, maybe if you're starting out it's a half-plague instead a full one.
Maybe when the solar flare is up to full power it's actually like "night of the comet" instead of a solar flare and the entire grave (including animals) rise up to attack your base. MmMmMMmMmMMm....
I think what people're really asking for is scalability. That way based on the "director AI" it can be a nice soft solar flare, or a devastating end of the world one.
Apply that to like the mad squirrel situation. Call it like infectious rabies. Have the "director AI" scale from one mad squirrel through to ALL OF THEM. Same with the boomrats. Scale from 1, to all of them. Same with the Muffalo's, early game it sends 1, as the "director AI" gets frisky it sends 2 or 5 or 10 or all of them at once." Of course the turrets need to be able to hit them. :) But you see what I mean?
Quote from: Cyclops on November 08, 2013, 03:04:34 AM
Also, how about a Solar-flare detector? It shouldn't be too hard to build something that can detect forming solar flares before they happen.
GENIUS idea here, what about an Observatory? It could be a very expensive machine that requires research, loads of resources, and a scientist to check on it on occasion, but it could tell you when solar flares will happen, when eclipses will happen, and when trade ships will arrive. Perhaps even raider parties, though that might be a bit much.
Quote from: Karakoran on February 11, 2014, 01:03:40 AM
Quote from: Cyclops on November 08, 2013, 03:04:34 AM
Also, how about a Solar-flare detector? It shouldn't be too hard to build something that can detect forming solar flares before they happen.
GENIUS idea here, what about an Observatory? It could be a very expensive machine that requires research, loads of resources, and a scientist to check on it on occasion, but it could tell you when solar flares will happen, when eclipses will happen, and when trade ships will arrive. Perhaps even raider parties, though that might be a bit much.
Hehe could just build a quantum cannon attached to the thermal generator and blast them out of the sky. :P Have someone assigned to the com room, broadcast "friend or foe" signals and just blast them out of the sky if they fail, and send a mop up team to take care of the rest.
Man it's really fun imagining these things. :P