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RimWorld => Mods => Unfinished => Topic started by: Britnoth on December 16, 2015, 12:42:37 PM

Title: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 16, 2015, 12:42:37 PM
Updating for alpha 14 alpha 15 alpha 16 alpha 17 beta 18 beta 19

Hunting Alert and Slower Infestation are now vanilla! Hurray! ::)

New Zone Tools: Chequer pattern cancel, uniform grow zone, cut blighted plants and replace existing wall tools.

Patient Sanity: Fixes colonist AI so they actually stay in bed when needing treated.
Added emergency flag to rescue and non critical doctoring, including even feeding now that even minor malnutrition can combine with other issues to prove fatal.
Rescue is higher than treatment so that doctors can prioritise what patient to treat first properly.
Swapped doctoring and patient priority in the work tab so that doctors do not go to bed and wait until someone else treats them instead of treating others first.
Pawns will go to rest whenever they need any form of treatment, as long as the patient work type is ticked.
Needing any treatment is now classed as an emergency, so they should not wander off changing their clothes, eating, or sitting alone at a table 'socialising' for several hours before they do so.

Friendlier Breaks: A mod to make the mental breaks a bit more reasonable.
Berserk pawns will no longer be hostile to their own faction.
Slaughterers will not target any pet trained in obedience.
Other breaks require a specific trait to be valid:
Kind for jailbreaks. Bloodlust for murderous rages. Nudist for wildman. Brawler for sadistic rage (prisoners).
Psychopath for corpse obsession, Ascetic for tantrum (valuable item) and Greedy for bedroom tantrum.
B19: Drastically reduced the chance of the give up and leave break.

WorkFlex: Replaces the main colonist behaviour core with an additional higher priority work check limited to just 12 tiles away.
A pawn allowed to both haul and clean, will clean dirt closer than 12 tiles away before going to haul a chunk from across the map, for example.
WorkFlex is now restricted from researching, smelting or stonecutting in an effort to avoid work-locking into long term tasks.
B19: Now restricted from 'scanning', sowing and harvesting work.

######## Not updated for now:

Pandora Dark: A sister storyteller to Cassandra Classic, but with greatly increasing raid sizes.



This beta did finally overhaul the raid size scaling - giving real point increases for having a large population (after a year of being told it was always like this, yeah...). The new difficulty levels also have much higher point multipliers, so Pandora will probably need extensive changes.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: cucumpear on December 19, 2015, 10:08:32 AM
Glad to see you posted everything here now.  :D
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Disnof on December 31, 2015, 01:40:53 AM
I really like how the SID affects the AI of the game.

No longer will the AI mindlessly funnel into your kill boxes. Instead they will assault the closest wall from their spawn. Not only that, but they MINE through your walls which is ~10x faster than smashing them with their fists... Also, drop pod shiv raids in your base make you reconsider your tactics. What good are those turrets when 10 guys just dropped into your kitchen and are burning all your stuff?  :)

I wish/hope future updates to the vanilla game are influenced by this mod.

TLDR: no more mindless raid AI
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: A Friend on December 31, 2015, 09:56:10 AM
TLDR: no more mindless raid AI

That sounds kickass.
Though I found an incompatibility with another mod. SID doesn't play nice with Ish's Medieval Noble Faction (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=14006.0) for some strange reason. It works fine with other mods that adds new factions though like Shinzy's Pirate and Norbal Factions. (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=7670.0)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 31, 2015, 09:18:14 PM
Thanks for the comments

SID doesn't play nice with Ish's Medieval Noble Faction (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=14006.0) for some strange reason. It works fine with other mods that adds new factions though like Shinzy's Pirate and Norbal Factions. (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=7670.0)

'Doesn't play nice' does not really give me a lot of information to go on. How does it not work? I just tried them together and it created a new world and game just fine.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: A Friend on December 31, 2015, 11:16:53 PM
Sorry if I was a bit vague, when I activated them together it caused my all my mods to unload.

But whoops, false alarm. I was unfortunately using an outdated version of the medieval faction. Just downloaded a new one and it worked well. My error.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on January 02, 2016, 05:00:28 AM
Updated the opening post with a newer version of SID.

- Returned the Scythers' default weapon. As fun as it was it was a bit too easy to manipulate.
- Mechanoids now have a somewhat less passive AI instead. Also changed mech spawns.  :)
- Raiders now prefer to mine through walls even when they have frag nades. They were grenading their own people too often to justify using them on walls.
- Pirate weapon loadouts further tweaked to suit their raid type.
- A few other changes trying to help the AI be more aggressive.

EDIT: Updated with a couple more loadout tweaks for pirates.

EDIT: More work on Pirate loadouts and raid types. Reversed frag nade AI change, instead solved it a better way I should have used to begin with.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on March 20, 2016, 11:43:07 PM
Posting a first attempt at a storyteller mod.

I dislike how the raid sizes both in the existing vanilla and modded storytellers would not scale very well with increasing colony population and development. It is almost entirely dependent on colony wealth - and with raid sizes having a soft cap that keeps very large raids in check unless you reach extremely high wealth levels you have had more than enough time to build structures and acquire equipment to fend them off. Raids were a concern early on, but once you are stable with enough people, it is rare to lose a colony to a raid even when playing self imposed challenges such as no turrets.

Pandora Dark will generate events in the same way Cassandra does, but instead will scale raid sizes much more aggressively. Colonist count will drastically increase it, as will the passage of time. The first few raids may be no larger, or even smaller than before but the increase is exponential. Hopefully it will be much more difficult to keep ahead of the curve. 8)

Edit: Update for alpha 13. Anyone care to test? :3
Edit: Moving to the main post.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: falconbunker on April 11, 2016, 12:47:46 PM
I will when I can, and is SID ready for A13?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on April 11, 2016, 01:44:48 PM
I haven't yet starting converting SID.

First I want to play enough, and then look through to spot anything that changed in how the AI worked from the previous alpha.

SID is purely xml changes, but I suspect its using some entries in new ways that were not originally intended.  ;)

Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: falconbunker on April 11, 2016, 01:58:56 PM
Ok
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: tonsrd on April 12, 2016, 01:31:02 AM
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=18339.msg201318#msg201318

ive not tested this but zeeb wa sasking for a mod that changes the name of heal root back to xand. can u add to ur pack ?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on April 12, 2016, 03:00:51 AM
I do not have a 'modpack'.  :P None are interdependent on any other mods, the exceptions being Hard Maps + Random Resources, which are mutually exclusive for obvious reasons.

Converting Brass Monkeys next, to make the coldest maps playable again.  8)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: winowmak3r on April 16, 2016, 10:59:01 PM
Just finished my last cold run (...and died) and saw Britnoth on Zeeb's stream and he suggested Brass Monkey to make the colder maps more difficult. Also decided to give the new storyteller and SID ones a try because they looked fun. Loading it all up now and will report back!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on April 21, 2016, 09:12:05 PM
Edit: Removed for a14.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: silentlord on May 07, 2016, 11:53:07 PM
just a note, SiD doesn't play well with Combat Realism mod at all. you add both in a load order and game has a fit and throws a pop up;

Recovered from incompatible or courrupted mods errors - all mods have been disabled and can be activated again i the mods dialog.

the debug log is pure red and afew yellows and whites.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on May 08, 2016, 10:46:18 AM
SID is just xml changes. If you load it first then Combat Realism, CR should just overwrite anything it needs to.

This will remove some of the loadout tweaks but still keep the raid AI changes, I would think.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: silentlord on May 08, 2016, 06:32:16 PM
okay thanks for reply. i love the idea of SiD, so i'll change load order and report back.

thanks Britnoth, works a charm now. thank you very much.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on May 27, 2016, 01:26:26 PM
Hi Britnoth, I've been playing with SID and Pandora Dark Extreme in a long-running game where I'm currently up to 33 colonists or so.

So the raids: I get about a billion zillion raiders (I guess about 200) with each raid, and every time they could utterly stomp me and end my colony. But inevitably at some point, they either decide to kidnap any downed colonists or just to be satisfied with the relatively meager damage they have done compared to my colony size.

I don't know if something could be done to make the raids more committed?

Also, Pandora Dark gets silly after a while, as you can maybe tell.  ;D
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 01, 2016, 10:43:34 AM
Hi,

Raiders that kidnap should also be rescuing any of their downed friends, denying you potential new recruits. It is a bit odd that they decide to kidnap just one person when you have 33 colonists, but the game arguably is not designed around having this many people. I'd be surprised if they give up without destroying a fair chunk of the base first, though.

Quote
I don't know if something could be done to make the raids more committed?

Well mechanoids don't try to kidnap.. how many do they send each raid? :3
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on June 01, 2016, 07:47:10 PM
Last time, it was about 100 scythers and 100 centipedes, I think...but they stayed put, letting me whittle them down, until a raid took out the rest, along with some of the raiders. :D
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 02, 2016, 03:09:08 AM
They stayed put? it was a normal assault raid or a ship part?

Edit, wait, 100 centipedes? SID should not be using those.... are you using another mod that changes them?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on June 02, 2016, 03:00:02 PM
ohhh... I must have messed something up, because the first time I used the mod, the centipedes died instantly. That makes sense if they were not even supposed to be in there. Please dismiss everything I said.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: squished on August 27, 2016, 02:19:59 PM
hi, any chance of uploading to steam workshop or is that not possible? (I sometimes play on linux which doesnt seem to support "manual" mods)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on August 29, 2016, 06:17:44 PM
Sorry, I don't use steam. :)

(Nor Linux, so can't help you there either)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Deimos Rast on September 05, 2016, 08:36:25 AM
hi, any chance of uploading to steam workshop or is that not possible? (I sometimes play on linux which doesnt seem to support "manual" mods)
Linux bro here; I use both steam and manual mods just fine. PM me if you need help (so we don't clutter the thread).
Mainly came to grab SiD and Pandora. I'm terrible at the game as it is, but hey, more mods!
What's the fertility on the tilled soil by the way? Most mods go for 200%, occassionally higher (240 iirc).
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: kaptain_kavern on October 21, 2016, 01:12:33 PM
Hey I just discover this thread because of here (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=26210.msg272916#msg272916). How can I have missed this?

Just by reading the title of some I'm looking forward to test them. Thanks for the mods
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: kaptain_kavern on October 27, 2016, 01:53:37 PM
Hey thanks Britnoth, New Zone Tools mod is a real life saver.
And cleverly done/realized! What more could I ask for?

Many thanks  8)

edit : I've spread the word (https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/59vxsa/essential_mods_in_a15/d9brcmh/) about your mods ;)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: leestriter on November 06, 2016, 06:00:17 PM
Will this work with better pathfinding?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 07, 2016, 02:26:35 PM
Hi. What will what work with better pathfinding?  ???

(Updating Pandora mod to add a second storyteller... )
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: leestriter on November 07, 2016, 05:55:45 PM
Slightly Increased Difficulty.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Vincent on November 07, 2016, 09:49:02 PM
I've been testing the new story teller, so far so good. I was wondering if you could tweak the spawning rate to be more gradual rather than one month nothing and then x raid day after days

My second try was ~30 days like the first but I think I did better than the first one (no death until 3 sapper raid back to back, no time to rebuild the wall)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 08, 2016, 01:35:07 AM
SID does not change pathfinding, so should work fine. Give it a try.



Pyrrha is quite a bit random by design.  ;)

If it feels like the raids are much more 'clumpy' then that is what I was looking for. 30 days is quite a lot of time to get ready.  8)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: zava on November 10, 2016, 10:47:53 AM
slightly increased difficulty makes walls pointless since enemies mine through them in a matter of seconds. Maybe it's just me but I have no idea how to defend now.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 16, 2016, 06:07:35 PM
Undefended walls may be pointless. A few seconds can be very valuable if you are shooting at them while they do it.  ;)

The problem then becomes if they do break though, they can now use the hole in your wall as excellent cover to shoot from...

To anyone trying SID, how are the changes to AI targetting working out?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: tonsrd on November 27, 2016, 12:13:48 PM
does Pandora dark attack numbers based on wealth or time ? or both ?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 03, 2016, 05:20:57 PM
Pandora raids are Wealth x Colony Size x Time.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: MisterVertigo on December 20, 2016, 09:47:43 PM
Any chance for a Hunting Alert update for A16?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 21, 2016, 01:11:45 AM
Done, its a very simple mod thankfully.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: MisterVertigo on December 21, 2016, 01:38:11 PM
Thank you!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Alenerel on December 23, 2016, 11:06:17 AM
Thanks you for the update. Im interested in hunting alert and patient sanity.

What does "new zone tools" do? I checked the chaquer patern, what is it for? And the grow zone?

BTW berserk pawns seems to attack much less to friendlies in A16, they will only attack them if they are really close, like 4-5 tiles.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 24, 2016, 08:50:09 PM
Chequer cancel was so I could easily make chessboard patterns as my flooring. :3

Lay down an area of flooring -> use the cancel tool to remove half the blueprints -> use a 2nd floor type to place blueprints where you just removed them.

The grow zone restricts the zone to a single fertility - its a quick way to select only rich soil, or normal soil but not gravel.

Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: gendalf on January 14, 2017, 12:15:02 AM
patient sanity is weird, it messes the set manually priorities, when installed, and then allows for people to heal others, even if they weren't set to be doctors, even the people who can't physically heal others(because of their traits) will pick up medicine and go heal.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on January 14, 2017, 09:47:27 PM
It does none of those things.

The only change to doctoring is adding the emergency flag to rescue and treatment, so doctors do not go to sleep instead of treating people.

The only work change is swapping the default priority of doctor and patient.

Nothing in my mod adds treating pawns without the doctor work type.

I suggest you check your other mods for issues.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on February 25, 2017, 08:03:08 PM
Hi Britnothm, using SID along with some other mods I only get scythers as mechanoid enemies, no centipedes. Is it SID or some other mod, and if so, is it intentional, and if so, why?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on February 26, 2017, 11:19:52 AM
Also, SID removes the mental debuff of a psychic ship.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on February 26, 2017, 06:29:53 PM
Yes, mechanoids only get scythers in SID. Centipedes can take a lot of damage, but their default weapons cannot hit anything and their large size and slow move speed makes them ridiculously easy to kite.

That is really strange with the psychic ship part.. they are an almost exact copy of the originals so not sure why is isn't working, ill take a look.

EDIT: TIL the psychic drone mood checks only for the psychic ship by its specific name, not for any building with a drone level. Fixing.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on February 27, 2017, 01:45:42 PM
Well, I can confirm that scythers are much more dangerous. A bunch dropped on my colony yesterday, and one of them broke down the wall to an Ancient Danger that held more scythers. RIP colony
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on February 28, 2017, 05:49:27 PM
I think maybe scythers should be worth more raid points, or whatever the value that determines raid sizes is called. I just had two centerdrops. One with a dozen shiv-armed pirates who I dealt with easily, and then another with two scythers that killed two of my seven colonists and downed a third before they were downed.

I don't know how specific this is to SID, but I think switching to scythers only for mechanoids has revealed that they are in fact underrated in terms of how difficult they are. Just a thought.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on March 01, 2017, 02:31:25 PM
Scythers are valued at 160 points. In comparison merc gunners are 70, snipers 90, and heavies (the ones with rockets) are 185.

They are underrated because in vanilla raids, they mechs split up into waves of scythers and centipedes. Scythers do not take advantage of their speed and melee damage, nor do they pick a good target to shoot at letting you cheese them with a personal shield.

SID if working correctly should have them picking a target it can hit and injure, and sometimes attacking in melee if you move too close to them.

Did they rush you in melee while you were not expecting it? If you get chased down in the open without defences, even 2 scythers can mess you up.  :)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: faltonico on March 03, 2017, 09:55:38 PM
Hello there!
Any reason why "Hunting Alert" is not officially released yet? i didn't find any problems that i could relate to it, and it worked as it said in the lid.
Nice work!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on March 04, 2017, 06:00:24 AM
SID if working correctly should have them picking a target it can hit and injure, and sometimes attacking in melee if you move too close to them.

Did they rush you in melee while you were not expecting it? If you get chased down in the open without defences, even 2 scythers can mess you up.  :)

I can confirm they definitely did, killed one of my colonists in one blow. :(

Also, psychic ship mental debuff works now.

There might be an issue regarding claiming ownership of abandoned siege camps. Occasionally I can do it, but most often not, even when the raid is long gone. However, I don't know if it is because of SID, haven't tested it in isolation.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on March 06, 2017, 12:43:25 AM
I labelled this thread as WIP because I may change or improve a mod as the game updates. Also, I was hoping/expecting my mods here to be short term stopgaps until fixes were included in the vanilla game. Still here 4 alphas later though... so maybe 'unfinished' is not the right place for them anymore.

Being unable to claim sieges when a pawn of that faction (including prisoners) is still on the map is a known issue, not related to SID.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: leestriter on March 10, 2017, 11:13:12 AM
Could you make a version of SID that still has centipedes? I like the mod but I miss the big guys, I'd rather have them improved or even vanilla. I can change my own files if you explain how.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on March 16, 2017, 03:23:40 AM
If you go to Mods\SID\Defs\ThingDefs_Races\ and remove Races_Mechanoid.xml, centipedes will be spawned from ship parts and ancient dangers again.

If you want them as part of normal mechanoid raids as well, go to Mods\SID\Defs\FactionDefs and remove Factions_Hidden.xml.

Making centipedes effective would need changing their access to weapons entirely, as even the inferno cannon is just not effective as it is. Giving scythers a charge rifle is justified I think, given they normally have a charge lance, but to make a centipede as effective as it should be you would probably need to add a custom weapon or two, which wasn't the goal of the mod.

SID is trying to help the AI by using the tools it already has, not giving it OP gear or larger raids.  :)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: leestriter on March 18, 2017, 08:41:41 PM
Thank you, I appreciate the help!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: lost_RD on April 03, 2017, 02:16:54 AM
Hey Brit,

Disnof is doing a lag colony with Pandora, up to Summer of 5504 with 50 colonists, and sieges are broken.

https://clips.twitch.tv/SilkyTallHerringHeyGirl

The way we think it could be fixed is if sieges expanded with raid size.

https://clips.twitch.tv/DarkCorrectSnakeTriHard

 
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on April 05, 2017, 11:46:09 AM
Quote
sieges are broken.

Hi Lost. This applies to any game, if you manage to amass enough wealth to get to similar raid sizes.

Pandora is a storyteller: she isn't intended to change the game in any way other than how events are spawned.


I would love to change sieges more in SID. The problem is the limit of 2 mortars per siege is both hard coded and does not decompile :(
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: faltonico on April 17, 2017, 06:37:24 AM
This would probably never happen in a normal situation but, if you draft a pawn with a mele weapon and set it to attack a downed colonist, the animal hunting warning pops up.
Just to let you know ;)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: khor on April 20, 2017, 05:02:06 AM
Can SID be removed for existing safe ?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on April 20, 2017, 05:33:43 AM
This would probably never happen in a normal situation but, if you draft a pawn with a mele weapon and set it to attack a downed colonist, the animal hunting warning pops up.
Just to let you know ;)

I know. As I want the mod to work with any other mod I decided to keep the check as simple as possible so that if, say, someone added a predator that was considered human the mod would still give you the alert, or if a mod that caused your own animals to turn against you for food, then again.. the mod would warn you.

Also I find it funny.  :P

Re: Removing SID from an existing game I assume you mean? Should be okay? The mod uses its own replacement for Jobdriver_Wait, which is used when pawns are drafted etc to find enemies to fight so I would try removing it when no fighting was going on.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: khor on April 20, 2017, 07:53:32 AM
This would probably never happen in a normal situation but, if you draft a pawn with a mele weapon and set it to attack a downed colonist, the animal hunting warning pops up.
Just to let you know ;)

I know. As I want the mod to work with any other mod I decided to keep the check as simple as possible so that if, say, someone added a predator that was considered human the mod would still give you the alert, or if a mod that caused your own animals to turn against you for food, then again.. the mod would warn you.

Also I find it funny.  :P

Re: Removing SID from an existing game I assume you mean? Should be okay? The mod uses its own replacement for Jobdriver_Wait, which is used when pawns are drafted etc to find enemies to fight so I would try removing it when no fighting was going on.
ok thanks for the information
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on May 27, 2017, 09:30:41 PM
Hi, just wondering if you are still around and planning to update any of your mods for A17?

Thanks!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: TrustyShoes on June 02, 2017, 11:42:55 PM
Also wondering if there are any plans for an A17 release?  I am desperately looking for a mod like Pandora Dark that increases the size of raids if anyone can recommend another mod in the meantime.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 03, 2017, 02:03:44 AM
I am still here. Just updated the UI ones, Pandora + co. will be along shortly.  ;)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on June 03, 2017, 02:47:48 AM
I am still here. Just updated the UI ones, Pandora + co. will be along shortly.  ;)

Thanks!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Juujika on June 12, 2017, 11:20:54 PM
I am still here. Just updated the UI ones, Pandora + co. will be along shortly.  ;)
Thank You^^
Do you have a Steam Workshop?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 17, 2017, 06:15:32 PM
Nope, I'm a filthy casual and don't use Steam. Sorry.  :P
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: poolday on June 22, 2017, 11:08:16 AM
Hi! I am really enjoying the mods, and I have a small request to ask: can you make the Workflex compatible with the Urgent Hauling from the Allow Tool mod?
I can see a lot of potential in Workflex and it works well for me specially at small communities.
I'm sorry in advance if this was already requested or answered
Cheers
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 24, 2017, 03:34:41 PM
Hmm, Urgent Hauling adds another hauling work type with a priority higher than flicking?

A simple way would be to add the <emergency>true</emergency> flag to its WorkGiverDef. Then any pawns allowed to would do that before any normal work in the same way they fight fires - the check for emergency work is made before the main behaviour, including annoyances like eating, sleeping, socialising or changing clothes.

Patient Sanity makes some use of it (and after losing a pawn this alpha to malnutrition because a doctor went to bed instead of feeding a patient, next version will probably use it even more. :P  ).
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: faltonico on June 26, 2017, 02:24:02 AM
Hello there!
Thank you for the updates!
I have a question though, with WorkFlex, if a pawn can't find a job in the nearest 12 tile radius, what does it do?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 26, 2017, 01:14:33 PM
I have a question though, with WorkFlex, if a pawn can't find a job in the nearest 12 tile radius, what does it do?

What it would do anyway - follow its normal work priority.

WorkFlex just duplicates the existing check but with a limited range - it isn't very complicated :3
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: faltonico on June 26, 2017, 02:22:59 PM
I have a question though, with WorkFlex, if a pawn can't find a job in the nearest 12 tile radius, what does it do?

What it would do anyway - follow its normal work priority.

WorkFlex just duplicates the existing check but with a limited range - it isn't very complicated :3
The thing is that though it could (the pawn) move 1 tile and search again, if nothing found repeat the same, i was basically worried of a resource hog.
Thank you for clearing that out.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: stigma on July 06, 2017, 10:04:22 AM
Some very good ideas here. I love the new zone controls. Uniform growing zone is really handy to mark out those rich soil spots. Before I always went all OCD and "had" to check and mark every single tile that was rich soil. Now it's eeeeasy :D

Workflex intrigues me - and I've only had limited experience with it so far.
It seems like a good idea and results in a lot of good efficiency choices like "hey, why not haul that thing next to you back to base while you are already out there"

That said it also worries me greatly that it seems to lack a good control mechanism from going overboard and ignoring your priorities. I haven't noticed too many critical situations popping up yet in a small starter colony, but I fear the potential for big issues will increase later on in the game as things start to scale up.

- As you mention, long-term or "unending" jobs like research may never stop being prioritized just because it is nearby, even though there is critically important other work that needs to be done.

- If your pawn enters an area with loads of low-priority jobs nearby (hauling, cleaning ect.), they might end up effectively deadlocked doing nothing else - and that sort of describes any late-stage base. (basically the same issue as the one above, but for another reason).

- It breaks "haul urgently" pretty much, or renders it's priority not all that urgent, which is not so great. (added by a popular mod as I'm sure you know).

The only control mechanism you mention is that if you set the schedule to "work" then this effectively disables the "nearby work" check in that time period. This lets you have some control I guess, but it still seems a little weak and is very reliant on you being able to judge very accurately exactly how much work-scheduling you actually need to have during a day to make critical work priorities don't get ignored. If you don't constantly keep on top of this then there is definitely a chance that things could go very badly wrong ("I'm gonna go research since it's close instead of treating that colonist who is infected with plague")

I feel that a better control/deadlock mechanism is REALLY needed here... Exactly what is optimal is hard to say but something along these lines:

- Exclude priorities (in workflex) that are obvious or very likely long-term or unending. Research and art definitely (I don't see any need for workflex to act on these at all), crafting, cooking, smithing ect. are also pretty much in that boat. A lot of other stuff too like bedrest probably don't really belong. Having workflex consider all types of jobs is a mistake I think. I think there is a very valid argument to be made that hauling (and maybe cleaning) is maybe the only really critical job workflex should take into account.... (and it would be so GREAT if you could adjust this to your liking in an in-game options menu!)

- Have some sort of automatic limiter on workflex, so that no matter what you don't get deadlocked and high priority work WILL get done at least intermittently. I don't know the best implementation of the top of my head, but for example you could have a check that "if a pawn has been doing only workflex-tasks for X amount of time then disable workflex priorities for Y amount of time for this pawn". A timeout is probably also required (especially if longerm/unending jobs are considered),  so something like "if current workflex-job has taken more than X time, stop the job and re-evaluate what to do). This should break any deadlocks that prevent normal high-priority jobs from ever being done due to workflex.

TLDR:
Until there is some sort of automatic system for dealing with deadlocks I am really hesitant to use workflex even though I really see it as having huge potential (especially in hauling efficiency). I'd also looove to see an ingame options menu to let you adjust the most important variables like range - and what job-types workflex considers.

A few quick questions:
- Can you remove workflex from an existing save safely?
- If you set the range in XML to be 0, does this effectively disable workflex? (in case you can't remove it safely this would be a workaround).
- in your description you say that even "sleep" scheduling is ignored to do workflex tasks. I assume this doesn't mean that pawns will potentially ignore sleep needs? ... I haven't seen this happening so far at least. Will they still go sleep if they run out of rest?

Thanks for the hard work on the mods so far - and I really hope that you will expand on workflex to resolve the issues it currently has and bring out it's true potential :D

-Stigma
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on July 06, 2017, 11:20:06 AM
Quote
("I'm gonna go research since it's close instead of treating that colonist who is infected with plague")

Doctor/patient AI being broken is an issue in vanilla. Also why I made Patient Sanity. They work together fairly well.

Quote
- Exclude priorities (in workflex) that are obvious or very likely long-term or unending.

Easy to say, not so easy to define what those are when it is entirely likely that another mod can add a work type that can be just as time consuming.
Marking a small area for mining to expand a room could be done fairly quickly. Deep drilling 2000 plasteel involves staying in one place for a long time. But they are both mining work.

Quote
some sort of automatic system for dealing with deadlocks

Strongly against this kind of game behaviour. Yes, it is perfectly possible to screw up your work priorities with it. You can also do that in the vanilla game.
The level of player interference to stop you being able to do this sounds both prohibitive and frustrating. Why isn't Johnny working on stone cutting like I expected him to? etc etc.

I usually have my doctor/warden/researcher type colonists on alternating hours of anything and work, to avoid them being work locked like that.

Quote
A few quick questions:
- Can you remove workflex from an existing save safely?
- If you set the range in XML to be 0, does this effectively disable workflex? (in case you can't remove it safely this would be a workaround).
- in your description you say that even "sleep" scheduling is ignored to do workflex tasks. I assume this doesn't mean that pawns will potentially ignore sleep needs? ... I haven't seen this happening so far at least. Will they still go sleep if they run out of rest?

- Adding/removing with an existing save has always been fine for me.
- Range of zero I have not tried. Might give an error, but probably would only have them consider work at range zero (same square).
- The work priority is higher than the default work check, but still lower as to not interfere with normal sleep or joy tasks.

This was actually my first mod.  :) I have a few ideas how to improve it, but I have no coding experience, so adding its own shiny UI is... not easy.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: stigma on July 06, 2017, 02:03:08 PM
Thanks for the quick reply.

DEADLOCK JOBS
You are right that defining what is problematic dead-lock work is not easy. It's not clear-cut for many jobs, but assuming that it is possible to exclude certain jobs on technical level I think that some jobs are no-brainers for exclusion (like research, I don't see any good reason why workflex should consider this at all really).

I would also be very interested in a version that only did hauling because IMO better/smarter hauling efficiency as pawns move around is 90% of what this mod brings to the table anyway. Cutting away other problematic tasks reduces the problem right away (and I would use a haulonly-workflex even with no other changes).

The ideal thing would be for included jobs to be user-selectable of course. An ingame UI would obviously be the best way - but IMO if you can easily edit in the mods text-files somehow then that is almost as good if you don't know how to do the UI stuff.

CONTROL SYSTEM / INTERRUPTS
Currently the only way to control/limit workflex to keep it from inevitably deadlocking (for the rest of the day anyway) is to use the scheduling with some periods of "work" set up - but this overkill and has unintended consequences (work restricts a lot of things a colonist can do other than just workflex jobs). You also need to constantly monitor and adjust it since it's static.

All that is needed to prevent all this are some interrupt-points where jobs are re-evaluated to keep workflex from hogging 100% of the worktime (just like a CPU works with threads). It's very convoluted logic or anything. I don't understand why you are so against it :(

scheduling "work" on and off is exactly the same thing as what i'm talking about really, except that it's very "dumb" and static because it happens at set intervals (and also blocks other actions that you might not intend). Much better if the interrupts just happen whenever workflex-jobs have used too much consecutive time (dynamic). Add a couple of values for how sensitive that interrupt is and it sounds like it would resolve the whole problem more or less.

I really like workflex for the smarter hauling behaviour it creates - but I don't think I can justify using it as long as the only way to prevent disasters is to bruteforce interrupt it via scheduling and hope that it is enough and at the right time ect. to not block critical work. (or else feel like I have to constantly babysit my colonists).

I hope I can somehow convince you on implementing a better control system :D
Everything I say here is only meant as constructive criticism.

About UI I wouldn't sweat that to start. I think advanced users who mod rimworld probably aren't scared to change a number in the XML files. As long as options exist there that's a pretty good stopgap solution, and you can worry about UI in later versions when the functionality is how you want it.

PS: I don't suppose it's possible to get a look at how the sourcecode looks? I've never created a mod for rimworld before, but it would be interesting to see how the internals work and if I think I could maybe tweak it a little bit to make something I like for personal use until if/when you make an improved version :)

-Stigma
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on July 07, 2017, 09:52:59 PM
Quote
All that is needed to prevent all this are some interrupt-points where jobs are re-evaluated to keep workflex from hogging 100% of the worktime

Defining how a pawn has spent too much time doing the same thing sounds... very very difficult. The game keeps a record of how much time a spawn has spent hauling, asleep, under a roof etc but I do not think it has a way of checking how much of the day was spent researching as opposed to wardening a prisoner and so on.

As I said, I do not want to interfere with the decisions the player makes. Either the work should happen or not depending on the settings the player uses, not because the game decides for you that you have done enough research now and should be doing something else.

WorkFlex is incredibly simple: all it does is use a duplicate of the existing work giver with its already implemented maximum distance used rather than left at 9999f, and with a slightly higher priority returned when a pawns schedule is not set to forced work.

I'd like to give the player more control over the mod, but want to avoid having the mod take control of the game. :) I have used it for some time over multiple alphas and had no issues. But that might be due understanding the mod and setting my work priorities with it in mind.  ???

Quote
but assuming that it is possible to exclude certain jobs on technical level

I really do not know where to start with this with the way the mod currently works. An alternative is to use specifically made AI checks for hauling or cleaning, but either way that does not sound as compatible with other mods as it could be.  ???
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: poolday on July 08, 2017, 03:27:31 AM
Hmm, Urgent Hauling adds another hauling work type with a priority higher than flicking?

A simple way would be to add the <emergency>true</emergency> flag to its WorkGiverDef. Then any pawns allowed to would do that before any normal work in the same way they fight fires - the check for emergency work is made before the main behaviour, including annoyances like eating, sleeping, socialising or changing clothes.

Thanks for the reply, it took me a couple of weeks to get back to the game and test this. It seems to work but the problem is that because they now treat the urgent hauling as an emergency the pawns might exhaust themselves or even starve while trying to haul things. Anyway it was worth it for a while and I know this is a WIP so let me say this mod is a good one to keep in mind. I'm going to wait until it may or may not be compatible with the AllowTool. Thanks.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: stigma on July 08, 2017, 09:37:24 AM

As I said, I do not want to interfere with the decisions the player makes. Either the work should happen or not depending on the settings the player uses, not because the game decides for you that you have done enough research now and should be doing something else.

I think we have 2 very different ways of looking at this.

I totally agree that the game should follow the players rules and not try to decide for itself, but the way I see it - workflex is already removing some of the control (my pawn has a priority to hunt but ended up only doing work inside the base the whole day sort of situation). Yes, you are choosing known parameters for workflex, but the situation is constantly changing outside your control since the "true" priorities of a pawn are going to change depending on where he is and what jobs are available close by - and no one can keep track of that continuously.

The way I see it Interrupts are actually giving back the player control and making sure that the players choices are at least not completely ignored - so you know that at least some hunting will be done if it is set to a high priority.

About timing jobs - I don't know what functions the game has available - but I'd assume that the simplest way to do it is just to start a timer at the start of every workflex-motivated job. If that timer exceeds a threshold, disable workflex priorities for X time so that normal priorities resume for a bit.

I don't think there is any need to track what type of job it is - or do any sort of fancy tracking of historical data. Just a simple timeout should do it.

I hope I'm not being annoying and overly persistent about this. If so I apologize. I don't mean to backseat develop - only to give ideas for what I think would be improvements.

-Stigma
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on July 09, 2017, 07:41:50 PM
It seems to work but the problem is that because they now treat the urgent hauling as an emergency the pawns might exhaust themselves or even starve while trying to haul things.

I think it would be upto the player to learn to show restraint in how many items they set to be hauled.  :)

but I'd assume that the simplest way to do it is just to start a timer at the start of every workflex-motivated job. If that timer exceeds a threshold, disable workflex priorities for X time so that normal priorities resume for a bit.

Certainly possible, but it would have to add its own data to each pawn recording the last tick a workflex job was assigned.  :-\
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: stigma on July 14, 2017, 10:58:20 AM
@Britnoth How does your replace walls function differ from JT Replacewalls? Aside from yours being a seperate tool that is.

It would be nice if it could override doors too, because you typically change those along with the walls.

-Stigma
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on July 14, 2017, 05:13:33 PM
@Britnoth How does your replace walls function differ from JT Replacewalls? Aside from yours being a seperate tool that is.

It would be nice if it could override doors too, because you typically change those along with the walls.

-Stigma

1. It is almost 6 months older.  :P

2. It does not use any detouring. It just adds the build on walls flag to the existing wall def, and adds a tool that places wall blueprints on existing walls. Very simple.

3. Really? The game only has the 'build on existing wall' flag, which is why it is limited to just walls. I rarely replace existing doors so felt this wasn't a critical problem...
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: shentino on July 17, 2017, 03:55:02 AM
Have you considered uploading this to the steam workshop?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on July 17, 2017, 01:59:40 PM
Have you considered uploading this to the steam workshop?

Britnoth doesn't use Steam per this reply: https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=17094.msg344079#msg344079
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: stigma on July 18, 2017, 12:13:53 AM
@Britnoth How does your replace walls function differ from JT Replacewalls? Aside from yours being a seperate tool that is.

It would be nice if it could override doors too, because you typically change those along with the walls.

-Stigma

1. It is almost 6 months older.  :P

2. It does not use any detouring. It just adds the build on walls flag to the existing wall def, and adds a tool that places wall blueprints on existing walls. Very simple.

3. Really? The game only has the 'build on existing wall' flag, which is why it is limited to just walls. I rarely replace existing doors so felt this wasn't a critical problem...

Well, thinking critically about it - I guess it is highly situational in practice.
I guess I use non-wooden doors mostly on defense, and past the early game you don't swap around materials on those very often.
It's not critical by any means.

JT Replacewalls is ever so slightly more convenient for not having a seperate tool you need to use - but if this is done in a more compatible way then I prefer that. I don't need this functionally THAT often. It's mostly just nice to now have to micromanage it those few times that I do.

-Stigma
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Likif on July 19, 2017, 06:04:02 PM
Hey Britnoth, any progress on better AI for A17? Or are you going to wait for future versions? I am not too keen on starting any game without your AI modifications.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Pokk720 on July 20, 2017, 10:56:50 PM
This mod should be on the releases page! Experimental or not it's sooo essential. I've only been using it for 10 minutes and I'm already impressed with how much smarter my pawns are. Now they will actually clean their rooms instead of wallowing in filth and becoming depressed because of it without my express orders. Hauling is also soo much better. I've fiddled with the priorities in the work type defs a lot up until now to try and replicate what this mod does. The patient fixes are also a big improvement. I'm just mad that it took me so long to find this!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: stigma on July 21, 2017, 08:59:40 AM
This mod should be on the releases page! Experimental or not it's sooo essential. I've only been using it for 10 minutes and I'm already impressed with how much smarter my pawns are. Now they will actually clean their rooms instead of wallowing in filth and becoming depressed because of it without my express orders. Hauling is also soo much better. I've fiddled with the priorities in the work type defs a lot up until now to try and replicate what this mod does. The patient fixes are also a big improvement. I'm just mad that it took me so long to find this!

I agree that hauling and cleaning tasks benefit greatly from this (I am assuming you are talking about workflex here).
It's all the other stuff that creates problems - I find I end up losing control of what the actual priorities are, and I can't bring myself to use it long-term, especially the later in the game I go as the workloads become larger and more complex. Maybe part of the problem is that I'm the sort of person who set up priorities for everyone to do everything EVENTUALLY somewhere down the priority ladder - even when I know that they will most likely never get a chance to under most circumstances. It would be less of an issue if you tend to set people to only do 2-3 types of tasks.

I reiterate that it would be really great if there was a haul/clean only version of workflex *hint hint*

-Stigma
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on July 25, 2017, 07:43:59 AM
RE: SID for a17: Probably not for a while yet. I am looking at how the AI has been changed though. Bad news: it is just changing from 'defend' to 'assault' AI. :(

I have never used manual priorities myself. Never found the need. Plus as the proud owner of a potato pretending to be a PC, having pawns limited to only a few work types helps reduce lag.

One thing users of Patient Sanity need to pay attention to - as all treatment is now emergency, even priority 4 doctors are going to rush to anyone needing treatment - including those where quality matters such as infections and plague.

Anyway... did some experimenting and produced this. Feel free to test. Seems to work alright for the few minutes I tried.

WorkFlex limited to haul and clean:

[attachment deleted by admin due to age]
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Boundir on July 28, 2017, 05:07:16 PM
Friendly Berserk: Berserk pawns will no longer be hostile to their own faction.
a17: Updated to use mod-friendly xml.
If going berserk would you go pick a fight with a wolf or a bear? I see that state as a pawn that would more likely break stuff, throw insults and get into social fights but not try to die either :)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Anarcraft on July 28, 2017, 09:24:26 PM
Hunting Alert: He had a machine gun in his hands.  All he had to do is stop constructing and shoot the mosquito.  Thank you for this!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: faltonico on July 29, 2017, 05:49:46 AM
I don't know if it is a mod messing with things on my end, but my fucking pawns, for the life of them, can't stay in fucking bed. Not even your mod patient sanity can prevent them from getting up from bed, even when i disabled any other job but bed rest, it gets up to "wander", even when i have enabled someone to feed them at all times.
Having them sedated is too much of a micromanagement to do, given the short time the effect last compared to how long is the disease.
So, the only method i have found to be working so far for the fucks to stay on bed, is to set a surgery and forbid the materials.
Sorry for the foul language, but i can't express with my reduced vocabulary my frustration regarding that situation.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on July 29, 2017, 07:44:48 AM
I'm not sure if you are trying to complain about my mod or not.  :(

Quote
even when i disabled any other job but bed rest, it gets up to "wander"

If they are not resting when they need to, even if they have no work to do... then that sounds like you have them on forced work. That overrides all other sleep/joy/rest requirements.

Friendly Berserk: Berserk pawns will no longer be hostile to their own faction.
a17: Updated to use mod-friendly xml.
If going berserk would you go pick a fight with a wolf or a bear? I see that state as a pawn that would more likely break stuff, throw insults and get into social fights but not try to die either :)

Implying your pawns are smart enough to not get themselves killed to begin with.

If I was berserk, I would not be making any conscious decisions by definition of the word.  :P
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: faltonico on July 29, 2017, 12:43:08 PM
ohhh!
How very intuitive! Forcing a pawn to do something during their work hours will make them do whatever the fuck they want (even if it is nothing) xD

I was not complaining about your mod BTW, just bitching about how fucked up this game is, and why i'm still playing it xDD
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: tigg on August 07, 2017, 11:42:36 PM
Are there A16 links for these? They sound great.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlueWinds on August 14, 2017, 07:08:14 PM
Anyway... did some experimenting and produced this. Feel free to test. Seems to work alright for the few minutes I tried.

WorkFlex limited to haul and clean:

Thanks! I tried out workflex, and same as Stigma, found it worked very well for haul and clean but was annoying for the other job types. Will give this new version a try and see how it plays.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Boundir on August 15, 2017, 01:35:56 AM
I've checked the code of Patient Sanity. It seems you don't care much about animals ;D
Was suspicious when I saw a colonist going to bed before my boomrat explode, starving.

I've added these lines in WorkGivers.xml. Don't know if it does the trick yet.

Code: [Select]
<Operation Class="PatchOperationInsert">
<xpath>*/WorkGiverDef[defName = "DoctorTendToAnimals"]/workType</xpath>
<value>
<emergency>true</emergency>
</value>
</Operation>

<Operation Class="PatchOperationReplace">
<xpath>*/WorkGiverDef[defName = "DoctorTendToAnimals"]/priorityInType</xpath>
<value>
<priorityInType>89</priorityInType>
</value>
</Operation>
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on August 16, 2017, 09:52:51 AM
Yeah, if I added emergency to tending animals as well I could see doctors staying up until they went crazy treating lots of slightly hurt animals...

Which btw does not include feeding them, so your doc would have went to bed with them hungry anyway. :P
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Boundir on August 16, 2017, 02:09:20 PM
Yeah, if I added emergency to tending animals as well I could see doctors staying up until they went crazy treating lots of slightly hurt animals...

Which btw does not include feeding them, so your doc would have went to bed with them hungry anyway. :P
Noticed that when my cow died :D Added the lines to priotarize feeding them too. My animals are life to me.
I have to think of doing more hunting I guess.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: jayerbayer on August 28, 2017, 04:42:49 PM
Thanks a lot for your mods Britnoth, I use almost all of them. They are extremely useful
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Debbonair on September 28, 2017, 01:36:10 PM
Would it be possible to get a new link for the haul/clean workflex version please?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kalre on October 05, 2017, 04:32:55 AM
Is there any way to make pandora raids less frequent ? I dont enjoy getting raided every day :(
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kalre on October 05, 2017, 01:30:06 PM
Shameless bump, something like Phoebe Chillax but with the raid sizes of Pandora Dark ? :(
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kalre on October 05, 2017, 06:32:26 PM
Up
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on October 05, 2017, 10:10:18 PM
Bumping every couple hours isn't going to help. Author hasn't posted in this thread in nearly 2 months. Sure he/she will check it the next time they stop by the forums.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Debbonair on October 06, 2017, 03:06:47 AM
Can anyone with the haul/clean version of workflex upload it somewhere and post a link please?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: tonsrd on October 06, 2017, 08:40:43 PM
join the rimword discord if u wanna poke a mod maker ,

or watch rimword live on twitch and speak to brit in chat :) brit hangs out in ( disnof ) chat a few times
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Debbonair on October 09, 2017, 04:25:41 AM
I do use Discord for D&D, what's the server info?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on October 09, 2017, 02:03:06 PM
I do use Discord for D&D, what's the server info?

https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=27941.0

There is also a modders only discord server, different from the modders channel on this public Rimworld server. (Believe you need to be a modder to get an invite to that modders only server)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Debbonair on October 09, 2017, 09:02:27 PM
Thanks
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Alenerel on October 18, 2017, 01:21:12 PM
WorkFlex sounds like a very good idea for haulers and cleaners, but for everything else its a nuisance. Could you make so it only works for hauling and cleaning?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Debbonair on October 21, 2017, 10:46:10 PM
He DID make a version for haul/clean only if you'd read the rest of the topic. problem is that some idiot admin deleted the link for it and I been trying for a few weeks to contact him for another link. I was told to join discord and message him, but he isn't on there. I found someone else on it who talks to him on twitch and asked if he'd ask brit to update this topic next time he talks to him. He said he would, but that was over a week ago...
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 02, 2017, 04:20:29 AM
[attachment deleted by admin due to age]

What the hell. It was less than 2 months old and a18 is still not even released.  >:(

Sorry for no reply, hadn't checked this forum in a bit and have had no messages either...

(still for a17)

Edit:
Shameless bump, something like Phoebe Chillax but with the raid sizes of Pandora Dark ? :(

You can edit the values under StorytellerCompProperties_ThreatCycle_Pandora_Dark in the storyteller def to use the same numbers as Phoebe, rather than Cassandra.

[attachment deleted by admin: too old]
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kalre on November 11, 2017, 08:30:26 PM
Hopefully we get an updated soon for our beloved mods :)

Also thanks for the info !
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Rock5 on November 17, 2017, 01:03:26 AM
Update for A18, please.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kalre on November 19, 2017, 09:54:22 AM
pandora where ;_;
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 19, 2017, 09:29:41 PM
pandora where ;_;

In our hearts. Also after the UI related ones are updated.  ;)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kalre on November 20, 2017, 09:09:04 AM
Thank you !
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Synchrotron on November 20, 2017, 11:58:47 AM
Nice! Thanks for the update.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on November 20, 2017, 12:08:02 PM
Thank you!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Hatti on November 20, 2017, 05:04:27 PM
like your comment on the pandora update ;D share your feelings...
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: kaptain_kavern on November 21, 2017, 10:45:00 AM
I don't know if you're aware of, but someone put your mod on Steam. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1207190116

Just wanted to let you know in case it's not you or something you'd wanted.


I noticed this is happening quite often now...


Anyhow, many thanks for your excellent mods
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Halno on November 21, 2017, 03:11:40 PM
I don't know if you're aware of, but someone put your mod on Steam. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1207190116

Just wanted to let you know in case it's not you or something you'd wanted.


I noticed this is happening quite often now...


Anyhow, many thanks for your excellent mods

It's unbelievable how much this happens. and the guy that stole the mod is an agressive fuckwad too.

Anyways great quality-of-life mods, Brit. I'm taking a few lessons from your code.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Tinkerer on November 22, 2017, 12:05:26 AM
As Kavern said, someone put your mod up on the workshop: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1207190116

Very abusive quote from the mod "author": https://i.imgur.com/BkR3kPF.png
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kirby23590 on November 22, 2017, 05:49:11 AM
It's very unbelievable that someone in the comments has posted some questions and to get help only to get. No an F You! by that author.

I hope your still around Britnoth! Your hunting alert and QOL-Mods are very helpful! thank you for your great mods!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 22, 2017, 05:51:13 PM
Thank you. I'm still around.

Considering expanding Friendly Berserk to make some of the new mental breaks a bit less ridiculous.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Canute on November 23, 2017, 06:14:48 AM
Just curious, don't steam got a report user function ?
The mod poster allready mention he isn't the author at the comments.
Just report him, together with his bad language it should give enough reason to block/ban him for a while.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Anarcraft on November 26, 2017, 08:28:59 AM
I had to disable Work Flex because my pawns would not "rest until healed".  They kept getting up to shovel snow or clean.  I had it near the bottom of the load order.  I'm running 181 mods.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 26, 2017, 07:53:22 PM
This gives me almost nothing to go on.

What priorities were the work type and bed rest on?

What work types did this not work correctly with if not all of them?

What other mods are you using that might affect it? ie Patient Sanity?

Did you try right clicking to force rest, and if so did it work?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Anarcraft on November 27, 2017, 08:20:31 AM
I know, there's always so much info I didn't know where to start.  I would have bed rest set to priority 1 and cleaning set to 4.  I didn't notice any other job types that were affected.  I can provide you a complete mod list but I'll have to test this again as I've updated my pack a few times.  I do also have Patient Sanity installed.  Yes, I was doing the "rest until healed" forced rest.  I don't know about them going to bed on their own, I only noticed this issue when I was forcing them to rest.  I'll test it again and give you an update.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 28, 2017, 12:48:12 AM
I had the same issue with a pawn not staying in bed when right clicked to force them to stay there.

Pretty sure it is an unintended interaction between patient sanity and workflex. :/

The problem here is, in an attempt to avoid pawns being job locked with workflex I disallowed resting in bed along with research, stone cutting and smelting. The thought here was so that the player could have work with a higher priority than bed rest, and the game would still respect that rather than seeing a bed within workflex range and then getting locked into resting until healed.

This does mean pawns will get out of bed to work within that range, then return to bed if no other close work is found. I think(?) that is the reasonable way to do it... you can still right click to force them.

Whether other crafting work like smithing and tailoring needs to be restricted is another thing to consider...

The reason they aren't staying in bed even when forced work to do so is likely the change patient sanity does do their AI check once they are already in bed. This is separate from work types - probably to allow the pawn to technically be doing 2 things at once? (resting in bed and watching TV). Vanilla Rimworld finally added non critical tending to patient work type, and waiting to be operated on is also in that.

Patient Sanity moves waiting for an operation back to bed rest (as the majority of operations should not be life threatening unless it is to remove an infected body part - in which case you are going to be micromanaging it anyway) yet the modded 'stay resting' check it has hasn't been changed since my first version.  :-[

Thinking of adding a specific case to stay in bed when waiting for an operation + forced rest, but not to wait without that forced order. Seems reasonable?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Anarcraft on November 28, 2017, 07:45:38 AM
The only thing that doesn't make sense with that is they will go to bed and rest to recover sleep but not do the same thing to heal from injury and prevent an infection (which is more critical than just recovering sleep), if I'm understanding this correctly.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on November 28, 2017, 08:53:51 PM
Resting does not prevent infection, that is decided by treatment quality. They should still bed rest if there is no allowed work within the 12 tile radius like normal.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Anarcraft on November 29, 2017, 08:26:00 AM
No, what I mean is it indirectly prevents infection.  If they rest their injury heals faster, and the faster it heals the less time it exists (less ticks) thus less chance of getting infected.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 02, 2017, 01:43:08 AM
Unless it has been changed recently, infection is a single check made a time period after the injury. The chance is adjusted by the treatment quality and the room they are treated in. Once treated, staying in bed shouldn't affect it. Possibly exception being wounds so small that they heal fully while resting.. but there was a minimum damage level which infections should not occur. Unsure if that is still implemented.  ???

Anyway, here is a small update to Patient Sanity for anyone unhappy with forced rest not being respected:

[attachment deleted by admin: too old]
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Anarcraft on December 02, 2017, 08:19:55 AM
Hmmm, OK, perhaps what I thought was vanilla behavior was tweaked by mods as I always play with a lot of mods.  Thanks for the update!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: TryB4Buy on December 05, 2017, 02:02:37 PM
No dropbox link?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: kaptain_kavern on December 05, 2017, 02:40:25 PM
Downloads are in attachments in the first post
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: frenchiveruti on December 09, 2017, 05:52:53 PM
Hello Britnoth, will you add the fix for "forced" bed rest? As staying in bed for patients who will receive treatment is very crucial, specially for old pawns who won't be winning against malaria or plague so easily and resting is mainly their only chance to survive (because bed rest actually increases the "inmunity" gain speed).
Also this affects pawns who will receive an operation like installing an arm or peg leg, as they won't stay in bed until the doctor reaches them
This can be seen in any testing environment, either with or without other mods.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on December 19, 2017, 03:09:16 AM
I attached an updated dll at the bottom of the previous page...
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: frenchiveruti on December 19, 2017, 01:18:54 PM
I attached an updated dll at the bottom of the previous page...
As a suggestion, you should post in the first post... as not everyone reads a page in the middle for any thread at all.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Harry_Dicks on December 27, 2017, 04:50:22 PM
Not sure if I fully understand WorkFlex. So let's say I have a pawn assigned only to hauling and tailoring with hauling a higher priority than tailoring. If my pawn has to haul an item from my base to a far corner of the map, and does so, if there is a tailoring bench within 12 tiles of his hauling destination at this far corner of the map (with an active/open bill that they qualify for), will the pawn then start to work the tailor bench after the initial haul job is complete (let's say the tailor supplies are next to the bench as well), as long as the tailor bench is nearby but no other hauling jobs are? Even if there are other hauling jobs they would normally complete before going to tailor (but all hauling jobs start/end on the other side of the map)?

Sorry if that sounded confusing - I think I'm just kinda retarded and making this more complicated than it should be.. :-\
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Xidas on January 04, 2018, 11:19:58 PM
Just a heads up, Friendlier Breaks and Slower Infestations don't have the current version number, apparently. The game is saying the intended version is "Unknown".
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on January 06, 2018, 12:19:38 AM
Not sure if I fully understand WorkFlex. So let's say I have a pawn assigned only to hauling and tailoring with hauling a higher priority than tailoring. If my pawn has to haul an item from my base to a far corner of the map, and does so, if there is a tailoring bench within 12 tiles of his hauling destination at this far corner of the map (with an active/open bill that they qualify for), will the pawn then start to work the tailor bench after the initial haul job is complete (let's say the tailor supplies are next to the bench as well), as long as the tailor bench is nearby but no other hauling jobs are? Even if there are other hauling jobs they would normally complete before going to tailor (but all hauling jobs start/end on the other side of the map)?

Sorry if that sounded confusing - I think I'm just kinda retarded and making this more complicated than it should be.. :-\

Correct. Distance for hauling jobs is the target to be hauled. Distance for work is the workbench the bill is at. Growing seems to work a little.. strangely though.

I could add tailoring to the list of exempted work, but I felt that was less of a continuous task than cutting 100s of stones or researching.

Just a heads up, Friendlier Breaks and Slower Infestations don't have the current version number, apparently. The game is saying the intended version is "Unknown".

Seems fine to me? Are you running the latest version?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Xidas on January 07, 2018, 12:26:25 AM
I'm running the latest version, and the mods themselves don't have any problems. It just brings up a log saying the version number is incorrect after loading the mods.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: juliannguyen18 on February 20, 2018, 04:11:59 AM
Same Xidas. BritUIAI is telling me version is incorrect
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Andre27 on June 04, 2018, 06:02:57 AM
WorkFlex seems to make my pawn unable to research without me disabling everything else he could do, I can have his growing at a 4 and research at 1 and he'll instead go and sow some crops rather than research.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on June 17, 2018, 04:58:36 PM
Hi.

For some reason the game currently handles plant growing differently, tending to ignore any distance restriction WorkFlex has. Also this version ignores research before any other work, as that is a long term task that would otherwise keep your pawn locked into that and do nothing else.
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: nordus76 on August 15, 2018, 11:34:00 PM
is this dead? anywhere to DL this mod/mods anymore?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Kirby23590 on August 27, 2018, 03:54:06 PM
 
is this dead? anywhere to DL this mod/mods anymore?

Unfortunately the DL links was removed because of the [attachment deleted by admin: too old]

:(
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on August 30, 2018, 04:37:57 AM
Indeed. For some reason they like to delete attachments for mods that are up to date for the current version before the next update is officially released.  :-X

Time to look through everything and see what was added to B19 and what still needs updated.

Looks like some form of hunting alert made it in?

Ninety-nine bottles of beer on the wall, ninety-nine bottles of beer...
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on September 01, 2018, 10:07:45 AM
Time to look through everything and see what was added to B19 and what still needs updated.


Looking forward to them! (especially the uniform growing zone tool)
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: zmadz on October 04, 2018, 11:26:58 AM
Yo Britnoth how's pandora updating going ?
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Britnoth on October 07, 2018, 01:44:00 AM
Hi, Good question.

The new difficulty scaling is much better in b19 now - not suffering from being capped anymore past a certain point.

Is there much need of Pandora anymore?  ???
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Alenerel on November 22, 2018, 11:27:11 AM
I thought that for 1.0 I wouldnt need patient sanity anymore, but pawns are still retarded... I kinda need this mod...
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: Cpawel on March 15, 2019, 10:54:20 AM
Anyone know if this collection has any updates, official or otherwise? Personally, I'm looking for an update to New Zone Tools, or anything that is similar to it.

While I'm here - if the author happens to see this post; love your mods and thank you for letting us use them!
Title: Re: [WIP] Britnoth's experiments thus far
Post by: BlackSmokeDMax on July 14, 2019, 01:00:19 PM
Anyone know if this collection has any updates, official or otherwise? Personally, I'm looking for an update to New Zone Tools, or anything that is similar to it.

While I'm here - if the author happens to see this post; love your mods and thank you for letting us use them!

Seconded. On all counts!

btw Cpawel, here is another decent mod for growing zones. I think I like this one better, but hope it helps! : https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=784123492