There's been a bunch of suggestions already and I'll be surprised if this one hasn't been brought up.
I did try and take a look around but I found nothing specific.
I do apologize though if this has been talked to death or belong in some already existing thread.
My English is not the best either, and my grammar is terrible, you've been warned.
So a suggestion Mechs/Mech suits!
You could totally add all kinds of them.
Mining, Builder, war-mech?
How would they work?
Types:
Well obviously for the Mech's to be worthwhile they'll have to make things easier for you as a player.
It therefore, goes without saying that they'll need to be quite buffed in the area they are specialized in.
The Mining mech needs to dig faster, while also maybe have some storage?
Builder have a faster building speed?
War-mech some kind of inbuild weapon system, high amount of defense/HP?
etc.
Saying that.
I do believe all mechs should to some extend offer a degree of protection as well as higher melee damage.
Balance.
Well as said the Mech should excel in the areas its specialized in, otherwise what's the point?
I can't really comment much in terms of speed of building or mining as first of all I haven't actually played the game.
And secondly, I'm sure that would be something that'll have to be done as you developer the game.
But here is some thoughts I think I could comment on.
Buildings.
The mech shouldn't just be build out of blue, I feel a workstation could be added (possible to be used with other elements of the game?)
That would allow colonists to build the mech, upgrade or even repair.
With that a charging station could be added, allowing recharging of the mech as well as a parking space for it.
But maybe you'll want to save resources so a simply 'parking spot' which is nothing but a few markings on the ground, could be added.
Allowing for multiple mechs to be parked in spots that would cost no/close to no resources but also offer nothing but just that, a place to park.
Power.
The mech should require power, recharged by your base it self.
As said the recharge station would obviously power the mech but also serve as a 'parking spot' if you will.
What would it use power on?
Well adding power costs to all its actions and a timer on the recharging of the mech would serve well for balance.
Players should then probably have the ability to decide how much the mech is used, even allow them to run it dry of power if they wished.
A portable recharging station (Though much slower at recharging) could be added, serving as a solution to the "Oh shit my mech is dry." problem.
Combat.
A mech is a large machine the way I see it.
As such it should do a decent amount of melee damage well above the average of the regular colonist.
Facing one of these in melee should be certain death, not great if you want to take prisoners.
It's weaponry should also be of the larger variant, allowing for much destruction and again not great for taking prisoners.
Now obviously unless its a war mech it probably shouldn't carry weapons, but all of them should have the strength in their favour.
In terms of health and cover I think a mech would have quite a decent amount of HP/armour allowing for it to take a beating.
With cover I think it would suit best if it wasn't applied at all to the mech, its after all a decent size so its center of mass would be well above any cover on the ground allowing for easy aiming at the vital parts of the mech. (Unless the enemy is really into shooting feet!)
To make the war mech more appealing you could also take the person inside of the mech into account.
Allowing him/her to take damage, a mining mech may not need the best of shielding therefore making the controller an easy target!
Where as the war mech would provide plenty of cover.
That kinda brings me onto ways the thing can die.
I think the mech could have a number of ways to die/get disabled.
Stuff like loosing its legs/arms, its main computer being damaged turning it into a pile of steel.
Critical damage resulting in a big explosion, fires everywhere.
Its user being killed leaving it with no one to control it. (Pirate mech = epic loot?)
Research.
A mech shouldn't just be a go-to option.
Now I'm a fan of research that gives multiple options, I dislike systems where you research something specific.
I much rather research something that opens up options across the board, maybe I get a speed upgrade for mining equipment that also allows me to build a vital mining part of the mining mech?
As such I would probably tie the research requirements into other things, not saying there couldn't be one or two costly research things that are mostly mech related.
That's just how I would of done it, however not a easy thing to comment on when clearly research still have a way to go and will probably require rebalancing as the game comes along.
I feel it has the potential for interesting game play, I mean image this.
The player would rely on these mechs for his defence against pirates during the dark season.
A wave of pirates appear and the player instantly sends them out against them, winning the battle!
However, these mechs did not just get damaged but used most of their power and are now at less than optimal condition.
The mechs are obviously sent directly back and into their charging stations and repairs beginning once the colonists have the time.
But before any real recharging or repairs are allowed a second attack appears!
What you have just used your mechs on dealing with turned out to be nothing but a smaller scout force/wave.
And you're now left with no choice but to use what power you have left on recharging these as well as hurry your colonists onto the tasks of repairing these machines.
You did just deal with one attack though and most of your colonists are tired and hardly recovered from the last attack.
You're now at the edge of what you're capable of handling.
You march into battle again come out victories, but at what cost? A few colonists are now running on fumes, some may even be dead, killed while steering their mechs into battle, etc, etc.
It's probably a long shot of an idea, but I just felt that if I'm ever going to see mech's in a game the like of DF, PA, etc.
It's something along the lines of Rimworld, it's simply the only 'setting' where it makes sense.
So I had to give it a shot in terms of suggesting it!
I hope it made sense and it wasn't just writing of a mad-wanna-be game designer.
Mech is not a bad idea itself, but I feel it doesn't "suit" the game. There is already a lot of mech games where you can customize your mechs and battle them against hostiles. Turn-based, real-time, I guess you can already get a lot of mech action.
It doesn't fit there because we are talking about a handful of stranded colonists. Mechs would require a heavy industry that this game isn't really supposed to offer, at least yet.
Having mech suits would be nice, maybe in a simpler form is more fitting the setting. Also using simple robot for mining and/or bulding would be cool too.
Robots as supplemental colonists that need power instead of food and can go into mental breakdowns as well, I'm all for it. Combat mechs in an otherwise survival/western background, not so much.
Quote from: Hypolite on October 07, 2013, 06:00:14 AM
Robots as supplemental colonists that need power instead of food and can go into mental breakdowns as well, I'm all for it. Combat mechs in an otherwise survival/western background, not so much.
I'm with Not-Bruce on this, the idea of late game robots to fulfil tasks is a nice idea and could spawn more events/story-interaction. But mech-suits I'd have to vote against.
I for one love mechs.
This game is not a mechs game. It is a very westerny scifi game and mechs dont fit. Industrial tools? Yea. Late game tech (if available) for like heavy drills or fast transport around the map (pneumatic tubes a la Futurama? :D )
But no, not mechs, too advanced of a tech and very unwieldy.
Personaly, I would like mechs.
I don't.
As far as I love mechs (ROWWWWWBOAAATTTSSS), I'm also agains the idea, but maybe not against let's say some light exoskeleton that would help colonists doing their chores.
But then you'd have Pacific Rim... world. :P
Yeah, I think exo-skeletons might be a viable upgrade at some point - maybe the root of a few branches of R&D that would affect different jobs. Mining, hauling, combat, etc.
Exo-skeletons seem fine.
I don't know what Tynan has in mind, but the way I see RimWorld is that at its very core, it's a game about colonists, and as such, the only controllable units should be the colonists (maybe some "pets", but even I'm not fond of the idea of controlling them as well).
An exoskeleton (I'm assuming you don't mean organic) can be more like changing clothing/armour than an actual mech you fasten into.
For that matter is there something your colonists can wear to stop them getting shot as much in mind for later versions?
Quote from: AspenShadow on October 07, 2013, 07:53:34 PM
An exoskeleton (I'm assuming you don't mean organic) can be more like changing clothing/armour than an actual mech you fasten into.
For that matter is there something your colonists can wear to stop them getting shot as much in mind for later versions?
I'd actually see it as a researched tech upgrade that gives a bonus to different action types, like the pneumatic drill for mining. Basic tech tree might be something like 1) Exoskeleton, 1a) Exoskeleton Mining Rig (requires Pneumatic Drill), 1b) Exoskeleton Construction Rig (req something). 2) Armored Exoskeleton (requires Armor tech), 2a) Combat Support Rig (requires Blasting Charge). That kind of thing.
Quote from: Spike on October 07, 2013, 07:59:56 PM
I'd actually see it as a researched tech upgrade that gives a bonus to different action types, like the pneumatic drill for mining. Basic tech tree might be something like 1) Exoskeleton, 1a) Exoskeleton Mining Rig (requires Pneumatic Drill), 1b) Exoskeleton Construction Rig (req something). 2) Armored Exoskeleton (requires Armor tech), 2a) Combat Support Rig (requires Blasting Charge). That kind of thing.
I thought as much, but an exoskeleton should really be considered equipment to be stored and gotten out of the locker room shouldn't it?
There are research ideas about improving every aspect of mining, construction, growing, etc. before they'd get to the tech-tier necessary to be able to design an exoskeleton, not to mention by then -if your colonists aren't always dying- you'll have people pretty high-skilled in those areas anyway from all the practice.
Then again at this point most considerations I can put forth are conjecture only until the Alpha release on November 1st.
Quote from: AspenShadow on October 07, 2013, 08:08:35 PM
Then again at this point most considerations I can put forth are conjecture only until the Alpha release on November 1st.
Agreed :P
And I could see it either way of being a researched item that you are assumed to have (like picks and pneumatic drills) or being an actual item that you'd have to research, manufacture and equip. If that's the case, it should be a bigger boost than just an assumed item.
The theme of this game is a band of survivors, but, then again, they DO have the ability of building a huge fortress out of solid steel using standard tools that even oafs own.
The exoskeleton could work as a low-mid onward item, augmenting the wearer to be better at mining, construction, etc. I would argue for them to have to be researched and manufactured or bought before being used (They are not that unique if just a named passive research). I would even go as far as have the wearer having an "exoskeleton" skill which dictates how much benefits the suits would give.
As a late-game toy, I even agree with the concept of larger mechs. I imagine them to be slower, bulky 2x2 machines (I don't know if large entities work in the game though) controlled by a person.
They could require the purchase/salvage of a power core (can't be built) and several other kinds of parts that can be either researched from scratch or faster by reverse-engineering. Once the parts have been researched, copies of the parts can be manufactured and the mech can be assembled at dedicated "mech assembly station".
Mining and construction mechs would be unnecessary due to the exoskeletons, but the combat mech could function as a tank. It would have good armor and high health, and could equip tank-grade weapons. It would, however, be slower than people. It would require power to work, having a decent but finite battery life and, to recharge, having the option of being plugged into any nearby power conduit for a minute or a charging station for several seconds. The mech would also require a character with a high "exoskeleton" level to operate it. Anyone with a low "exoskeleton" skill could hurt themselves while operating the mech, in addition to less efficiency and higher maintenance needs.
NPCs of wealthier factions would be able to bring these combat mechs over to raid you. When mechs are destroyed, they would obviously explode (still leaving a few salvageable parts), although mechs could also be recovered by killing the person inside before the mech itself (this would need to be difficult/rare).
There are three main issues I have with mechs:
Can my version of mechs even be programmed into the game (they are 4x as big as a person)?
X -person
\/
/\ - mech
Do these mechs fit into the lore of the game?
Can mechs be made to fit into the balance of the game? (Mechs must be optional; they can make combat slightly easier due to the investment costs but MUST NOT be a requirement)
altough ive been a big mechwarrior fan for a decade or 2 i cant seem to find joy in encountering them in this game.
They feel way to high tech for rimworld and way to expensive.
Quote from: Semmy on October 09, 2013, 12:48:44 PM
altough ive been a big mechwarrior fan for a decade or 2 i cant seem to find joy in encountering them in this game.
They feel way to high tech for rimworld and way to expensive.
I'm sorry dude, but I agree, my opinion on mechs is well-demonstrated earlier on in this thread:
Good, but not RimWorld. I just really think it wouldn't work.
I don't think this is a bad idea as a late game technology, although restricted to manual labour/construction tasks and melee only combat for balance. It would be good if they were difficult enough to build that you only ever had 1 or 2. Would be interesting for the possiblity of difficult level raiders having a mech in their party just to terrorise you a bit.
As an enemy like a mega-beast type, they could be interesting (especially when accompanied by raiders).
As something you might be able to capture at great cost and possibly then repurpose, that also could be interesting especially with the sense of accomplishment that entails. If Rimworld were to have something like this, I hope that they are incredibly unreliable and hard to maintain -- but cause a hella lot of fear.
As something you can build yourself, I don't really like it. I think it detracts too much from the fragility of the colonists. Life should be hard and cheap for these guys.
I'd also be against mech suits but I'd be into people size or smaller mech/robots.
The reason I'm not into the mech suits is because it sounds like Tynan will be putting in some kind of body augmentation. I'm thinking Deus Ex kind of body augmentation.
Quote from: Finjinimo on October 09, 2013, 11:41:09 PM
As an enemy like a mega-beast type, they could be interesting (especially when accompanied by raiders).
As something you might be able to capture at great cost and possibly then repurpose, that also could be interesting especially with the sense of accomplishment that entails. If Rimworld were to have something like this, I hope that they are incredibly unreliable and hard to maintain -- but cause a hella lot of fear.
As something you can build yourself, I don't really like it. I think it detracts too much from the fragility of the colonists. Life should be hard and cheap for these guys.
This person speaks The Truth (although I'm not fond of the capture part).
Quote from: Finjinimo on October 09, 2013, 11:41:09 PM
As an enemy like a mega-beast type, they could be interesting (especially when accompanied by raiders).
As something you might be able to capture at great cost and possibly then repurpose, that also could be interesting especially with the sense of accomplishment that entails. If Rimworld were to have something like this, I hope that they are incredibly unreliable and hard to maintain -- but cause a hella lot of fear.
As something you can build yourself, I don't really like it. I think it detracts too much from the fragility of the colonists. Life should be hard and cheap for these guys.
+1 one of the most awsome ideas.
I REALLY WANT MECHS!
Oh man!
Even just mod support for adding our own exo-vehicles with custom add-ons. Even rigs:
http://lostplanet.wikia.com/wiki/Utility_Rig
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQCd_K-Yxfg
or better yet Shrikes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_scQk45tBzQ&feature=player_detailpage#t=578
Well rigs fit rather perfectly, just need to have research labs for complex hydraulics and rudimentry motor skills articulation software drivers and controllers.
Well alright maybe not RUDIMENTRY but yeah, touch, go and engineering.
But the other stuff?
Well youre space ship should still be littering the surface of the planet with debri, maybe you can explore caves or outside world and discover remains, or maybe under the planet you can discover rare caches from a lost civ with old bad ass technology for reverse engineering. No doubt this game will have research labs?
Dude Mechs, please.
MECHS!!!
Wanted to say id love mechs, id hope we get bionic implants as well, making our own suped up soldiers who lack humanity, or may be susceptible to like hardware failure, and madness. Or if we had AI units that controlled things like power management and doors or whatever, theyd go rogue at times and hijack our cyborg super soldiers and attack the colony from the inside
YES YES YES
I think the best option would be small "walking tank" mecha similar to Armored Troopers, Heavy Gear, AMP Suits, the Metal Frames in Solarstorm, or the Power Loader from Aliens. ("Mini Mecha" in the words of TVTropes. Link omitted to minimize distraction) They're small enough to fit into industrial buildings, and their simplicity, scale, aesthetics, and limitations would fit the Rimworld setting.
Their primary use would be as multi-utility labor elements for farming, construction, and cargo handling. Most pawns (and even an unfortunate Muffalo) could be carried at full speed (Mooo?!). But like any other vehicle (or potential draft animals) in a setting like this, people would want to bolt weapons and armor onto them and send them into battle.
Due to their size, a truck can probably only carry one mech, and a crawler could carry two. This would cost most of said vehicle's payload capacity.
Example Models
MF-55 "Henry" - A well-tested civilian mechaframe, suited to agriculture, logging, and cargo work. Some individuals have equipped them with improvised armor and weapons for more aggressive actions.
Required Facilities: Machine Shop, Electronics Lab, sufficient space in a Motor Pool
Required Technology: Advanced Electronics, Advanced Vehicles, Advanced Machinery
EDIT: Maybe they're best off ordered from traders or captured from raiders. The colony might have the capability to build a truck itself, but a Scopedog would be pushing it.
Example Equipment:
Power Tools: Mechaframe-sized hydraulic power equipment for more efficient labor. (Drill, chainsaw, hydraulic rams, winch, etc.)
Range Extender: Backpack-mounted batteries or fuel tank allow for longer-duration operations at the cost of carrying capacity or storage.
Improvised Armor: Metal plates and plexiglass windows, with a heavy nylon backing to protect the occupants from spall and fragments. Similar to improvised armor for vehicles.
Mechaframe Weapon: Allows for the carriage of a Clydesdale MG12 or Viridian AC25 (effectively modifying them into a mecha-scale handgun or rifle)
Combat:
Weapons: Machineguns and autocannons. Howitzers and mortars are for crawlers.
Armor: More durable than pawns, bikes and buggies, but armored trucks and crawlers are sturdier. Can shrug off small arms and vehicle machineguns, but autocannons are effective and a crawler or crew-served howitzer will quux it up.
Mobility: Can climb over things, take cover, and enter buildings like infantry, but its speed is similar to that of a crawler. There's a risk of it getting nibbled to death by buggies or armored trucks in the open.
Chunky Salsa Effect: Bad things happen to pawns in melee with a mecha. The kinds of motions found in combat are not conducive to a light touch and pulled punches. (Under more normal conditions, pawns can be dragged or carried safely.)
Example Image (MF-77 Ogre Civilian Metal Frame from Solarstorm, fitted with claws instead of hands):
(http://imageshack.us/a/img716/4659/epd7.th.png) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/716/epd7.png/)
I love the idea of some kind of powered exo-skeleton to aid in building, mining or other heavy lifting tasks, as something that simple could be built out of scrap metal & salvaged parts (And if you search the internets, there are numerous examples of people making these like this one http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2009-05/man-machine )
However full blown war mechs doesn't seem like something that would mesh with this game all that well
I agree that a mech suit would work well, but only in a context where it's going to be used for mining/constructing/etc. Maybe it adds a temporary skill boost to the person in it while they're using the suit, but takes fuel (There's uranium already in the game for unimplemented reactors IIRC).
Yes1 please add
Quote from: Finjinimo on October 09, 2013, 11:41:09 PM
As an enemy like a mega-beast type, they could be interesting (especially when accompanied by raiders).
As something you might be able to capture at great cost and possibly then repurpose, that also could be interesting especially with the sense of accomplishment that entails. If Rimworld were to have something like this, I hope that they are incredibly unreliable and hard to maintain -- but cause a hella lot of fear.
As something you can build yourself, I don't really like it. I think it detracts too much from the fragility of the colonists. Life should be hard and cheap for these guys.
I think that this and other events like it should be part of the standard Cassandra storyline. In the event that an automated narrative generator is implemented, I'd want most long-lasting colonies to have on one of their major accomplishments:
"Day xxx. Today, the Bandit King finally had enough of our 'impudence' and sent his finest bandit squadron to the simple farming community of TOWN. They were equipped with the most advanced lasers and the most impenetrable armor this side of the galaxy. They even utilized the Bandit King's personal mech suit, the Reynolds Ranger. I swear, those missiles were as big as I am, but we eventually took it down with a well-aimed shot into its armor plating. Okay, so it was more like 600. What's important is that we captured the Bandit King's most powerful weapon, won that battle, and maybe even the war.
P.S. We now have a new fountain centerpiece in TOWN's central square."
And yes, I name my colony TOWN.
I think before outright mech suits, armor would be more appropriate...perhaps coupled with higher damage across the board on guns, so UN-armored guys would go down easier, while armored guys could take a bit more punishment.
I'm adding my vote to this as well (as long as the enemies get them really close to end game)
(keep in mind i am copy/pasting this from my post on the steam ideas thread)
ROBOTS! why not have "Robot Bays" or something similar. these could hold the most basic of robots (ones that put out fires) to defences bots, to medical robots to builders. these would take ALOT of energy, and it would not be wise to have more than, say, 3. they have batteries in them that will get low. they will automatically go back to a robotics bay to recharge, which should take a lot time for the larger ones with larger batteries (defence ones) and short ammount of times for the simple repair drones. if they run out of batteries before they get back to the bay, they just lay there on the map until a colonist hauls them back to the robot bay.
I would like to see mechs in the game cuz it is a westers SCI-FI! game.
If Mech Suits are to be added than for balancing they should have to be bought in separate pieces from a traveling salesman and would need to be very expensive.
The idea of a steampunk kind of suit may work. Though like many others the idea of a mech seems a bit of a stretch for the Rimworld universe.
I suppose if I were to design it: 1.Slow, 2.Explodes causing death to pilot and AoE damage to those near, 3.mountable weaponry(interchangeable), 4.Buildable, but costly and time consuming(think wonders from the civilization series), 5. colonists inspired(bonus of some sort whilst within certain proximity)..the same as the AoE damage proximity.
So yes it can be beast, or wreck your colonists. ;D
I think Mechs are a great idea but instead of imagining theses massive walking tanks (well maybe in the endgame captured from a Pirate king) but more of a durable exo-skeleton used for mining and haling and battle. For example the mining one could not really limit the speed of the colonist wearing it but mean they have a much more powerful drill. A hauling one could be able to pick up 2-4 stacks of items (could have to research strength to improve the load) and be able to either move 1 really fast or lots but at a slower speed. The Combat one could just have a bit of shielding and better accuracy for the driver for that little bit more help in a fight. Obviously they would need power and need to be plugged into a charging station and always need driver to work but then it would stick with the western theme but just upgrade the people in it. So not going from man to tank more like man to man who is a bit stronger by machine. I think that i would work very well and really help colonists but at the cost of it taking up a lot of time on the Tech tree making it an item thats not to OP but still something useful.
I think it should not be a mech, but a exo-skeleton for combat and mining. The combat one could move faster or have armour depending on what model, increase melee damage, increase accuracy, lower shooting time, take less damage depending on model, and come with a preinstalled gun that could be inter switched. For the mining one it could mine faster, carrie a stack or two of items, not be terrified of darkness ( it wold have a head lamp) and a interchangeable drill.
Quote from: Semmy on October 09, 2013, 12:48:44 PM
altough ive been a big mechwarrior fan for a decade or 2 i cant seem to find joy in encountering them in this game.
They feel way to high tech for rimworld and way to expensive.
Rimworld isn't about joy, it's about overcoming the world that seeks to kill you, survival, and death. Personally I would be more interested in a rogue military mech bashing down my gates and being forced to overcome the most frightening beast imaginable than controlling wretched thing. Mech would probably exist in this universe, please don't restrict the possibilities in random events just because you don't think it fits. I've been reading a lot of "I don't think it fits the world" latly but all I'm hearing is "Let's limit it's potential because it's not what I vision" please let the world be what it chooses to be. I don't support controlling mechs, until it's late game at least, but don't use ;the colony as an excuse to not have them at all.
I would like to see mech suits in the game. Maybe give the lower 'level' ones (The first you try build, or get from raiders if your lucky enough to kill the driver without blowing up the mech) could look fairly jury-rigged and might break down and have a limited range of things they can carry. Better and more improved ones can be teched or bought. I think they should resemble the mechs from Avatar, Aliens and NS2 (Big, bipedal, exposed driver or shielded control unit, hands or moddable arms form customising by giving them MGs, drills, welders ect.)