(http://puu.sh/mN14d/7f962d7c04.png)
Happy to see people trying to survive a crashed ship haven't escaped the SJW activism -_-
Gay incestuous zoophile polyamorous marriage here we come!
Does it really have to pollute this game?
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 03:35:45 PM
Happy to see people trying to survive a crashed ship haven't escaped the SJW activism -_-
Gay incestuous zoophile polyamorous marriage here we come!
Does it really have to pollute this game?
... Let's play spot the troll
Stating SJW demands for "inclusion" have overreached to the point of being ridiculous = trolling to you?
It's starting to feel like that era where every show had to have their token black dude just to show they were on board with civil rights and all, but the character wasn't necessarily relevant to the show or the universe and wasn't really adding any quality to the final product, it was just tokenism and signaling. Now we have gay/trans/polyamorous tokens instead. /snore
One of the reasons John Carpenter's "The Thing" is a pretty cool movie, with a very gloomy and desperate feel, is because there are no women at all in the movie. It's very rare, but it makes for a very cool monster movie. We couldn't have that now, not because it's not good or wouldn't make for a cool story, but because if you don't have your standard empowered woman-warrior token somewhere in there, it's not deemed "fit for consumption".
Filling every single cultural product with OH IM SO PROGRESSIVE signaling is very common atm and honestly feels forced.
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 03:55:41 PMIt's starting to feel like that era where every show had to have their token black dude just to show they were on board with civil rights and all, but the character wasn't necessarily relevant to the show or the universe and wasn't really adding any quality to the final product, it was just tokenism and signaling. Now we have gay/trans/polyamorous tokens instead. /snore
Well, it's stuff that exists in the real world, so why not also allow it to happen in a game? Or are you trying to say that "gay/trans/polyamorous" people don't actually exist?
Well if you go by OH IM SO PROGRESSIVE typical standards of inclusion, 50% of the population is homosexual and just about every woman is meant to be an ass-kicking warrior machine, which actually does not exist outside of some college students' utopian fantasy.
That's what I mean by overreaching. I don't care if it's at least somewhat realistic. But most of the time when script writers/designers go that route, they are more concerned with political signaling than something that actually resembles reality and where suspension of disbelief doesn't suffer collateral damage.
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 04:13:03 PM
Well if you go by OH IM SO PROGRESSIVE typical standards of inclusion, 50% of the population is homosexual and just about every woman is meant to be an ass-kicking warrior machine, which actually does not exist outside of some college students' utopian fantasy.
That's what I mean by overreaching. I don't care if it's at least somewhat realistic. But most of the time when script writers/designers go that route, they are more concerned with political signaling than something that actually resembles reality and where suspension of disbelief doesn't suffer collateral damage.
While the PCness you describe is one of my pet peeves with modern media I didn't get that impression from Tynan's comment. It sounded more like pawns being gay is just a thing that can randomly happen same way a random wanderer joining your colony could be anything from a 16 year old war veteran to an 80 year old surgeon with amnesia. I don't see anything indicating pawns will be 50% gay (although I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case but for other reasons). So until A13 rolls around and/or there is some actual evidence supporting the theory Tynan suddenly decided the game where most colonies are sustained on human meat and leather needs to be more "family friendly" I'd say just keep calm and carry on.
So... Tynan... You forgot to NEVER, ABSOLUTELY NEVER say word "gay" on internets....
Blame on you!
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 04:13:03 PM
Well if you go by OH IM SO PROGRESSIVE typical standards of inclusion, 50% of the population is homosexual and just about every woman is meant to be an ass-kicking warrior machine, which actually does not exist outside of some college students' utopian fantasy.
That's what I mean by overreaching. I don't care if it's at least somewhat realistic. But most of the time when script writers/designers go that route, they are more concerned with political signaling than something that actually resembles reality and where suspension of disbelief doesn't suffer collateral damage.
Sources please.
Here, let me give you an example of how this is done:
http://www.tv.com/shows says the top 5 popular shows are: Game of thrones, arrow, marvel's agents of shield, grey's anatomy, and coronation street.
AFAIK none of those have even 10% homosexual characters.
http://www.imdb.com/search/title?num_votes=5000,&sort=user_rating,desc&title_type=tv_series says the top 5 is breaking bad, game of thrones, the X-files, the wire, and one punch man.
None of those have anything close to 50% homosexual characters.
Another imdb list http://www.imdb.com/chart/toptv/ says band of brothers, planet earth, breaking bad, game of thrones, the wire. Same story.
The writers guild of America calls these the top 5: The sopranos, seinfeld, the twilight zone, all in the family, and M.A.S.H. And again nowhere close to 50%, I don't think M.A.S.H. even has a single homosexual, the closest they get is one guy trying to get kicked out of the army for wearing clothing traditionally associated with women.
Other names I have seen mentioned are house of cards, and downtown abbey. I highly doubt they even come close to 5% homosexuals.
On another topic:
Don't insult Xena: Warrior Princess, that show is epic. Also, it has a less than representative amount of homosexuals (especially for ancient Greece), and most women in the show
aren't ass-kicking warrior machines.
Politically correctness is shit, but don't use that as an excuse to be ignorant. Now, please die of bone cancer you pathetic unwanted spawn of the sow you call 'mother'.
Moderator here! Yeah so this fun little chunk above the red is a prime example of stuff I'll normally perm ban people for. I'm going to leave it here for a bit just as a point of reference for something you surely don't do on this forums. Now, feel free to point and laugh because his ban is for two weeks and when he comes back we're going to have a nice long chitty-chat. Keep this thread mostly friendly please! I'm not saying don't argue, but behave.
-Ramsis
He was describing a situation which would be unlikely but hilarious, Rimworld is a storytelling game, the more variables to be mixed together into a story in it makes it more interesting generally.
Just report him for trying to start a fight and carry on.
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 03:35:45 PM
Happy to see people trying to survive a crashed ship haven't escaped the SJW activism -_-
Gay incestuous zoophile polyamorous marriage here we come!
Does it really have to pollute this game?
So Tynan said gay and you talk about SJW activism? Do you realize you're making no sense whatsoever? I can't believe people like you still exist. Though I'm still putting 10% on troll.
omg the game stories will be even more disturbing when told out of context :D And i love it
I don't really understand this kneejerk reaction.
I don't mind stuff like these as long as the game doesn't force it into my face that it comes off as annoying pandering and negatively affects my enjoyment of the game's other features.
And what Tynan stated is obviously a joke. C'mon, y'all overreacting.
*Rubs hands together anxiously* Oh can't wait to get into testing, this is gonna be amazing. (And totally fabulous! ;) )
In other news... Now you get more incentives to name colonists after your friends.
To the people talking about pandering.
RimWorld features humans in a distant future. Just acknowledging that a tiny fraction of a human population can have a certain sexuality is called reality, not pandering.
It's the same as saying it's pro-military when a colonist has a ~1% chance of having a backstory as a soldier. Or pro-slavery when a colonist has a ~1% chance of having a child slave backstory. The only thing Tynan did was modeling human sexuality as we see it in our human nature.
I'm not going to argue about gay couples/people in TV/movies (not that I agree with you, but I just don't have the energy for that particular discussion), but I'm not really sure how any of this applies to RimWorld. RimWorld is a colony simulator, and this update is going more into personal relationships. Whether you like it or not, gay people exist, and there's no reason to assume that colonists on the rimworld would be any different from people on earth, in the here and now. Hence, it makes sense that colonists have a chance to be gay/form gay relationships.
If the game for example forced at least on of your colonists to be gay on embark, that would be a different matter, but there's absolutely no reason to believe something like that will be the case.
TLDR; gays exist. Stop trying to bury your head in the sand, and deal with it. They're generally nice people.
you know what the funny thing is?. I came to this topic because i saw two pages and thought "woah! maybe i'll see some interesting conversation on alpha 13", but instead i see two pages of arguing about gay people in rimworld. I mean, it's really not that big of a deal guys, calm down.
agree with above. i thought yay more news about A13. instead i got a pic of tynan being funny and two pages of people acting like politicians.
I'm really interested to see how those underground hives are going to work and how prevalent they are going to be.
Imagine playing on a cold map and those bee hives suck out the temperature by connecting two entrances from outside to the inside.
Did ty mention that insect hives live in a second plane below the surface? because that would imply that different planes were implemented now.
god that would be a nightmare. i play mostly on ice sheet, and dear god if thats a thing he better add reinforced floors too.
Drop the discussion on homosexuality/killing based on sexuality or I'm going to start passing out temp-bans. Only warning.
Quote from: Skissor on January 29, 2016, 08:53:37 AM
I'm really interested to see how those underground hives are going to work and how prevalent they are going to be.
Imagine playing on a cold map and those bee hives suck out the temperature by connecting two entrances from outside to the inside.
Did ty mention that insect hives live in a second plane below the surface? because that would imply that different planes were implemented now.
Thank you for the nightmares Skissor xD
All in all the next update looks to be super promising, all the drama that can be had with Randy Random.... it's going to be glorious!
Where are you getting this from? Is there a changelog I missed?
Quote from: postm00v on January 29, 2016, 12:34:45 PM
Where are you getting this from? Is there a changelog I missed?
Yes. Two new blogs on the official ludeon website.
Quote from: killer117 on January 29, 2016, 08:55:44 AM
god that would be a nightmare. i play mostly on ice sheet, and dear god if thats a thing he better add reinforced floors too.
I'm also looking forwards to new floor elements. I mean, if those hives can make entrances from below the ground, what stops a modder from creating custom trapdoors? Custom tunnels or whatever just like in prison architect.
In fact, I'd like to see prisoners escaping with escape tunnels lmao. Would be hilarious.
Quote from: NoImageAvailable on January 28, 2016, 04:41:39 PM
While the PCness you describe is one of my pet peeves with modern media I didn't get that impression from Tynan's comment. It sounded more like pawns being gay is just a thing that can randomly happen same way a random wanderer joining your colony could be anything from a 16 year old war veteran to an 80 year old surgeon with amnesia. I don't see anything indicating pawns will be 50% gay (although I wouldn't be surprised if that was the case but for other reasons). So until A13 rolls around and/or there is some actual evidence supporting the theory Tynan suddenly decided the game where most colonies are sustained on human meat and leather needs to be more "family friendly" I'd say just keep calm and carry on.
I completely agree, I would REALLY like to see the level of procedural generation that makes it possible for say a horde of space-raiding-barbarian-SJW-cat-ear-glasses-touting-soccer-moms to besiege your colony riding giant bugs captured from a local hive.
That level of complexity is most desired by me and plenty of others.
EDIT: For some reason when I read my own comment it sounds to me like some sarcastic snarky comment against SJW barbarian pirate generation. I'm completely serious, I want crazy stuff like that to be possible.
Quote from: Produno on January 29, 2016, 05:06:36 AM
Any gays in my colony will be shot :). Im not homophobic but as already pointed out, why does everything have to have its token gay couple. I dont think Tynan intended it to be like that so this is more of a reply to others in this thread.
Theres plenty of stuff i used to watch on tv and now dont because of this. If its something people want to engage in then each to their own but why do they have to force everyone else to be a part of it.
Homosex was rampant in the days of Rome and is prevelant in futuristic literature about space empires based off Rome. It's not out of place at all for there to be colonies of gay clones either. Now that'd be freaky.
People are complaining about homosexuality becoming a thing in rimworld?
well screw you, im going to make a gay-only colony and it's going to be the most fabulous one ever..with margarita's and..stuff
Why is Rimworld sounding so much like the Sims according to this update?
I don't care whatsoever about the discussions of sexuality, right/wrong/etc. on that front, but this doesn't sound like a particularly interesting update, "relationships" is all I took out of that post, and that doesn't seem like it'll contribute appreciably to gameplay.
Quote from: porcupine on January 30, 2016, 04:10:46 AM
Why is Rimworld sounding so much like the Sims according to this update?
I don't care whatsoever about the discussions of sexuality, right/wrong/etc. on that front, but this doesn't sound like a particularly interesting update, "relationships" is all I took out of that post, and that doesn't seem like it'll contribute appreciably to gameplay.
Well for me, it would help make pawns feel less like mindless robot haulers that uses beer as fuel. And hopefully remove a peeve of mine that includes your colonists not giving a damn about whatever happens to the people they've been living with for years.
Gameplay wise, colonist deaths would have a more severe impact on your colony's other residents assuming that they knew the guy. The longer they've been part of your colony, the more influence they would probably have.
And probably some mood boosts or debuffs when they interact with each other.
And random fisticuffs.
Edit 2: Oh and it introduces ground-based/caravan traders and prisoners escaping and fighting back. Wohoo.
Edit: But since nobody has played it yet, I may be wrong.
Though I'm in this for small scale story stuff among my colony so other people who plays the game differently may not see it as great and appreciate it as much as I do...
Quote from: porcupine on January 30, 2016, 04:10:46 AM
"relationships" is all I took out of that post, and that doesn't seem like it'll contribute appreciably to gameplay.
Hmm sounds like you skipped 90% of the other words.
Quote from: Fluffy (l2032) on January 29, 2016, 06:34:07 AM
TLDR; gays exist. Stop trying to bury your head in the sand, and deal with it. They're generally nice people.
I don't have any problems with someone being gay or whatsoever (just saying that on the start), but you can't assume someone is nice because he is gay :D
It's like saying "straight people are generally nice people", but sadly, this isn't true. I feel "gays are generally nice people" thingy is a kind of "good stereotype", if that's a thing :D
I'm not saying gays are generally not nice people, i'm just saying you can't assume someone won't kill you at night and eat your flesh only because he is a gay :D
People with relationship to communism invaded colony!
Kinda shocked about the intolerance some guys put forward here. I think relationships had to be added, since Rimworld is a colony sim, and they certainly will add some flavour to the gameplay. Same-sex love being added shouldnt even be a topic up for discussion, because it has always been a part of society and will always be, and it is not something you can just "make go away" because you dont like it, lol.
What? This is a game not a real life simulator. Games are often used as a form of escapeism. Not everyone wants something in a game just because its part of modern society. At least give us an option if we want all our colonists to turn into raving homosexuals :).
It's likely the code will make relationships and such based off colonists, not gender specific or anything, which removes unnecessary coding. You're not getting a toggle option for people being gay because you can't deal with it.
Zombie makes a good point. Coding actual sexualities into the people of RimWorld is probably a lot harder than just letting everyone randomly form a relationship with whomever they like. This isn't necessarily a "lazy" developement choice, either; it's a decent management of time and resources for the time being.
Worst case scenario: A modder with the same concerns as you will probably figure out a way to either a) prevent same-sex relationships from forming, or b) stop relationships from forming entirely...
Quote from: Produno on January 30, 2016, 12:58:27 PM
What? This is a game not a real life simulator. Games are often used as a form of escapeism. Not everyone wants something in a game just because its part of modern society. At least give us an option if we want all our colonists to turn into raving homosexuals :).
Being that this game is inspired in part by Dwarf Fortress it is hardly surprising that relationships are included. All the interactions are a part of what many people like about these games. They really play to a story-telling portion of your mind as well as the logistical portion.
Quote from: Adamiks on January 30, 2016, 06:01:03 AM
Quote from: Fluffy (l2032) on January 29, 2016, 06:34:07 AM
TLDR; gays exist. Stop trying to bury your head in the sand, and deal with it. They're generally nice people.
I don't have any problems with someone being gay or whatsoever (just saying that on the start), but you can't assume someone is nice because he is gay :D
It's like saying "straight people are generally nice people", but sadly, this isn't true. I feel "gays are generally nice people" thingy is a kind of "good stereotype", if that's a thing :D
I'm not saying gays are generally not nice people, i'm just saying you can't assume someone won't kill you at night and eat your flesh only because he is a gay :D
This is kindof the point I was trying to make. Of course there's homosexual arseholes out there (hehe), but they're generally not 'raving homosexuals', won't try to rape you or convert you, and mostly won't eat your babies. They're just people, with all the good and bad that entails.
Ok i hate having to do this ever but TRIGGER WARNING. don't read my damn post if you are particularly sensative, i touch on sexuality, abuse, and more. This is only to cover my ass.
I do hope there's a slim chance that sexuallity can change over time / trauma, as this is how it is in reality in my experience. I have never subscribed to the idea that sexuality is "static" and cannot change, i know myself personally have transformed several ways among the years, by having trauma happen, overcoming it, and still having residual thoughts from it anyways. I've also known many men / women whos sexuality flexes from events and recovery, negative / positive association, family issues, and more... But this comes from a guy who has studied how / why fetishes, sexual tastes, and all those work out. It is extremely complex, and effected by significant (or traumatic) events, negative / possitive association, hormone levels, family history, internal stigmas, and more. Childhood abuse in particular is a very centric role in many effects as well, as it is in a very impressionable time, where we formulate a majority of our "this is how the world is" mindset, and this expands beyond sexuality and into many other things.
I also sincerely wonder (do not take this the wrong way - not threatening a soul with this) if people playing their own game might be heavily criticized for taste in their own colonists , and perhaps rejecting certain sexual traits within their colony. I mean rimworld in an abstract way is very provocative and political in a sense, but i wonder if sjws and "its my game" mentality collide, what would the results be? After all mentioning a cannibal camp in casual conversation isn't normal, but on rimworld it is. One of the reasons i love rimworld... Thought provoking. And just as someone mentioned a gay only colony (good luck on the rng finding that many gay people) I wonder how severe the reaction people would have for rejecting gay prisoners / colonists in a lets play. Keep in mind - this is victimless, and it is their game, but i suspect the first time anyone kills a prisoner solely based on that, there will be quite the reaction, despite it being virtual and victimless.
Oh and, regarding my first comment, i know it might be a bit provoking especially to those tender to the topic. If someone has questions on this, feel free to pm me on it, particularly if it got you heated, as i want to avoid drama in this thread if possible. I don't have any hate persay to any group, but i disagree on many how's and why's, and i think misconceptions on them only further hurt those who are already hurt. I also say this as a man who faced abuse, had abused / abusive family, several friends for many years whom had fluctuated sexually, and have fluctuated sexually myself. So im not trying to spout things without thought.
But one thing i know for certain : this is going to be a very hot topic for a while, if not for the entire life of rimworld.
i don't think tynan expected this when adding what is more or less just character fluff for colonists as part of the social aspect.
literally why.
Quote from: Goldenpotatoes on January 31, 2016, 10:07:38 AM
i don't think tynan expected this when adding what is more or less just character fluff for colonists as part of the social aspect.
literally why.
It's not about why, it's about WHY NOT?
...
Well I could list many reasons...
Anyways, I'm totally gonna name my colonists after people I know now... heh...
Well all things considered it's not such a big deal; I'd gladly butcher the gay colonists to keep cannibals happy, but then again I wouldn't want them to get AIDS or random STDs. I guess the crematorium will do. 8)
User was temp banned for this post.
Ramsis warned you..
My post count is testament to the amount of time I spend here, but since this will be the first patch since I bought the game I figured I'd dive in and see what was going on. What's actually going on is simply further proof that the Internet is full of exactly the same people, regardless of which corner you end up in. Frankly, it's soul-destroying. Three pages of Donald Trump's manifesto with about three genuine mechanics-discussing contributions completely lost in the noise. Keep up the good work, boys and girls.
Anyhoo.
When I first started playing I set up special little jail cells for my captives. I quickly realised that, given everyone would want their own bedroom eventually anyway, it was more efficient to just set a bedroom up as a prisoner room until the New Recruit notification popped up, then switch it over so they could keep the same bed. Now it seems I'll have to revert to my old ways and put a bit more thought into how I set up The SHU; double doors, extra wardens and walls made from more than just wood for a start. Sounds good, though!
Quote from: Produno on January 30, 2016, 12:58:27 PM
What? This is a game not a real life simulator. Games are often used as a form of escapeism. Not everyone wants something in a game just because its part of modern society. At least give us an option if we want all our colonists to turn into raving homosexuals :).
We, uh, will probably have that option? I can't see any impediment, as the mechanics stand right now, to turn away someone you consider undesirable - or eject someone from your colony for possessing undesirable traits.
Quote from: Z0MBIE2 on January 30, 2016, 02:40:45 PM
It's likely the code will make relationships and such based off colonists, not gender specific or anything, which removes unnecessary coding. You're not getting a toggle option for people being gay because you can't deal with it.
According to Tynan's post on Reddit gay is a trait:
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/43351c/ludeon_blog_progress_continues/czf40bu
---
To everyone who's considering such action to be morally objectionable it might be worthwhile thinking about the choices you make in Rimworld.
Personally, for instance, I regularly leave elderly people with frail bodies and a bad back who have just crashed to the planet within walking distance of my colony to bleed out slowly while my colonists look on. I've also been known to capture people and harvest whatever organs I need from them before letting them starve to death. More than once I've euthanized someone (presumably against their will) on account of severe brain trauma...
If anyone thinks that this sort of behaviour is less morally objectionable than refusing to let gay people join your colony then you have a very twisted sense of morality.
Im glad to hear it's a trait, and not just a dice roll if someone fancies x gender or not. It would be weird if everyone was bisexual openly on some level.
.... I wonder if "intolerance" or "antigay" would be a trait too. This would be very entertaining, as people arguing about it here could argue about colonists arguing about it. The hilarity that would happen =)
TLDR; making hats out of human leather is fine. Having a pawn labelled as gay is cause for concern.
<sigh>
I am going to attempt to stop feeding the trolls now, Bruxy and others make a good point - this thread is about cool stuff in A13.
Quote from: Bruxy on January 31, 2016, 11:51:23 AM
When I first started playing I set up special little jail cells for my captives. I quickly realised that, given everyone would want their own bedroom eventually anyway, it was more efficient to just set a bedroom up as a prisoner room until the New Recruit notification popped up, then switch it over so they could keep the same bed. Now it seems I'll have to revert to my old ways and put a bit more thought into how I set up The SHU; double doors, extra wardens and walls made from more than just wood for a start. Sounds good, though!
Well now the prisons have to be thought out beforehand. I kind of want to see how fleshed out and how deep this prison system is going to be. Will it rival Prison architect? I guess not, but it's still an interesting addition. ;)
Quote from: Fluffy (l2032) on January 31, 2016, 02:47:45 PM
TLDR; making hats out of human leather is fine. Having a pawn labelled as gay is cause for concern.
<sigh>
This reminds me of something I posted a long time ago (link (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=14866.msg156830#msg156830)). I don't think it exists yet in the game, is it? Or even in the real world?
I never got in trouble for that, either :D
Quote from: Noobshock on January 31, 2016, 11:24:23 AM
Well all things considered it's not such a big deal; I'd gladly butcher the gay colonists to keep cannibals happy, but then again I wouldn't want them to get AIDS or random STDs. I guess the crematorium will do. 8)
User was temp banned for this post.
Ramsis warned you..
Lol this is a company forum please don't be too too rash with your comments.
Quote from: Fluffy (l2032) on January 31, 2016, 02:47:45 PM
TLDR; making hats out of human leather is fine. Having a pawn labelled as gay is cause for concern.
<sigh>
I am going to attempt to stop feeding the trolls now, Bruxy and others make a good point - this thread is about cool stuff in A13.
You feed the trolls every time you post. Just live and let live and ignore them completely. Also human leather clothes are worth a lot in game because muh black market prices.
I can't wait for this A13 update, I really want to see a bunch of raiders show up and it turns out they're a family or something weird.
Also there should be more sophisticated raiding party actions and shit, like say raiders bring an EMP mortar to take down your turrets while their riflemen advance. That'd be cool.
So excited to here about A13! Although I don't know how much I will love the fact that event 'colonists' so to speak will come back again. Why do I get the feeling all the fleeing pawns I rejected are going to team-up as raiders and curb stomp my bases...
Also excited about the new relationships aspects will make the game feel more alive, besides can't you imagine all the internal conflict a colony would have between a small group of people..stuck with each other day and day out in dire conditions?
Quote from: silvervixen667 on January 31, 2016, 10:24:55 PM
So excited to here about A13! Although I don't know how much I will love the fact that event 'colonists' so to speak will come back again. Why do I get the feeling all the fleeing pawns I rejected are going to team-up as raiders and curb stomp my bases...
Also excited about the new relationships aspects will make the game feel more alive, besides can't you imagine all the internal conflict a colony would have between a small group of people..stuck with each other day and day out in dire conditions?
man.. i never thought about all the people ive kicked out coming back to destroy me. Huh, thats not a fun thought. And welcome to the forums!, if you ever need any human-skin clothing or fine human meals. I'm your guy ;)
Thank you! I have been lurking a lot, mainly in the mods section, but I just had to share my excitement. Think of all the angry old ladies coming after you...*shutter*. Or the potential heartbreak if a colonist's SO/brother/sister etc ends up on the opposite site and dies in conflict. I imagine said colonist would get a huge mood decrease upon finding the body...possible Romeo and Juilet would be for dramatics.
Quote from: jzero on January 31, 2016, 10:40:16 PMIf you ever need any human-skin clothing or fine human meals. I'm your guy ;)
Oh my, I hadn't even thought of the cannibalism/clothing issues with relationships. "This hat was my sister you monster!"
Imagine if clothing made from human leather listed the name(s) of the "donors" in the item description...
wait wait wait, is there going to be "wearing a family member -30" thought? If theres not my mood -30
Quote from: skullywag on February 01, 2016, 07:29:58 AM
wait wait wait, is there going to be "wearing a family member -30" thought? If theres not my mood -30
Wearing my husband -40
Wearing my lover -30
Wearing my friend -15
And also:
Killed family -30
Killed friend -20
God, this is going to be hilarius.
Also, Visitor's bee hive trap.
I also wonder if it will eventually effect combat / performance, like hesitation, aggression, strong nerve, and other things from emotions either buffing or debuffing stuff.
Particularly cool if this could add / remove traits... Like a vengful pacifist becoming a willing fighter after seeing a loved one killed , or something else.
Quote from: Skissor on February 01, 2016, 07:54:26 AM
Wearing my husband -40
Wearing my lover -30
Well. That depends on
which part of "my husband" and "my lover" I'm wearing...and
where. Given the right answers, it could be a mood bonus, instead.
Also wearing the mother in law +30
Well, that guy Darkeye killed my wife, but he was captured, and now he is in the prision.
I'm gonna shank him to death.
Vengence, +15 mood boost. Happens spontaneously.
Quote from: skullywag on February 02, 2016, 03:58:28 AM
Also wearing the mother in law +30
Wearing Tynan parka +100 ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Dream an speculate on, it is hilarious....
And then reality of how limited the interactions are will set in,
just like the animal armies did.
Whelp, I look forward to my psychopath colony. Preferably with the cannibal trait. So I can kill and eat anyone I want.
"Dude! You made a hat out of my brother! His face looks a lot better on your head than it ever did on his own."
Now that the game will have gay people and eventually children (once Tynan is ready to tackle that ball of wax) will there be same sex parents? Last I heard that technology is coming around in the next few years.
Well here goes nothing. WHO CARES ABOUT GAY PEOPLE! IT'S A NEW GOD DAMN ALPHA! IT'S SHAPED UP TO BE A HELL OF A GOOD ONE! ,
Thank
Edit1:Guys... toxic fallout... 3 mounths indoors... people fighting... oh. My. God.
toxic fallout... 3 months indoors... all female colonists are pregnant... oh my god
Just checked the update again and saw Trauma Savant a.k.a brain damage unlocking hidden talents. I can only imagine how awkward the situation will be when your best man is bleeding out with a fractured skull because a tribesman repeatedly clubbed his head, but he unlocked his hidden talent of cooking.
Also, does this mean we'll have to keep our pawns from getting too close to each other? I'm not looking forward to the colony's social butterfly dying to a squirrel and everyone falling into depression, which leads to social fights, that leads to more possible death, that leads to more depression.
Welcome to the wonderful world of tantrum spirals, we have !FUN! here! (also beer, loads of beer)
Still waiting for the event where someone get's so drunk, it takes a bottle and attack other colonists.
Quote from: TLHeart on February 02, 2016, 03:53:15 PM
Dream an speculate on, it is hilarious....
And then reality of how limited the interactions are will set in,
just like the animal armies did.
Can I ask... What is the point of you even being in the forums with so much passive aggressiveness? We are making jokes about some scenarios that will likely not happen anyway. Nobody is dense enough to believe it, seriously.
Also, the animal implementation completely surprised me! What exactly was blown out of proportion there if I may ask?
Quote from: Skissor on February 03, 2016, 12:15:20 PM
Quote from: TLHeart on February 02, 2016, 03:53:15 PM
Dream an speculate on, it is hilarious....
And then reality of how limited the interactions are will set in,
just like the animal armies did.
Can I ask... What is the point of you even being in the forums with so much passive aggressiveness? We are making jokes about some scenarios that will likely not happen anyway. Nobody is dense enough to believe it, seriously.
Also, the animal implementation completely surprised me! What exactly was blown out of proportion there if I may ask?
Maybe he just wants attention.
I kinda recall when animals were mentioned on the changelog, and alot of people got hyped over endless possibilities, and well... boomrat army is a thing.
Quote from: StorymasterQ on February 01, 2016, 08:53:34 PM
Well. That depends on which part of "my husband" and "my lover" I'm wearing...and where. Given the right answers, it could be a mood bonus, instead.
Exhaled air through my nose slightly faster than normal at this one.
Quote from: Skissor on February 03, 2016, 12:15:20 PM
Quote from: TLHeart on February 02, 2016, 03:53:15 PM
Dream an speculate on, it is hilarious....
And then reality of how limited the interactions are will set in,
just like the animal armies did.
Can I ask... What is the point of you even being in the forums with so much passive aggressiveness? We are making jokes about some scenarios that will likely not happen anyway. Nobody is dense enough to believe it, seriously.
Also, the animal implementation completely surprised me! What exactly was blown out of proportion there if I may ask?
Yes the jokes are hilarious, and as you have said will never happen in game... the reality of the limits of the game... So who is the dense one?
As for the animals, lots of people talking about huge animal armies, at the ready, well then the limitations of the game set in.
Animals hardly even add to the game as implemented... The whole nuzzle and gives a positive mood to the colonist has been broken since release. The amount of food used to tame, and feed an animal are not ever recovered in any way if you want them as a food source.
As far a being part of the forum, that is my choice. Not everyone has to be the same to be part of the forum. That would be very very boring.
Quote from: Fluffy (l2032) on February 03, 2016, 03:24:39 AM
Welcome to the wonderful world of tantrum spirals, we have !FUN! here! (also beer, loads of beer)
But with a pretty and functional UI! =-D
And zigzagoon bee hive kill boxes that poison and almost kill visitors.
So visitors still exist solely to find amusing ways to kill?
Well, in the vanilla game yes... I don't remember if in the vanilla visitors leave something (silver, food) if they are happy with the hospitality.
If you modded, the visitors can be talked to, recruited and some other interactions. Don't know if you can make the "hotel" yet, somewhere you make for them to eat and sleep.
So can I have this update now-ish? What if I said please?
Currently vanilla visitors dont leave anything unless they die.
woot! finally relationships. woohoo!
does it come with sexy times? can couples finally use the royal beds at the same time?
will it come with jealousies and rivalries and threesomes? lel.
also, to those comparing this to the sims. you probably haven't been playing the sims correctly.
sims is about inviting people you hate over to a party and then creatively arranging for them some "accidents" to collect their gravestones to summon their ghosts and then impregnating every single woman with your love seed while becoming friends with death and letting him join your rock band to play the bass.
lel.
it's a sandbox, just like GTA or any other sandbox. your limitations are based on your own creativity to enjoy the tools that the devs give you. the more tools and options you have, the better. this allows you to play the game exactly however you like it.
-----
as for me. relationships in rimworld (does this come with the option to spawn children?) would just mean that i'm going for a long game. long enough to actually see the children grow into adulthood.
oh yea, i'm going for a hundred year playthrough once kids are introduced to rimworld.
Multiple pawns to a bed is confirmed.
Quote from: TLHeart on February 03, 2016, 06:34:16 PM
Yes the jokes are hilarious, and as you have said will never happen in game... the reality of the limits of the game... So who is the dense one?
Nobody I guess, since discussing possibilities is nothing else than poor guessing after all.
Quote from: Snownova on February 01, 2016, 05:33:14 AM
Oh my, I hadn't even thought of the cannibalism/clothing issues with relationships. "This hat was my sister you monster!"
Imagine if clothing made from human leather listed the name(s) of the "donors" in the item description...
My god, this idea is so twisted I never even thought of it! Sadly, it'd be really fiddly to execute but it would definitely be amusing... for that (hopefully-tiny) group of players who would ever see it.
As for the gay trait, I hesitate to even respond to this discussion, but I'll just say that this aspect (like many in RW) is largely modeled on the way Crusader Kings 2 handles homosexuality. As in, it's just sort of there. I suppose the CK2 devs have a very consistent historical context to lean on (and deflect criticism towards) but I never heard anyone complaining about it. Anyway, there's no activist intent behind this feature; it took like an hour to implement. It's just a trait like any other that inverts the "how attracted am I towards person X" function with respect to gender.
Speaking generally...
I've actually thought about the sociology of RW and as soon as pregnancy and children are in, there's just massive potential for potentially uncomfortable situations. I think people aren't really bothered by cannibalism because it's so distant. But with relationships and reproduction, the game very quickly seems to want to model human miscarriages, fetal alcohol syndrome, abortions, gay hatred, gender hatreds, domestic violence, etc etc.
Ordinarily I would just do all of this of this since it is good design to use easy-to-implement features that create personal dramas. But... damn. It gets real heavy real fast.
Even as it is right now, with no new features, I just realized
while writing this that domestic violence is already in the game! Characters with low opinions of each other can get in fights. Lovers or spouses can have low opinions. So... yeah.
And as soon as pregnancy is added, it'll use the same code as animal pregnancy, which necessarily (in order to be logical and create drama) models miscarriage due to bad luck, starvation or injury. Well, that can happen to humans too. It can also be a method of abortion: have a colonist you don't want pregnant? Just starve her for two weeks, problem solved. This is basically already in the game (it already works for animals).
There will be other rather dark incentives. You already have an incentive to say, let old refugees die. Once children are in, if you want the colony to expand via child-rearing, you might have an incentive to exclude gays from the community because their relationships don't produce biological children and you want to optimize your food-to-children ratio. And so on, and so on.
I don't want to Playskool-ize the game, I just have to shake my head and laugh darkly at some of the stuff that pops out of it so easily and naturally, often without even developer intent, but with such heavy implications.
I think it says something about how the logic of life knits together. Once you put in the basic rules, all the interest and joy and ugliness spring forth automatically. That emergence is an amazing source of power and the basis of RW's design - but it's also a bit scary sometimes!
Finally, while this isn't the goal of the design, it naturally provides some interesting food for thought about ethics, morality, survival, and how they relate. It's funny to laugh about cannibalizing your 80-year-old crippled colonist during a bad winter, but maybe it also says something about our real-life morality and why it differs from that of our ancestors, who lived in much harder environments than we do.
Anyway, I find it interesting to think about. And yet again the power of emergence amazes me.
Wow. Just think bout what started this thread. The opinion that bug-fueled gay prison breaks were going to be funny. But it resulted in one guy getting temp-banned twice, twice!. Then a few pages of cannibal conversations with an argument in there somewhere involving animal armies. And now Tynan posted. Funny how threads go all over the place isn't it :)
Quote from: Tynan on February 07, 2016, 01:33:58 PM
Finally, while this isn't the goal of the design, it naturally provides some interesting food for thought about ethics, morality, survival, and how they relate. It's funny to laugh about cannibalizing your 80-year-old crippled colonist during a bad winter, but maybe it also says something about our real-life morality and why it differs from that of our ancestors, who lived in much harder environments than we do.
Anyway, I find it interesting to think about. And yet again the power of emergence amazes me.
I think while most people find ways to point fingers for action X,Y, or Z... especially for things in the ancient past, they forget to look at all the factors that lead up to that or those actions. RW, as you put it Tynan, has a unique way of bringing this to the surface without any intent. It simply is there lurking and only needs the right conditions to bring them out just like real life does. It's the reason I love playing RW and have not grown tired of it at all.
Looking forward to A13 release with a little hesitation. More of real life possibilities have been added.
Edit: Just a little after thought on my above message. RW has a unique way of modeling life. Life has a law that most people don't want to believe exists.
The law is this: If the conditions for life to happen exist, life will happen.
That being said, this game has many of the 'possibilities' there, in the game. When the conditions are right; as odd, silly, dark, morbid, sick, or twisted as things become those same 'possibilities' exist in real life. Granted we aren't going to see a hive of single minded giant insects invading a prison that kick off a riot that turns into a jail break lead by two gay brothers who happen to be also married... but perhaps instead of the giant insects it ends up being caused by poor conditions leading to an infestation of biting insects that finally make these two brothers say enough is enough with the poor treatment, bad conditions, starvation conditions, and so on. As I said, if the conditions are right, life will happen even if it sounds silly or funny in the contrast of a game. Just think about it a little.
Amazing job Tynan. Even though most of us know it was never intended. Still, amazing.
Quote from: Tynan on February 07, 2016, 01:33:58 PM
[.....]
So basically, domestic abuse and abortion confirmed. Nice!
Quote from: jzero on February 07, 2016, 02:11:45 PM
Wow. Just think bout what started this thread. The opinion that bug-fueled gay prison breaks were going to be funny. But it resulted in one guy getting temp-banned twice, twice!. Then a few pages of cannibal conversations with an argument in there somewhere involving animal armies. And now Tynan posted. Funny how threads go all over the place isn't it :)
Also, just think about how strange all of this would sound if we forgot that we were talking about a game.. :P
Quote from: Tynan on February 07, 2016, 01:33:58 PM
As for the gay trait, I hesitate to even respond to this discussion, but I'll just say that this aspect (like many in RW) is largely modeled on the way Crusader Kings 2 handles homosexuality. As in, it's just sort of there. I suppose the CK2 devs have a very consistent historical context to lean on (and deflect criticism towards) but I never heard anyone complaining about it.
As long as humans rely on sexual reproduction genetically there will always be homosexuality due to the phenotype necessities for such, thus it's excusable in any simulation realistic and otherwise that it would be a thing that would occur. I don't really want to elaborate on why since this is a company forum and I don't want to be
that guy.
Anyhow Tynan if someone castigates you for adding salad tossers, or if someone castigates you for not being 'progressive enough', ignore them. It's your game mate don't let idiots sway you (if it ever comes to the point where you actually give in to minority demand).
Also have a video for enduring my shitpost
https://youtu.be/msPej22MP7o
Tynans post reminds me why i love him as a dev. I just hope the community is mature enough to endure upcoming topics that i know will be modded in : namely rape, stds, incest, and more
Quote from: mumblemumble on February 07, 2016, 08:54:16 PM
Tynans post reminds me why i love him as a dev. I just hope the community is mature enough to endure upcoming topics that i know will be modded in : namely rape, stds, incest, and more
I... I kind of doubt that, man...
What's probably more likely is someone requesting it and then earning uncomfortable replies or weird looks.
Edit:
But thinking about it, could be something that could add alot in the game, traumatic experiences for pawns, being disliked by the entire colony, drama, etc. That is if done correctly.
Dunno, quite an uncomfortable topic to discuss outside of game mechanics.
Quote from: mumblemumble on February 07, 2016, 08:54:16 PM
Tynans post reminds me why i love him as a dev. I just hope the community is mature enough to endure upcoming topics that i know will be modded in : namely rape, stds, incest, and more
We already have a Hot Coffee-esque mod where dudes hump mechanoids
If the community were going to be hooligans they'd have done it already
Well incest would be extremely rare to begin with, obviously, but rape i could see as a mental break outcome, slim chance of attempt in a early relationship with those whom are psychotic, or even something used by waring factions to hurt the enemy.
Also yes, im fully aware these subjects are controversial and uncomfortable, but i feel it would most definitely add to drama... And what better way to make you absolutely vilify an enemy faction than if one of your colonists was assaulted, and it caused issues for the entire colony because of it? I imagine it could stir up extremely powerful emotions. Even if it was just a kidnapped colonists returned, beaten and broken, barely able to walk, in a mess of a mental state, and everyone scrambling to care for them, that alone could be huge and cause many reactions.
But again, these might just stay as mods. I know tynan is brave on many topics, but i don't know how many cans of worms he wants to bother opening.
But regardless, rimworld to me has always been a bit of a humanity simulator in a sense, seeing how people live, get along, function, and seeing how difficult, uncomfortable, and outright painful things are delt with is a main feature in my mind. In that way, its very much an "adult" game - not in that its obscene, lewd, or gorey, but because you deal with very real, not particularly comfortable situations semi regularly, and sometimes there simply isn't a good outcome. But you still press on, and do your damn best, perhaps questioning decisions after, but continuing till the end anyway. And this is why i think these features would be fantastic, is to enhance THAT element...
Though... Really even these topics are limited by the fact people are static personality wise. It would be AMAZING if people had personal growth, with stats changing over time through specific events (surviving nasty battles giving a fast runner trait, excessive exposure to violence giving psychosis, ect) or even having traits phase in / out with mood. I could particularly see people getting depressive traits for a certain period of time with it, which would be very VERY interesting for character development, as well as giving a much deeper connection to pawns.
Are these things uncomfortable? Yes. Grim? Yes. Triggering? Yes.
Adding to emotional impact / storytelling possibilities? Absolutely.
Though, just my opinion i guess, and I'm fully aware many will disagree JUST because its extremely uncomfortable to discuss.
QuoteTriggering?
No, get out of here mate.
Ayy lmao, can't wait to see how this discussion goes on when it gets on Steam and the community doubles.
Quote from: Bob_Namg on February 08, 2016, 02:12:51 AM
QuoteTriggering?
No, get out of here mate.
Never said i agreed with such a policy, but such people do exist, and are also in rimworld communities, like folks suggesting transgender colonists (not kidding, I've seen this) .... Like a colony would risk surgery on perfectly physically healthy people , silver every month for hormones, and huge risks to social structure just because one person wasn't comfortable with their body, ontop of then very volatile mentality during the "change" . Certainly would never happen in most colonies struggling to survive, and frankly id think such people would have better priorities, like not becoming warg meat, or mechanoid target practice.
But again, just my opinion, and I've already covered this and more in this very thread.
Ok, so what we've learned from this thread is everybody's hyped up over a feature that's taken one hour to implement, and most of the discussed interactions won't happen (because that'd be stupid/too complicated/whatever).
Lets get back to adding some end-game content here. I found some of the mods really drew out the gameplay, making the tech tree longer essentially, requiring refining of resources, etc.
As it stands now, you've got end-game within a couple of hours on a colony (as far as useful tech is concerned), and nothing to really do at that point except ... sit, and draw out the game, and expand your colony with no driving force/purpose.
Quote from: porcupine on February 08, 2016, 02:55:03 PM
Ok, so what we've learned from this thread is everybody's hyped up over a feature that's taken one hour to implement, and most of the discussed interactions won't happen (because that'd be stupid/too complicated/whatever).
Lets get back to adding some end-game content here. I found some of the mods really drew out the gameplay, making the tech tree longer essentially, requiring refining of resources, etc.
As it stands now, you've got end-game within a couple of hours on a colony (as far as useful tech is concerned), and nothing to really do at that point except ... sit, and draw out the game, and expand your colony with no driving force/purpose.
Ghetto water mechanics?
I leave for three days and Tynan gave me a long post that is filled with quotes I'm going to add to my list of Rimworld quotes.
This is great! My signature is being kept relevant by Tynan Himself!
Quote from: porcupine on February 08, 2016, 02:55:03 PM
Ok, so what we've learned from this thread is everybody's hyped up over a feature that's taken one hour to implement, and most of the discussed interactions won't happen (because that'd be stupid/too complicated/whatever).
Lets get back to adding some end-game content here. I found some of the mods really drew out the gameplay, making the tech tree longer essentially, requiring refining of resources, etc.
As it stands now, you've got end-game within a couple of hours on a colony (as far as useful tech is concerned), and nothing to really do at that point except ... sit, and draw out the game, and expand your colony with no driving force/purpose.
There are definitely more things to research and build, so the end-game will take longer to get to.
But just in general, I don't think the "make the game longer by adding more content to consume" linear model is the right one for RW. It's not really a content consumption game. I prefer to think of it more like adding more aspects and possibilities to a system, which can generate more outcomes and create interest over time. Which is related to content consumption, but is quite different because it imagines the content->outcome relationship as nonlinear instead of linear.
I'm hoping things like relationships will actually add a lot more endgame, just because the game will have more things to generate stories about and will generate more stories long-term that way.
The ideal end-game of the design is for the game to become eternally interesting, with no relation to things like how many research projects there are. It shouldn't be a string of content you eat until you're done, but rather a system you immerse yourself in, that cycles through beginnings and endings essentially without limit (possibly across multiple playthroughs). I don't think we're really there, but that's just the theoretical perfect target I'm chasing.
Quote from: Tynan on February 09, 2016, 06:15:16 AM
I'm hoping things like relationships will actually add a lot more endgame, just because the game will have more things to generate stories about and will generate more stories long-term that way.
The ideal end-game of the design is for the game to become eternally interesting, with no relation to things like how many research projects there are. It shouldn't be a string of content you eat until you're done, but rather a system you immerse yourself in, that cycles through beginnings and endings essentially without limit (possibly across multiple playthroughs). I don't think we're really there, but that's just the theoretical perfect target I'm chasing.
I'm drooling ;D
Question for the Ty-meister, in relation to that end game module of endless play-ability. Do you think that end games could potentially end up with an option to continue on another storyline?
Alright examples are best to explain this. Say you are successful in launching a ship and you get 8 colonists off the ground. Do you think there could be an option to follow them to the next 'randomly generated' world? Where they begin over on a new planet (or the same planet, might be a random event they get shot down again on another part of the world).
Or perhaps once your colony get destroyed and the ruins of your once thriving colony is now deserted, the random event for a wanderer to join could be changed to a small band of refugee from a town come to settle? Effectively reseting some of the difficulty level to match the new wanderers joining, allowing them to choose a new name if they want and sort of forging a new story in itself? Like the next chapter to the saga.
Idk I thought I might ask if that's the direction your taking coz it's been itching at me for months now xD. Regardless of which I'm still foaming for this new update and a complete game down the track.
Quote from: Skissor on February 08, 2016, 08:41:50 AM
Ayy lmao, can't wait to see how this discussion goes on when it gets on Steam and the community doubles.
Oh man when the Steam peeps get on here stuff will get real interesting.
Several important things to realize about relationships, pregnancy, and child-rearing.
1) In almost all cultures worldwide, up until about the 1900s or so (and continuing in the more..... "rural" parts of the world today), people lived CRAMMED together.
Whole families would live in one-room houses, multiple related-families in houses next-door, and so on and so forth. Many tribal groups lived in "longhouses", where each family got a little compartment of the whole. "Privacy" was at a premium, and a luxury. Relatedly, in many places, children were reared communally. Not to say that they wouldn't know who their parents were, nor not live with them, but the whole community banded together to raise them, teach them skills, and keep them safe.
2) Child mortality was really, really, REALLY high.
That old chestnut about "-X- people only had an average life expectancy of 30 years!!!!!" is a little more complicated than it appears. Basically, the average "life span" (which is what most people think about when they hear "life expectancy") has been roughly the same for the entirety of human existance: between 50-70 years. "Life expectancy" is actually an average of how long people tend to live. Most adults from the Stone Ages to the 1900s, barring death from war/accident/disease, could reasonably expect to see 50. That "life expectancy" number tends to be so low due to the absurdly high level of infant mortality that has been the norm for most of human existence. Barring modern "Western" methods of childbirth and medicine, most children do not survive, either birth or the first few years of life. Same with mothers. Up until the 1950s or so, childbirth was a very dangerous time for the mother. Many mothers bled to death after giving birth.
This level of child mortality is one of the reasons "ancient", and even rural families in the modern world, have so many goddamn kids. You need to have a lot in order to have a a decent number survive to adulthood. It was for this reason that "adulthood" was assumed at a much lower age in ancient times than it was today. In Colonial America, you were considered an adult at 15-16, and could be expected to marry and serve in the militia at that age.
3) Large families are preferred.
Another reason for "ancient" and rural families to have large groups of children is simple: more hands make for light work. Contrary to popular opinion on this forum, children aren't "useless" for the first 15 years of life. Even young children can be given chores (cleaning, gathering firewood, milking animals, etc), and could/would lessen the workload on adult members of the group. Hell, in Classical Greece, children as young as 3-4 were taught how to spin thread for weaving.
So, what does this mean for Rimworld?
- "Having children" would be a serious investiture of time and resources. Humans are one of the few species on the planet that spend so much time in adolescence. Most animals become "adults" after 1 year or so. This long adolescence lets humans pass on skills, as well as give their offspring the best chances for survival. However, you actually have to raise the kid for that long! On the other hand, children would be able to accomplish different jobs, based on age.
-Barring "Glitterworld" medicine and well-kept hospital faculties, "mortality", both among mothers, newborns and young children, should be relatively high. You would want to keep expecting mothers well-fed, warm, and well-rested. Newborns and young children tend to have depressed immune systems, so they would be more susceptible to disease until they grow up some. Keeping them inside and keeping your living facilities clean would minimize this
-"Childhood" would be relatively short. "Childhood" meaning the time when the children have no responsibilities. I think that the "life stages" from animals could be used with a little modification.
1- Newborn: basically, a prop in the parents room/living space. 0- 12 months
2- Child: like "animal juveniles". Can be given minor tasks (not fighting), like cleaning or hauling (at reduced rates compared to adults), or be taught skills by adult members. 1 year - 10 years.
3- Juvenile: Teenagers, basically. Can do everything adults can do (including fighting), at slightly reduced rates/efficiency. Can also be taught skills, just like children. 10 years -14 years.
4- Adult. 14+. I have had 14 year-old-raiders in my games.
It is important to note that in the "real world", especially in the Colonial times, a colony wasn't considered "permanent" until there were established families, and children were born. The King of France paid unmarried women to travel to New France (Canada) in order to marry the unmarried men and increase the population and permanency of the colony.
@Boston
Most of that is accurate though id argue that giving birth isnt quite as bad as you say. If it were then most women wouldnt survive to produce so many children. That being said, when things go wrong, there wasnt much anyone could do about it until recently.
Next Id ague that the useful child phase would be a bit older than 1 year. Maybe 2 at the earliest. A toddler phase where they just do joy activities or follow a parent might be best for years 1-4 where they might pick up their skill passions for later in life.
Quote from: Tynan on February 09, 2016, 06:15:16 AM
Quote from: porcupine on February 08, 2016, 02:55:03 PM
Ok, so what we've learned from this thread is everybody's hyped up over a feature that's taken one hour to implement, and most of the discussed interactions won't happen (because that'd be stupid/too complicated/whatever).
Lets get back to adding some end-game content here. I found some of the mods really drew out the gameplay, making the tech tree longer essentially, requiring refining of resources, etc.
As it stands now, you've got end-game within a couple of hours on a colony (as far as useful tech is concerned), and nothing to really do at that point except ... sit, and draw out the game, and expand your colony with no driving force/purpose.
There are definitely more things to research and build, so the end-game will take longer to get to.
But just in general, I don't think the "make the game longer by adding more content to consume" linear model is the right one for RW. It's not really a content consumption game. I prefer to think of it more like adding more aspects and possibilities to a system, which can generate more outcomes and create interest over time. Which is related to content consumption, but is quite different because it imagines the content->outcome relationship as nonlinear instead of linear.
I'm hoping things like relationships will actually add a lot more endgame, just because the game will have more things to generate stories about and will generate more stories long-term that way.
The ideal end-game of the design is for the game to become eternally interesting, with no relation to things like how many research projects there are. It shouldn't be a string of content you eat until you're done, but rather a system you immerse yourself in, that cycles through beginnings and endings essentially without limit (possibly across multiple playthroughs). I don't think we're really there, but that's just the theoretical perfect target I'm chasing.
Sure, but what I'm saying is, after the first play through or two, not much changes. I've played from the first Alpha I think, and I've certainly put in tons of RW time, but I skipped a few of the last Alpha's (waited almost a year), and when I came back, it didn't feel like much had changed in terms of how the game rolled out.
Sure, some stuff needed research, that I could swear did not before. Raids became more reasonable. Plasteel became important to build a ship, etc., but aside from interacting with a few new animals and trying to train them, there wasn't much to do that felt new. It was like I hadn't missed much at all. There were no new challenges.
Quote from: mumblemumble on February 08, 2016, 09:43:11 AM
Quote from: Bob_Namg on February 08, 2016, 02:12:51 AM
QuoteTriggering?
No, get out of here mate.
Never said i agreed with such a policy, but such people do exist, and are also in rimworld communities, like folks suggesting transgender colonists (not kidding, I've seen this) .... Like a colony would risk surgery on perfectly physically healthy people , silver every month for hormones, and huge risks to social structure just because one person wasn't comfortable with their body, ontop of then very volatile mentality during the "change" . Certainly would never happen in most colonies struggling to survive, and frankly id think such people would have better priorities, like not becoming warg meat, or mechanoid target practice.
But again, just my opinion, and I've already covered this and more in this very thread.
Being transgender is more than just hormone treatments, or "changes". Not everyone takes any sort of hormone (not everyone gets them), not everyone goes into any surgery at all. This reasoning that the game shouldn't have transgender people "because it's expensive and difficult for colonies to support them" is asinine, and a misunderstanding of what being transgender is.
But I wouldn't put anything past a forum where saying that The Thing was good because it had no women in it is somehow acceptable.
If you mean perhaps hermaphrodites whom are literally born a certain way, then yes. Though those are hermaphrodites, not transgender.
As for alternatives, a bit unsure what else you can mean.... Unless you mean perhaps those who consider themselves "just" more fem or butch, but id call that a personality quirk, not necessarily full blown transgender. So if you want to explain how im wrong instead of just SAYING im wrong, go right ahead. Otherwise I'm inclined to not believe you, if you don't explain yourself.
Also, not sure about the "no women thing" i never said that, and realize women are capable, but protected in life, since they are valuable compared to men. (childbearing, pleasant company, slightly more vulnerable health wise, ect) and fyi, women in rimworld can do whatever men can, as far as I'm aware. (Though a bellcurve for strength / dexterity between genders would be cool.)
I think Tynan is making the right call. Looking at what CK2 does and just putting it in because it exists. Gay people are a thing, so they are in. The dark horrible stuff that can happen because he simply includes a feature doesnt mean the feature should be avoided. Kids happen, so they should be put in. (Eventually) What we do with them and the terrible things that can happen are just a part of that. If you want to have a colony where all you do is eat children and gay people... well thats your call... but Tynan shouldnt avoid those bits to the game just because thats what someone wants to do.
As for what he said about the End Game, some games dont have an end game and thats the point. SimCity (Skylines now) was a good game because there was never an end. DF doesnt have an end, you can keep sending dwarfs to reclaim the same hold over and over. its not COD giving a 'story' that you try to get too the end of ASAP, its about giving you a place to tell a story. one that has as much depth as possible. (while still being fun) My colony in A12 is almost 20years old. i could have had a whole new generation by now. Once RW is totally finished I could play endlessly and always find the fun in telling a story and never knowing how its going to end.
Quote from: Maxuli on February 12, 2016, 09:10:56 AM
But I wouldn't put anything past a forum where saying that The Thing was good because it had no women in it is somehow acceptable.
;D top kek
It's a rather rare occurrence in movies and it's one of the things that make this particular one stand out as it adds to the grim and desperate atmosphere. How that's offensive to anyone is a mystery to me.
I've read this entire thread and all I can think about was mass effect 3. I had gone through 2 so many times to get all of the endings and relationships with all the characters you can. So when I played 3 it wasn't much different. Until I happened across two gay characters on the ship. At first I thought "why?" Then it hit me. I was playing a video game, but not only that but one where I had gotten intimate with a few other alien species. I'm not saying I support or hate the idea. It just adds something else to the game. Something that makes it a little more real. Ever since I started playing rimworld I've wanted not only more tech and items to build and research, but more of a reason to believe my colonist are real and living people with lives and feelings. And honestly a canibal bothers me more than a gay person would. Unless they're preachy.
Now I'm thinking about preachy canibals.
Quote from: mumblemumble on February 12, 2016, 11:16:25 AM
If you mean perhaps hermaphrodites whom are literally born a certain way, then yes. Though those are hermaphrodites, not transgender.
As for alternatives, a bit unsure what else you can mean.... Unless you mean perhaps those who consider themselves "just" more fem or butch, but id call that a personality quirk, not necessarily full blown transgender. So if you want to explain how im wrong instead of just SAYING im wrong, go right ahead. Otherwise I'm inclined to not believe you, if you don't explain yourself.
Also, not sure about the "no women thing" i never said that, and realize women are capable, but protected in life, since they are valuable compared to men. (childbearing, pleasant company, slightly more vulnerable health wise, ect) and fyi, women in rimworld can do whatever men can, as far as I'm aware. (Though a bellcurve for strength / dexterity between genders would be cool.)
Transgender people are also born a certain way as well. We experience dysphoria for having a body that doesn't match our gender identity. I'm not sure what your point is here.
Your second paragraph is basically expression of masculinity/femininity, that goes beyond being just transgender and can be applied to everyone. While survival is a big aspect of the game and jobs aren't really gendered, some clothing/hairstyles/accessories can be described as feminine/masculine. Maybe there can be a system to apply this femininity/masculinity in-game. Some survivors are more feminine/masculine in expression and will wear stuff that they like, probably for a mood buff. Gives an incentive to diversify clothing.
Anyways, on the whole "transgender" dealio. As said before, "transgenderness" is more than just changing our bodies. Its important, but it varies. Some want hormones and surgery, some just want hormones and are uncomfortable with surgery, some are just fine with just dressing as the gender they are and aren't really comfortable with hormones or surgery. But the whole interconnecting thing is dysphoria, which is the uncomfortableness one has with ones body because it doesn't match your gender identity. Real Thing (tm).
So how will this be modeled in game? A mood debuff called dysphoria that applies to all transgender survivors. Transgender survivors will usually wear clothing that matches their gender identity for a small mood buff that partially mitigates their debuff. If they get hormones, their physically shape changes and they get a permanent mood buff that cancels out the dysphoria or even goes over it a bit. If they get surgery, the dysphoria debuff goes away and they get a permanent mood buff that makes it hard for them to break.
Now, this path assumes all transgender characters want to go down the path of surgery, which isn't true IRL but is simplified for the game. Now, transgender people in game as in real life are pretty rare. Low rate of occurrence but we still exist. If you get one and take the time and money to invest in them, you can end up with a survivor who is pretty hard to break, signifying their dedication to the colony that did so much for them.
Transgenderism is a mental illness. Strong feelings of inadequacy does not mean you are born the wrong gender or that chopping your dick off will help your life down the line. This will become obvious once all the special-snowflakism and victim-culture rentseeking die down as a result of economic contraction. Right now the places advocating for these ideas are not scientific but social echo-chambers (hello tumblr) where the slightest hint of disagreement or calling into question the ballooning insanity where "I identify as a pansexual dragonkin" is taken seriously (because hey, you can "identify" as a dog if you feel like it) leads to hysterical witch-hunts.
The strongest evidence in the nature vs nurture debate when it comes to sexual preference and gender identity are studies of identical twins. I'll let you guess what their conclusions are.
Unfortunately tumblr & co aren't interested in science. The LGBTQRSTUVWXYZ advocacy groups are little more than a cult at this point.
Pretend noobshock doesn't exist.
Noobshock, even if transgenderism is a mental illness, why you care so much about some people chopping off their dicks just to feel better? I mean, hey, if that will help them in anyway, they can chop whatever they fucking want.
More like: pretend science on these subjects isn't relevant and keep reading tumblr. We get it bruh.
Either way, I don't really care so much but like I've said it's become more like a cult than a movement dedicated to actually helping people (which you can't do if you make it a point to ignore all evidence that doesn't go your way), and it's one of the most aggressively preachy cults out there. So it's not so much that I care, rather that if I don't, these people will find it a productive endeavor to troll all the way to videogame development forums to make sure their made-up identities are culturally supported, since science isn't going to do it. And besides I don't particularly enjoy the thought of letting confused teenagers self-mutilate permanently because some kooky transgender advocate told them it was a good idea.
This post is now relevant for valentines day. Happy valentines day...
Wait... I just checked back onto the forums after several months away and I have a question.
Tynan appears to be back, and the development hiatus has been lifted? If so Where do I find the change log/devblog?
Thanks.
Quote from: Listy on February 14, 2016, 01:50:41 PM
Wait... I just checked back onto the forums after several months away and I have a question.
Tynan appears to be back, and the development hiatus has been lifted? If so Where do I find the change log/devblog?
Thanks.
http://ludeon.com/blog/
The good old changelog isn't being kept anymore
Got it. Thanks.
Quote from: JimmyAgnt007 on February 12, 2016, 11:28:35 AM
I think Tynan is making the right call. Looking at what CK2 does and just putting it in because it exists. Gay people are a thing, so they are in. The dark horrible stuff that can happen because he simply includes a feature doesnt mean the feature should be avoided. Kids happen, so they should be put in. (Eventually) What we do with them and the terrible things that can happen are just a part of that. If you want to have a colony where all you do is eat children and gay people... well thats your call... but Tynan shouldnt avoid those bits to the game just because thats what someone wants to do.
As for what he said about the End Game, some games dont have an end game and thats the point. SimCity (Skylines now) was a good game because there was never an end. DF doesnt have an end, you can keep sending dwarfs to reclaim the same hold over and over. its not COD giving a 'story' that you try to get too the end of ASAP, its about giving you a place to tell a story. one that has as much depth as possible. (while still being fun) My colony in A12 is almost 20years old. i could have had a whole new generation by now. Once RW is totally finished I could play endlessly and always find the fun in telling a story and never knowing how its going to end.
It's definitely the right call. It's hurtful to see opposition to tough content even though the well-praised Dwarf Fortress has all this relationship stuff in it, and I haven't seen anyone complain about it there.
The reason why people care about transgendereism is because people doing such things quickly become even more insecure. Mindsets can be changed with work (which is why i really want a "personal growth" feature in rimworld) but flesh is much harder.
Quite simply, if a guy chops his dick off and has regret later (this DOES happen quite often) then he is fucked, and generally commits suicide, as if he is a heterosexual male after he realizes his regret, he also realizes he will NEVER be able to be intimate with a woman, which is obscenely depressing.
And honestly those who become "transgender" (as someone else made a ruckus on making sure i know it means a very broad definition) very often change their mind and realize they are just insecure. I've seen, and encountered this several times, and its tragic especially if not realized in time, like my experience of a ftm friend who realized she could be straight (formerly identified as les) after being my friend for 5 years, but came to me desperately wanting it after extensive hormone treatment. Of course, me being straight, i rejected her, because the appearance of her was downright repulsive, and it was very traumatic for her to realize she could be straight, work up the courage to ask, only to be rejected by the looks which were not how she naturally was, but now irreversible.
And for the record, i agree with noobshock on the mental illness idea, and find everyone saying to ignore it INSTEAD of arguing a point very telling that they might not even believe it themselves but have EXTREME levels of cognitive dissonance . Transgenderism generally stems from feelings of inferiority. The woman who was trans before admitted this to me, as she was raped countless times as a child, and began to despise her "weak femininity" as she called it. I know if her inferiority issues were addressed, she would be a much happier person. Not to say i hate such people, i don't, but i feel for them. I've been there myself, growing up i had no father and a mother always talked about men being scumbag monsters when i was a boy, and i felt very, very ashamed of my masculinity for half a decade, hating myself, my sex drive, and very possibly being a transsexual "candidate" had i met anyone who suggested and supported it. But thankfully with time sex became acceptable, i like my body, and urges, while still annoying do not cause the suicidal panic they used to have, nor the immense guilt, or feeling like a "monster which only existed to hurt women" as my mother said.
So yeah... I've seen several examples of this, sexuality is very much formed by events, not just "how someone is". Childhood, abuse, parental experience, trauma, and other factors all lead into it, and generally you can even identify why we have certain fetishes if you really identify what happened in the past. And insecurity is best addressed directly, as padding it with things to comfort it only makes one more unstable. Just like someone having a phobia over something refusing to ever acknowledge it exists, will make them gaurentee to shut down if they are triggered by it, rather than just facing their fear, and slowly gaining the ability to stay calm about it.
While I generally tend to avoid posting on these "controversial" topics, I feel obligated to post as a long time gamer.
First and foremost, I have no problems with the proposed additions to the game. They seem like sound and legitimate mechanics to add towards the randomness that is RimWorld. Everyone has the right to their opinions, so for the most part I don't see an issue with the majority of posts here. Some do tend to go a bit overboard though. I really do love how people pointed out wearing hats made of people is less of a moral issue than introducing homosexuals.
That said, I can also understand the other side of the comments. Some people are concerned about adding all these real life aspects to a game. I share this concern as well, but I am still open to new mechanics that enhance the gameplay. Many people do play games as an escape, but that doesn't mean it can't have these aspects to it. It is your game, do what you want with the mechanics it provides. I doubt I am the only one who has made an entire cannibal only colony in which I ate anyone that didn't fit in. I look forward to making a fabulous colony, and downloading mods that add 100's of new colors for the carpets that will decorate my floors. Now I know not everyone would find that entertaining, but I come from an age of gaming where we didn't know what we found entertaining until someone made it for us (and of course, until we gave it a chance).
TL;DR Give it a chance. While you don't make the decisions on what mechanics get added, you do control what happens with them.
Yeah... It really is just an argument over "how does sexuality and mentality work.". But its been stigmatized as something you don't talk about so much in society that now that everyone has a reason to talk about it (possibly adding it in, possibly modeled after "reality") people are all tense and insist they want their version, without entertaining the idea they might possibly be wrong, and simply do not want to hear disagreements because cognitive dissonance. So despite wanting something, they won't sit down and debate it.
Its actually seriously amusing, especially because the topic ensures everyone can say how they feel, without the defense of certain thoughts being "discrimination" shutting down opinions that might be offensive to those who disagree.
Well, unless someone is just an asshole about something, but myself, I am trying to be as civil as possible because i know many people would LOVE to shut me up, just based on such an opinion. This is why i hate censorship, ridiculous stuff should be debunked, not just labeled as taboo.
I think we're getting ahead of ourselves here. The topic is about the hilarity of new events in A13, and it's spread off to the mentality of transgenderism. At this point, I'm going to call "who cares" because fuck it, Rimworld isn't even capable of modeling the mentality of cannibalism, what's it going to do with transgenderism?
"It's just there" is a good way of coding it in A13, so we'll play it like that. Discussions about the things themselves should be brought up in another topic.
Quote from: StorymasterQ on February 14, 2016, 07:49:52 PM
I think we're getting ahead of ourselves here. The topic is about the hilarity of new events in A13, and it's spread off to the mentality of transgenderism. At this point, I'm going to call "who cares" because fuck it, Rimworld isn't even capable of modeling the mentality of cannibalism, what's it going to do with transgenderism?
"It's just there" is a good way of coding it in A13, so we'll play it like that. Discussions about the things themselves should be brought up in another topic.
Yes. I feel like this topic has gotten WAY out of hand and we should if not give up on this than at LEAST start a new topic t continue the argument because this is getting a little rediculous
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 03:55:41 PM
One of the reasons John Carpenter's "The Thing" is a pretty cool movie, with a very gloomy and desperate feel, is because there are no women at all in the movie. It's like all those war movies without civilians, or video games without children NPCs (because someone might start killing them).
Bullshit, there could be a monster movie where a woman dies right away - you know, because women are physically weaker, more emotional, and probably more likely to die. No, it wouldn't be politically correct. "No women at all" is a cowardly way out. The closest movie I know is Planet of the Apes (1958), where the only woman on the spaceship, a sexy blonde, dies right at the start to a malfunctioning cryosleep casket.
As for "there shall be no this or no that" attitude, ancient Greece had gay sex, pedophilia, and more. Spartans dyed their hair before their most famous battle. Northern vikings were colorful and vain. If you know a bit of history, modern society looks prude and strict when it comes to male fashion. And those were some of the toughest, manliest bastard in history.
I haven't read the whole thread at this point. But let me just drop in and remind people to keep things on topic.
Controversial discussions of real life topics have their place - in the off topic forum. Around here the discussion should relate to the game and the OP, please.
*WARNING THREAD DERAILMENT HAS OCCURED, EVACUATION IMMINENENT*
bit late to the party, but whether you consider transsexuality to be a mental disorder or not, the fact is that transgender people exist. Why would we not have them in game?
On a final note, and not wanting to go too off-topic, but please consider that we are talking about real people here. Some of the things said here (and the tone in which they are said) could be extemely hurtful, please do try and keep that in mind - whatever your viewpoint is.
I'm suprised ozzie Osborne didn't post here, cause this was derailing from the crazy train.
Anyway, if the bullet mechanics in v13 and all previous ones are fixed so misses do not have possibility to go through walls, i think firefights could be very different. Also, i think pretty much all decent size objects should act as minor cover. I did hear trees didn't act as cover, but idk if that is true. But i would like anything which is presumed above knee height to act as cover. Would certainly make jungle fighting neat, but i don't know if trees do, or do not act as cover.
I would also love to see if emotions effected performance too, depressed people sluggish, angry people more aggressive / higher pain tolerance, but these are pipe dreams.
I can try saying something...
It is just a feature of the game. None was intended besides adding more content to the story generator.
In the game there will be people interacting with each other, there will be white, black, straight and gay, young and old. Is that a problem? They will only interact with each other.
So if you are going to discuss sexual preferences, I agree with Tynan, go to offtopic.
MAIN TOPIC: will we be able to do something similiar to the Hospitality mod? where you improve relations talking to another faction, and can even try to recruit someone that way.
We're going to end up posting the same amount of off-topic though if everyone puts in their 2 cents before actually talking about the main topic.
Quote from: Z0MBIE2 on February 15, 2016, 11:35:11 AM
We're going to end up posting the same amount of off-topic though if everyone puts in their 2 cents before actually talking about the main topic.
I'm too poor to have 2 cents...
Anyways, I wonder if prison break events would give you a notification when it occurs. Cause I think that it would too easy to solve by just sending your pawns with miniguns and power armor before they even get a a chance of getting a weapon themselves.
Perhaps it would only notify you once they've managed to breach your armory or got into a same room as a pawn and getting "spotted".
I am going to start enforcing Rule 5 (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=122.0) with 24 hour temp-bans. Please stay on topic in this thread.
If you wish to discuss what was previously being discussed, or even put in your 2 cents about it, head on over to the Off-Topic subforum and create a thread there about that subject and have the discussion there.
I'm looking forward to the modding potential of the upcoming update. I'm hoping we can make the ground trade caravans do nasty things, such as bringing in a small secret raiding party from the pirate faction instead of things to trade.
Yeah!
Have guests playing nasty, and possibly stealing things or suddenly becoming hostiles when in your base.
Triggering/notifying as hostile through their actions or being sighted by a colonist is indeed a key part of it...
Holy shit i didn't even know about ground caravans... Actually, what would be really cool is trapped items set to go off during a raid. You just bought a few m16s? They blow up and start fires, because x asshole faction put thermite into them.
Might not happen but that sounds fun.
Quote from: mumblemumble on February 16, 2016, 03:18:34 AM
Holy shit i didn't even know about ground caravans... Actually, what would be really cool is trapped items set to go off during a raid. You just bought a few m16s? They blow up and start fires, because x asshole faction put thermite into them.
Might not happen but that sounds fun.
Ground caravans are in? Damn that's cool, wonder if we'll get draggables like wagons or something with that.
How'd they do the caravan part though?
Muffalopacks? Centipedepacks? Thrumbopacks?
Oh yes!
An alpacapack
Ah the woolen glory
I was thinking a sled pulled by wargs in the snowy biomes
Beware visitors who haul in giant wooden horses as gifts!
Also having wagons, wheelbarrows, or other things to help move stuff around would be awesome.
I guess there wont be any age restrictions with relationships until a later alpha, cant wait to see the first "granny grabber" ;D
Quote from: Panzer on February 16, 2016, 02:05:14 PM
I guess there wont be any age restrictions with relationships until a later alpha, cant wait to see the first "granny grabber" ;D
This happens in Banished all the time. 65yo man living with a 14yo girl. suddenly children. I think people should have a preference for people closer to their own age.
On the topic of age, due warning. https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=122.msg190955#new
Not trying to enforce btw, just making aware because it was recent
I wasnt suggesting it should happen, just that it did in Banished.
Tynan can keep this from happening by simply requiring that a pawn be 18 before they start having those kinds of relationships. Granted in real life it doesnt work that way but it would prolly be for the best.
I will say, for the setting of colonists, id think younger breeding would happen anyway simply because more hands are needed.
I think the rule was specifically aimed at SEXUALIZATION of youth, not so much if youth have children, but admins feel free to correct me incase I'm wrong.
And no i wasn't saying you were out of line , just the topic is delicate, and putting it out there. I honestly think 13 years would be the minimum, just because colonies treat new hands as a premium commodity, and restriction to an age due to whatever laws people grew up with (which do not apply now, because cannibalism, murder, piracy, building code, ect ect) might be ignored in favor of more population generation. It's actually exactly how it is in many, many tribal, small areas of the world, and age of consent is very much a bigger society thing. Beyond obviously not doing the deed before said girl reaches womanhood (aka puberty), most of these tribes try to have them younger for healthier offspring, and best likelihood of healthy adults by trying to have children with larger numbers.
And while rimworld colonies aren't tribal, they are MUCH smaller than a normal town, and i could see them wanting a long term population solution, given people are either killed, or worn out with age by 40 most of the time.
I think there is also a difference with what happens here in the forum and what happens in the game.
Eating people in the game fine. Locating forum members in the real world and eating them, not so fine.
Quote from: JimmyAgnt007 on February 16, 2016, 02:56:48 PM
I think there is also a difference with what happens here in the forum and what happens in the game.
Eating people in the game fine. Locating forum members in the real world and eating them, not so fine.
I believe eating any people is wrong... but that's just my opnion. Some people might disagree
Quote from: Listen1 on February 16, 2016, 03:17:46 PM
I believe eating any people is wrong... but that's just my opnion. Some people might disagree
Abhorrent notion for sure, I think we're on safe ground stating that. Thing is....
Have you heard of the 1972 Andes flight disaster?
"Uruguayan Air Force Flight 571 was a chartered flight carrying 45 people, including a rugby union team, their friends, family and associates, that crashed in the Andes on 13 October 1972, in an incident known as the Andes flight disaster and, in South America, as the Miracle in the Andes (El Milagro de los Andes). More than a quarter of the passengers died in the crash and several others quickly succumbed to cold and injury. Of the 27 who were alive a few days after the accident, another eight were killed by an avalanche that swept over their shelter in the wreckage. The last 16 survivors were rescued on 23 December 1972, more than two months after the crash.
The survivors had little food and no source of heat in the harsh conditions at over 3,600 metres (11,800 ft) altitude. Faced with starvation and radio news reports that the search for them had been abandoned, the survivors fed on the dead passengers who had been preserved in the snow. Rescuers did not learn of the survivors until 72 days after the crash when passengers Nando Parrado and Roberto Canessa, after a 10-day trek across the Andes, found Chilean arriero Sergio Catalán,[1] who gave them food and then alerted the authorities to the existence of the other survivors".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Andes_flight_disaster
What would you of done in such a situation? It's interesting to consider this, might you of taken a nibble on a dead passenger?
Quote from: Ectoplasm on February 17, 2016, 02:09:25 PM
Quote from: Listen1 on February 16, 2016, 03:17:46 PM
I believe eating any people is wrong... but that's just my opnion. Some people might disagree
What would you of done in such a situation? It's interesting to consider this, might you of taken a nibble on a dead passenger?
Just because it's wrong... dosen't mean I wouldn't do it.
The Andes flight situation is one of the worst thinks it could happen, in one of the worst scenarios. Being in that situation, you will have to do what you need to survive.
Another event would be a Battle Royale (Like the anime/mangá/book), where you get locked up in some place and can only leave if you are the last man standing. I would try to survive as hard as I could, even if that means assaulting or maybe killing someone.
But you are right, it is good to stop and think about this, if everyone did that, and tried to imagine themselfs at other peoples shoes... The world would be a muche better place.
Well, back at the topic. It would be totally awesome if in the middle of the combat, people would surrender, and you would have the option of letting them walk away, capture them or you know, pew pew headshot.
Also an event where people beg to join your colony, because they don't wanna die. Torture and beating people and gibbet cages could come back to the game, fear bar too.
Am I... a bad person?
Quote from: A Friend on February 16, 2016, 06:48:36 AM
How'd they do the caravan part though?
Muffalopacks? Centipedepacks? Thrumbopacks?
Oh yes!
I was thinking more of trucks for towns and for tribes maybe the animal could chandge by biome.
Quote from: Mossy piglet on February 17, 2016, 04:41:27 PM
Quote from: A Friend on February 16, 2016, 06:48:36 AM
How'd they do the caravan part though?
Muffalopacks? Centipedepacks? Thrumbopacks?
Oh yes!
I was thinking more of trucks for towns and for tribes maybe the animal could chandge by biome.
I would assume they took the common sense approach, and simply utilized one of the mods that already does this.
I played my last game with modvarietypack (first one I've ever used), and it drew a lot of extra gameplay out of the game. Some of it was seriously OP (IE: the hauler bots/MAI/etc.), but the modified research tree, and the need to refine materials before you could use 'em, made it a serious challenge early on. (albeit, part of that was from not knowing what to do next heh, they need to shade stuff you "could" build, but don't have any of the base resources for, since I found myself desperately trying to figure out how to get "Y", when all I had was "X").
On Gender in rimworld.
I think having more fluid genders is a great idea. Especially when we're talking about the far flung future of who knows when were I've been replacing perfectly good limbs on colonists because I have spare robot legs and I need them to be faster. That's stark utilitarianism by contrast to this.
There's no kids or procreation in this yet and I appreciate the comments made about the limitations of modern alteration techniques. But why are we still thinking like it's 2016. We're about a twenty years away from extracorporeal pregnancy, less before we have additional robotic limbs, not just replacement, third and fourth arms, controlled via thought. Genitalia and more importantly identity and the ability to freely express and explore it when it harms no one else. That's a lot closer than when rimworld is set, certainly a lot closer than extracorporeal pregnancy.
And please don't point at science or medicine as evidence for your beliefs on transgender, especially without linking the article. Ignoring the enormous complexity of the uterine environment and the effect it has on even genetically identically twins I would like to point out we haven't found the gay gene either. Doesn't mean people aren't living happy and fulfilling lives with a same sex partner because we can't identify the cause. And given the myriad of things that can happen along the pathway of even anatomical gender development in utero the notion that transgender is all in someone's head belies a poor understanding of gender, embryological development and, most importantly, our current understanding of mental illness.
Apologies to Tynan. I did not want to derail this thread.
But I absolutely would risk the surgery for a colonist who identified as an opposing gender or anywhere along the spectrum on which gender lies, even if they lie off the spectrum. Who we are and who we want to be is a complex mess. I'll grant my opponents that, but the freedom and support to explore identity, especially in a future where we can replace an eye in half a day and be back working in a field a couple of days later, the freedom to do that is important.
And having it in game would be awesome.
See, but now your opinion will probably be discussed, which just derails it more. If you put in your personal opinion on something off-topic you're displaying a big 'Discuss this' sign.
I stopped reading the thread past halfway through the second page because it was mostly nonsense.
If gay, bi, etc. are traits, that means they'll take up space for other traits. Will they be part of a separate column of traits or will they share space with the old traits? Will we get to have colonists with more than a max of three traits? (Three was the current max right? I haven't played in a while.)
Quote from: Wayfaerer on February 17, 2016, 06:40:51 PM
On Gender in rimworld.
I think having more fluid genders is a great idea. Especially when we're talking about the far flung future of who knows when were I've been replacing perfectly good limbs on colonists because I have spare robot legs and I need them to be faster. That's stark utilitarianism by contrast to this.
[...]
Honestly, I think this is a bad idea, let me explain why:
I was under the impression that gender was a non-point in rimworld (up to this point, all colonists are asexual, so it is really a non-issue).
Rimworld doesn't need to track gender, it needs to track sex (sure, there can be a spectrum here if we're going to worry about the delicious parts as opposed to the genetic parts [male, female, alien, hermaphrodite, mayonnaise, etc.]).
At the end of the day, we shouldn't be giving a damn about a colonists gender, as Tynan had previously said, its basically lazy coding, let the events play out without specific restriction. If that makes everybody permanently fluid, so be it, but that's the entire point, lazy coding. Tracking in detail a colonists sexual preferences/traits in a level of depth that is not devoted to the rest of the game is a poor investment of time IMHO.
I took the first post as a joke. Even if he is being serious, as long as the game mechanics dont break. Ill be okay with whatever. My own personal views on gender and topics related, hold zero water when it comes to the implementation of this update. If you are really that pissed about it then make a level headed argument. Virtually throwing up your arms and screaming wildly will not get you the desired outcome you want. For some people, this is a very touchy subject and this isnt a place that your freedom of expression is guaranteed. So if you cant abide by the rules set forth than I would suggest not posting.
Quote from: Nanao-kun on February 17, 2016, 08:53:17 PMIf gay, bi, etc. are traits, that means they'll take up space for other traits.
Presumably it would either have to be a separate category of trait which everyone was assigned or mechanics would have to exist that give the trait weight (perhaps something like negative mood if there are no potential partners in the colony?). If it exists as a normal trait and has no mechanic-related impact then that's a real balance problem.
Alternatively I suppose if colonists have offspring then gay as a trait could impact on that, but that's definitely not in the next alpha.
Since, as Tynan said, it is lazy codding, it's probably just a subgender defined by the backstory, Heterosexual man, homosexual woman.
Being a Trait would be a bad ideia, since it your sexual preferences dosen't impact in the efficiency you chop wood or cook meals.
Certainly, being a homosexual man would impact on your beauty perception. "Red shirt with green pants? Ugh."
j/k
Quote from: StorymasterQ on February 18, 2016, 07:27:54 PM
Certainly, being a homosexual man would impact on your beauty perception. "Red shirt with green pants? Ugh."
Somewhere out there...
A Christmas elf cries himself to sleep...
Lol @ this thread.
As a part time programmer I laugh at how much easier it would be to say 'ANYBODY CAN BE ANYTHING' and it has nothing to do with SJW and more like not having to put a billion if/then/where clauses into your code.
You say SJW, I say KISS KISS!! (keep it simple stupid!)
Quote from: A Friend on February 18, 2016, 09:06:26 PM
Quote from: StorymasterQ on February 18, 2016, 07:27:54 PM
Certainly, being a homosexual man would impact on your beauty perception. "Red shirt with green pants? Ugh."
Somewhere out there...
A Christmas elf cries himself to sleep...
Random event. Santa's coming to town!
If you are a good boy, you get beer, chocolate, maybe a puppy or a colonist!
Well, use your imagination if you are not.
So in the interest of derailing an already seriously derailed thread, when is the vegetarian trait going to be implemented?
"Ewww, animal meat, yuk!"
Quote from: Listen1 on February 19, 2016, 05:26:26 AM
Random event. Santa's coming to town!
If you are a good boy, you get beer, chocolate, maybe a puppy or a colonist!
Well, use your imagination if you are not.
Terrarias mecha santa? ;D
(http://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/terraria.gamepedia.com/d/dc/Santa-NK1_phase_2.png?version=3f323fa6407ba4534b35647eaf47ac68)
Quote from: Shurp on February 19, 2016, 06:12:28 AM
So in the interest of derailing an already seriously derailed thread, when is the vegetarian trait going to be implemented?
"Ewww, animal meat, yuk!"
On the same note, a cannibal "Ewww, vegetarian meat"
Quote from: Panzer on February 19, 2016, 06:13:39 AM
Terrarias mecha santa? ;D
http://hydra-media.cursecdn.com/terraria.gamepedia.com/d/dc/Santa-NK1_phase_2.png?version=3f323fa6407ba4534b35647eaf47ac68
Yeah XD forgot about those
Guys. 11 pages is enough. We have discussed the CRAP out of gay/bi/trans sexuals. It has seriously gotten to the point where we are talking about mecha-santa. This thread needs to finish up and end. If we cant do this i will personally post a thread in off topic called "gay/bi/transgender discussion" and we can move it over there.
Quote from: jzero on February 20, 2016, 11:09:59 PM
Guys. 11 pages is enough. We have discussed the CRAP out of gay/bi/trans sexuals. It has seriously gotten to the point where we are talking about mecha-santa. This thread needs to finish up and end. If we cant do this i will personally post a thread in off topic called "gay/bi/transgender discussion" and we can move it over there.
And gay/bi/transgender/mecha-santa, don't forget about him.
And yeah, topic should be closed. If not, someone will revive it and this discussion will restart
This thread isn't dead, its just brain damaged.
Put it on cleaning duty i guess.
Hey, I did my part to turn it into a vegetarianism flamewar instead of a homosexuality one.
Cleaning duty? Why don't we just butcher this thread and turn it into fine meals and leather jackets?
Quote from: Regret on January 28, 2016, 04:50:02 PM
Quote from: Noobshock on January 28, 2016, 04:13:03 PM
Well if you go by OH IM SO PROGRESSIVE typical standards of inclusion, 50% of the population is homosexual and just about every woman is meant to be an ass-kicking warrior machine, which actually does not exist outside of some college students' utopian fantasy.
That's what I mean by overreaching. I don't care if it's at least somewhat realistic. But most of the time when script writers/designers go that route, they are more concerned with political signaling than something that actually resembles reality and where suspension of disbelief doesn't suffer collateral damage.
Sources please.
Here, let me give you an example of how this is done:
http://www.tv.com/shows says the top 5 popular shows are: Game of thrones, arrow, marvel's agents of shield, grey's anatomy, and coronation street.
AFAIK none of those have even 10% homosexual characters.
http://www.imdb.com/search/title?num_votes=5000,&sort=user_rating,desc&title_type=tv_series says the top 5 is breaking bad, game of thrones, the X-files, the wire, and one punch man.
None of those have anything close to 50% homosexual characters.
Another imdb list http://www.imdb.com/chart/toptv/ says band of brothers, planet earth, breaking bad, game of thrones, the wire. Same story.
The writers guild of America calls these the top 5: The sopranos, seinfeld, the twilight zone, all in the family, and M.A.S.H. And again nowhere close to 50%, I don't think M.A.S.H. even has a single homosexual, the closest they get is one guy trying to get kicked out of the army for wearing clothing traditionally associated with women.
Other names I have seen mentioned are house of cards, and downtown abbey. I highly doubt they even come close to 5% homosexuals.
On another topic:
Don't insult Xena: Warrior Princess, that show is epic. Also, it has a less than representative amount of homosexuals (especially for ancient Greece), and most women in the show aren't ass-kicking warrior machines.
Politically correctness is shit, but don't use that as an excuse to be ignorant. Now, please die of bone cancer you pathetic unwanted spawn of the sow you call 'mother'.
Moderator here! Yeah so this fun little chunk above the red is a prime example of stuff I'll normally perm ban people for. I'm going to leave it here for a bit just as a point of reference for something you surely don't do on this forums. Now, feel free to point and laugh because his ban is for two weeks and when he comes back we're going to have a nice long chitty-chat. Keep this thread mostly friendly please! I'm not saying don't argue, but behave.
-Ramsis
agents of shield does have gay characters. you do know this, right?
Does agents of shield have vegetarian characters who object to butchering captives and selling the meat to space pirates?
I am by no means new to rim world, think I joined around Alpha 2 or 3, got on to the game because of Quill18. I love this game and all of its silly quirks, I am interested to see exactly what kind of dynamic this update will bring. And some we got on to the whole topic of morality I want to throw it right out the window and am now wondering if it would be possible to creat a people farm where we keep prisoners and breed humans for canibalism. I mean if we keep animals captive and breed them why not humans? There are already people (myself included) who have created canibalistic colonies, why not creat one with a people farm? Creepy thought? Yes, idea for a new A13 colonie? Totally ;D
Will prisoners breed? That would make the people farm far more viable.
Rimworld - A dark fantasy simulator by Tynan Silvester ;D
Er.... Prisoners breeding is very much opening the door to prison rape.... Guess if it is, ill have 1 x 2 cells for any important prisoners
Quote from: Shurp on February 22, 2016, 05:05:20 PM
Will prisoners breed? That would make the people farm far more viable.
Despite mumblemumble's objection, Shurp's suggestion is going into my list.
Don't misinterprete me, i actually suggested rape in this very thread, BUT, prisoners sex being added as 100% consensual is completely silly. I don't think it should happen without the high possibility of it being rape, because, honestly, several tribes / factions that hate each other... Face it, most sex won't be completely consensual .
My "objection" is not prison sex, but the idea if prisons where sex is always consensual. Because i think no prison sex is far more believable.
Prisoners breeding would just probably have the pregnant person shanked to death or the baby instantly turned into meat to sell. Not to mention the parents would probably be sold by then or killed, or recruited. Just, don't. Stop.
I.... What....? I... Don't...... Just...... What?....
Either way, i think if its added, jail segregation by gender is needed. (at least for people who aren't cannibal campers)
Also, anyone who rapes my colony (unless they are extremely valuable, because i still need to keep the colony going... Though i will arrange a way to punish them ) is going straight into my incineration room. Yeah, i still use the stone vault with clothing on the floor / molotov setup. Not only does it incinerate bodies extremely well, it consumes no power, and gives the rest of the base a good heat boost once the room gets around 1000 f.
Also i agree, the dark side of the interaction between pregnancy, rape, and cannibalism is extremely grim. If i ever encountered that, mercy killings all around.
Sounds like a story generator to me. It can also make Rimworld a required component in a college-level ethics class.
Actually i seriously agree. Rimworld is potentially one of the best moral delema simulators I've seen, and i don't see it stopping with that any time soon
It's almost like This War of Mine, isn't it? A13 will have many people cross their WTF Threshold many times.
Quote from: mumblemumble on February 22, 2016, 09:21:12 PM
going straight into my incineration room. Yeah, i still use the stone vault with clothing on the floor / molotov setup. Not only does it incinerate bodies extremely well, it consumes no power, and gives the rest of the base a good heat boost once the room gets around 1000 f.
And Rimworld's first concentration camp gas oven is born.
Godwin's Law! I win!
Quote from: StorymasterQ on February 22, 2016, 09:45:19 PM
It's almost like This War of Mine, isn't it? A13 will have many people cross their WTF Threshold many times.
That would actually be a cool experience. But I doubt it'll be as dramatic as
Depression Simulator 2014 TWM. I would really love to see how the relations play out. I want it to give me a reason to feel attached to my characters like XCOM 2.
March Is Coming...
Relations, no matter how well they are done, will only be the first draft. We play it, poke holes in it, and things get fixed. It will be interesting to see how it works out and I look forward not only to it but what it evolves into. Tynan isnt known for holding back so it will be fun.
Le me wondering
Your child is 5 years old (you da mvp player) and the parent has... 1570...
"Dad what was it like back where you came from?"
"Dunno ive been sleeping for centuries"
I hate to say it but Dwarf Fortress and Crusader Kings I & II already treaded the "hilarious/dark/awful" territory. There is even the various "s***Xsays" threads on reddit where you have CK2 players asking "how can I kill my kids?" and "why can't I marry my daughter" while dwarf fortress "min/max" play involves forcibly separating parents from their kids so that you can put them through "baby danger room" training so they emerge puberty as battle scarred legendary combatants.
I said it before and I'll say it again, programming "PC" is more work then just letting this stuff go through. Tynan builds systems and players can use or abuse them as they see fit. If people are SUPER OUTRAGED BECAUSE OF BABY MURDER SIMULATOR...just point them at the other simulation games that have this stuff going on. CK2, by design, has brothers marrying their 16yr old sisters. Pediphilia AND incest.
If people get super upset they can always create "PG" mods for the game. No more harvesting captured raiders for organs, no more slavery, no more cannibalism...
Programming PC, did you say? I've always programmed PC. I've never owned a Mac, you see.
...BADUMTSH?
Quote from: Produno on January 29, 2016, 05:06:36 AM
Any gays in my colony will be shot :). Im not homophobic but as already pointed out, why does everything have to have its token gay couple. I dont think Tynan intended it to be like that so this is more of a reply to others in this thread.
Theres plenty of stuff i used to watch on tv and now dont because of this. If its something people want to engage in then each to their own but why do they have to force everyone else to be a part of it.
Hah I was thinking that and I agree its not needed, especially in a small colony the odds would be very slim with only around 1-5% of the world actually being homosexual. At least in this game we have a lot of options to remedy the situation lol.
*edit* Sorry just saw the post by a mod saying not to talk about that so edited my post.
Why not publish alpha 13 now? :'(
Quote from: Daman453 on February 28, 2016, 02:54:09 PM
Why not publish alpha 13 now? :'(
Because everybody knows it's coming out Tuesday! :)
Quote from: Daman453 on February 28, 2016, 02:54:09 PM
Why not publish alpha 13 now? :'(
Because a13 should be well prepared before served.
I feel like we should just rename this thread "post about random crap and occasionally argue" because I think that is the point we have reached
Cannibalism and making hats out out of human skin: AWESOME GAME!!! 8) 8) 8)
Gay people: OMG EWWWW :o :o :o :o
We haven't really come too far as a species have we
Quote from: Kaballah on February 29, 2016, 06:58:28 AM
Cannibalism and making hats out out of human skin: AWESOME GAME!!! 8) 8) 8)
Gay people: OMG EWWWW :o :o :o :o
We haven't really come too far as a species have we
Apparently not. This thread has been an incredibly disappointing read.
Quote from: mcduff on February 29, 2016, 09:58:06 AM
Quote from: Kaballah on February 29, 2016, 06:58:28 AM
Cannibalism and making hats out out of human skin: AWESOME GAME!!! 8) 8) 8)
Gay people: OMG EWWWW :o :o :o :o
We haven't really come too far as a species have we
Apparently not. This thread has been an incredibly disappointing read.
Shouldn't be very disappointing, it's just blatant trolls.
Question for anyone really with the answer or a speculation, are there plans to add the ability for your colonists to attack settlements you've previously set up or pirate settlements that exist in your world? So rather than always being the target of raids you become the perpetrator?
I believe there is, or was, a mod that allowed "away teams" to go on raids with simulated results, but I don't think it's an intended game feature because leaving the map gets complicated.
Quote from: Devon_v on March 01, 2016, 04:16:25 PM
I believe there is, or was, a mod that allowed "away teams" to go on raids with simulated results, but I don't think it's an intended game feature because leaving the map gets complicated.
I just watched Quill18 playing Rimworld with Hardcore SK Modpack where one of his guys went for an away mission. So it's definitely one within that pack
The away mission quill18 had is one of the Rumor Of.. incidents from Miscellaneous.
Also his ruins are also a part of Miscellaneous ;D
Quote from: Haplo on March 02, 2016, 06:29:19 AM
The away mission quill18 had is one of the Rumor Of.. incidents from Miscellaneous.
Also his ruins are also a part of Miscellaneous ;D
Heil ze Haplo.
The level of bigotry in the world and even just among Rimworld players will never cease to disappoint me. :(
Only if you pay attention to ze trolls.
So am I correct in the belief that Tynan is back from his sabbatical this month?
Quote from: RoboticManiac on March 06, 2016, 02:53:20 PM
So am I correct in the belief that Tynan is back from his sabbatical this month?
Quote from: Tynan's blogCan't wait to get it to you guys. I'll be back in March. (edit: I'm not sure when the alpha will actually be finished. It could be after March – just to be clear).
Nobody knows, but it's 6 days into March so I wouldn't say so.
Just want to say, having different views on lgbt than lgbt approved perspective is not necessary bigotry.
Not saying there hasn't been any in this thread either, but having a different view alone isn't it. Even calling it trolling is inaccurate, as that implies its not said because people believe it, but because they want to anger people. Trust me, believe it or not, MANY PEOPLE think differently, and disagree, and this won't be changing soon, even though voicing it might not always be "allowed" , this doesn't stop it from being thought.
Also im eagerly awaiting another progress report, OR, the new version.
Quote from: mumblemumble on March 06, 2016, 07:43:30 PM
Just want to say, having different views on lgbt than lgbt approved perspective is not necessary bigotry.
Not saying there hasn't been any in this thread either, but having a different view alone isn't it. Even calling it trolling is inaccurate, as that implies its not said because people believe it, but because they want to anger people. Trust me, believe it or not, MANY PEOPLE think differently, and disagree, and this won't be changing soon, even though voicing it might not always be "allowed" , this doesn't stop it from being thought.
Also im eagerly awaiting another progress report, OR, the new version.
While your oppinion is valued and the sentiment appreciated for the most part its irrelavent to what the thread is discussing (Alpha 13 - New events are gonna be hilarious).
preach it
I never expected my tiny post to have such a long dragged out discussion about lgbt and stuff. But I guess I'm still proud that this game is able to spark debates like this one.
your post has turned into a monster. A monster full of interesting conversation, sure, but a monster nonetheless
I personally think this post is great because of this, even if nobody listened to what is said, its re-assuring that delicate topics can be covered without people entirely flipping out.
if this happened more in society, life would be much better.
also, obviously, I'm far from the only one from continuing this thread with "off topic" comments... And I really wouldn't call it a monster, I think its amazing that social dialog can happen, and think it should happen much more. Taboos on discussing things never really allow improvement on said topics.
I really do want to see how things work with relationship with more finer grain stuff btw...like, lets say 1 guy accidentally shoots his brother in the leg... They are still brothers, but the guy is still bound to be pissed right?
Maybe they will have a fight over it later =P "Fuck you john, you shot my leg!" *Punches him in the nose and wrestles him down, but invariably stops before he gets badly hurt*