I just figured out how to kill the infestation bugs without a real fight. Just dig a long tunnel and shoot them from a distance with the survival rifle. Easy. I'm pretty sure some of you figured this out before me too!
So let me just request that if you find an exploit strategy, please report it. These kinds of things are basically bugs, and they break the game (even if people sort of "like" them, they harm the overall experience). So please report them!
I'd love to hear about any exploits you know of in this thread. Are there other no-risk ways to defeat infestations or sieges? The ones I know of are:
- Shoot infestation bugs from long range
- Open the roof and let infestation bugs freeze
- Shoot siegers with sniper rifles (until they attack)
Quote from: Tynan on March 21, 2016, 04:46:51 PM
Just dig a long tunnel and shoot them from a distance with the survival rifle.
How is this an exploit? You need to first dig a long tunnel and expose yourself to sappers, plus the last chunk to dig is possibly dangerous for your colonist. What about freezing and burning the bugs to death? Doesn't seem like an exploit to me.
I mean, Tynan, I even managed to make a bug jelly factory that works forever and keeps producing jelly, wanna see it?
he probably does...
The unroofing has always felt...wrong...to me, could we allow the unroof tool to only work a certain distance from colonist structures or something?
Depending on how your base is laid out, you could be shooting the bugs at long distance with almost no effort. A long hallway (common in deep mines) is enough to do it. It's also absurd the bugs would never just attack. It's clearly an exploit.
Burning and freezing them aren't exploits per se; I call those cool strategies. Vanishing their roof with the no-roof tool is an exploit, though.
Yes there are judgment calls to make in what is and isn't an exploit. But I want you guys to tell me if anything seems like it might approach the line so I can think about how to handle it or if anything needs changing.
Yes, I thought of the bug jelly factory. In fact it's sort of "designed to be possible". Though I worry about it being too easy. I'd love to see yours. How do you deal with the constantly-spawning bugs, though?
Quote from: skullywag on March 21, 2016, 05:27:01 PM
he probably does...
The unroofing has always felt...wrong...to me, could we allow the unroof tool to only work a certain distance from colonist structures or something?
Wouldn't solve it; I can set it up so that colonist have to go and manually remove the roof, though.
that would also stop another issue at the same time, the one where you forget to unroof before removing a building and kill everyone. Wouldnt that also mean building roofs as well?
Here's my factory:
http://puu.sh/nP1LP/cddecca5fc.png
Bugs die on the traps and the colonists clean and rearm the traps consistently. Jelly factory voila!
Quote- Shoot siegers with sniper rifles (until they attack)
i'm not sure this is an exploit?
Quote
Here's my factory:
http://puu.sh/nP1LP/cddecca5fc.png
Bugs die on the traps and the colonists clean and rearm the traps consistently. Jelly factory voila!
nice.
Bugs don't attack doors so it is easy to pop out shoot at the bugs and pop back in when they come at you. The retreating bug has it's back turned when it heads back so you pop out again and get a enfilade shot on it. Makes it really easy to deal with them even in close quarters.
Quote from: thedee05 on March 21, 2016, 05:50:04 PM
Bugs don't attack doors so it is easy to pop out shoot at the bugs and pop back in when they come at you. The retreating bug has it's back turned when it heads back so you pop out again and get a enfilade shot on it. Makes it really easy to deal with them even in close quarters.
hmm would them attacking doors be a bad thing?
(also Tynan offtopic but go see his video in the video subforum, its ace)
The problem is, yes I think bugs shouldn't attack doors. It's the same discussion we had about the manhunting animals.
The obvious "exploit" is that you can shoot out of the open door and then hide again. But this isn't new and we were able to do that with manhunting animals since summer 2015.
well, when it comes to shoot-out-of-enemy-range strategies against bugs,siegers,sappers :
maybe as soon as they get attacked, they get hostile. and if they are in a group, the entire group goes hostile and attacks up to a certain range before heading back. except for the "builders" in a siege or sappers, they won't join group attacks and would only attack when they are directly attacked.
--------------
as for the peek-and-shoot strategies against manhunter and bugs :
when you attack them, they go crazy and gains the ability to attack doors and walls. they will primarily target the person who attacked and anything that blocks their way. but they will lose this ability once that person is dead.
Quote from: keylocke on March 21, 2016, 06:10:28 PM
when you attack them, they go crazy and gains the ability to attack doors and walls. they will primarily target the source of the person who attacked and anything that blocks their way. but they will lose this ability once that person is dead.
I think that is a very bad idea. That pretty much guarantees 1 dead colonist. This would make the infestation event deadlier than some raids.
Although it's unlikely to come up, if you were to sell warm-weather animals to traders during the cold season, and then those traders stick around long enough, the animals die of hypothermia and then you can use the animal corpses. Profit! I mean, exploit!
Quote from: MarvinKosh on March 21, 2016, 06:44:48 PM
Although it's unlikely to come up, if you were to sell warm-weather animals to traders during the cold season, and then those traders stick around long enough, the animals die of hypothermia and then you can use the animal corpses. Profit! I mean, exploit!
you can also trap traders by building walls around them. starving them to death or until they go crazy and start killing each other.
Quote from: Skissor on March 21, 2016, 06:24:13 PM
I think that is a very bad idea. That pretty much guarantees 1 dead colonist. This would make the infestation event deadlier than some raids.
ah, maybe not "dead". just incapacitated.
it's like if you don't attack them, then they don't know you're there behind the door, but when you attack, then they will try to break down doors to get you.
----------
another "exploit"-like strategy (kinda an old one) against melee attackers is to see which people they are currently targeting and using these targets as bait to run around your gunners as your gunners shoot them down.
Quote from: MarvinKosh on March 21, 2016, 06:44:48 PM
Although it's unlikely to come up, if you were to sell warm-weather animals to traders during the cold season, and then those traders stick around long enough, the animals die of hypothermia and then you can use the animal corpses. Profit! I mean, exploit!
Well, considering you'd have to be able to be skilled enough to hold those warm-weather animals (in ice sheet biome I guess?), I think that exploit is forgivable. :P
I've already learned useful info from this thread. Please keep it coming.
Another exploit I remembered: You can kill a passing thrumbo without and risk at all, by just building a wall around it. Not as bad as killing traders this way, but still bad.
Killing trader animals is worse than killing Thrumbos.
If I look at some muffalos, they come wearing golden swords worth 40k and you only need to enclose them.
Using 2 or more people when fighting a mechanoid beyond cover, and having one drop behind cover for a split second before coming back out to "reset" the mechanoid's targeting. I'm assuming it would work with other pawns, but generally other pawns have hte same firing speeds or quicker than your own colonists.
Quote from: Coenmcj on March 21, 2016, 07:08:14 PM
Using 2 or more people when fighting a mechanoid beyond cover, and having one drop behind cover for a split second before coming back out to "reset" the mechanoid's targeting. I'm assuming it would work with other pawns, but generally other pawns have hte same firing speeds or quicker than your own colonists.
Good to know.
Btw this is a known exploit since Alpha 12:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzA-6OrLPas
Quote from: Skissor on March 21, 2016, 07:18:28 PM
Btw this is a known exploit since Alpha 12:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzA-6OrLPas
So time for centipedes to be the tanks they are meant to be and ram down walls?
There's a triplet (at least) of exploits revolving around trapping people with walls.
You can trap traders/visitors by building walls around them and letting them starve to death.
You can trap and kill thrumbos by building walls around them and letting them starve to death.
You can cook crashes ship parts and their defenders with a wall enclosure, an incendiary IED, and some wooden beds. Video.
So pawns might have to learn to mine if they detect this scenario.
How about giving them the behaviour of sappers?
As soon as they have heat stroke, hypothermia, or starvation, they start looking to exit the map and the shortest path gets mined out/deconstructed.
Though it would seem strange for a visitor to start deconstructing his way out of your base/trap. Same with animals, how are animals/mechanoids going to deconstruct things?
Quote from: Skissor on March 21, 2016, 06:53:43 PM
Well, considering you'd have to be able to be skilled enough to hold those warm-weather animals (in ice sheet biome I guess?), I think that exploit is forgivable. :P
Well yeah, but it is so gamey. It relies on you having foreknowledge that those animals will probably die and that the traders won't bat an eyelid. Instead they should be like, "Hey wait a minute wise guy, just how am I supposed to get all these chickens home in this freezing weather before they become popsicles? No deal."
It's technically possible to get someone who doesn't do dumb labour to do a bunch of materials hauling.
For example, you can set a restricted area which doesn't include your existing stockpile of steel, assign a building to be made, and tell them to build it even though the only materials available to do so are halfway across the map.
When they come back with the materials, cancel the job or get them to do something else, and they will drop the materials and walk off. Repeat as needed.
Unfortunately, hauling materials and then using them to build is sort of what a pawn with the Constructor job does all the time. But if you were to close the above exploit, pawns which aren't allowed to haul would still be able to build, they would just have to build things which already have all the materials in place, which is actually still quite labour intensive.
Quote from: Skissor on March 21, 2016, 07:48:36 PM
how are animals/mechanoids going to deconstruct things?
Considering the lore behind them (Being that some of them were domestically used, assumedly, some would be industrial), I'd say about some of them being ex-mining mechanoids?
You can trap a wild animal by downing it, rescuing it, and keeping it indoors. For example, this Thrumbo only left my base when I ordered all the doors leading outside to be held open:
http://puu.sh/nPl8Q/4810641383.png
These attacking tribals response to these walls/doors i built outside my base was to take a detour which added four or five times the distance to their journey, spreading them out and making them easier to deal with:
http://puu.sh/nPlio/961f1b19eb.png
This wasn't a No Risk exploit I found, as I had one colonist incapacitated when the tribals finally came round the other side, but I can certainly see how could be exploitable.
I've also found that the fire popper or whatever it's called has a few nifty effects: If you set it off pre-emptively, it will protect almost anything it exploded onto from fire, and enough foam explosions in one area will make pawns move incredibly slowly through all the muck.
fire, i take you to burn!
https://youtu.be/022SgHKOoCw
really, fire is winbutton and extremely usefull strategy for everything, all you need is wooden walls and molotovs.
When animals go crazy and hunt someone, I keep that person running around (when they are faster than the animal) and let others kill the animal. Animals tend not to go after any other targets once they are locked on. A small thing but thought id mention it.
Quote from: Nasikabatrachus on March 21, 2016, 10:53:14 PM
You can trap a wild animal by downing it, rescuing it, and keeping it indoors. For example, this Thrumbo only left my base when I ordered all the doors leading outside to be held open:
i'm not sure this is an exploit. i actually tame animals this way so my colonists don't have to walk very far.
Quote from: RawCode on March 21, 2016, 11:16:40 PM
really, fire is winbutton and extremely usefull strategy for everything, all you need is wooden walls and molotovs.
drawback is that some items end up getting destroyed.
Quote from: keylocke on March 22, 2016, 12:27:48 AM
Quote from: Nasikabatrachus on March 21, 2016, 10:53:14 PM
You can trap a wild animal by downing it, rescuing it, and keeping it indoors. For example, this Thrumbo only left my base when I ordered all the doors leading outside to be held open:
i'm not sure this is an exploit. i actually tame animals this way so my colonists don't have to walk very far.
I mean, that's my point. You pacify a wild animal by attacking it and placing it inside your base, the better to be tamed. Seems like an exploit.
When mechs with miniguns attack, shielded pawns can stand up to them for a long time due to the minigun spread.
Move a shielded pawn up first, until they become targeted. A shield can withstand a single minigun often forever, while non-shielded pawns get plenty of time to shoot from another direction.
The exploit here would be that the mech doesn't detect that the shielded pawn is not a threat, while the multiple pawns with rifles are.
Perhaps a threat/aggro mechanic would be helpful here.
if you just want to kill everyone, item loss is not problem.
What about the fact that we can shoot people through walls as can the enemy. Has that been addressed i havent specifically tested for it yet (i will).
Quote from: skullywag on March 22, 2016, 04:13:57 AM
What about the fact that we can shoot people through walls as can the enemy. Has that been addressed i havent specifically tested for it yet (i will).
i've had colonists build walls only to have grenades pass straight through the wall and harm those colonists. it's weird.
Grenades I dont have an issue with unless theres a roof but I just pretend the grenade lands on the roof and explodes (and that the roofs are paper thin), grenades over a wall should be possible, no need to make them adjust their travel height as it kind of just works right now anyway.
Its more the fact that you can aim at something behind your target and bullets can intercept pawns in cover as collateral damage, not forgetting the current bug (kind of) of hitting a colonist who has already got behind cover but you the bullets have already calculated they are going to hit so hitting the pawn while they are in full cover.
Can't locate this one on Mantis:
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=16410.0
It's what I would consider an exploit or bug, but I don't know if it has been fixed.
Oh, In my mega fort, I had some turrets near the map edge and the main entrance was located there as well. The whole reason for that was that when enemies tried to flee that was the closest edge for them so they had to run past all the turrets on their way to get out. So i guess the exploit is finding the most likely escape route and setting up an ambush.
Well technically, having an ambush ready for a fleeing an enemy is a cool strategy, but enemy pawns are not too bright and flee in a predictable fashion.
I think even if they fled back to their spawn point it would make sense. look at my base, if you get routed attacking the front door, do you try to flee by going closer to the turrets towards the nearest edge or do you go back the way you came?
if i set an ambush with pawns who happened to come out the other door then fine. but it kinda breaks things when they run into gunfire to get away from the gunfire. lol
Here's a tiny doozy for you, Tynan: https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=2295
(for the lazy: Euthanizing colonists gives colonists less negative thoughts than letting them starve to death)
That last one I imagine is semi-Intentional however, considering the starvation is a non-intentional (Generally speaking) whereas euthanasia requires a user action, and might be considered a "merciful" way to kill them.
It's a little silly still considering that euthanasia is suppose to be a humane way of ending someone's life, but everyone is ok with someone inhumanely starving to death.
Quote from: ZestyLemons on March 22, 2016, 11:43:32 PM
It's a little silly still considering that euthanasia is suppose to be a humane way of ending someone's life, but everyone is ok with someone inhumanely starving to death.
I will admit it is how I deal with my meat vegetables to avoid the negative mood hit. A friend or family member dying debuff is still there.
The problem is the same with a lot of similar issues, which is that there's no really good way to determine *why* an event happened for AI purposes.
As in, a guy starved to death - how do we know it was intentional by the player, and not just because everyone is starving?
A trader starved to death or burned to death - should his faction get angry? How do we know?
I can think of ways try to detect it but it gets tricky.
Quote from: letharion on March 22, 2016, 03:02:23 AM
When mechs with miniguns attack, shielded pawns can stand up to them for a long time due to the minigun spread.
Move a shielded pawn up first, until they become targeted. A shield can withstand a single minigun often forever, while non-shielded pawns get plenty of time to shoot from another direction.
The exploit here would be that the mech doesn't detect that the shielded pawn is not a threat, while the multiple pawns with rifles are.
Perhaps a threat/aggro mechanic would be helpful here.
To hell with you Leth, that's the only time shield-gens are useful is to take bullets for my gunners. Oh, you're a colonist who refuses to use weapons? Here, enjoy being my literal cover.
Would be silly to see an aggro system pop in nowish but I guess anything is possible.
well an aggro system (like the way mmorpg bosses behave) would make combat more dynamic and less predictable.
since i also abuse the shielded-bait-running-around-while-others shoot strategy, coz i'm naturally degenerative/exploitative and lazy when playing. lel.
but adding a real aggro system could increase battle difficulty without needing to raise the quantity of attackers.
Quote from: Tynan on March 23, 2016, 12:02:00 AM
The problem is the same with a lot of similar issues, which is that there's no really good way to determine *why* an event happened for AI purposes.
As in, a guy starved to death - how do we know it was intentional by the player, and not just because everyone is starving?
A trader starved to death or burned to death - should his faction get angry? How do we know?
I can think of ways try to detect it but it gets tricky.
1) traders lost in colony
2) investigation event
3) where are items and bodies?
4) inside stockpile? well - blame player.
5) still on floor? - well - recover items and blame raiders.
player try to build wall section that will trap trading party - throw warning and set flag, if trading party die afterwards - blame player.
If trading party survive - kay, no punishment.
That sounds way to complicated for an issue that is just slightly off.
Well, I guess that you could somehow track the origin of injuries back to the original source. For example, lightning starts fire, fire burns trader, trader dies -> nobody's fault, just a tragic accident.
But yeah, as Tynan says, it's not always possible to come to a solid conclusion as to why an event happened to justify making the AI hostile. You could spin a whole new game out of that called CrimeSceneWorld. ;)
Quote from: Skissor on March 21, 2016, 05:35:59 PM
Here's my factory:
http://puu.sh/nP1LP/cddecca5fc.png
Bugs die on the traps and the colonists clean and rearm the traps consistently. Jelly factory voila!
Ok, this should be impossible in next build (1122). You may still be able to kill an infinite number of bugs, but you aren't harvesting infinite jelly this way.
Noooooooooooooooooooo
I'm conflicted now. Should I further expose exploits or keep them for myself? Hmmm
lol.
Well, they'll all get exposed in the long term anyhow.
You sure, Ty? 8) :-X
By my secret exploit finder, o elite private tester.
Quote from: Tynan on March 24, 2016, 03:46:24 PM
By my secret exploit finder, o elite private tester.
It's a conspiracy! 1122 was an inside job!
Im probably gonna be hated for this, but...
doing anything in diagonal cells should be disallowed. Repairing turrets through a corner...no, stop it.
Quote from: skullywag on March 25, 2016, 01:28:10 PM
Im probably gonna be hated for this, but...
doing anything in diagonal cells should be disallowed. Repairing turrets through a corner...no, stop it.
I agree, I have a note written for this. It's just that it's a bit of a tricky technical problem. But I'll try to do it for A14.
This is not a "real" exploit but it's a kind of.
Using growing areas to grow flowers in a room without a roof and using this room as a "gate" for the base. When raiders attack. You just need to open the first gate and set the flowers on fire then close the second gate and put a roof to the room. When raiders enter, they will suffer overheating and burn to death.
Easy way to annihilate entire hordes of raiders.
Here is a screen :
(http://i.imgur.com/K0eR93l.jpg)
yea. the flame room trap is an old exploit.
i think burning pawns or overheating/cold pawns should automatically run outside on instinct, before they start doing their panic dance.
i can think of several solutions to that. for starters, fire could be limited in size based on what is burning.
also, i didn't realize a temperature trap would still work with a door open.
If only we could get enemy pawns to play BomberWorld with molotovs. ;)
Does this count a an exploit: (seen on reddit)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WUbHPyMYdoc
i laughed.
Theyre doing our jobs for us:
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=18010.0;topicseen
For me it was chickens in the last game I played. It took me about a year to have 200 chickens but when you have so many outside, attackers will target them before colonist or turrets. Not a very smart use of triple rocket launchers by the attackers... Chicken population grows extremely fast, when I sold every chicken I got something like 5000 for all of them. It required a minimal amount of labor and investment for such a huge return in a short time.
I mentioned before some issues with infestations. I think bugs should attack doors in order to kill colonists, now you can shoot, then hide behind a door and repeat until they are dead.
Hmm, you know, bugs wouldn't necessarily need to attack and destroy the door - they could secrete and deposit a sticky resin which slows the opening and closing of the door for a while.
Quote from: MarvinKosh on March 26, 2016, 07:16:15 PM
Hmm, you know, bugs wouldn't necessarily need to attack and destroy the door - they could secrete and deposit a sticky resin which slows the opening and closing of the door for a while.
or even more annoying seal the door (lock it to their faction) while they increase in number.
Quote from: skullywag on March 26, 2016, 06:29:15 AM
Theyre doing our jobs for us:
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=18010.0;topicseen
those were internal doors. wouldn't it be easier if you just kept the door open?
also, my internal doors are all made of wood. the only doors i make out of stoneblocks are for the main gate and the prisoner doors (both are auto-stone doors)
anyways. i think there be a restriction to build doors (ie : it can only be built if there are two walls on either side.
Haven't seen this one mentioned yet so here goes: It is possible to sell uncollected steel from all over the map just by making a zone where the steel currently is at. If you delete your in colony zone, you can guarantee that you are selling the distant steel. This could be resoloved by having to build an unpowered trade statue which would be used by the local traders. Think of it as a low-tech orbital beacon.
Wow, this thread is very informative! I'm still taking notes here, so please continue to tell me anything that comes up.
Ways to cheese the infestations would be good to know too.
Quote from: Darth Fool on March 27, 2016, 11:45:33 AM
Haven't seen this one mentioned yet so here goes: It is possible to sell uncollected steel from all over the map just by making a zone where the steel currently is at. If you delete your in colony zone, you can guarantee that you are selling the distant steel. This could be resoloved by having to build an unpowered trade statue which would be used by the local traders. Think of it as a low-tech orbital beacon.
woah, this is a great exploit and it also applies to almost every distant stuff that drops from cargo pods. :o
Quote from: Darth Fool on March 27, 2016, 11:45:33 AM
Haven't seen this one mentioned yet so here goes: It is possible to sell uncollected steel from all over the map just by making a zone where the steel currently is at. If you delete your in colony zone, you can guarantee that you are selling the distant steel. This could be resoloved by having to build an unpowered trade statue which would be used by the local traders. Think of it as a low-tech orbital beacon.
Damn, how did I never realize this? Great way to sell stuff to traders that you never even collected.
I've never noticed this before because I usually like to build in the center of the map, but I've found that when a raid breaks and flees it will head straight towards the nearest edge of the map even if the path is very dangerous, or if there are plenty of player-built structures between the raiders and the map edge. In my long-term game for the latest build, I got six prisoners from the most recent raid due to this behavior. Very exploitable.
Another attacking weakness is that when your units are hidden inside, raiders will attack any available door. The door does not need to lead to anything. This allows for fake doors to distract raiders on their way to the base and get them to arrive in smaller numbers.
A related exploit is that when hidden, if you have multiple doors into your base, you can amass all of your troops with melee weapons and wait for isolated enemies to attack a door. Note that even ranged weapon carrying raiders will enter into melee distance to try and punch open the door. Granted, if all the raiders tried to enter through one door, there would be an exploit. Basically, for this one, I think ranged attackers should try and shoot their way through doors/walls from a distance, as long as there are no friendly raiders in the way.
I suggest moving this one to the public tester forums to get more insights.
Apparently:
you can apply and remove peg legs from prisoners to train doctoring.
Quote from: Nasikabatrachus on March 27, 2016, 04:03:16 PM
I've never noticed this before because I usually like to build in the center of the map, but I've found that when a raid breaks and flees it will head straight towards the nearest edge of the map even if the path is very dangerous, or if there are plenty of player-built structures between the raiders and the map edge. In my long-term game for the latest build, I got six prisoners from the most recent raid due to this behavior. Very exploitable.
As I did in my mega fort. Thats why i set the main door right at the edge.
The best solution I can think of is that they flee in the direction of the edge they spawned at. In the case of a drop pod attack, maybe a random edge instead of nearest. Either method is better than trying to flee right past all my turrets.
Quote from: skullywag on March 29, 2016, 08:27:14 AM
Apparently:
you can apply and remove peg legs from prisoners to train doctoring.
You could probably do the same with Dentures, no? And likewise every other prosthetic, although dentures and peg legs are a lot cheaper should the patient die!
Using personal shields on people dodging in / out of cover to draw fire while others shoot the targets.
Using 2 doors on manhunting animals, firing 1 pistol / pdw shot before closing the door.
I think bug should constantly attack your colony and try to break through walls or equipment if necesary to harvest at least one colonist, make it so they have to go al the way and carry a corpse back to create more food not be just a thing that show up from nothing.
and the size of the swarm should increase constantly like for instance first just small bugs then something like a couple of medium sized pests and then something like a behemoth like monster.
make it painful and a deadly threat if not managed properly.
I think it would be great to make a jelly factory but be a real difficult thing
Renham, suggestions are welcome but please open a new thread. This thread is only for calling out exploit strategies.
Quote from: ZestyLemons on March 22, 2016, 10:02:49 PM
Here's a tiny doozy for you, Tynan: https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=2295
(for the lazy: Euthanizing colonists gives colonists less negative thoughts than letting them starve to death)
Could the negative thoughts with euthanizing colonists/prisoners be reduced if that unit has suffered a terminal injury, like brain damage, or if they're permanently unconscious for some other reason?
Or maybe some random counter buff like people being relieved that the suffering has stopped? Might open this up to other exploitation though, like forcing some LVL 1 doctor to perform some ill fated surgery...
Quote from: ciditi on March 29, 2016, 01:44:10 PM
Quote from: ZestyLemons on March 22, 2016, 10:02:49 PM
Here's a tiny doozy for you, Tynan: https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=2295
(for the lazy: Euthanizing colonists gives colonists less negative thoughts than letting them starve to death)
Could the negative thoughts with euthanizing colonists/prisoners be reduced if that unit has suffered a terminal injury, like brain damage, or if they're permanently unconscious for some other reason?
Or maybe some random counter buff like people being relieved that the suffering has stopped? Might open this up to other exploitation though, like forcing some LVL 1 doctor to perform some ill fated surgery...
While euthanizing someone should be a negative hit, I feel it should have less impact that say watching your friend die while a raider attack goes on. I also feel it should be more situational. If there is a chance someone can live if the life support is left on until a new heart is found, it should be harder to take than say someone who was brain dead and there was no hope because they were already gone.
But going back to the exploit of someone starving in a locked room... While this is a game, I think this exploit is kind of a reflection of society in general if you look at history. Historically, not much has changed to address starvation and the thousands that die per day in the U.S. alone compared to back in the times of Rome over a thousand years ago. People in general will find ways to 'excuse' them self from attachment of that person having starved to death (it was so and so's responsibility / I did and gave all I could but I had problems too) compared to giving permission to take someone's life after everything had been exhausted to save it.
Non-the less... perhaps set it up that if a colonist starves to death and no one else is starving a major hit on the colony is taken to address the game exploit?
Sorry if this a bit late, but locking visitor pawns inside inescapable rooms (just walls, no doors). They are trapped, cannot escape, and eventually starve to death without even trying to bash down a wall.
Its an extremely easy, if tedious way to get loot at the start, just wait a few nights till the food goes away that they brought, eventually they will kill each other out of stress, then once everything is said and done, open the vault up and claim the gear, all without the faction minding. You can also speed this up with heaters / freezers to cook / chill them.
Granted this takes a WHILE, particularly with the fact they bring multiple meals, but you can really, really exploit this, for free equipment, and many other things.
I think if a pawn is in danger (starvation, heat, cold, ect) and has no way to escape the map, they should make a way themselves, perhaps even resulting in a very small drop in goodwill.
I also noticed, locked in the tiny room, the pawn did not even consume all her carried meals before collapsing from starvation.
These were tested in 13.1130
Quote from: mumblemumble on April 01, 2016, 07:13:07 PM
Sorry if this a bit late, but locking visitor pawns inside inescapable rooms (just walls, no doors). They are trapped, cannot escape, and eventually starve to death without even trying to bash down a wall.
Its an extremely easy, if tedious way to get loot at the start, just wait a few nights till the food goes away that they brought, eventually they will kill each other out of stress, then once everything is said and done, open the vault up and claim the gear, all without the faction minding. You can also speed this up with heaters / freezers to cook / chill them.
Granted this takes a WHILE, particularly with the fact they bring multiple meals, but you can really, really exploit this, for free equipment, and many other things.
I think if a pawn is in danger (starvation, heat, cold, ect) and has no way to escape the map, they should make a way themselves, perhaps even resulting in a very small drop in goodwill.
I also noticed, locked in the tiny room, the pawn did not even consume all her carried meals before collapsing from starvation.
These were tested in 13.1130
I actually JUST tried to do this, granted I DID make a door, and the pawns after a while attempted to bash the door down once one or more went bonkers from stress. Same build, 0.13.1130.
I said in my post, NO DOOR specifically. if its just solid walls, they just give up, and submit to their fate.
And someone who is doing this kind of exploit won't care about not having a door.
Oh also, this works to farm goodwill easily, by rescuing them, despite inflicting it upon them.
Quote from: mumblemumble on April 01, 2016, 07:24:00 PM
I said in my post, NO DOOR specifically. if its just solid walls, they just give up, and submit to their fate.
And someone who is doing this kind of exploit won't care about not having a door.
Oh also, this works to farm goodwill easily, by rescuing them, despite inflicting it upon them.
Ahh my bad. I missed the 'no door' part. :-[
An exploit that I've made use of time and time again regards the executed prisoner debuff. When I want to execute a prisoner I don't use the execute prisoner option because that results in the executed prisoner debuff. So what I do is I bring in one of my colonists with a gun and use the forced fire option (with B) to shoot at the prisoner until hes dead. When all is said and done the prisoner is executed with no debuff other than the "witnessed strangers death" for -3, which is a far lighter consequence.
Quote from: Tynan on March 21, 2016, 05:28:32 PM
Wouldn't solve it; I can set it up so that colonist have to go and manually remove the roof, though.
Yea. this would be a really good solution for something that I think doesn't fit within your current vision.
Hot swapping bunk. Have only one non-prisoner, non-medical bunk or sleeping spot per three colonists. Restrict colonists to sleep in one of three shifts and assign the bunk to them at the beginning of their sleeping shift. Prevents some buffs like shared bedroom while reducing the number of necessary beds. Requires a lot of micro-managaing but in a starting colony that is on the edge of neurosis can be worth it. Many possible ways to deal with this exploit, such as penalizing the loss of ownership. I would prefer to make hot-swap bunking an actual option amongst the assign category where anyone who needs to sleep takes whatever bunk is available with a slight penalty.
Ok, here is another one I just tested: the old handicapped sacrificial prisoner. Wait until you have a prisoner with an infected leg, perhaps helped along by maintaining a dirty prison, and then amputate the leg. Place the prisoner behind your entry way. As soon as raiders get through the entry way they will decide to kidnap who they can. All but one of them will leave as fast as they can, while the one remaining one is slowed down carrying the sacrifice. Now, charge out with your colonists and melee the poor raider to recover your "guest". Wash, Rinse, Repeat. Works with useless colonists as well.
Molotovs impact in walls by detonating "inside" the wall, meaning you can light the other side without having a line of sight.
Also means a molotov is less effective if chucked at a wall, as 3 of the fuel puddles spawn inside the wall.
Also applies to grenades and rockets, unsure if this is fixable, but making the explosion spawn outside the wall would be great.
Rockets i can understand, mind you, since they launch at such high speeds / could Pierce walls a bit, but molotovs leaking through a stone wall is odd, and abusable to light tribals trying to bash down a door.
Quote from: mumblemumble on April 05, 2016, 03:13:59 PM
Molotovs impact in walls by detonating "inside" the wall, meaning you can light the other side without having a line of sight.
Also means a molotov is less effective if chucked at a wall, as 3 of the fuel puddles spawn inside the wall.
Also applies to grenades, unsure if this is fixable, but making the explosion spawn outside the wall would be great.
That's actually a bug, I'd say.
Quote from: Tynan on April 05, 2016, 03:26:35 PM
Quote from: mumblemumble on April 05, 2016, 03:13:59 PM
Molotovs impact in walls by detonating "inside" the wall, meaning you can light the other side without having a line of sight.
Also means a molotov is less effective if chucked at a wall, as 3 of the fuel puddles spawn inside the wall.
Also applies to grenades, unsure if this is fixable, but making the explosion spawn outside the wall would be great.
That's actually a bug, I'd say.
Bug, exploit, incendiary incident, whatever you want to call it, as long as it gets fixed =)
Well, this thread is for exploit strategies.
Could you report it as a bug in a separate thread, according to the usual method?
While doing testing with the development build, I decided to see what I could do to make traps effective. It turns out that you can exploit them by spamming the construction of doors in a way I don't think they were intended. This was done so that colonists could reset traps without standing on live traps and killing themselves. What you see here is an extremely long line of traps in equally long corridors. Enemies can't path through doors and traps don't count as a barrier, so they will force themselves through all the traps to get to the main entrance to the colony since it is the only way in that's not blocked, even though they hit the traps again and again. When colonists need to access traps they just walk in between the traps by going through the doors, even though it shouldn't be possible for a colonist to enter a door through the side (a bug from my point of view). These trap corridors are so effective that I haven't had to personally attack any enemies with my colonists for about 2 years, as nobody has been able to survive going through each hall of traps. Not even centipedes can get through (all of them die from their head getting crushed by 4 traps)! That being said I have never completed all of the traps in the corridors simply because I haven't had the need for any more than this.
The only problem I've had when doing this is colonists will reset a trap while another one is standing on that trap resetting yet a different trap. As soon as the trap gets reset, the trap will occasionally instantly activate on the colonist standing on it. I've lost at least colonist to this peculiar behavior so far.
(http://i1044.photobucket.com/albums/b441/NightwolfASM6502/screenshot1_zpsy2dbtdgt.png) (http://s1044.photobucket.com/user/NightwolfASM6502/media/screenshot1_zpsy2dbtdgt.png.html)
Quote from: Nightwolf on April 05, 2016, 05:01:57 PM
...
That's certainly creative! Never thought of something like that. There's probably an array of exploits that revolve around stacks of doorways, really.
I never thought of this one here (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=18305.0) but it seems like a neat idea.
I guess if a player save scumming to get a legendary table is a problem, you could get around it by setting the randomisation seed based on the world seed and total colony time played. Reloading will therefore be repeating the same action expecting a different result, aka madness.
Personally, I don't think that there's so much randomisation that it is worth trying to get legendary furniture. Sculpting will easily get you more reliable results!
I like the idea of using doors to reset traps in a non-cheesy way and I might try it and see how it goes.
Honestly with the "save scum", thing, i think instead having an xcom tick box to prevent it that you can turn on / off would be ideal, rather than it being forced on, and screwing people who say, save right before a raid or something.
Besides save scumming is a very different type of exploit.
Quote from: mumblemumble on April 06, 2016, 02:21:32 PM
Honestly with the "save scum", thing, i think instead having an xcom tick box to prevent it that you can turn on / off would be ideal, rather than it being forced on, and screwing people who say, save right before a raid or something.
Besides save scumming is a very different type of exploit.
I think this is what the new perma death mode does. ;)
Exactly... Some people suggest a device to prevent save scumming, and while I'm fine with it being an option off by default, having it on and unable to be turned off would become such a headache for everyone else eventually, i think it wouldn't be worth it.
Besides that, save scumming kinda goes outside "game exploits" to "exploiting players"
And while the majority of players won't 'save scum', often the devices developed to prevent it end up becoming issues and problems for those who never would do it.
Constructing buildings around turrets and then deconstructing all but one square to make the turret in darkness.
Moving this to General Discussion so everyone can weigh in.
Shooting siegers with a sniper rifle would be nicely countered if they had fast guard dogs with them. As soon as a sniper shot is fired, they unleash 2-3 dogs at him.
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Grenades work through walls. If there's an enemy on the other side of a wall, throw a grenade there. Works very well with stone walls and raw stone. I mean the explosion hurts through a wall.
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Reconnect abuse - instead of building a switch, place a disconnected circuit next to the turret you want to power. Then manually press Reconnect and you save pawn time and components.
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IED exploit - place one IED as a trigger, scatter and forbid more shells as the payload. Not sure if it's a real exploit. You can cancel construction of other IED to get one shell per square, then forbid the shell. Works best indoors so shells don't deteriorate.
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Effective but cheesy - place several IED traps around a crashed ship part, far away enough to not go off in a chain reaction. Poke and run away. I'm not sure this is an exploit, but it would make sense if some mechanoids were on guard and just wouldn't allow me to spend a lot of time constructing stuff around them.
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Unroof building when stuff is on fire. Don't hold doors open, don't build firefoam, don't plan ahead. Works everywhere except under mountains.
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Use harmless decoy colonists to draw enemy fire. Make him wear Personal Shield and as much armour as you can afford, and put him in cover in first line of defense. Enemies will focus on shooting him and do very little damage, while your real damage dealers have fun.
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Give a pawn a crappy inaccurate weapon and make him hunt to train Shooting skill.
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Order a pawn to craft expensive items or art, then cancel construction when it's about to end. This trains crafting skill with no material used. Related - make people construct stone chess tables for obscene amount of Construction xp and very little resources used.
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I like to build my open colonies like this. But I realized it feels exploit-ish for a couple of reasons. Basically grab as much land as you can, because roofs are essentially free in Rimworld.
(http://wstaw.org/m/2016/04/28/loosecolony.png)
1. Outer perimeter walls confuse the hell out of sappers. They treat a wall as THE objective, and only seem to consider how to breach the outer wall. They have no idea what their goal is or where to go to cause lots of damage.
2. This lets you turn your entire colony including fields into one huge "workshop" room, like on the left. You start getting bonuses for Spacious and other room bonuses if you do it carefully. Actually it happened accidentally to me. It might be a bit dirty, but it's invariably luxurious and extremely spacious. I suppose the beauty can be fixed with planting dandellions everywhere.
3. You leave a few doors open, then when wargs come you just close those doors and they bark outside. Your fields and everything inside is safe. Even if sappers come they tend to be attacked by wargs. But even on Randy it's extremely rare to have a raid during a manhunter event.
4. Outer perimeter wall makes toxic fallout trivial. While it may look like it takes a long to build, it's not so if you initially use wood.
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 27, 2016, 07:29:01 PM
Shooting siegers with a sniper rifle would be nicely countered if they had fast guard dogs with them. As soon as a sniper shot is fired, they unleash 2-3 dogs at him.
Wonder if they can make guards during sieges. Snipe and running isn't a bad tactic, is smart and a bit roleplay, but have some snipers or similar of their own set specifically to respond? release the hounds would be cool.
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QuoteGrenades work through walls. If there's an enemy on the other side of a wall, throw a grenade there. Works very well with stone walls and raw stone. I mean the explosion hurts through a wall.
Yeah, I hate it when a grenade flies through the wall
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QuoteReconnect abuse - instead of building a switch, place a disconnected circuit next to the turret you want to power. Then manually press Reconnect and you save pawn time and components.
Wonder if they can make connecting, reconnecting a manual feature. So build it, then you gotta tell it where to connect instead of the auto. Pawn comes to hook up?
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QuoteIED exploit - place one IED as a trigger, scatter and forbid more shells as the payload. Not sure if it's a real exploit. You can cancel construction of other IED to get one shell per square, then forbid the shell. Works best indoors so shells don't deteriorate.
Nah, that isn't an exploit. That is clever tactics. I mean it is an explosive being detonated by an explosion.
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QuoteEffective but cheesy - place several IED traps around a crashed ship part, far away enough to not go off in a chain reaction. Poke and run away. I'm not sure this is an exploit, but it would make sense if some mechanoids were on guard and just wouldn't allow me to spend a lot of time constructing stuff around them.
Well, as it stands, that is a pretty clever tactic. The building of them might not be hostile hence the mechanoids not activating to defend their bit of ship?
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QuoteUnroof building when stuff is on fire. Don't hold doors open, don't build firefoam, don't plan ahead. Works everywhere except under mountains.
Will poke at this at the end.
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QuoteUse harmless decoy colonists to draw enemy fire. Make him wear Personal Shield and as much armour as you can afford, and put him in cover in first line of defense. Enemies will focus on shooting him and do very little damage, while your real damage dealers have fun.
Hrm. Is a bit of an AI issue. Perhaps one way is that shooters focus on main threat within range so they keep shooting at your shooters and melee just run right by if not a threat. The threat rating set by the equipped weapon. compared to defence. So weapon up threats, armor drops threat. Result is a range of influence for triggering aggro? Therefore if you have an unarmored with a legendary minigun firing, he is going to priority over everything else regardless of where he stands?
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QuoteGive a pawn a crappy inaccurate weapon and make him hunt to train Shooting skill.
That isn't exploit. It really is learning to shoot. Put it into real life perspective. you are trying to learn to shoot and given a crappy terribad gun that doesn't really hurt the animals. You will learn how to compensate for aim misalignments and where to aim for. Over time, you will be able to make that crappy gun shoot not too bad. Suddenly you are given a high power, high accuracy precision weapon?
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QuoteOrder a pawn to craft expensive items or art, then cancel construction when it's about to end. This trains crafting skill with no material used. Related - make people construct stone chess tables for obscene amount of Construction xp and very little resources used.
Hrm... I guess it is somewhat exploity. Perhaps a reduction in cancel yield per percentage done? Every 10%, lose 2% of material return? This means it stays on similar par to if you just built it and deconstructed?
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QuoteI like to build my open colonies like this. But I realized it feels exploit-ish for a couple of reasons. Basically grab as much land as you can, because roofs are essentially free in Rimworld.
1. Outer perimeter walls confuse the hell out of sappers. They treat a wall as THE objective, and only seem to consider how to breach the outer wall. They have no idea what their goal is or where to go to cause lots of damage.
2. This lets you turn your entire colony including fields into one huge "workshop" room, like on the left. You start getting bonuses for Spacious and other room bonuses if you do it carefully. Actually it happened accidentally to me. It might be a bit dirty, but it's invariably luxurious and extremely spacious. I suppose the beauty can be fixed with planting dandellions everywhere.
3. You leave a few doors open, then when wargs come you just close those doors and they bark outside. Your fields and everything inside is safe. Even if sappers come they tend to be attacked by wargs. But even on Randy it's extremely rare to have a raid during a manhunter event.
4. Outer perimeter wall makes toxic fallout trivial. While it may look like it takes a long to build, it's not so if you initially use wood.
The wall one is interesting. Isn't that unheard of. The bonus for spacious and beauty if you grow and home zone? Well I consider that like having a beautiful or big front yard. Stepping outside and seeing a massive expance of land all yours would put me in a mood. Is fair.
The roofs though... This is something I read a few times for the intant on, instant off. On page one he said that a roof could be set to be buildable. Maybe that is the answer? Make a new visual toggle in the bottom right to toggle roof on/off. An on roof having some transparency to it perhaps? This way you have to build a roof and the roof can catch fire.
The worst exploit in the game is shooting through jammed open doors. You can shoot them, they can't shoot you..
Deep water spawning right next to mountains. Makes for a bit of a janky embrasure if you construct around it right. Enemy pawns don't seem to know what to do, don't even fire with ranged weapons since there is no path. I exploited this to no end on my last world.
Other exploity tactics. Hmmmm... Insect hives don't seem to spawn outside the room where they spawn. Unless the insects break out into a new room. This means you can make a 12x12, or so, room, put turrets around the periphery and farm it for lots of meat and jelly. Just have to clear out a few of the extra hives every week, to prevent turret losses. This sort of farm pretty much fed that same colony with the deep water embrasure.
I am not sure why this exploit is not more common on these forums. Rather than a kill box I use a Gratuitous Ganking Gauntlet!
http://imgur.com/QIRC6Sc
Nearly all baddies will ignore the colonists as they hobble through the sandbag filled hallway while they get stabbed over and over through the corners. This base entrance can kill hordes of attackers using melee attacks with very little danger of retaliation. Even melee raiders/tribals/robots do not fight back even though they could.
It only stops working vs mad animals (because they just target the closest person) and when something in the hallway actually gets line of sight on something it wants to kill. Then it starts looking for targets and fighting back. When this happens I just move the attacked pawn back a square to get rid of agro and the attacker goes back to limping through the gauntlet.
On the one hand, I don't want you to fix this because I love using murder holes like this. On the other hand, I think this is clearly an exploit and it is very powerful.
Sorry if someone else addressed this, but ... yeah siege raiders could use an AI tweak. They'll often have a sniper among them with a sniper rifle, but often enough the sniper will build and when they are building, they aren't protecting their teammates. I don't think sniping siegers is an exploit though the snipers among the siegers should ALWAYS be on guard duty and should never build.
I have not yet deployed them, but I'm currently attempting something that might be considered an exploit -- taming boomrats and boomalopes and giving all of them 'release' training. Basically free self-guiding incendiary grenades :P
I dunno if this is considered an exploit or not, but when getting hit with raiders, I will look to see if there are any cougars or bears near the raiders. I'd hit the cougar/bear with my sniper to put it into a frenzy, and they'll go after the nearest people -- since I sniped from a distance and made sure to target one near the raiders, that's the raiders that'll get attacked. I also look out for boomrats/boomalopes, particularly if they are waiting before attacking or building siege as that will start a firestorm near where the raiders are that can really help me.
Bug farming can be done by creating a door with a chunk in it. The bugs will treat the door as closed while the colonist will fire through it. This behavior is obviously not intended.
You can grab loot from land traders without actually killing them -- I found out accidentally the trader muffalos will drink themselves to incapacitation if there is beer nearby, and if they become incapacitated they instantly dump their entire inventory.
Quote from: schnivelbiv on April 27, 2016, 11:10:18 PM
I am not sure why this exploit is not more common on these forums. Rather than a kill box I use a Gratuitous Ganking Gauntlet!
http://imgur.com/QIRC6Sc
Nearly all baddies will ignore the colonists as they hobble through the sandbag filled hallway while they get stabbed over and over through the corners. This base entrance can kill hordes of attackers using melee attacks with very little danger of retaliation. Even melee raiders/tribals/robots do not fight back even though they could.
It only stops working vs mad animals (because they just target the closest person) and when something in the hallway actually gets line of sight on something it wants to kill. Then it starts looking for targets and fighting back. When this happens I just move the attacked pawn back a square to get rid of agro and the attacker goes back to limping through the gauntlet.
On the one hand, I don't want you to fix this because I love using murder holes like this. On the other hand, I think this is clearly an exploit and it is very powerful.
omg. i just learned something. :o
@Tynan
how is shooting siegers with a sniper an exploit? most of the time they have snipers too and shoot back.
what's next, using mortars is an exploit too?
if you want to hunt REAL exploits, how about roof collapsing on evil/poison ships?
Gimmicky solutions to gimmicky strategies won't plug a perceived exploit, it will just carve room for a new exploit. Putting dogs in a raider camp doesn't stop me from sniping the camp, it just means the dogs get shot first. Thanks for the meat I guess.
You're not really going to fix this without completely revamping sieges, because anything in an open field like that is vulnerable to snipers and counter-mortar fire. Those sieges are mincemeat vs anyone prepared to handle them the second they show up.
I think we're well and off of the bar set for an exploit in the first few pages by now, though..
Quote from: letharion on March 22, 2016, 03:02:23 AM
When mechs with miniguns attack, shielded pawns can stand up to them for a long time due to the minigun spread.
Move a shielded pawn up first, until they become targeted. A shield can withstand a single minigun often forever, while non-shielded pawns get plenty of time to shoot from another direction.
The exploit here would be that the mech doesn't detect that the shielded pawn is not a threat, while the multiple pawns with rifles are.
Perhaps a threat/aggro mechanic would be helpful here.
This!
Add 2-3 shielded pawns behind rocks (I usually use the ones who can't fight for backstory reasons) and you can rotate them if one of them loses the shield.
Meanwhile, snipers prioritize fire at mechanoids that use incendiary weapons or charge lance.
Quote from: Vaporisor on April 27, 2016, 08:30:32 PM
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 27, 2016, 07:29:01 PM
Shooting siegers with a sniper rifle would be nicely countered if they had fast guard dogs with them. As soon as a sniper shot is fired, they unleash 2-3 dogs at him.
Wonder if they can make guards during sieges. Snipe and running isn't a bad tactic, is smart and a bit roleplay, but have some snipers or similar of their own set specifically to respond? release the hounds would be cool.
Real snipers typically fire several shots and immediately hide somewhere else, because the usual response is to hunt them down. What they do is essentially an ambush, and whatever happens no one is going to just stay there and let be sniped. And if a sniper shoots from very far away - say 1 km and more - it's enough to simply stand up and walk away before the round arrives. That's why snipers don't use laser pointers, and hardly anyone else does.
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Quote
QuoteGrenades work through walls. If there's an enemy on the other side of a wall, throw a grenade there. Works very well with stone walls and raw stone. I mean the explosion hurts through a wall.
Yeah, I hate it when a grenade flies through the wall
No, no I don't meant it FLYING through a wall which I guess is possible but will obviously be fixed. I mean you're on one side, enemy is on the other side, you throw a grenade as close as possible at the wall, and explosion deals damage despite exploding on your side.
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QuoteReconnect abuse - instead of building a switch, place a disconnected circuit next to the turret you want to power. Then manually press Reconnect and you save pawn time and components.
Also works with two batteries. If you have a remote machine like a smelter near frontline, keep one charged battery and one empty. Press 'reconnect' to connect to the empty battery when you're done smelting.
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Quote
QuoteOrder a pawn to craft expensive items or art, then cancel construction when it's about to end. This trains crafting skill with no material used. Related - make people construct stone chess tables for obscene amount of Construction xp and very little resources used.
Hrm... I guess it is somewhat exploity. Perhaps a reduction in cancel yield per percentage done? Every 10%, lose 2% of material return? This means it stays on similar par to if you just built it and deconstructed?
Or award xp once the work is finished, proportionally to the commitment. I played a free team-based FPS/RTS "Tremulous", which is about aliens versus humans, both building bases end upgrading their equipment. Credits for weapon and gear are gained by killing enemies. Each type of enemy is worth a certain number of points, say 600 for a smaller alien. If two marines kill it, one dealing 200 and another 400 damage, one of them gets 200 credits and another 400 (plus a small bonus for the finishing blow). They get nothing at all until the alien is killed.
Quote
The wall one is interesting. Isn't that unheard of. The bonus for spacious and beauty if you grow and home zone? Well I consider that like having a beautiful or big front yard. Stepping outside and seeing a massive expance of land all yours would put me in a mood. Is fair.
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Something related occured to me - you can put a stockpile in a room with another purpose and it will be a big boost to its impresiveness. So you can make a plasteel, gold, jade, uranium, silver stockpile in dining room to cheer everyone up. Or put it in someone's room to satisfy a greedy colonist. It's really an exploit because the silver or plasteel is not his, and it's not there forever, but they get a mood boost. I think at least greedy colonists should get an extra mood penalty when a room impresiveness goes down by a lot.
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Enemies will outrange your turrets ? Turn power off with a switch or uninstalling a battery. Wait until they are in range of turrets. Turn the power back on. I used this against 3 scyther raid in first year.
I think the solution could be enemies sniping even unpowered turrets if they don't risk anything to do that. Scythers deal high damage and have high range, turrets are relatively expensive and fragile. Wargs and other manhunters is another story.
For the bug problem I use explosives. RPGs work great, nades are a little riskier because you have to get closer.
Drafting a colonist doesn't disturb sleep. If you know a colonist will enter a room of another colonist, draft the sleeper. It only has side effects when the sleeper is highly rested - he will go out of bed without getting full rest benefits. But if the sleeper is barely rested, he will go back to bed without any mood loss.
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People keep saying you hit more with minigun if you target a square next to the target, instead of shooting it directly. Because of miss radius. I can't verify, I haven't used it.
I hate to give this up, but it does feel pretty exploitative.
Rather than assign pawns to cut down trees, I'll assign them to build graves on top of the trees. This gives me the wood and clears out the tree, usually faster than plant removal, and costs no resources. Deconstructing a grave is super fast. Also this allows you to cut down trees when you have few/no colonists who will do plant removal... that's how I figured it out in the first place.
RIP Grave Tree Garden A13.
You can detect air pockets within mountains with the No Roof Area tool. Drag mouse over an area and if there's an air pocket deep in mountains you will see it's possible to unroof it.
I just had an evil idea. I noticed my colonist who lost a kidney to a charge lance has a market value of only about $880, compared to the typical $1300 of a healthy colonist. Kidneys and perhaps lungs have little practical use in the game right now - I believe blood filtration might be involved in resisting diseases ? Anyway, if you have a great doctor you can mutilate your colonists, extracting a kidney and/or a lung from each of them to artificially keep their market value low and have easier raids.. There is a slight chance that those colonists take a hit to second kidney or lung, killing them instantly, and there's one less body part to destroy. But for the ruthless there's a way to keep raids smaller... and train Medicine! You can even sell those kidneys.
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 28, 2016, 08:13:08 AM
I just had an evil idea. I noticed my colonist who lost a kidney to a charge lance has a market value of only about $880, compared to the typical $1300 of a healthy colonist. Kidneys and perhaps lungs have little practical use in the game right now - I believe blood filtration might be involved in resisting diseases ? Anyway, if you have a great doctor you can mutilate your colonists, extracting a kidney and/or a lung from each of them to artificially keep their market value low and have easier raids.. There is a slight chance that those colonists take a hit to second kidney or lung, killing them instantly, and there's one less body part to destroy. But for the ruthless there's a way to keep raids smaller... and train Medicine! You can even sell those kidneys.
Without that they may die to a simple infection ... happend so often.
I'm not reading the rest of the posts to prevent spoilers... I don't want to know about "bugs" to exploit while I'm actually playing.
I think easy exploits heavily impact the fun during the game (having the feeling the game is stupid creates a loose of interest).
1 - I noticed is possible to build lot of turrets or simpli put 2 snipers next to any landed ship (psyco or toxic). In general ships are OP (but I play at high/extreme level).
2- To kill bus hives when they get too big is enough to put them on fire with molotov and wait.
3- Having a long wall with two dors at the extremes makes it easier to kill raders... just with 2 snipers that go out and i of the doors.
4- Killing caravans to steal everything is kind of easy (and sometime wrongly triggered by riders).... with the obvious downside (still wondering how to recover reputations, thought trading would have helped.
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 28, 2016, 08:13:08 AM
I just had an evil idea. I noticed my colonist who lost a kidney to a charge lance has a market value of only about $880, compared to the typical $1300 of a healthy colonist. Kidneys and perhaps lungs have little practical use in the game right now - I believe blood filtration might be involved in resisting diseases ? Anyway, if you have a great doctor you can mutilate your colonists, extracting a kidney and/or a lung from each of them to artificially keep their market value low and have easier raids.. There is a slight chance that those colonists take a hit to second kidney or lung, killing them instantly, and there's one less body part to destroy. But for the ruthless there's a way to keep raids smaller... and train Medicine! You can even sell those kidneys.
N.B. Only the population figure is used in raid calculations, as far as I know. The actual value of a colonist isn't considered. I've looked at the bit which does this calculation, and made a mod which does the calculation differently, so yeah.
As much as I'd hate to make it known, there is an exploit with double doors you can do. If you have a room with the hive inside, you can have your colonist start to walk inside, pause, command them to fire at whatever's inside the room, and the bugs will never fight back. The door opens but the colonist never goes inside. Colonists will try and walk through the door, but they register seeing the bug before they even get to it...
(http://i.imgur.com/vpvRe9Y.jpg?1)
Makes harvesting Jelly virtually risk free, so long as you stay on top of the bug count.
(My justification is the colonist is just cracking the door open and the bug can't get to them :P)
Not sure if this is an exploit, but I've stumbled upon an interesting way to deal with sappers.
I cut through a nearby hill to lay a power line to connect with a geothermal, and filled the one tile wide tunnel with stone doors, to keep raiders from shortcutting through. (There were around 10-12 doors involved.) However, when sapping raiders spawned, they pathed through the tunnel. Their melee guys tried to punch the doors down, as the sappers blew them up. The sappers ended up blowing up so many of their own men that the raid fled, well before ever getting near my actual base.
Not sure if an exploit - if you put a plasteel turret in front of others, attackers will focus on it. It doesn't deal any more damage. That's just bad AI priorities. If turrets are quite close to each other, raiders should walk that extra few steps to target the soft turrets.
Quote from: Jorlem on April 28, 2016, 01:32:46 PM
Not sure if this is an exploit, but I've stumbled upon an interesting way to deal with sappers.
I cut through a nearby hill to lay a power line to connect with a geothermal, and filled the one tile wide tunnel with stone doors, to keep raiders from shortcutting through. (There were around 10-12 doors involved.) However, when sapping raiders spawned, they pathed through the tunnel. Their melee guys tried to punch the doors down, as the sappers blew them up. The sappers ended up blowing up so many of their own men that the raid fled, well before ever getting near my actual base.
That is an AI process I guess. One potential way is to put the AI so that they do the ! run away attempt from grenades? What you said is the one bit of combat with sappers that gets to me.
QuoteI want to hear about exploit strategies!
If it is an exploit, I'd argue it isn't strictly a strategy. Generally just abusing a bug or serious behaviour oversight in the AI.
There has only been 1 or 2 real bug exploits in 9 pages of this thread. :P
Oh, and if out ranging a siege is an exploit, then the seiges are an exploit too, as those mortars out range my pistol. Next siege I should just use dev tools to delete them, I guess. :o
There's a thread about mortars in which people are talking about noncombat characters being able to use them. This seems like an oversight to me. Maybe should be reported as a bug instead, but there you go.
Non-combat in the sense they have 2 or less Melee and Shooting skill, or missing eyes and fingers, and no passion in skill. Such characters are only good for handgrenades and mortars are less risky.
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 28, 2016, 07:51:27 PM
Non-combat in the sense they have 2 or less Melee and Shooting skill, or missing eyes and fingers, and no passion in skill. Such characters are only good for handgrenades and mortars are less risky.
Ah, okay. So Empaths and Healers etc. still can't? Never mind then! :D
Mortars require math, not shooting skill. That isn't how you aim a mortar.
For many intents and purposes unconstructed walls count as full walls. They support roof, they block movement, they seem to have just as much HP, they have more beauty (0) than a rock wall (-2). I wonder if I could get away with hauling materials to construction zone and just leaving them there ! That's what the forbid button is for, isn't it ?
Quote from: Mathenaut on April 28, 2016, 10:39:24 PM
Mortars require math, not shooting skill. That isn't how you aim a mortar.
Are you saying colonists incapable of Intellectual shouldn't be able to use mortars ? Instead or in addition to incapable of violence ?
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 29, 2016, 10:22:57 AM
For many intents and purposes unconstructed walls count as full walls. They support roof, they block movement, they seem to have just as much HP, they have more beauty (0) than a rock wall (-2). I wonder if I could get away with hauling materials to construction zone and just leaving them there ! That's what the forbid button is for, isn't it ?
Quote from: Mathenaut on April 28, 2016, 10:39:24 PM
Mortars require math, not shooting skill. That isn't how you aim a mortar.
Are you saying colonists incapable of Intellectual shouldn't be able to use mortars ? Instead or in addition to incapable of violence ?
Sounds legit.
I can't help but think this (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxQqJbW-ohw) is somewhat relevant to the mortar discussion, given Rimtech and the like.
Quote from: Coenmcj on March 21, 2016, 07:08:14 PM
Using 2 or more people when fighting a mechanoid beyond cover, and having one drop behind cover for a split second before coming back out to "reset" the mechanoid's targeting. I'm assuming it would work with other pawns, but generally other pawns have hte same firing speeds or quicker than your own colonists.
Not quite true. A mechanoid will continue "aiming" even if their target has left range/los. If the aim completes, and there is ANY enemy (of the mechanoids) in range and LOS, they will instantly swivel their gun to that target and fire, basically using the "aim" at a different target for the new one instead. I've been unable to actually exploit the mechanoids not firing, however, i HAVE been able to use it to swap a mech's target to a shielded cover pawn instead of the unarmored nudist sniper it was originally targeting.
possibly exploits:
Unroofing a burning building is instant, risk free, and automatically makes the interior nonlethal.
Sappers will not bother to "recognize" enemies until they're near their targeted entry point. This means if the sappers have a long walk and you run out to meet them, they will wander right by your colonists instead of stopping/seeking cover/shooting.
If you have a single, unblocked entry into your base, you can make it a super long single tile corridor and line it with traps (just build door access to the corridor and a door exit from the base). Even though raiders are supposed to remember the traps, only some of them will stop to try to attack walls to get through, meaning the traps will still all spring at the raiders. (on the other hand, raiders remembering trap locations means that traps can never be worth it without forcing raiders to trigger them repeatedly over multiple raids)
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 29, 2016, 10:22:57 AM
For many intents and purposes unconstructed walls count as full walls. They support roof, they block movement, they seem to have just as much HP, they have more beauty (0) than a rock wall (-2). I wonder if I could get away with hauling materials to construction zone and just leaving them there ! That's what the forbid button is for, isn't it ?
They do not support roof, if you deconstruct walls near them then roof will actually fall, they only block way so roof can be constructed.
Quote from: Aatxe360 on April 29, 2016, 10:31:07 AM
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 29, 2016, 10:22:57 AM
For many intents and purposes unconstructed walls count as full walls. They support roof, they block movement, they seem to have just as much HP, they have more beauty (0) than a rock wall (-2). I wonder if I could get away with hauling materials to construction zone and just leaving them there ! That's what the forbid button is for, isn't it ?
Quote from: Mathenaut on April 28, 2016, 10:39:24 PM
Mortars require math, not shooting skill. That isn't how you aim a mortar.
Are you saying colonists incapable of Intellectual shouldn't be able to use mortars ? Instead or in addition to incapable of violence ?
Sounds legit.
Depends. It's math, not rocket science. If a colonist knows the geometry to construct something, they know the geometry to aim a mortar. If they don't and they fire anyways, it'll work more or less the way mortars function now.
As so many times, with so many other things with arguments like this, reality makes this easier, not harder. Properly done, every mortar shot after the first should land closer to the target with a very small deviation around bullseye. Hell, I might actually consider using mortars then.
I gotta say the biggest exploits are micro managing snipers to pick off enemies that don't fight back, also u can move units from a cover wall back and forth and get free shots on mechanoids, also I can snipe the mechanoid ships that land and nothing will come to attack me, I don't even have to move my pawn back and forth.
Quote from: userfredle on April 29, 2016, 08:58:45 PM
I gotta say the biggest exploits are micro managing snipers to pick off enemies that don't fight back, also u can move units from a cover wall back and forth and get free shots on mechanoids, also I can snipe the mechanoid ships that land and nothing will come to attack me, I don't even have to move my pawn back and forth.
I wonder if they could put in a mechanic to where if a sniper fires, they move to where the sniper was and look for targets. Sniping and running would fit with a covert sniper more with reality. Even just have certain people in the spawn set to be the investigators?
Doesn't a lot of this simply come down to "the enemy AI is bad and easy to exploit"?
I have a boreal forest base with 2x2 fueled generators. Two power my base, two power a soil sunlamp on a separate remote circuit. My base has a slight power deficit (90-300W; slightly more if smelter is enabled). My sunlamp circuit has a slight power surplus (2000 - 1600 - 100 = 300W). Naturally, I practice battery juggling. I load one battery at a time in the sunlamp circuit. Once full, it's uninstalled and hauled to the warehouse. Conversely, when a battery in my base power room is about to drain completely, I replace it with a fully charged battery.
The whole time about 3 fully charged batteries are sitting in my warehouse, ready to be installed in case of a prolonged attack. Now the kicker: uninstalled batteries NEVER seem to go Zzzzt. I'm not sure if this is intended, but it allows me to avoid exploding batteries almost completely, and still have emergency power.
Quote from: Tynan on March 23, 2016, 12:02:00 AM
The problem is the same with a lot of similar issues, which is that there's no really good way to determine *why* an event happened for AI purposes.
As in, a guy starved to death - how do we know it was intentional by the player, and not just because everyone is starving?
A trader starved to death or burned to death - should his faction get angry? How do we know?
I can think of ways try to detect it but it gets tricky.
Do you really have to detect the "why?" Maybe it would be easier, and almost just as effective, to have a "member of my faction died in an inhumane way" thought. For colonists, if their buddy starves to death, they should be *extremely* upset - why has my friend starved? Are we running out of food? Then I could be next. Has someone denied him food? That's sick. - The reason is secondary.
It's trickier for the other factions, but I think it could be solved by A) limiting incoming pawns by climate (no caravans on ice sheets, for example) and by B) understanding when their pawns die in a fight with a hostile third party.
An unaccounted-for death should otherwise worsen relations - wouldn't you be at least suspicious if you send a group to see that new colony, and two of them don't come back, whatever the reason?
***
And speaking of other exploits, many of them are related to the way roofs work right now. If roofs were constructed and de-constructed tile by tile, it would solve a lot of issues.
Quote from: stefanstr on April 30, 2016, 02:17:45 PM
It's trickier for the other factions, but I think it could be solved by A) limiting incoming pawns by climate (no caravans on ice sheets, for example) and by B) understanding when their pawns die in a fight with a hostile third party.
Rather than hardcoding "no caravans because it's ice sheet", I would restrict them to Summer and maybe if it coincides with a heat wave. Base it on temperature and weather, not biome.
If you want to train your medical skill, the easiest way to do it is to hunt some big game animal with a pistol or an uzi (any weapon that does low damage per hit). Once the animal is downed, you can rescue the animal and perform often dozens of treatments on them. At 500xp per treatment (for 1.0x passion), that's a whole lot of essentially risk-free and cost-free xp.
After the treatments, you can either finish off the animal and turn it into lunch or let it recover and then shoot it and treat it some more.
I wouldn't really consider it an exploit, except it trivializes training the medical skill to the point that anyone can be made a great surgeon in only a few days.
Quote from: b0rsuk on April 30, 2016, 10:57:04 AM
I have a boreal forest base with 2x2 fueled generators. Two power my base, two power a soil sunlamp on a separate remote circuit. My base has a slight power deficit (90-300W; slightly more if smelter is enabled). My sunlamp circuit has a slight power surplus (2000 - 1600 - 100 = 300W). Naturally, I practice battery juggling. I load one battery at a time in the sunlamp circuit. Once full, it's uninstalled and hauled to the warehouse. Conversely, when a battery in my base power room is about to drain completely, I replace it with a fully charged battery.
The whole time about 3 fully charged batteries are sitting in my warehouse, ready to be installed in case of a prolonged attack. [This] allows me to avoid exploding batteries almost completely, and still have emergency power.
I wouldn't call this an exploit, it just looks like smart management. (Brilliant, actually!) And it's not like you're getting all payoff with no cost; you're putting in extra work hauling these batteries back and forth all the time. That deserves a reward.
As for batteries exploding, isn't it actually conduits that short out? Makes perfect sense that batteries sitting by themselves won't suddenly explode unless you leave them out in the rain. Can't be a wiring fault if there are no wires.
Quote from: Limdood on April 29, 2016, 11:16:59 AM
(on the other hand, raiders remembering trap locations means that traps can never be worth it without forcing raiders to trigger them repeatedly over multiple raids)
I'm using them by making multiple 'shortcut' hallways in parrallel, with all but one stuffed with traps- there's only one safe path through for my colonists to use, while enemies have an ~80% chance of getting it wrong. And whenever the enemies wade into an unsafe path, those traps aren't re-armed- it becomes the new 'safe' path for my colonists. Seems to work ok so far.
Quote from: Limdood on April 29, 2016, 11:16:59 AM
(on the other hand, raiders remembering trap locations means that traps can never be worth it without forcing raiders to trigger them repeatedly over multiple raids)
So a trap can trigger once per hostile faction. If you have 2 hostile tribes and 1 pirate faction, a trap can trigger 4 times, including mechanoids.
But there's a way to make them trigger known traps. It's called setting them on fire. While burning, they will run around and not care. So spice things up with an incendiary IED trap, a molotov or incendiary launcher. Traps made out of stone don't burn.
I saw this over on reddit, it seems to fit...
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/4hb0d3/a_neat_little_trick_to_utilize_the_space_between/
Planting IEDs all around crashed alien ships before I pop them makes short work of the contents. Maybe have them pop if someone comes really close as a solution? That would also deal with the 'enclose ship in walls with a single exit'-strat.
Quote from: carbon on April 30, 2016, 02:46:15 PM
If you want to train your medical skill, the easiest way to do it is to hunt some big game animal with a pistol or an uzi (any weapon that does low damage per hit). Once the animal is downed, you can rescue the animal and perform often dozens of treatments on them. At 500xp per treatment (for 1.0x passion), that's a whole lot of essentially risk-free and cost-free xp.
After the treatments, you can either finish off the animal and turn it into lunch or let it recover and then shoot it and treat it some more.
I wouldn't really consider it an exploit, except it trivializes training the medical skill to the point that anyone can be made a great surgeon in only a few days.
It's not on my account an exploit, as surgeons in real life
do practice (and get experience !) on animals close to human being (pig). :)
Quote from: Tynan on March 23, 2016, 12:02:00 AM
The problem is the same with a lot of similar issues, which is that there's no really good way to determine *why* an event happened for AI purposes.
As in, a guy starved to death - how do we know it was intentional by the player, and not just because everyone is starving?
A trader starved to death or burned to death - should his faction get angry? How do we know?
I can think of ways try to detect it but it gets tricky.
For starvation, why not just do a check on death to see if they can/could have pathed right then? If they can't find a path (regardless of their actual mobility/ability to follow said path) from wherever they are to the edge of the map then apply penalty. If they can, no penalty.
The same could be done for colony pawn starvation. If the door is forbidden and thus blocks the path to the edge of the map upon death = euthanize penalty.
Taking it one step further: do this check on downed rather than death, so that the player can't just deconstruct the obstacle before it dies. I'm not sure how memory intensive this would be rather than just checking during the death event since that likely runs relatively quickly while the data from the downed event would have to be stored for a while.
The better way to counter the locking in a walled off area is to have a regular check for routing. If they lose routing, it starts just losing standing. When they go to leave, make use of the sapper AI but have it try to get out instead of in. "So and So are trying to leave but are trapped and are trying to dig out"
We also have it for prison breaks, at least i had one they punched out a wall. Have caravans stuck bust their way out. Try tapping them in, they let in -50c cold right into your greenhouse during escape or tear down a solid mountain wall on ya. As for animals, I don't consider it an exploit but they could put up disturbed sleep so that trying to build walls around them as they slept gets them up and walking around.
Quote from: Darth Fool on March 27, 2016, 11:45:33 AM
Haven't seen this one mentioned yet so here goes: It is possible to sell uncollected steel from all over the map just by making a zone where the steel currently is at. If you delete your in colony zone, you can guarantee that you are selling the distant steel. This could be resoloved by having to build an unpowered trade statue which would be used by the local traders. Think of it as a low-tech orbital beacon.
Similarly, make a stockpile (cleared to hold nothing) that contains all the silver where you landed. (Exclude stone & slag, which otherwise might get moved.) Then you can buy without ever having to move your silver.
Actually, I like to make my initial landing zone such a stockpile anyways, so I get an instant inventory. Since it is cleared to store nothing, everything is movable as usual.
Quote from: pdxsean on May 01, 2016, 10:16:42 PM
I saw this over on reddit, it seems to fit...
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/4hb0d3/a_neat_little_trick_to_utilize_the_space_between/
I don't think this is an exploit. In real life, many plants like to grow close to trees.
If you really wanted to prevent that, I would implement shade. Trees would steal sunlight of adjacent plants.
Two exploits I use frequently enable me to affect the world without requiring peon action. They've already been mentioned, but I'll detail how I use them.
1) reconnecting power
a) connect to solar panel when sun is shining, to wind turbine when wind is blowing, and only to battery when no alternative
b) I thought of using a dead battery to reconnect to turn things off, but the posted idea of reconnecting to an unconnected power line seems better
2) rezoning roofs
I often play in cold regions. So I can close the roof at night to heat and keep it heated, and open it during the day for free light and growing.
And my favorite exploit: indoor rose pasture in work/dining area. Roses have a much higher beauty than flooring. They don't require the light of a sunlamp -- only 30% (and even heaters will provide 60% light in adjacent cells). Because they have a 5:1 life:grow time, they will mature even in poor light. Then when mature let livestock graze on them. Plus, the livestock nearby colonists will result in more nuzzling.
Note: flowers provide beauty even if they can't grow (in an always dark area). Fix would be to have them provide increasing beauty as they mature.
In a13, roses have a new flag set:
<preferability>NeverForNutrition</preferability>
Are you sure livestock are still eating them?
I have an huge room digged inside the mountain, with a small tunnel leading to it.
90% of times the infestation spawns in that room because its way bigger than my base.
That room is sealed and have alots of heaters set to 200ºc with a switch.
They can spawn and live for a few minutes but they will die from the heat.
Edited:
I like the idea of punishing the players who build underground.
However this infestation thing spawning hives very close to your base is kinda stupid.
Something like an manhunt event with bugs that could dig into your base should be better =P
Chance of event based on amount of tiles mined.
In current state hives should spawn a hive queen when the hive health goes bellow 25% hp.
RE Bugs Swarm:
Long range attack is only good if , bug swarm is small and shooters are uninjured. If either of these arnt in your favour then One has a alot harder time managing or even destroying them.
Open Roof thing , tricky, Swarm has to be under a thin Roof , myself being a Mountian Player this doesnt happen alot.
But saying that I have use the unroof feature one time after the swarm Unroof themselve's and drop Mortor fire bombs on the suckers , still took a day or two to land a decent hit tho.
has for freezing them ( dont know if they suffer heat stroke ?) could Bugs become more increasingly adaptive to envoriment after each spawn?
I don't think this has been said before, but nocturnal hunting (especially a Night Owl Brawler melee hunter) is seriously OP. Most things die before waking, so it's more like designating meat-plants to be harvested than anything else. :P
Honestly, I think the biggest problem with the infestation mechanic is that it will only catch a player off guard the first time it happens to them in the game. After that, the player quickly learns that, short of not digging into mountains, there is little one can do to prevent the infestation from eventually triggering. As such, it becomes a very easy event to exploit with extremely powerful outcomes. My response on every colony that will build into the mountains is to purposefully trigger the spawn in a specially designed freezer/turret room where I can eventually contain the maximum 30 hives. After this, I can dig into the rest of the mountains with impunity. The happy byproduct of maintaining 30 hives is I have no problems whatsoever with food, money, or further infestations. In short, a properly managed maximum infestation completely breaks the economy of the game and fails to prevent a player from building mountain complexes.
As far as how I would balance them...
I think infestations need to be balanced against how much you have dug into the mountains so that the player cannot simply just design a single room and know the infestation event will trigger in it. (As I currently do when I want to exploit the event.) Additionally, if there is a long running infestation (which indicates it is highly likely the player is purposefully managing it.), I would include the possibility of the infestation dying out or a period of time where the respawn rates drop dramatically (sort of like a blight event for bugs). I am not against the player being able to farm infestations, but right now the amount of pawn labor required to cultivate a bug farm is very little investment compared to the vast amount of resources the player receives in return. Another possible option for non-farming players would be to introduce resource intensive items that can reduce/eliminate spawn chance in a certain area of effect when built. All of these would serve to give players cost/benefit and risk/reward scenarios that they must consider and make an infestation something more than just a binary switch to the player.
You can make permadeath mode irrelevant by pressing ALT + F4 instead of saving and then loading the game again.
Life finds a way to savescum.
Build a sunlamp outside. But a structure around the sunlamp so that a roof overhead forms. Use remove roof to remove all the roof except for one tile which floats above the sunlamp. Delete all the walls of the building except one which is close enough to keep supporting to one, distant, disembodied tile of constructed roof. You now have an outdoor sunlamp that won't shortcircuit in the rain.
Let's say you have overwhelming numbers of tribespeople coming to your base, dress one colonist in armor, a shield, and a melee weapon in a doorway. Fill the area behind him or her with people with ranged weapons. The person in the doorway will likely get downed, and will no longer be attacked. The doorway will be open, but still exist, and tribespeople will not enter. You will still be able to shoot them through the doorway, and many of them will congregate right there... five or six colonists will be able to chase off 30 to 40 tribespeople this way, likely without death. I feel sad posting this.
That's actually a known bug (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=20040.0 (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=20040.0)), and can be done by holding the door open with a dropped item.
Quote from: Songleaves on May 18, 2016, 11:38:00 PM
That's actually a known bug (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=20040.0 (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=20040.0)), and can be done by holding the door open with a dropped item.
But we admire your sacrifice in letting a colonist be badly wounded to repel a raid.
Well, I am bad and I think I kinda exploit it more... potentially. I did the following once and felt too evil....
What I do is I have a colonist minus a leg..... I get a raid that looks bad, and I un medical that guy's bed, forbid the medbay and tell them to relocate him to the now only available medical zone spot on the ground I just make. Then when almost there, I draft the guy carrying and now there is a guy sitting outside right for the kidnapping. The raiders come into a fire zone without firing a shot at me. Then back to bed with him.
Quote from: Vaporisor on May 19, 2016, 12:53:31 AM
Well, I am bad and I think I kinda exploit it more... potentially. I did the following once and felt too evil....
What I do is I have a colonist minus a leg..... I get a raid that looks bad, and I un medical that guy's bed, forbid the medbay and tell them to relocate him to the now only available medical zone spot on the ground I just make. Then when almost there, I draft the guy carrying and now there is a guy sitting outside right for the kidnapping. The raiders come into a fire zone without firing a shot at me. Then back to bed with him.
Good find!
I bet you can avoid bloodshed by ordering a colonist to overdose beer.
I think you can also give away prisoners. You need 2 hostile factions because they won't kidnap one of their own.
Okay, I've tried Ice Sheet for the first time in a while. It's basically unplayable. Trade caravans combined with inability of factions to handle low temperatures is GAMEBREAKING. Pawns dying left and right leaving you free stuff. Cargo mufallos dying, providing you with free meat and everything they carry. I stopped playing because I gained thousands of silver, medicine, plasteel, and other resources within days, without lifting a finger. It's not fun anymore.
Getting factions to fight one another through several methods:
- I was once being chased by outlanders, one of whom had frag grenades; I ran my colonist into a group of visitors and when they got hit with frag grenade they switched from neutral towards outlanders to their enemy and attacked them.
- I once had a poison ship part near my base. A trade caravan was passing through and went close enough to the ship part that I sniped the ship part and out came the mechanoids to fight the caravan.
Quote from: Tynan on March 21, 2016, 04:46:51 PM
I just figured out how to kill the infestation bugs without a real fight. Just dig a long tunnel and shoot them from a distance with the survival rifle.
They only thing I see wrong with this is your choice of weapon. You should be using turrets instead. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CGE_h4jBBXc)
There are a ton of people who are going to hate me for telling you this but a good way to make sure you funnel opponents into killzones is to design a trap system like this
(https://i.imgflip.com/14unip.jpg)
The colonists will walk straight through the two doors and rearm the traps safely during peace time and after battles. However invaders will path the long way through the center preferring the open path to the base wherein there could be a handily placed kill box. Only sappers are immune to this layout. Invaders don't seem to be wise enough to want to bash down the doors, instead they choose to traverse the longer path through the death ridden hallway. These traps are always going to kill sythers, and usually strong enough to take out 1-2 centipedes even before they hit the kill box because they trigger every last trap in the hallway.
This particular sample is very modest. Redundant systems of this type are very strong, and only require blocks to rearm, which is very cheap indeed on most maps.
Whenever I rescue a crashpod survivor, I strip them before I start doing medicine. I've gotten a lot of good quality synthread clothing this way.
if your colonists are facing a bad mood, and you have dead colonists, you can rebury them as much you like for the buried in sarcophagus mood buff. I admit I use this when that really annoying phyonic wave hits.
Zig Zag tunnels with sand bags in the center leading to the base. The outer sides your pawns can melee through the corners while the enemy slowly walks over the sand bags toward your base entrance. This is in the same park as Molotov and grenades on walls.
One way to combat jelly farms, make hives produce a limited amount of hives that are smaller and do not reproduce. So once the Big hive pops out 5 small hives over time it drys up. Same could be done with how many spawn out of them. I currently have a turret kill box that I farm meat and jelly from. Twenty turrets all on fuel generators along with that cursed solar flare guard device. 25k usage, that's messed up.
Found a neat bug with that flare guard. 4 fuel gens, 20 turrets and the flare guard is attached to the line as well. Solar flare happens and the guard goes out but the gens and turrets remain on. The four fuel gens only push 4k so not sure if it's broken or bugged content. unless it's a typo of 25000 to 2500 usage. But half my turrets should go down if it eats that amount of power, yet they don't.
Flare guard is a mod isn't it?
Animals... Obedience ? Release ? Aint nobody got time for that! Just set an allowed zone like BEAR ATTACK and see bears go where attackers are. Instead of limiting animal micromanagement like Obedience and Release was supposed to, it increases it because you can modify zones on the fly.
INSTANT wall deconstruction - order a colonist to put a vent (30 steel), door (25 resource), or cooler inside a wall. The wall vanishes as soon as he hauls the resources. You only lose a portion of the wall resources (5 -> 4 stones). This can be useful when there's fire, ambush, infestation or other urgent threat. You can also use it for your own ambushes. Just remember to cancel the door/vent construction.
My bad forgot I had fuse mods on lol.
One other exploit, place a sleeping spot, have pawns gun target sleeping spot and raise their skill in shooting while the bed spot remains. Solution give bed spots and pet bed spots 1 hp.
Always thought traders should be aware that there are blueprints of a room to be built around them. Possibly have a code detect when any of your blueprinted actions will have the effect of creating a room and have the trapped pawns first attempt to move out of the area and become "sapper" hostile if they are unable to path find their way out.
After a big attack, when there's weapons and stuff lying around. I have my colonists drop their weapons in the base, then equip the weapons next to the dead enemies, then haul the dead enemies back to the base. Then rinse and repeat. Allows my to roughly halve the number of trips I need to take which is useful for seigers who can be far away, and also lets me use non-haulers to at least grab their weapons.
Quote from: Songleaves on May 30, 2016, 06:43:41 PM
After a big attack, when there's weapons and stuff lying around. I have my colonists drop their weapons in the base, then equip the weapons next to the dead enemies, then haul the dead enemies back to the base. Then rinse and repeat. Allows my to roughly halve the number of trips I need to take which is useful for seigers who can be far away, and also lets me use non-haulers to at least grab their weapons.
I also do that!
Maybe that's not an exploit... but you can equip weapons even on colonists incapable of violence! In my previous colony I had medium-long range weapons on all capable shooters in case of a raid, while my colonists incapable of violence, 3 or 4, acted as shotgun squires. Those were handy for infestations.
Quote from: Songleaves on May 30, 2016, 06:43:41 PM
After a big attack, when there's weapons and stuff lying around. I have my colonists drop their weapons in the base, then equip the weapons next to the dead enemies, then haul the dead enemies back to the base. Then rinse and repeat. Allows my to roughly halve the number of trips I need to take which is useful for seigers who can be far away, and also lets me use non-haulers to at least grab their weapons.
I really don't see that as an exploit at all, since it's simply a method the player can use to increase the efficiency of their Pawns. For me it's in the same ballpark as hauling corpses fully clothed and only stripping them when they are in/near your base (as opposed to stripping them where they fell). And if you start taking things like this out of the game then you will be inadvertently stripping gameplay features for some players.
Plus taking this path means you're in danger of defining efficiency as an exploit, which would be a disastrous path to start treading IMO (this applies to pretty much all games, but especially so for sandbox games like RimWorld).
The door with stone chunks is a exploit in my opnion.
Blitz video for reference:
https://youtu.be/nlq8sp3KZBw?t=484
Creating a very large growing zone, plant it, then unzone it so blight does not kill it. Harvest and repeat once at 100%.
This thread is very useful! I've taken a lot of notes.
Some of these will be very hard to solve, but it's good that I know about them.
You can use Draft+Undraft like a slap from Dungeon Keeper:
Don't like that your worker has chosen a joy activity far away from the work zone ? SLAP HIM. No more going for a walk on the other half of the map.
Butchering colonist walks all over the food stockpile dropping meat ? SLAP HIM as soon as he's past the door, he'll drop the meat and it will magically find its way to unoccupied spots.
All in all, Draft command lets people play like an overbearing, micromanaging boss. And in some cases Draft + immediate Undraft increases work efficiency.
I let enemies enter my base.
This sounds like the most stupid exploid ever, but it makes defending really, really easy. Enemies split and start attacking random (?) objects. They keep doing that even if I fight with their allies a building away. It's almost as bad as killboxes to kill enemies this way.
I realize that this is a valid millitary tactic, especially common in urban insurgent warfare, but... not like this. It feels like I am defending the base against a bunch of untrained idiots.
Quote from: Nimander on June 06, 2016, 03:58:17 AM
I let enemies enter my base.
This sounds like the most stupid exploid ever, but it makes defending really, really easy. Enemies split and start attacking random (?) objects. They keep doing that even if I fight with their allies a building away. It's almost as bad as killboxes to kill enemies this way.
I realize that this is a valid millitary tactic, especially common in urban insurgent warfare, but... not like this. It feels like I am defending the base against a bunch of untrained idiots.
Repairing damaged structures is currently essentially free. What if attackers (also) caused breakdowns ?
Quote from: b0rsuk on June 06, 2016, 03:18:25 AM
You can use Draft+Undraft like a slap from Dungeon Keeper
And that was an awesome feature of that game.
Rimworld needs a slap button. Not for the slap "per se" (altough I admit, it was hilarious), but for the effects it brings.
Quote from: Wex on June 06, 2016, 01:20:53 PM
Quote from: b0rsuk on June 06, 2016, 03:18:25 AM
You can use Draft+Undraft like a slap from Dungeon Keeper
And that was an awesome feature of that game.
Rimworld needs a slap button. Not for the slap "per se" (altough I admit, it was hilarious), but for the effects it brings.
Posession spell & zerking tribals with legendary plasteel longsword while wearing power armor. :P
WallSlasher, this thread is specifically for exploit strategies. Exploit strategies are things players do to succeed in cheesy ways.
Bugs and suggestions have their own forums :)
Quote from: GarettZriwin on June 06, 2016, 02:09:40 PM
Posession spell & zerking tribals with legendary plasteel longsword while wearing power armor. :P
The other sci-fi colony survival sim game, Maia by Simon Roth, has Possession - for IMPs, your robots only. I don't think it has slap. I backed it too, I can check out a newer version.
Easy way to kill thrumbos. If there are lots of bottle necks on the map build walls and traps at those points so that passing creatures have to walk over the traps to get from one part of the map to another. The traps won't kill a thrumbo, but it usually dies of infection after a few days. You get all the meat, fur and horn from a thrumbo with all the effort of trapping a squirrel.
Haven't tried that on this version of the game yet though.
Quote from: muffins on June 07, 2016, 10:07:53 AM
Easy way to kill thrumbos.
In addition to this one, the easiest way I've found to kill thrumbo's, is by simply making a zone next to them with beer. They will drink until they blackout, and if it doesn't kill them the first round, they will drink another beer immediately as they wake up, killing them and dropping their horn.
25-30 beers for 4 dead thrumbos seems a bit easy to me, but I am not sure if it's considered an exploit? Also I saw it mentioned another place, but didn't find it in this post.
I'm not sure if this has been said or not but one way I find to deal with massive raids is to intentionally let a member of the colony become downed.
A raid will usually give up and leave with whoever they can steal but won't continue attacking. I can simply order my people to open fire, save the prisoner and have taken very little casualties.
They shouldn't try and give up during raids. They should attempt to capture people as the fight continues making it all the more vital that 'no man is left behind'.
This works with prisoners too if you leave them incapacitated outside a colony.
Quote from: Elixiar on June 07, 2016, 07:50:58 PM
I'm not sure if this has been said or not but one way I find to deal with massive raids is to intentionally let a member of the colony become downed.
A raid will usually give up and leave with whoever they can steal but won't continue attacking. I can simply order my people to open fire, save the prisoner and have taken very little casualties.
They shouldn't try and give up during raids. They should attempt to capture people as the fight continues making it all the more vital that 'no man is left behind'.
This works with prisoners too if you leave them incapacitated outside a colony.
I'm happy to say this has been solved :)
Quote from: The-MathMog on June 07, 2016, 10:39:33 AM
Quote from: muffins on June 07, 2016, 10:07:53 AM
Easy way to kill thrumbos.
In addition to this one, the easiest way I've found to kill thrumbo's, is by simply making a zone next to them with beer. They will drink until they blackout, and if it doesn't kill them the first round, they will drink another beer immediately as they wake up, killing them and dropping their horn.
25-30 beers for 4 dead thrumbos seems a bit easy to me, but I am not sure if it's considered an exploit? Also I saw it mentioned another place, but didn't find it in this post.
Easiest way to kill thrumbos (has this been said yet?):
1. Wait for night & for silly thrumbo to fall asleep
2. Box sleeping thrumbo in with 4 walls (this doesn't awaken the sleeping giant, or anything else - likely including a raid party!)
3. Wait for thrumbo to starve
4. Harvest the horn, meat, and leather
5. Profit.
When constructing explosive traps, a common trick used by players is to have one IED trap with a trigger, and a bunch of shells scattered around as the payload or breadcrumbs of death. No problem so far.
However, shells left in the open deteriorate and eventually explode. Some people construct 1x1 roofs over them, but there's a simpler way. Order construction of a number of IED traps, let them haul shells to contruction zones, and... forbid the constructions. The shells are now oficially construction materials on a construction zone, and construction materials are unaffected by elements in Rimworld. When a raid arrives, cancel the constructions.
You can make sure they haul shells but not components by temporarily forbidding all shells on the map.
If it's -30 outside and you want to slaughter some chickens for food, you can sell them to a trader and wait for them to freeze to death instead.
When a machine breaks down, you can just deconstruct it. This gives you all the componets and you can just build it again, without using any extra componets.
i think this is an exploit, it feels like one.
if i make growing zones outside my base, plant pine trees, once they are planted, delete growing zone, leaving the trees there, now raiders will just run around your forest burning trees and get all split up, allowing you to just pick them off. i means its good the raiders will try decimate your food supply, but feels like it can be exploited.
Quote from: Mossy piglet on June 12, 2016, 04:41:48 PM
When a machine breaks down, you can just deconstruct it. This gives you all the componets and you can just build it again, without using any extra componets.
Not true. There is an 80% return on deconstruction. You get components back on a deconstruct, but always minimum of one less than it took to build.
Quote from: Vaporisor on June 13, 2016, 12:08:02 AM
Not true. There is an 80% return on deconstruction. You get components back on a deconstruct, but always minimum of one less than it took to build.
For low component costs, you get 100% of components back. This seems to include all constructions up to and including 2 components. In other words, you can deconstruct-repair:
power switches, fueled generators, batteries, wind turbines, orbital trade beacons, firefoam poppers, crematorium, hydroponics basin (plants will die), electric stove, IED traps, heaters, ship structural beams (LOL).
If you deconstruct a hydroponics basin
(100 steel) you get 75 steel back. But if you deconstruct a battery, you get 38 steel back. So I think the return is 75%, then rounded. 5 seems rounded upwards, because 0.75 * 50 = 37.5
Additionally, you can repair damaged conduits faster by deconstructing and constructing them. You get 1 steel back on deconstructing a conduit, presubably because 0.75 * 1 = 0.75, and that's rounded up to 1.
Oh, and you can deconstruct campfires, getting some wood back. This is just silly. And there's no toggle to stop refuelling the campfire.
Mechanoids at the gates ! Turret conduits are partially damaged and two centipedes are exchanging bullets with a single plasteel turret. What to do ?
Turn off the turret power switch. Centipedes will lose interest, walk forward more and get in range of more turrets. Then you turn the power back on. It works even better against Scythers.
QuoteWe used to be able to wall in friendlies and make them flip - and eventually take all they had at no penalty. Now they like to break walls and tunnel out. BUT! Always check if they got grenades. If they do, they will grenade the walls around, and thus the living hell of one another - and if the trader happens to die, killed by his own people... No penalty and tons of loot :P
http://steamcommunity.com/app/294100/discussions/0/359543951706065757/
Poison ships was kind of really hard on the A14.
Then I discovery you can reinstall turrets on this new version!
Now I am redeploying all my 20 turrets around the poison ship before opening fire!
PS: I wish I knew that before I lost my sister and my arm!
^^^ that doesnt sound like an exploit, just good sense?
Yeah, I mean, you have to go out of your way to do that, and make all the necessary installations, cover them in darkness, and all that, and in the meantime if a raid just so happens at the exact moment, you will be vulnerable.
When you have an extremely volatile colonist with long lasting negative mood, such as stacked 'rejected proposal', you can wall him in with pemmican. It doesn't matter if he berserks. Caravans can dig out, berserking colonists can't.
(http://wstaw.org/m/2016/07/21/asylum.png)
Quote from: b0rsuk on July 21, 2016, 04:06:38 PM
When you have an extremely volatile colonist with long lasting negative mood, such as stacked 'rejected proposal', you can wall him in with pemmican. It doesn't matter if he berserks. Caravans can dig out, berserking colonists can't.
-snip-
I should do this. Totally inhumane, but so obvious.
For fixing it, maybe add long lasting/permanent social debuffs and mental damage from isolation?
Well there is one for being inside too long. I can't remember the name.
You may also get the cramped and ugly environment mood.
Quote from: b0rsuk on July 17, 2016, 05:37:53 AM
Mechanoids at the gates ! Turret conduits are partially damaged and two centipedes are exchanging bullets with a single plasteel turret. What to do ?
Turn off the turret power switch. Centipedes will lose interest, walk forward more and get in range of more turrets. Then you turn the power back on. It works even better against Scythers.
Thanks for the Tip, I am now doing line controlled turrets from inside my base and it is doing so great that I will stop doing that.
Quote from: SpaceDorf on July 21, 2016, 08:19:29 PM
Well there is one for being inside too long. I can't remember the name.
You may also get the cramped and ugly environment mood.
cabin fever?
Instead of power switches, I put a single unconnected power line in range of turrets/light bulbs and tell them to reconnect, so they switch between the unpowered and the powered line instantly.
Possible fix: make reconnection a toggle like job
Quote from: 123nick on July 21, 2016, 11:07:45 PM
Quote from: SpaceDorf on July 21, 2016, 08:19:29 PM
Well there is one for being inside too long. I can't remember the name.
You may also get the cramped and ugly environment mood.
cabin fever?
Yeah :) That one. English is not my native language and sometimes I am just to lazy to look up the translation. Or just can't remember the right words.
Quote from: FalconBR on July 21, 2016, 03:51:45 AM
Now I am redeploying all my 20 turrets around the poison ship before opening fire!
That's one long power line!
Hmmm, well *that* is interesting -- batteries can be uninstalled too. Do they hold their charge in transit?
... testing ...
OH MY GOD!
I just realized that you can upsurp the only one pawn per square rule by making a 1x1 animal area and assigning all of your animals to it. Strategic placement of this area can prove disastrous to invaders.
Quote from: newcadence on July 21, 2016, 08:08:49 PM
I should do this. Totally inhumane, but so obvious.
For fixing it, maybe add long lasting/permanent social debuffs and mental damage from isolation?
Inhumane ? I walled him in with plenty of food, good bed, chair, table, heating, light (from the heater), and even a horseshoe pin. This way no one in my colony gets maimed or killed. I actually let him out 2 days before the first "rejected proposal" expired because there was a party. By the time the dining room was already beautiful and complete with light and comfortable furniture, and he got to play with Mole's titties to keep his mood up, too.
If I played by game mechanics, I could drop him in a stone cell with just food and heating, and not even a sleeping spot. It would work just as well.
It used to be harder to do, but now pemmican is an easily available food that doesn't spoil. You know what would completely thwart my plan ? If he caught flu! Or infestation, because I later learned that this spot is deep enough.
Also colonists don't need to dig out to thwart this. They just need to fly into rage and start destroying furniture. If he destroyed his heater, I would be forced to open it or watch him get frostbite.
I have just discovered a way to get past the melee blocking for colonists. While one colonist is blocking the path and fighting someone, set the other colonists to work on a construction project on the far side of the enemy...then when they are on the blocked square, draft them. You can thus have an arbitrary number of melee colonists on a single square. May work with commands other than construction.
Quote from: Darth Fool on July 26, 2016, 10:59:31 PM
I have just discovered a way to get past the melee blocking for colonists. While one colonist is blocking the path and fighting someone, set the other colonists to work on a construction project on the far side of the enemy...then when they are on the blocked square, draft them. You can thus have an arbitrary number of melee colonists on a single square. May work with commands other than construction.
Probably, because it sounds like the game uses soft collisions. The check needs to be not only when entering a square, but when drafting.
Quote from: Shurp on July 22, 2016, 07:24:09 PM
Hmmm, well *that* is interesting -- batteries can be uninstalled too. Do they hold their charge in transit?
... testing ...
OH MY GOD!
Do uninstalled batteries lose their charge in a solar flare event?
Quote from: slitherrr on August 25, 2016, 04:34:54 PMDo uninstalled batteries lose their charge in a solar flare event?
I can't imagine they would, given that installed batteries don't lose their charge during a solar flare. Z
As a matter of fact, I think (but would need to check to be sure) that they still continue to charge during the solar flare event; It's just items that draw power that seem to be disabled.
Quote from: DariusWolfe on August 25, 2016, 05:31:46 PM
Quote from: slitherrr on August 25, 2016, 04:34:54 PMDo uninstalled batteries lose their charge in a solar flare event?
I can't imagine they would, given that installed batteries don't lose their charge during a solar flare. Z
As a matter of fact, I think (but would need to check to be sure) that they still continue to charge during the solar flare event; It's just items that draw power that seem to be disabled.
Uninstalled batteries don't lose charge, and batteries do not charge during a solar flare.
PS- I've never actually done this, but I've been told that if you knock out the corners between rooms, you can place a sculpture there, and it will raise the impressiveness of all the adjacent rooms (so up to 4x the beauty). There's lots of janky optimal ways to construct bases and kill zones that have to do with diagonals, many already mentioned. Has anything been done about these strats in A15?
Another exploity thing is that very often sterile tiles will increase the impressiveness of a room far more than they should, as in they're better than gold or silver tiles. The solution, I think, would be to have cleanliness above 0 not increase impressiveness.
And is there ever any reason to make a reasonably sized chicken coop. You seem to be able to jam as much livestock as you want into as little area as you want. 200 chickens should probably not be able to be housed on 2 tiles.
Even more ridiculous is that my chicken coop is in the freezer, and the frozen eggs they lay hatch just fine.
Quote from: milon on June 08, 2016, 09:23:08 AM
Quote from: The-MathMog on June 07, 2016, 10:39:33 AM
Quote from: muffins on June 07, 2016, 10:07:53 AM
Easy way to kill thrumbos.
In addition to this one, the easiest way I've found to kill thrumbo's, is by simply making a zone next to them with beer. They will drink until they blackout, and if it doesn't kill them the first round, they will drink another beer immediately as they wake up, killing them and dropping their horn.
25-30 beers for 4 dead thrumbos seems a bit easy to me, but I am not sure if it's considered an exploit? Also I saw it mentioned another place, but didn't find it in this post.
Easiest way to kill thrumbos (has this been said yet?):
1. Wait for night & for silly thrumbo to fall asleep
2. Box sleeping thrumbo in with 4 walls (this doesn't awaken the sleeping giant, or anything else - likely including a raid party!)
3. Wait for thrumbo to starve
4. Harvest the horn, meat, and leather
5. Profit.
Animals break down walls to get to food. I found this out the hard way when a couple of gazelle trapped behind my walls opened an ancient danger.
Kind of an exploit involving the AI not using triple rocket launchers properly. I've had a few sapper raids with 20+ heavily armed pirates and multiple triple rocket launchers, which can do some serious damage. But when you wait until they are digging at a wall and use the insanity lance on one of them, many of the pirates will rush in to melee the insane pawn, all the while taking massive friendly fire damage, and a grand finale of triple rocket launchers making mince meat out of the whole pile. I've reproduced this behavior on 3 occasions now.
This is by far my favorite exploit, if/when you patch it, I will be extremely sad.
Basically have a cooler cool a single tile, and then use vents from there, MASSIVELY increases effectiveness of the cooler! I haven't tested exactly how large of a freezer I can make with a single cooler, but I assume it would be massive. This cooler is set to 0F and keeps the 12x12 room at ~20F (I double wall with an air gap for extra efficiency, and I can get it down to -55F with that single cooler!):
(http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/258216445136877061/1E55D68301B507A0DA8B3AB6D8C751F73960DE2A/)
woah. that cooler exploit is fantastic.
also these ones :
Quote from: Jstank on July 26, 2016, 04:32:14 AM
I just realized that you can upsurp the only one pawn per square rule by making a 1x1 animal area and assigning all of your animals to it. Strategic placement of this area can prove disastrous to invaders.
Quote from: SimpleMachine88 on August 25, 2016, 06:57:22 PM
PS- I've never actually done this, but I've been told that if you knock out the corners between rooms, you can place a sculpture there, and it will raise the impressiveness of all the adjacent rooms (so up to 4x the beauty). There's lots of janky optimal ways to construct bases and kill zones that have to do with diagonals, many already mentioned. Has anything been done about these strats in A15?
Another exploity thing is that very often sterile tiles will increase the impressiveness of a room far more than they should, as in they're better than gold or silver tiles. The solution, I think, would be to have cleanliness above 0 not increase impressiveness.
And is there ever any reason to make a reasonably sized chicken coop. You seem to be able to jam as much livestock as you want into as little area as you want. 200 chickens should probably not be able to be housed on 2 tiles.
Quote from: muffins on June 07, 2016, 10:07:53 AM
Easy way to kill thrumbos.
I found 2 different ways:
1 - fire strategy.
- Set thrumbo(s) on fire (multiple ways to do so, from grenades to placing wood below them and so on...).
- Shoot it while it runs around being burned.
Fix => I'd find it more logical if thrumbos ignored that they're burning when being shot at. Also when surrounded by lots of people.
This is a bit risky because the thrumbo might not be dead before the fire stops, and works not so well with multiple thrumbos... but I feel not enough.
2 - insanity lance
Works "only" on multiple thrumbos (hahaha)
- target one RESTED thrumbo with the insanity lance.
- It'll attack other thrumbos.
- Wait a bit (they've got LOTS of life, which is why the thrumbo needs to be rested). Then either you've got 1 downed / dead thrumbo, and an almost downed one.
That works best with groups up to 3. With 4 thrumbos they tend to gang up 1 VS 3 so you get only one, but generally they get infected and die anyway.
Downside : needs an insanity lance.
My way to kill thrumbos (A14):
a 1X1 stckpile critical priority for beer.
Where? just some square away from the thrumbos.
They prefer trees but eat the most around in half a day. Because they are always hungry they go for the beer eventually. If they moove away the stockpile follows them.
I've the beer and you have an empty stomach.. let's find a compromise, my littlebig white sack of meat :)
You can actually force tame animals if you incap them,rescue and then treat(with a little bit of luck you can get a bond), but if you don't get that bond at the first treatments you might aswell kill him......or euthanize(start it and then immediatly stop the pawn before he finishes the Euthanasia process the Anesthesis will apply which will cause the animal to not get up after getting treated), beat up the animal a bit, treat it(hope your lucky), repeat. With a little bit of work you will get the animal on your side.
I think some of what we're seeing here aren't exploits, so much as they're strategies.
Setting a Thrumbo on fire and taking advantage of the panic reaction is simply smart. I think a big animal is going to be more worried about the big hurt all over its body than the small hurts of your bullets. Same with getting a Thrumbo drunk.
An exploit is the use of a bugs, glitches or game systems to gain an advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers. While I'd be surprised if he actually intended beer to be used as a hunting tactic, I think it's one Tynan would call fair; It'd work in real life, after all.
Quote from: DariusWolfe on August 26, 2016, 12:28:07 PM
I think some of what we're seeing here aren't exploits, so much as they're strategies.
Setting a Thrumbo on fire and taking advantage of the panic reaction is simply smart. I think a big animal is going to be more worried about the big hurt all over its body than the small hurts of your bullets. Same with getting a Thrumbo drunk.
An exploit is the use of a bugs, glitches or game systems to gain an advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers. While I'd be surprised if he actually intended beer to be used as a hunting tactic, I think it's one Tynan would call fair; It'd work in real life, after all.
Thanks for the explanation... and yes... basically, other players are calling "setting fire to the strongest animal in the game so it might be killed with next to no risk"... "use of (...)a game system to gain an advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers". Same for beer until they die.
It makes no sense for me that the "wisest animals of the universe" (or so the legends say) can be downed in such pathetic and dumb manner.
Actually, as a whole, I think fire in combat is so OP that its clever uses are exploits. I mean pawns can get ears ripped off, mauled, shot off, lose their liver, even one arm and STILL BE FIGHTING !!!! But, if they start burning they enter complete panic mode, running out of cover in stupid movements toward the things that set them in fire and only deigning to start to removing fire from oneself when begin to be major.
Quote from: kasnavada on August 26, 2016, 07:02:40 PM
Quote from: DariusWolfe on August 26, 2016, 12:28:07 PM
I think some of what we're seeing here aren't exploits, so much as they're strategies.
Setting a Thrumbo on fire and taking advantage of the panic reaction is simply smart. I think a big animal is going to be more worried about the big hurt all over its body than the small hurts of your bullets. Same with getting a Thrumbo drunk.
An exploit is the use of a bugs, glitches or game systems to gain an advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers. While I'd be surprised if he actually intended beer to be used as a hunting tactic, I think it's one Tynan would call fair; It'd work in real life, after all.
Thanks for the explanation... and yes... basically, other players are calling "setting fire to the strongest animal in the game so it might be killed with next to no risk"... "use of (...)a game system to gain an advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers". Same for beer until they die.
It makes no sense for me that the "wisest animals of the universe" (or so the legends say) can be downed in such pathetic and dumb manner.
Actually, as a whole, I think fire in combat is so OP that its clever uses are exploits. I mean pawns can get ears ripped off, mauled, shot off, lose their liver, even one arm and STILL BE FIGHTING !!!! But, if they start burning they enter complete panic mode, running out of cover in stupid movements toward the things that set them in fire and only deigning to start to removing fire from oneself when begin to be major.
People have fought on in real life after getting limbs ripped off, actually. Same thing with getting organs destroyed.
However, burns? Burns are some of the most painful injuries to experience.
Quote from: Boston on August 26, 2016, 07:34:38 PMPeople have fought on in real life after getting limbs ripped off, actually. Same thing with getting organs destroyed.
However, burns? Burns are some of the most painful injuries to experience.
Agreed, not to mention that fear of fire is so primal that panicked escape is about the only thing that'd occur to you. Maybe a super disciplined person could find some semblance of calm while being on fire, but even they would make putting the fire out their first priority.
I don't disagree that fire is probably a little overpowered. Anything short of an animal or colonist being drenched in fuel and set on fire (i.e. incendiary weapons) should be able to be put out in a reasonable time frame, and even animals should be able to roll on the ground to put out the fire (especially if they're genetically engineered for higher intelligence). Plus, the fact that human pawns flee AWAY from assistance is just stupid.
Over on reddit someone explained an exploit of calling for traders, killing them all, then using the money gained from traders to buy back loyalty, order more traders, and so on. Personally I'd like to see trader murder carry a high permanent penalty, but unfortunately the problem of them getting caught in the crossfire by wandering randomly between a firefight makes such penalties seem unfair.
Maybe traders could adopt the "flee" posture when there are enemies nearby? As in non-colony pawns in red mode as opposed to colonists in draft mode.
Anyway here's the details on that exploit (not my OP) and a link to a twitch of it.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/500g5w/alpha_v15_just_released_on_steam/d70adgv
Quote from: DariusWolfe on August 26, 2016, 09:39:10 PM
Quote from: Boston on August 26, 2016, 07:34:38 PMPeople have fought on in real life after getting limbs ripped off, actually. Same thing with getting organs destroyed.
However, burns? Burns are some of the most painful injuries to experience.
Agreed, not to mention that fear of fire is so primal that panicked escape is about the only thing that'd occur to you. Maybe a super disciplined person could find some semblance of calm while being on fire, but even they would make putting the fire out their first priority.
I don't disagree that fire is probably a little overpowered. Anything short of an animal or colonist being drenched in fuel and set on fire (i.e. incendiary weapons) should be able to be put out in a reasonable time frame, and even animals should be able to roll on the ground to put out the fire (especially if they're genetically engineered for higher intelligence). Plus, the fact that human pawns flee AWAY from assistance is just stupid.
Actually... humans & animals ignore burns too when on adrenaline. When adrenaline falls though...
About fear of fire I saw it as something that applied much much sooner than when you've starting burning. I think that just seeing fire is enough for most animals to be wary. Then again, the animals in rimworld ain't afraid of humans, something which...well. Anyway, it should not trigger randomly panicking and running round into fires... rather fleeing (far) from it and fast.
I'm surprised 'closet bedrooms' hasn't been brought up, maybe it's not seen as an exploit.
Making bedrooms just 1x2, and fill that space with a bed, with the idea that negative moods associated with the awful room don't count when the colonist is asleep, which is all they can do in that tiny room. When they wake up they leave the awful closet and its negative effect.
Obviously the solution to this can't-be-sad-when-you're-asleep exploit is to either a) make it so negative moods associated with awful rooms slowly degrade after leaving (some sort of 'slept terribly' moodlet), not immediately on leaving, and/or make it so colonists have a hard time falling asleep in a terrible room, subjecting them to more of the negative moods associated with the awful room.
Quote from: pdxsean on August 28, 2016, 04:58:02 PM
Over on reddit someone explained an exploit of calling for traders, killing them all, then using the money gained from traders to buy back loyalty, order more traders, and so on. Personally I'd like to see trader murder carry a high permanent penalty, but unfortunately the problem of them getting caught in the crossfire by wandering randomly between a firefight makes such penalties seem unfair.
The loyalty "cost" should be balanced in such a way that stealing goods (with or without killing) has a penalty of at least the value of the goods.
I'd argue that likewise a trader dying on your site (or a visitor) should have a similar penalty if they die on your site.
mining with mini-guns.... I kind of wonder if maybe walls should have armor factors themselves, ranges in real life have concrete walls which are impervious to small arms rounds, pistol rounds, and small caliber non rifle rounds (not sharp tip rounds) because the rounds just flatten on the concrete. I suspect rock walls would do the same in this, especially with tiny mini-gun bullets.
You can mine with *water* if you have enough of it under high pressure. Mining with pistols is certainly inefficient but if you have unlimited ammunition why not? Yes, the bullets will smoosh but they will also chip the rock and gradually erode it.
Eventually you might have a giant pile of lead to cart off :)
Let's please try to keep this on-topic. This thread is for reporting exploit strategies - off topic posts may be removed. Thanks.
Heres a pretty nasty exploit : manhunting animals and military aid.
Military aid never fight with animals unless attacked, so summoning military aid often means free gear, as guys walk in, get surrounded by boars, and get killed without ever firing a shot. If you can then kill the animals, and rescue them, you can make a profit ALL AROUND, with the weapons you get, extra reputation from rescued folks. (assuming you rescue enough)
This could be fixed by at least making them fight manhunting animals, as now it is WAY too easy to abuse, even a couple hares can down a band of fighters because of how they act
https://youtu.be/Ym81dn39b3Y?t=134
Pardon the Russian language, not my video. Walk towards a door to open it. Once it's open it's possible to shoot out, but raiders can't shoot in.
Quote from: pdxsean on August 28, 2016, 04:58:02 PM
Over on reddit someone explained an exploit of calling for traders, killing them all, then using the money gained from traders to buy back loyalty, order more traders, and so on. Personally I'd like to see trader murder carry a high permanent penalty, but unfortunately the problem of them getting caught in the crossfire by wandering randomly between a firefight makes such penalties seem unfair.
Diminishing returns on silver paid for bringing faction up. Problem balances itself out. After a while, they just don't see the shiny as worth it, which would be a bit more realistic.
Quote from: Mehni on September 03, 2016, 05:07:38 PM
https://youtu.be/Ym81dn39b3Y?t=134
Pardon the Russian language, not my video. Walk towards a door to open it. Once it's open it's possible to shoot out, but raiders can't shoot in.
That's an exploit, alright, I think we can all agree on that. However, this is also a perfect example of why the game pushes the player to exploit, because :
1/ it fails to offer more valid options to the player against tactical odds (enemies have unmatchable accuracy = mechanoid scythes, unmatchable numbers = insectoids or raiders, ridiculous power = a herd of rabbits can easily kill an armed brawling expert, often also ridiculous moving speed, etc.)
2/ it enforces "rules" that are counter-productive (no windows/embrasures to shoot through, that could protect colonists against a melee rush, no amount of combat training prevents "friendly fire", which can be lethal to colonists even after a single shot, but is totally disregarded by enemies, who don't mind lobbing scores of grenades, incendiary devices or other RPG shells into a blob of allies as long as they see one colonist near it, even skilled and well-equipped colonists will miss shots against "easy targets" several times in a row, as seen in the video (pistols at short range), traps are useless since bothersome to manage and almost more dangerous to colonists/allies than foes, etc.)
I'll keep this message purposefully short, since I'm mindful that this thread is to report "exploits" and not discuss opinions or features.
The game needs to seriously improve in how it currently handles combat. The very existence of "killboxes", the mother of all exploits in Rimworld, demonstrates my point. One could spend an eternity fixing the symptoms, but they won't go away if one doesn't fix their cause.
Quote from: ThiIsMe007 on September 04, 2016, 09:56:03 AM
Quote from: Mehni on September 03, 2016, 05:07:38 PM
https://youtu.be/Ym81dn39b3Y?t=134
Pardon the Russian language, not my video. Walk towards a door to open it. Once it's open it's possible to shoot out, but raiders can't shoot in.
That's an exploit, alright, I think we can all agree on that. However, this is also a perfect example of why the game pushes the player to exploit, because :
1/ it fails to offer more valid options to the player against tactical odds (enemies have unmatchable accuracy = mechanoid scythes, unmatchable numbers = insectoids or raiders, ridiculous power = a herd of rabbits can easily kill an armed brawling expert, often also ridiculous moving speed, etc.)
2/ it enforces "rules" that are counter-productive (no windows/embrasures to shoot through, that could protect colonists against a melee rush, no amount of combat training prevents "friendly fire", which can be lethal to colonists even after a single shot, but is totally disregarded by enemies, who don't mind lobbing scores of grenades, incendiary devices or other RPG shells into a blob of allies as long as they see one colonist near it, even skilled and well-equipped colonists will miss shots against "easy targets" several times in a row, as seen in the video (pistols at short range), traps are useless since bothersome to manage and almost more dangerous to colonists/allies than foes, etc.)
I'll keep this message purposefully short, since I'm mindful that this thread is to report "exploits" and not discuss opinions or features.
The game needs to seriously improve in how it currently handles combat. The very existence of "killboxes", the mother of all exploits in Rimworld, demonstrates my point. One could spend an eternity fixing the symptoms, but they won't go away if one doesn't fix their cause.
No exploit there, just the AI being utterly retarded about beating on random doors. Like always.
There is no reason to use exploits to win:
1. There are many perfectly valid options to fight raids. The vanilla game is very, very easy once you know how to fight.
2. It is called game play balance. There is a mod that adds embrasures. It totally breaks the game and makes even huge raids get mowed down by a handful of turrets or colonists with good guns. Might as well just disable raids.
3. Killboxes are not an exploit. A weak AI does not make any tactic that works against them an exploit. Improve AI or remove turrets. Don't call people cheats.
~~~
Seriously, is this thread STILL being misused?
The only things I would consider borderline status that are currently in the game are:
1. The current issue with vents behaving strangely between rooms of vastly differing size. Letting you cool or heat huge areas with just 1 cooler/heater.
2. Using reconnect as an instant on/off switch. Considering you can remotely order turrets to hold fire, I don't see this as a contradiction in the game rules unless other elements of the game were changed to require pawns manual flicking.
3. Diagonal melee attacks when the horizontal and vertical tiles are blocked by impassable terrain. You cannot shoot through the gap, but you can hit someone with a club though it? Very questionable.
Don't know if it is an exploit, but when i need to shoot my incendiarylauncers and i can't find a target i just place an animal's sleeping spot near my objective and so I can manually fire at it.
Quote from: giannikampa on September 05, 2016, 03:33:46 AM
Don't know if it is an exploit, but when i need to shoot my incendiarylauncers and i can't find a target i just place an animal's sleeping spot near my objective and so I can manually fire at it.
Yeah I would call that an exploit, similar to putting down 1-square-sized stockpile zones on all the materials far away from base, and selling them from there.
I always found it strange you could drop sleeping spots without needing a colonist to actually do it themselves. Maybe Tynan needs to change that.
well a spot is just a place you assign to..something
the solution to this would be to not make them targetable by weapons
Yeah, absolutely. Or better yet, allow weapons to be targeted at anything, not just enemy targets. Why not allow for looser targeting, the game's not exactly easy as is.
Does placing 20+ doors lined on the inside of a large killbox defense so raiders bash on them while I shoot them in the back count as an exploit?
I saw on a recent post that if you create a one room freezer with a vent venting into your actual freezer room, it will make the freezer way colder than it would with just the cooler alone. sounds like an exploit worth exploring.
Not sure if this works for everything, but with the drills if you place a power conduit not attached to anything near it if you want to turn it off you can click "reconnect to grid" and it'll flip to the grid with no power, so you can turn things on/off without having someone go to it.
Quote from: FSUYevon on September 05, 2016, 11:43:30 AM
Does placing 20+ doors lined on the inside of a large killbox defense so raiders bash on them while I shoot them in the back count as an exploit?
No. Someone intentionally coded raiders to randomly bash on doors. That is a pretty big hint that this is intended behaviour, if not the intended consequence of that behaviour that they do it so often it makes them totally ineffective.
This OP title really needs to be renamed to something less... accusatory imo.
The OP title is by the game developer looking for exploits to squash. The cooler thing definitely needs to be fixed. If AI behavior is abusively stupid it should be fixed too.
Report it here if you want to see it removed in the next update :)
Quote from: Shurp on September 06, 2016, 07:09:07 AM
The OP title is by the game developer looking for exploits to squash.
And in the same post says that using a long range weapon to out range a shorter range weapon is considered an exploit.
Which is why some clarification would be nice.
Is this thread for exploitable bugs, or just suggestions to make the game harder? :o
The issue with sieges isn't that you can outrange them. It's that the siegers wouldn't move into range to shoot back. They'd just mill about and let you cut them down. I think that has been fixed. At least when I usually shoot at them some stop what they're doing and shoot back... not enough to make a difference though. But at least it's not *no risk* which is what the OP was discussing.
The goal is to fix things which are obviously broken. The one square room cooler/vent trick obviously shouldn't work that way. If you can easily wipe out an attacking pirate mob by stacking doors, then the AI needs tweaking to prevent that sort of thing.
On the other hand, cutting down tribals with miniguns is exactly what *should* work. No need to nerf that :)
Quote from: ericbomb on September 05, 2016, 11:56:29 PM
Not sure if this works for everything, but with the drills if you place a power conduit not attached to anything near it if you want to turn it off you can click "reconnect to grid" and it'll flip to the grid with no power, so you can turn things on/off without having someone go to it.
This is a good one, I'd even argue this is just
dumb simple coding, as 'grid' in this case means connect to any surrounding line, regardless as to whether it's connected to an actually powered network.
Maybe power lines need to carry a "live: 0/1" value, and orphaned lines aren't considered "part of the grid" for the context of this button.
Quote from: Franklin on September 07, 2016, 10:24:53 AM
Quote from: ericbomb on September 05, 2016, 11:56:29 PM
Not sure if this works for everything, but with the drills if you place a power conduit not attached to anything near it if you want to turn it off you can click "reconnect to grid" and it'll flip to the grid with no power, so you can turn things on/off without having someone go to it.
This is a good one, I'd even argue this is just dumb simple coding, as 'grid' in this case means connect to any surrounding line, regardless as to whether it's connected to an actually powered network.
Maybe power lines need to carry a "live: 0/1" value, and orphaned lines aren't considered "part of the grid" for the context of this button.
Similar to what I would do to fix this. If i was interested in fixing this.
The game is full of situations where you are 'supposed' to use a pawn to flick a switch. This is what the flicking work is for.
At the same time, you have work types that would be considered 'flicking' such as rearming an existing trap, set as hauling work not flicking. You are not building anything, or moving anything, just pulling a lever or whatever. Yet someone that refuses to haul like a pack animal wont do this either...
And then, you have the instances where it would make sense to need someone to flick something.. not needing flicking at all:
Setting heaters and coolers.
Turrets being told to hold fire.
Cancelling construction. (highly abusable if used correctly)
Quote from: Shurp on September 06, 2016, 11:01:20 PMThe one square room cooler/vent trick obviously shouldn't work that way.
It doesn't. The poster even said his information is second/third-hand knowledge.
It does work in the way that the temperature rises slower in the freezer because open doors are less effective at venting air than vents. Helps keep food edible longer in heat waves and solar flares. There are threads here and reddit where Tynan responded to questions about temperature control so I'm pretty sure he's aware of this workaround.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 07, 2016, 10:46:00 PM
Cancelling construction. (highly abusable if used correctly)
Highly abused if micromanaged correctly. There's your trade-off. Of course, if Tynan were to fix it, he'd probably just make canceling a construction lose materials put into it.
Quote from: Aatxe360 on September 07, 2016, 11:00:16 PM
Quote from: Shurp on September 06, 2016, 11:01:20 PMThe one square room cooler/vent trick obviously shouldn't work that way.
It doesn't. The poster even said his information is second/third-hand knowledge.
It does work in the way that the temperature rises slower in the freezer because open doors are less effective at venting air than vents. Helps keep food edible longer in heat waves and solar flares. There are threads here and reddit where Tynan responded to questions about temperature control so I'm pretty sure he's aware of this workaround.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 07, 2016, 10:46:00 PM
Cancelling construction. (highly abusable if used correctly)
Highly abused if micromanaged correctly. There's your trade-off.
Sorry but this post is entirely false in all respects.
The 1 tile plus vent exploit works well. I just tested it myself.
I can keep a 20x40 room below freezing with 1 cooler. At 20 C outside. The way vents are working breaks the laws of thermodynamics.
You can mass select construction and mass cancel. No micromanagement involved.
You can mass select and mass reconnect multiple turrets. No micromanagement involved.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 07, 2016, 11:13:32 PM
Sorry but this post is entirely false in all respects.
The 1 tile plus vent exploit works well. I just tested it myself.
I can keep a 20x40 room below freezing with 1 cooler. At 20 C outside. The way vents are working breaks the laws of thermodynamics.
And a lot of laws are 'broken' in-game. Artillery shells disappear when hitting a mountain. Colonists can still eat on their own with no jaws or dentures. Colonists cannot reproduce, yet have familial relationships. Vents don't have an option to be opened or closed. Bones disappear when butchering. Seems a case of game design.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 07, 2016, 11:13:32 PM
You can mass select construction and mass cancel. No micromanagement involved.
You can mass select and mass reconnect multiple turrets. No micromanagement involved.
That's your 'abuse?' That's
game design. I thought you were talking about something completely different. Ever hear of the lost art of architecture?
If you want to continue down this route, why not mention the God's Eye view you have of the entire map and the real time locations of animals, raiders, and colonists?
How to counter siege when you are way too inferior to your opponent:
Step 1: Wait for the opponents to stop bombing and fall asleep
Step 2: Steal their mortars
Step 3: They will begin the assault, defend.
Yes, this actually works. You can uninstall and take away their mortars while they all sleep.
Lol!!! And I thought killing them in their sleep was cheesy :)
And still both are actual Tactics used in Real Life Warfare :)
Sabotage and Assassination.
I mean you could build IEDs while they are sleeping or install traps throughout the camp ..
The problem with both "exploits" is you have to eat the damage they deal until they go to sleep.
My favourite tactic is still sniping the guy who builds the mortars .. without mortars they are no threat to me, when they attack I retreat and eat them with my defenses.
Quote from: Wishmaster on September 08, 2016, 01:19:49 PM
How to counter siege when you are way too inferior to your opponent:
Step 1: Wait for the opponents to stop bombing and fall asleep
Step 2: Steal their mortars
Step 3: They will begin the assault, defend.
Yes, this actually works. You can uninstall and take away their mortars while they all sleep.
I can't wait to do this myself, this sounds so satisfying.
Quote from: Aatxe360 on September 07, 2016, 11:23:16 PM
Quote from: Britnoth on September 07, 2016, 11:13:32 PM
Sorry but this post is entirely false in all respects.
The 1 tile plus vent exploit works well. I just tested it myself.
I can keep a 20x40 room below freezing with 1 cooler. At 20 C outside. The way vents are working breaks the laws of thermodynamics.
And a lot of laws are 'broken' in-game. Artillery shells disappear when hitting a mountain. Colonists can still eat on their own with no jaws or dentures. Colonists cannot reproduce, yet have familial relationships. Vents don't have an option to be opened or closed. Bones disappear when butchering. Seems a case of game design.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 07, 2016, 11:13:32 PM
You can mass select construction and mass cancel. No micromanagement involved.
You can mass select and mass reconnect multiple turrets. No micromanagement involved.
That's your 'abuse?' That's game design. I thought you were talking about something completely different. Ever hear of the lost art of architecture?
If you want to continue down this route, why not mention the God's Eye view you have of the entire map and the real time locations of animals, raiders, and colonists?
Artillery shells hitting a mountain are hitting an overhead mountain. They dont just magically vanish. You can eat without a denture, if your food is mash. Colonists dont reproduce because they dont want to. Vents not having a close option is hardly breaking the laws of physics.
The cooler and vent exploit is an EXPLOIT because it is using a game bug (vents not working correctly) in a way that makes it so the intended behaviour (the coolers having a limit to how much they can cool) is effectively ursurpsed. It is not intended to cool an entire mountain base with 1 cooler.
The mass cancel of construction is a potential exploit, because it is effectively deconstructing a wall without any pawn actually being near it or doing any work. Select an area of unfinished wall. Hit cancel. Wall that was previously blocking shots magically vanishes without anyone there to do it. If this was intended, then deconstructing wouldnt actually BE a pawn work type.
QuoteColonists dont reproduce because they dont want to.
nope. that is not a fact. it's just your personal opinion. another hypothesis why the colonists don't reproduce in rimworld is that the devs have simply decided not to put in human reproduction as part of their game design.
why? probably coz of several reasons like different laws in different countries that could affect sales, or whatever.
meanwhile the timeframe for growth has been tackled several times. ie : others want accelerated growth similar to animals, while others (like me) prefer to have ultra-fastforward gameplay speeds so that 15 rimworld years would roughly be around 3 hours real time. (i usually play in 3x fastforward speed.. and it feels too slow, especially in the late game when i've already built everythang and was just waiting for new stuffs to happen.. this is usually when i start going on "meh" mode.)
besides, there are also colony sim games that have kids and there's no problem (DF, banished, Black&White, etc.) so from a technical perspective, i believe that the main reason why there's no human reproduction in rimworld is mostly due to a decision by the game dev not to include it.
Quote from: keylocke on September 09, 2016, 04:53:53 AM
nope. that is not a fact. it's just your personal opinion.
The original comment was 'cannot' reproduce. I was addressing that. We know they can reproduce in game, they just don't.
No laws fundamental laws of nature, or in game laws need to be broken. Which need to when dealing with the exploits I previously mentioned.
Vents are supposed to 'equalise' temperature. Nowhere in the description does it day 'create or remove heat'.
Quote from: keylocke on September 09, 2016, 04:53:53 AM
i believe that the main reason why there's no human reproduction in rimworld is mostly due to a decision by the game dev not to include it.
I can't wait to build rape dungeons where I can send all my captured female colonists so I can harvest the babies for making kibble...
Quote from: Boba Phat on September 10, 2016, 06:19:36 AM
I can't wait to build rape dungeons where I can send all my captured female colonists so I can harvest the babies for making kibble...
And this is why the Rimworld developers probably should refrain from activating human reproduction. We don't need the bad press that would result. "Rimworld is a game about eating babies! Ban Rimworld!"
Quote from: Britnoth on September 08, 2016, 11:01:12 PM
Artillery shells hitting a mountain are hitting an overhead mountain. They dont just magically vanish. You can eat without a denture, if your food is mash. Colonists dont reproduce because they dont want to. Vents not having a close option is hardly breaking the laws of physics.
No rubble comes falling down after hitting an overhead mountain. They vanish.
All colonists can eat frozen food of all types quickly(or not so quickly with no jaw) without heating it up. Colonists don't reproduce or need to use the bathroom because that's *gasp*
game design. It's all game design currently and you're full of it.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 08, 2016, 11:01:12 PMThe cooler and vent exploit is an EXPLOIT because it is using a game bug (vents not working correctly) in a way that makes it so the intended behaviour (the coolers having a limit to how much they can cool) is effectively ursurpsed. It is not intended to cool an entire mountain base with 1 cooler.
It doesn't cool an entire mountain base. That would be absurd and an exploit. The coolers have a limit and... *tests it out* Ok. A cooler with a target of 0F/-18C can keep 531 squares(roughly a 23x23 area) well below freezing(roughly 23F/-5C) when it's behind three vents. I'm not sure exactly what to think about that. Maybe an increase in power consumption or have the vents consume a small amount of power?
I did test it in winter on parts of my base behind an airlock to the outside, so no feasible way atm to test a heat wave and see how much that would affect this issue.
You're hypothesis when you first posted just screamed bloody murder that a cooler could still work in a heat wave. AC in the 5500s should be able to handle heat waves fine even if something cobbled together by stranded survivors won't be all that impressive. Collect your thoughts before you post next time.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 08, 2016, 11:01:12 PMThe mass cancel of construction is a potential exploit, because it is effectively deconstructing a wall without any pawn actually being near it or doing any work. Select an area of unfinished wall. Hit cancel. Wall that was previously blocking shots magically vanishes without anyone there to do it. If this was intended, then deconstructing wouldnt actually BE a pawn work type.
Now you're being specific again. That's good. I still don't consider this an exploit myself, just game design. The colonists still have to haul materials there and away. Also, that square isn't actually finished being constructed yet. I see it as a visual cue that if you need plan something else there, you can! You cannot put plans over plans. Only one set of plans per square.
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
@aatxe
Sorry, you're just wrong.
1) an artillery shell hits your mountain, which probably is 2000m tall (otherwise it would be a HILL) and you're telling me you, in your cave at the mountain bottom should have rubble falling down?
Why do you thing USA most secure militar facilities are build into mountains? They're ANTI NUCLEAR and you're saying a simple artillery shell from some raiders would make rubble fall down? lol
2) you might want to check this link and the posted screenshot. Specifically the top 2nd example
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=25368.msg259148#msg259148
A/C + vents are broken. End of story. There is nothing to discuss about it, it's a proven fact. Maybe they work well when used separately, but when used like in that example, you can clearly see how it is a exploit to trick the system into have one single cooler work at a much higher efficiency than it really should.
Is the cooler to blame? Or the vent? Or the combination of both? I don't know, I don't care. Fact remains: it's an exploit that can be abused to cool much larger surfaces for much less (barely any) power than it really should.
Forgive spelling. On the phone, CBA to spell check.
Quote from: Aatxe360 on September 10, 2016, 05:16:54 PM
It doesn't cool an entire mountain base. That would be absurd and an exploit. The coolers have a limit and... *tests it out* Ok. A cooler with a target of 0F/-18C can keep 531 squares(roughly a 23x23 area) well below freezing(roughly 23F/-5C) when it's behind three vents. I'm not sure exactly what to think about that. Maybe an increase in power consumption or have the vents consume a small amount of power?
....
Collect your thoughts before you post next time.
I just did my own test. Cooled an outside room 40x40 (minus pillars) with 1 cooler and 3 vents. outside temp 17 C. Inside it is -15 C.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I keep flocks of chickens just inside the chokepoints to enter my base. Raiders (and mad animals) spend all their time killing chickens while turrets and colonists pick them off. Worst kill ratio I have had so far is 2 chickens:1 raider:0 colonists/turrets.
Quote from: Zeneth on September 10, 2016, 07:07:56 PM
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
It has, but it needs to be said more. This is one of the most ridiculous exploits in the game, along with the vent trick, and wiring to use reconnect as a power switch. Tynan, if you're reading this, I'd list that as answers 1, 2, and 3.
Ok, not the most useful of exploits, but when a colonist is having a "psychotic break-- hiding in room", it is possible to get the colonist to move to any enclosed area simply by laying down a sleeping spot and assigning that spot to the colonist.
Quote from: SimpleMachine88 on September 12, 2016, 07:23:56 PM
Quote from: Zeneth on September 10, 2016, 07:07:56 PM
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
It has, but it needs to be said more. This is one of the most ridiculous exploits in the game, along with the vent trick, and wiring to use reconnect as a power switch. Tynan, if you're reading this, I'd list that as answers 1, 2, and 3.
It's really not very much of an exploit at all. A 2x2 bedroom with a single bed works pretty much the same, except that it allows for the possibility of them deciding to pray/meditate in their bedroom (which is as much an advantage as it is a disadvantage). If you don't want the always-present 'impressive bedroom' buffs, then small bedrooms are supposed to work fine.
Quote from: Zhentar on September 12, 2016, 09:41:11 PM
Quote from: SimpleMachine88 on September 12, 2016, 07:23:56 PM
Quote from: Zeneth on September 10, 2016, 07:07:56 PM
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
It has, but it needs to be said more. This is one of the most ridiculous exploits in the game, along with the vent trick, and wiring to use reconnect as a power switch. Tynan, if you're reading this, I'd list that as answers 1, 2, and 3.
It's really not very much of an exploit at all. A 2x2 bedroom with a single bed works pretty much the same, except that it allows for the possibility of them deciding to pray/meditate in their bedroom (which is as much an advantage as it is a disadvantage). If you don't want the always-present 'impressive bedroom' buffs, then small bedrooms are supposed to work fine.
I have a screenshot somewhere of a colonist with a "Spacious Interior" mood buff while she was in her 1x2 doored cubby hole with a sleeping spot.
Quote from: SimpleMachine88 on September 12, 2016, 07:23:56 PM
Quote from: Zeneth on September 10, 2016, 07:07:56 PM
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
It has, but it needs to be said more. This is one of the most ridiculous exploits in the game, along with the vent trick, and wiring to use reconnect as a power switch. Tynan, if you're reading this, I'd list that as answers 1, 2, and 3.
There is no bug. Colonists mood behaves correctly in small rooms. They suffer from cramped environment mood. They suffer from unimpressive bedroom if greedy, etc etc.
I really wish people would stop repeating this myth every damn day. It is getting old.
EDIT:
QuoteI have a screenshot somewhere of a colonist with a "Spacious Interior" mood buff while she was in her 1x2 doored cubby hole with a sleeping spot.
Yes yes, that also gets repeated every damn day. The fact is:
MOOD DOES NOT UPDATE WHEN ASLEEP. THAT "SPACIOUIS INTERIOR" THOUGHT IS NOT APPLIED. IT HAS NO AFFECT ON MOOD. IT IS NOT A BUG.
Quote from: Dingus on September 13, 2016, 01:18:20 AM
I have a screenshot somewhere of a colonist with a "Spacious Interior" mood buff while she was in her 1x2 doored cubby hole with a sleeping spot.
I can get you that same screenshot with a 2x2 or 3x3 (with the bed on a far wall). Colonists moods slowly shift towards their current surroundings, and all of the parts (except for comfort) are frozen while they sleep.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 13, 2016, 09:16:58 AM
Quote from: SimpleMachine88 on September 12, 2016, 07:23:56 PM
Quote from: Zeneth on September 10, 2016, 07:07:56 PM
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
It has, but it needs to be said more. This is one of the most ridiculous exploits in the game, along with the vent trick, and wiring to use reconnect as a power switch. Tynan, if you're reading this, I'd list that as answers 1, 2, and 3.
There is no bug. Colonists mood behaves correctly in small rooms. They suffer from cramped environment mood. They suffer from unimpressive bedroom if greedy, etc etc.
I really wish people would stop repeating this myth every damn day. It is getting old.
EDIT:
QuoteI have a screenshot somewhere of a colonist with a "Spacious Interior" mood buff while she was in her 1x2 doored cubby hole with a sleeping spot.
Yes yes, that also gets repeated every damn day. The fact is:
MOOD DOES NOT UPDATE WHEN ASLEEP. THAT "SPACIOUIS INTERIOR" THOUGHT IS NOT APPLIED. IT HAS NO AFFECT ON MOOD. IT IS NOT A BUG.
Except that in the 1x2 bedroom case, they get the cramped debuff but they are immediately asleep so the debuff doesn't actually do anything (their mood doesn't change while asleep), then when they awaken they are immediately out of their room, so the cramped debuff goes away.
So, in a ridiculous example: Say the Cramped debuff gave you -40 mood. Colonist goes into his room and directly into his bed; gets -40 mood. However, that doesn't move the bar - the bar moves over time to the setpoint established by his various modifiers. But because the bar doesn't move when he's asleep, it doesn't actually move down. He wakes up, is immediately out of his room, so worst case scenario the mood bar moved down imperceptibly but immediately recovered after he woke up and exited his cubby into a spacious hallway/room.
Quote from: zandadoum on September 11, 2016, 05:54:08 AM
@aatxe
Sorry, you're just wrong.
1) an artillery shell hits your mountain, which probably is 2000m tall (otherwise it would be a HILL) and you're telling me you, in your cave at the mountain bottom should have rubble falling down?
Why do you thing USA most secure militar facilities are build into mountains? They're ANTI NUCLEAR and you're saying a simple artillery shell from some raiders would make rubble fall down? lol
Installations deep in the mountain is
not the edge of the mountain. They vanish when they hit
any part of the overhead mountain including that bit you use for a front porch. Lrn2comprehend
Quote from: Britnoth on September 13, 2016, 09:16:58 AM
Quote from: SimpleMachine88 on September 12, 2016, 07:23:56 PM
Quote from: Zeneth on September 10, 2016, 07:07:56 PM
I'm sure this maybe has been said before, but I can't be bothered to scroll through all 19 pages of this thread, so, I don't really know if this is an exploit, but if you make a room that is 2x1 with a door and a bed inside, colonists will use it as a bedroom and have no mood debuffs from it, thus making actual bedrooms not really useful.
It has, but it needs to be said more. This is one of the most ridiculous exploits in the game, along with the vent trick, and wiring to use reconnect as a power switch. Tynan, if you're reading this, I'd list that as answers 1, 2, and 3.
There is no bug. Colonists mood behaves correctly in small rooms. They suffer from cramped environment mood. They suffer from unimpressive bedroom if greedy, etc etc.
I really wish people would stop repeating this myth every damn day. It is getting old.
EDIT:
QuoteI have a screenshot somewhere of a colonist with a "Spacious Interior" mood buff while she was in her 1x2 doored cubby hole with a sleeping spot.
Yes yes, that also gets repeated every damn day. The fact is:
MOOD DOES NOT UPDATE WHEN ASLEEP. THAT "SPACIOUIS INTERIOR" THOUGHT IS NOT APPLIED. IT HAS NO AFFECT ON MOOD. IT IS NOT A BUG.
This is an exploit. 1x2 cubbyholes for sleeping should at
least inflict a longer-lasting debuff for sleeping in cramped quarters.
I mean it's an exploit of intended behaviour, not an exploit of a bug, we should make it clear. And 'exploit of intended behaviour' should be defined as pushing established gameplay mechanics beyond reasonable scope into a min/max strategy.
So while 1x2 rooms are an "exploit" it's more that they're an "imbalance".
There is no 'cramped sleeping quarters' mood.
So.. how the HELL is it an exploit that a mood penalty is NOT IN THE GAME YET?
These forums make my brain hurt. :o
It's probably not worth anyone's time to keep rehashing the same old "is it an exploit vs. isn't it" arguments.
My understanding (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=17919.msg259699#msg259699) is this thread should be primarily about reporting new, possible exploits, rather than debating a handful of cases to the point of insanity.
The developers will be the ultimate judge of what is and is not an exploit. If something that isn't an exploit is reported, they're savvy enough to figure that out and ignore it on their own.
Not sure if what I'm doing is an exploit or not and if anyone has said this.
Put your beds in a 2x1 space to JK
After encountering three sieges in a row and losing 4 or 5 colonists in total I tried another tactic when approaching a siege event. You know how it is said that when they run out of food or shells they will attack?. Well, instead of using sniper rifles and risk some of my colonists getting hurt I decided to just steal all their food and shells hoping it will trigger an assault on the colony. What actually happened was that the pirates starts to drop more and more supplies for their people on the ground. Using every available colonist to steal their supplies (5-6 at the time) I managed to gain more or less 60 survival package meal and 20? Artillery shell I could've gotten more if one of their drop pods didn't land face first on Azlan's face.
tldr
Steal stuff during sieges when they're asleep to gain top dollar resources
If anyone is interested on the colonies fate, it got it's butt unwillingly fornicated by an infestation. I hate infestations
Not really an exploit, so much as oversight : Raiders weapons doesn't necessarily match their ability. Brawlers will have snipers, people with bad back will have melee gear, and those with little experience in guns will be given harder to use guns. A small check, and giving raiders appropriate gear would really make raids much harder.
Obviously if this is done, numbers for raids should be tweaked
Quote from: Darth Fool on September 12, 2016, 07:40:01 PM
Ok, not the most useful of exploits, but when a colonist is having a "psychotic break-- hiding in room", it is possible to get the colonist to move to any enclosed area simply by laying down a sleeping spot and assigning that spot to the colonist.
Wow, huuuuge !
if a prisoner goes berserk, you can build a single tile wall on the outside the prison door and they'll stop trying to break down the door. then you just wait out the mental break and deconstruct it when it's over.
That sounds more like WAD than an exploit. You can remove the door beforehand and seal him up in a room with a food stockpile to the same effect. No risk of a prison break that way either :)
Hmmm, on a related note, I found an "exploit" to deal with traders who overstay their welcome. If you try to box them into a room they will all panic and try to escape. So start building a wall that traps them, wait for the panic message, then deconstruct. They take off and your devilstrand crop remains unmolested by hungry muffalo.
Don't know if this has already been mentioned, but...
As of the current build, kiting enemies which are "guarding" a certain spot until they "give up" chasing you is a great way to cheese infestations and sieges. When they get tired of chasing you and start to head back to the spot they were guarding, you just turn around and get a bunch of free shots out.
I've taken out entire infestations in a single day, with one pawn and his pistol, using this technique. Siege camps are a bit harder to do this to, given that they typically have snipers :P
Quote from: Shurp on September 18, 2016, 11:50:48 PM
That sounds more like WAD than an exploit. You can remove the door beforehand and seal him up in a room with a food stockpile to the same effect. No risk of a prison break that way either :)
I have seen Tynan say that placing a wall in front of a berserk prisoners door to stop them beating their way out is an 'exploit'.
So I guess whenever one goes berserk, I will just have someone repairing the door every other hour for 8+ hours.
More micro for no gameplay change, thanks Tynan. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Weird... Seems to me that building a barricade to block in rioting prisoners is a sensible strategy. The only thing "exploity" is that the prisoners give up. They should be willing to dig at the walls (as traders now do)
Quote from: Britnoth on September 19, 2016, 09:49:02 AM
More micro for no gameplay change, thanks Tynan. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The difference is you have to dedicate a pawn to repairing the door.
Quote from: Shurp on September 19, 2016, 10:22:22 AM
Weird... Seems to me that building a barricade to block in rioting prisoners is a sensible strategy. The only thing "exploity" is that the prisoners give up. They should be willing to dig at the walls (as traders now do)
Yeah, it seems like the kind of exploit that's just an exploit because it looks exploity. Like, if we could lock doors then nobody would argue locking someone in their room is a viable way of dealing with a violent outburst. We need lockable doors, perhaps.
Are killboxes exploits? Because realistic Enemy AI will eventually figure them out and stop being lemmings? Or cassandra will throw in a raid that can overcome them (especially with fleeing enemies that can relay strategies)?
Is this an exploit?
I have only my starting three colonists with their starting rifle and pistol. A ship part crashed. So I picked up my turrets and parked them next to the ship part with a moved battery to power them.
They're doing a fine job of killing the scyther and heavy charge blaster equipped centipede. My two armed colonists are gaining firearm experience.
[attachment deleted by admin - too old]
Seems like a valid tactic to me.
Speaking of ships parts, one thing I found out and think is a little exploitive is that you can enclose them with a wall and leave one spot clear, shoot the part and force all the mechanoids to spawn around that spot. Leave some artillery shells there and have a grenadier in position and at least scythers will die in seconds.
Solution: prevent building new constructions right next to the ship, in similar fashion to map edges.
Quote from: Franklin on September 19, 2016, 11:52:33 AM
Quote from: Shurp on September 19, 2016, 10:22:22 AM
Weird... Seems to me that building a barricade to block in rioting prisoners is a sensible strategy. The only thing "exploity" is that the prisoners give up. They should be willing to dig at the walls (as traders now do)
Yeah, it seems like the kind of exploit that's just an exploit because it looks exploity. Like, if we could lock doors then nobody would argue locking someone in their room is a viable way of dealing with a violent outburst. We need lockable doors, perhaps.
No one would argue a violent and equiped raider should not be able to break though a wall or door with enough effort expended.
it is not reasonable to say a prisoner in shackles should either be able to fight with the same effectiveness as an unarmed, unshackled colonist, or have the ability while shackled and without any kind tool to beat down a solid steel/plasteel door.
And another mechanoid exploit is to use downed centipedes as target practice. A passionate shooter can easily rack up 30k shooting xp in a day of shooting at a centipede with a pistol.
Quote from: Zhentar on September 23, 2016, 11:30:06 AMAnd another mechanoid exploit is to use downed centipedes as target practice. A passionate shooter can easily rack up 30k shooting xp in a day of shooting at a centipede with a pistol.
Is that really an exploit, tho'? It seems like a system working as intended, enabled by a lack of lower-risk options for training skill.
I guess it might be worthwhile to place a cap on how much XP can be gained from a single target, or within a single time-frame (more realistic, I think), but it might also be worthwhile to have options for training lower skilled shooters that don't constantly risk manhunting packs of rabid weasels or something.
Consider that after the first 4,000 XP earned in a stat, XP gain is reduced by 80%; we can assume that's the limit of what Tynan wants us to earn in a day. It's a safe bet that something that allows a zero passion, zero skill pawn to hit that threshold in a couple of game hours with no risk and no resource consumption is an exploit.
Shooting inanimate objects gives you 6xp per shot (incidentally defined in a constant that calls it "practice"). Neutral animals, which carry the risks you mention, gives 50xp per shot. Actual combat gives 240xp per shot. Shooting at incapacitated combat targets still gives the same 240xp, even though the risk level is on par with the inanimate object.
Of course, the other reason that this exploit works is that target that are "lying down" are ridiculously hard to shoot. It's lying down now, so your accuracy is reduced by 80%!? I guess that it's supposed to represent the reduced cross sectional area of a human, but it kind of ignores the fact that it's much easier to hit a target that's not moving. (And it gets really weird if you put sand bags in front of the centipede, because suddenly your shooters can hit a little pile of sand bags far more reliably than they can hit the giant robot sitting behind them)
Quote from: Zhentar on September 23, 2016, 04:42:30 PM
Consider that after the first 4,000 XP earned in a stat, XP gain is reduced by 80%; we can assume that's the limit of what Tynan wants us to earn in a day. It's a safe bet that something that allows a zero passion, zero skill pawn to hit that threshold in a couple of game hours with no risk and no resource consumption is an exploit.
Shooting inanimate objects gives you 6xp per shot (incidentally defined in a constant that calls it "practice"). Neutral animals, which carry the risks you mention, gives 50xp per shot. Actual combat gives 240xp per shot. Shooting at incapacitated combat targets still gives the same 240xp, even though the risk level is on par with the inanimate object.
Of course, the other reason that this exploit works is that target that are "lying down" are ridiculously hard to shoot. It's lying down now, so your accuracy is reduced by 80%!? I guess that it's supposed to represent the reduced cross sectional area of a human, but it kind of ignores the fact that it's much easier to hit a target that's not moving. (And it gets really weird if you put sand bags in front of the centipede, because suddenly your shooters can hit a little pile of sand bags far more reliably than they can hit the giant robot sitting behind them)
Yeah, it's an exploit, will fix.
Quote from: Zhentar on September 23, 2016, 04:42:30 PM
Consider that after the first 4,000 XP earned in a stat, XP gain is reduced by 80%; we can assume that's the limit of what Tynan wants us to earn in a day. It's a safe bet that something that allows a zero passion, zero skill pawn to hit that threshold in a couple of game hours with no risk and no resource consumption is an exploit.
Shooting inanimate objects gives you 6xp per shot (incidentally defined in a constant that calls it "practice"). Neutral animals, which carry the risks you mention, gives 50xp per shot. Actual combat gives 240xp per shot. Shooting at incapacitated combat targets still gives the same 240xp, even though the risk level is on par with the inanimate object.
Of course, the other reason that this exploit works is that target that are "lying down" are ridiculously hard to shoot. It's lying down now, so your accuracy is reduced by 80%!? I guess that it's supposed to represent the reduced cross sectional area of a human, but it kind of ignores the fact that it's much easier to hit a target that's not moving. (And it gets really weird if you put sand bags in front of the centipede, because suddenly your shooters can hit a little pile of sand bags far more reliably than they can hit the giant robot sitting behind them)
Thanks for this. I wasn't aware of most of these systems (how do you shoot an inanimate object anyway??) and with your explanation, it's considerably easier to understand that this isn't WAD.
Target it by hand.
Click the weapon icon on the pawn you can shoot everything, even your own pawns.
Quote from: SpaceDorf on September 23, 2016, 08:20:11 PMTarget it by hand.
Click the weapon icon on the pawn you can shoot everything, even your own pawns.
::wanders off to feel stupid somewhere else::
Quote from: Shurp on September 22, 2016, 06:45:06 PM
Is this an exploit?
I have only my starting three colonists with their starting rifle and pistol. A ship part crashed. So I picked up my turrets and parked them next to the ship part with a moved battery to power them.
They're doing a fine job of killing the scyther and heavy charge blaster equipped centipede. My two armed colonists are gaining firearm experience.
What, exactly, is being exploited here? Enemies' tendency to shoot turrets before colonists? I would guess that's working as intended, especially if the turrets are doing more damage than the colonists.
Of course, the question is how often the centipedes are hitting completely unprotected turrets.
I don't know if this has been pointed out, I don't fancy digging through 22 pages of posts to find out, but I found if you order you pawn to go through a door but as it opens you Undraft then redraft the colonist the door will open fully allowing your colonist to shoot through it however, raiders will not attempt to shoot back through the door nor will the attempt to melee attack your colonists. This means your colonists can safely shoot through an open door at raiders (Until they eventually manage to destroy the door).
Quote from: Travinsky on September 24, 2016, 12:11:08 PM
I don't know if this has been pointed out, I don't fancy digging through 22 pages of posts to find out, but I found if you order you pawn to go through a door but as it opens you Undraft then redraft the colonist the door will open fully allowing your colonist to shoot through it however, raiders will not attempt to shoot back through the door nor will the attempt to melee attack your colonists. This means your colonists can safely shoot through an open door at raiders (Until they eventually manage to destroy the door).
This was recently reported as a bug (although I think it's been around for quite a while).
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=26218.0
Quote from: MikeLemmer on September 24, 2016, 11:28:56 AM
What, exactly, is being exploited here?
The ability to pick up turrets and fully charged batteries and walk across the map with them to a crashed ship part. I didn't build these on site. I just dismantled part of my existing base defense and moved it.
My impression is that the intent of ship part crashes and sieges is to force the player to exit his fort and fight the enemy on neutral ground. Being able to easily move turrets partially negates this.
BTW, centipedes can't hit turrets, and a lone scyther can't do too much damage either. But I surely would have lost a colonist limb or two vs the scyther if the turrets hadn't been there.
Quote from: Shurp on September 25, 2016, 09:36:20 AM
The ability to pick up turrets and fully charged batteries and walk across the map with them to a crashed ship part. I didn't build these on site. I just dismantled part of my existing base defense and moved it.
My impression is that the intent of ship part crashes and sieges is to force the player to exit his fort and fight the enemy on neutral ground. Being able to easily move turrets partially negates this.
BTW, centipedes can't hit turrets, and a lone scyther can't do too much damage either. But I surely would have lost a colonist limb or two vs the scyther if the turrets hadn't been there.
I'm sure Tynan had this in mind when deciding batteries and turrets could be reinstalled. To me (and likely many others) it sounds more like a good tactic than an exploit.
Btw, whenever I do this I always lose a few turrets. Mainly because there are many mechs that come out and there's usually at least one with a rocket launcher.
EDIT: Ohh I forgot to mention, moving part of your defenses also means that you're spreading them thin. You run the risk of being raided while having less than normal defence at your main base.
Well, by the time I have serious mech attacks I also have lots of colonists with body armor and rifles. So I don't bother bringing my turrets; like you say, they tend to blow up :)
This was early in the game -- too early really, only 20 days in or so. So I didn't have anything else to bring except two pop guns.
Another exploit mentioned on reddit, the "heater exploit" if it hasn't been mentioned here. Basically a heater in a 1x1 room with a vent will heat any size room on the other side.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/54aiab/this_is_how_i_warm_up_my_base_in_normal_icesheet/d80gp61
Quote from: pdxsean on September 27, 2016, 10:34:39 PM
Another exploit mentioned on reddit, the "heater exploit" if it hasn't been mentioned here. Basically a heater in a 1x1 room with a vent will heat any size room on the other side.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/54aiab/this_is_how_i_warm_up_my_base_in_normal_icesheet/d80gp61
_ Holy crap that's my post on reddit lol
Quote from: pdxsean on September 27, 2016, 10:34:39 PM
Another exploit mentioned on reddit, the "heater exploit" if it hasn't been mentioned here. Basically a heater in a 1x1 room with a vent will heat any size room on the other side.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/54aiab/this_is_how_i_warm_up_my_base_in_normal_icesheet/d80gp61
same applies to coolers
Quote from: zandadoum on September 28, 2016, 02:18:18 AM
Quote from: pdxsean on September 27, 2016, 10:34:39 PM
Another exploit mentioned on reddit, the "heater exploit" if it hasn't been mentioned here. Basically a heater in a 1x1 room with a vent will heat any size room on the other side.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/54aiab/this_is_how_i_warm_up_my_base_in_normal_icesheet/d80gp61
same applies to coolers
_ Yeah, actually it's not about heater, but
Vent exploit instead.
I was recently playing a game (large map size) when a bug hive spawned in a dark room near the southern end of the map, and my base was located at the north. I didn't have the resources to fight it and it wasn't bothersome so I left it and it kept multiplying and multiplying, and is now a massive hive that has eaten up the small hill it spawned in (one annoying thing is that I constantly get Roof Collapse notifications because the bugs keep mining adjacent cells).
Almost all of the raids, sieges and trade convoys I get come from the south and they all get eliminated instantly when they walk a few steps up and the bugs swarm them. My colony is super safe now becaus nothing can get past the megahive and I've limited all my colonists to stay away from it, but I think the game is also spawning very few raids or threats now because maybe the storyteller thinks I'm dealing with a giant hive when we're peacefully co-existing? I can also scavenge items from the dead raiders or even capture raiders who are incapacitated at a safe distance from the hive by waiting until night and then sending my psychopathic jogger (Lots of rotting bodies to be seen in that area) to snatch and run while most of the hive is asleep. I set up some incendiary mortars to set the hive on fire if I need to but honestly it's the best thing ever so I won't. I guess this could be an exploit if you purposefully mined a bunch of dark tunnels near the map edges hoping for an infestation. It could also just be a cool strategy. It would definitely be better if the hive was somehow a threat to the colony but right now it's 100% safe and 100% beneficial. Something like bugs going out on hunts perhaps? Right now I'm thinking of a way to distract the swarm so I can jog in and grab some of the insane amount of sweet sweet jelly that's been building up.
(http://imgur.com/jhNujuQ.jpg)
^ Neat. Perhaps after a certain number of active hives, the colony starts producing artillery bugs to target distant threats, Starship Troopers-style (http://starshiptroopers.wikia.com/wiki/Plasma_Bug_(film)#Starship_Troopers_film).
Why not artillery bugs that shoot *eggs* which hatch elsewhere on the map... "oh crap, they're colonizing my freezer!"
You may disagree with the huge ant infestation being helpful if a psychic ship lands behind it. 8)
Maybe less-aggressive hauler-type bugs? If you leave them alone long enough they'll start scavenging from your base.
If you ignore them you can have a semi-peaceful existence at the cost of them looting your freezer from time to time (amount based on number of hives).
If you attack them they'll start organizing "raids" with soldiers (sized based on number of hives).
Quote from: Nevon on September 28, 2016, 04:02:45 AMI was recently playing a game (large map size) when a bug hive spawned in a dark room near the southern end of the map, and my base was located at the north. I didn't have the resources to fight it and it wasn't bothersome so I left it and it kept multiplying and multiplying, and is now a massive hive that has eaten up the small hill it spawned in (one annoying thing is that I constantly get Roof Collapse notifications because the bugs keep mining adjacent cells).
Almost all of the raids, sieges and trade convoys I get come from the south and they all get eliminated instantly when they walk a few steps up and the bugs swarm them. My colony is super safe now becaus nothing can get past the megahive and I've limited all my colonists to stay away from it, but I think the game is also spawning very few raids or threats now because maybe the storyteller thinks I'm dealing with a giant hive when we're peacefully co-existing? I can also scavenge items from the dead raiders or even capture raiders who are incapacitated at a safe distance from the hive by waiting until night and then sending my psychopathic jogger (Lots of rotting bodies to be seen in that area) to snatch and run while most of the hive is asleep. I set up some incendiary mortars to set the hive on fire if I need to but honestly it's the best thing ever so I won't. I guess this could be an exploit if you purposefully mined a bunch of dark tunnels near the map edges hoping for an infestation. It could also just be a cool strategy. It would definitely be better if the hive was somehow a threat to the colony but right now it's 100% safe and 100% beneficial. Something like bugs going out on hunts perhaps? Right now I'm thinking of a way to distract the swarm so I can jog in and grab some of the insane amount of sweet sweet jelly that's been building up.
Man, I hope Tynan doesn't consider this an exploit. This is what I call "emergent gameplay". Plus, there's always the possibility that the hive expands too much, or you make a mistake and bring ruin down on your head.
Quote from: Shurp on September 19, 2016, 10:22:22 AM
Weird... Seems to me that building a barricade to block in rioting prisoners is a sensible strategy. The only thing "exploity" is that the prisoners give up. They should be willing to dig at the walls (as traders now do)
It makes sense, but it doesn't meet the intent of the mood system. When people go berzerk, this should be a big risk for the colony. If all you need to do is spend 5 granite to build a temp wall, than this mechanic is not creating the level of problem that the developer intended.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 29, 2016, 10:55:52 AM
You may disagree with the huge ant infestation being helpful if a psychic ship lands behind it. 8)
What would happen if you poked the ship with a sniper rifle from range? Would the bugs and mechs fight it out?
I would think the bugs attack the mechs just like they attack any raiders/siegers, but I can't say I have played a game where mechs and bugs have come in close proximity.
I'm not sure if this would be considered an exploit or not, but if you want to avoid the penalties associated with bonded animals, you simply can remove the pawn as the master before combat. The pawn will have a "Not India's master" penalty for the short duration of the combat, but this, to me, is much less risky than losing one of your hauler pets.
This is another possible exploit. I will send miners to mine a long straight path through an entire mountain. You can criss cross these lines to find many of the hidden steel and other metals. This is not an exploit at this point.
But having many single lane tunnels carved out throughout mountains (Typically a short distance away from your base) greatly increases the chances that an infestation is going to happen in a safe place. If you build doors at the entrances to these tunnels, it makes dealing with infestations risk free (By using the door exploit and having straight lines, a sniper standing in the doorway can clear a lot of bugs out without ever getting hit). Even without the doorway exploit, putting a sniper at the end of the tunnel can do serious damage before the bugs have enough time to close the gap. And since they only give chase for a short while, you just have your sniper run away when they get within a couple squares, wait for the bug to lose interest, and repeat until they are dead.
Positioning a sniper far away from the bugs won't even attract them. You can kill them without ever going after you.
Quote from: Tynan on March 21, 2016, 04:46:51 PM
I'd love to hear about any exploits you know of in this thread. Are there other no-risk ways to defeat infestations or sieges? The ones I know of are:
- Shoot infestation bugs from long range
- Shoot siegers with sniper rifles (until they attack)
I shoot wasps nests at my house from 20 feet away with Raid and they do not attack me all the time. I do not think long range engagement of bugs is an exploit- its just smart tactics... Im not going up to a fire-ant hill and beating it with a stick in real life... Im spraying poison/gasoline on it from as far away as I can get. I would like to note I don't LR bugs in game, but burn them.
What else am I supposed to do to a team of 11 seigers? Mortar them? I do that too, and then use a sniper team as support for the mortar fire (or visa versa?). That is an exploit?
Quote from: Serenity on September 30, 2016, 02:05:55 PM
Positioning a sniper far away from the bugs won't even attract them. You can kill them without ever going after you.
True, but infestations do not typically happen in an open area where you have enough room to snipe them from max range, at least in my experience.
The tunnels help guarantee you get that range advantage.
Yeah, it's certainly a rare thing. I had it happen yesterday when they spawned in an open pocket that I mined out for steel.
Strip mining is the the more common way to see that though. Like here:
https://youtu.be/e-70WA5uaEs?t=433
Quote from: stu89pid on September 30, 2016, 01:58:35 PMWhat would happen if you poked the ship with a sniper rifle from range? Would the bugs and mechs fight it out?
They should. But then you have a psychic ship guarded by dozens of respawning ants instead.
Quote from: Serenity on September 30, 2016, 02:37:05 PM
Yeah, it's certainly a rare thing. I had it happen yesterday when they spawned in an open pocket that I mined out for steel.
Strip mining is the the more common way to see that though. Like here:
https://youtu.be/e-70WA5uaEs?t=433
Oh nice video example, that's very similar to what I am doing except my tunnels were spaced a little further apart and connect on the far end.
Quote from: Britnoth on September 30, 2016, 03:02:35 PM
Quote from: stu89pid on September 30, 2016, 01:58:35 PMWhat would happen if you poked the ship with a sniper rifle from range? Would the bugs and mechs fight it out?
They should. But then you have a psychic ship guarded by dozens of respawning ants instead.
Well, if the bugs kill the mechs, depending on how the map is arranged, you would probably be able to get in range of the ship and plink it down to 0 without aggroing the bugs, although this would take a bit of time with just one sniper rifle.
But now I am very interested in getting a starship troopers defense line setup in my newest colony, it just sounds fun and another the possibilities in Rimworld are endless.
Quote from: stu89pid on September 30, 2016, 01:41:28 PM
It makes sense, but it doesn't meet the intent of the mood system. When people go berzerk, this should be a big risk for the colony. If all you need to do is spend 5 granite to build a temp wall, than this mechanic is not creating the level of problem that the developer intended.
Or you can have your colonists grab wooden logs to beat the berserker down. Or you can shoot him. Berserk isn't meant to be a severe problem as far as I can tell. It's just meant to be a problem you have to respond to. It's really more of a problem for the berserker than the colony. And letting your colonists go berserk is a way to run out of colonists :)
Note that if you snipe enough members of the mortar team they will give up firing shells and will attack your base instead. Maybe this behavior should be added to the bugs. Plink enough of them and they get angry and go out hunting the threat that is plinking them.
(and then get obliterated by turrets :)
Is the good old "easy entrance" considered an exploit? I mean, creating one "free path" to your base full of traps and directly in front of your guns.
I have watched in some videos that sometimes they sap, but if they dont they will all die easily.
Quote from: Shurp on September 19, 2016, 10:22:22 AM
Weird... Seems to me that building a barricade to block in rioting prisoners is a sensible strategy. The only thing "exploity" is that the prisoners give up. They should be willing to dig at the walls (as traders now do)
I dont think this is exploity. Prisoners have no weapons and often they are even stripped out of clothing, it would be very weird that they could take down a steel door, a steel wall or any kind of wall or dool any other than the wood wall/door.
A berserk colonist in the other hand I can see it taking down any kind of doors after some time... Though I think its weird that being berserk they could take any kind of wall besides the wooden one. I mean, you dont take down a steel/marble/slate wall by headbutting it.
--
About the far insect infestation, I dont see it as an exploit either. Its more like a very random thing. Maybe work out a bit more the conditions to have an infestation, like having at least a 3x3 mined room that doesnt "touches" outside. I mean, that it has to be at least another room to make sure that it is inside the mountain. Something like that.
When a poison or psychic ship shows up close to my base and I can't use mortars without wrecking my stuff, I set up turrets and IED around the ship around the ship and then poke it with a sniper rifle. They all pop out and get killed.
Don't know if its an exploit since I do take a lot of psychic trauma or wilted crops when I set up the turrets and sometimes the aliens blow them up and I lose a bit of steel.
A "fix" to this would be to make the aliens pop out and fight regardless of damage to the ship if a colonist gets within turret range.
Quote from: Alenerel on October 12, 2016, 04:16:27 PM
Is the good old "easy entrance" considered an exploit? I mean, creating one "free path" to your base full of traps and directly in front of your guns.
I have watched in some videos that sometimes they sap, but if they dont they will all die easily.
It's an exploit in the sense that raiders should learn "hey this entrance is where all the turrets are, let's try the back door" after a few times.
I would think a possible fix to this would be to add a "cost" layer to the map for other factions that increases when a faction member dies (is injured?) at a location to shift the pathing. Eventually "through the wall" will be cheaper than "through the big open entrance where everyone always dies."
to counter the prison break i put horrible weapons near the prison so when they try to get weapons they are weaker, not stronger.
awful stone shiv : dps 0.48 damage 1 cooldown 125.55
awful stone club: dps 1.23 damage 4 cooldown 219
awful wooden longswords : dps 0.89 damage 2 cooldown 135
i make shivs in the begining, i put club and longswords because of the long cooldown (less eye injury)
if dps is below 1.63 then i have profit
Quote from: PieTau on October 13, 2016, 11:06:11 AM
to counter the prison break i put horrible weapons near the prison so when they try to get weapons they are weaker, not stronger.
awful stone shiv : dps 0.48 damage 1 cooldown 125.55
awful stone club: dps 1.23 damage 4 cooldown 219
awful wooden longswords : dps 0.89 damage 2 cooldown 135
i make shivs in the begining, i put club and longswords because of the long cooldown (less eye injury)
if dps is below 1.63 then i have profit
Now that's a really great tactic.
To help make the comparison, here are the stats for just a fist (assuming the wiki is accurate).
DPS: 3.28 damage: 6 cooldown: 1.83
Edit: Not sure if that cooldown is supposed to be 183 ticks or 1.83 seconds.
That is actually sheer genius. ;D
getting extra food and shels from sieges
Procedure:
wait til they are asleep
take the food and the shels
(being carried be colonist counts as not being in base) so when you see drop pots coming down, let the colonist farthest away drop the food/shels and let him take the ones closest to the centre
repeat until they wake up
after enough runs you can have a lot of stacks laying outside there base.
now you can kill them and get the extra loot
i dont now exactly how far you have to bring it so the game thinks it is gone, it is difficult to see edge or centre of the siege camp
I just found out that you can put sleeping spots on the interaction spots of workbenches to get a free 40% comfort. I get that stools, dining chairs, and armchairs would give the colonist something to sit to improve comfort. But a sleeping spot that you create out of thin air shouldn't do anything, right?
Is this actually an exploit? Now that I think about it, sleeping spots are very weird... They give 40% comfort (vs 0% from sleeping on the ground without sleeping spot), but don't require anything to be build. How does that work?
For the attachments, notice the difference in location of the little white triangle under the comfort bar.
[attachment deleted by admin - too old]
Quote from: Roy on October 20, 2016, 09:08:38 AM
I just found out that you can put sleeping spots on the interaction spots of workbenches to get a free 40% comfort. I get that stools, dining chairs, and armchairs would give the colonist something to sit to improve comfort. But a sleeping spot that you create out of thin air shouldn't do anything, right?
Is this actually an exploit? Now that I think about it, sleeping spots are very weird... They give 40% comfort (vs 0% from sleeping on the ground without sleeping spot), but don't require anything to be build. How does that work?
For the attachments, notice the difference in location of the little white triangle under the comfort bar.
The former sounds like it's clearly a bug.
The latter is probably a case of at least it's a planned place to sleep that's "yours" as opposed to just passing out from exhaustion somewhere. It would probably make more sense if a sleep spot took a small amount of labor to create even if it doesn't take materials and the comfort it provides should be based off of the type of ground.
Quote from: Roy on October 20, 2016, 09:08:38 AM
I just found out that you can put sleeping spots on the interaction spots of workbenches to get a free 40% comfort. I get that stools, dining chairs, and armchairs would give the colonist something to sit to improve comfort. But a sleeping spot that you create out of thin air shouldn't do anything, right?
Is this actually an exploit? Now that I think about it, sleeping spots are very weird... They give 40% comfort (vs 0% from sleeping on the ground without sleeping spot), but don't require anything to be build. How does that work?
For the attachments, notice the difference in location of the little white triangle under the comfort bar.
then why limit with workshop put the entire base full of sleeping spot, they dont slow you down, comfort would never be an isue anymore. for wake-up user it is a real help they get grumpy becuse they can't relax.
When a colonists has had a mild break pigging out...set a prisoner sleeping spot in your food storage to prevent the thief from raiding your precious food.
But then *nobody* can eat.
Hmmm, this would solve my smokeleaf binge problem without having to build a wall.
It won't work for smokeleaf because prison cells don't reserve drugs.
Well there ya go, I'll stick to walls then.
(You can do the same thing to your food stockpile if you want to keep Mr. Hungry Hippo out. Just drop a wall in front of the freezer door.)
Not so much an exploit as a pressing issue with raids : raider skill in weapons, and weapons provided do not seem to scale.
What I mean is, unlike TOWN DEFENSE, a RAID involves CAREFULLY SELECTING several warrior to go and fight. The problem? Often people can come in with barely any skills in combat, destined to die as cannon fodder. I highly doubt a village would send their shop keeper who has almost no combat experience to a fight when others have better qualifications.
Another part of this is high melee people are often given guns, which causes problems too...I very often see people with rifles having 0 shooting, 10 melee. Which means they are an awful shot.
Really, if the raid algorythm was adjusted to mainly use people qualified to fight (one or 2 people who dont fit, like a cook or doctor would be fitting, but generally they should be at least 4 with whatever weapon they have) and people used the weapons they were better with, you would help the problem of raids = wealth, by reducing wealth coming in without reducing threat (2 guys who are crack shots with rifles are MORE dangerous than 3 who cannot operate the gun, yet 3 guys gives much more reward) and also reducing body counts late game.
And besides this, the balance of this could use tweaking anyways. I feel its kinda an exploit, because certain enemies you just KNOW are low priority, like the 0 shooting with sniper guy, compared to the 10 shooting with an assault rifle guy... if this was changed to make the raid SMALLER, but more skilled, it would be more threatening, but have less loot, and less bodies
EDIT: yes , I know this can be interpreted as off topic, but this would, if solved address multiple issues : Raid power being consistent, Raids providing too much loot, raids having too much gore cleanup, colonies becoming armed too fast, cannibalism being very, VERY easy as a source of food (this isn't awful, but if you get a 30 man raid, that enough meat for a LONG time) certain raiders, and some entire raids (depending on rng) being almost useless, and other issues... Yes, it WILL take re-balancing, but it fixes enough I think its worth it.
---------------
As a separate exploit, traders do not fight maddened animals, which makes it very easy to bait traders into being slain... especially easy with angry thrombos, you can easily call a few dozen trades when one is mad, and have them get obliterated, and make your money more than back.
Having a lot of beers and a trade caravan with dromedary or muffalo to haul their stuff. That should suck because their animals will eat your food or w/e they can from your base.... Unless they drink so much beer that they go "hammered" (unconscious) and drop all their expensive stuff.
Just think: prohibiting caravan animal "grazing" would not only solve the aggravation of buffalo wiping out your devilstrand, it would also remove the beer exploit.
Maybe it would be fair to drop a beer stockpile on top of your devilstrand :)
Quote from: Zhentar on September 23, 2016, 04:42:30 PM
Shooting inanimate objects gives you 6xp per shot (incidentally defined in a constant that calls it "practice"). Neutral animals, which carry the risks you mention, gives 50xp per shot. Actual combat gives 240xp per shot. Shooting at incapacitated combat targets still gives the same 240xp, even though the risk level is on par with the inanimate object.
You can shoot at mechanoids around a poison ship with zero risk, zero movement.
Exploit No 25 V2.1
1. Tell your sniper to shoot at a (EDIT: WILD) muffalo.
2. Once muffalo downed, tell your doctor to rescue and tend to its injuries.
3.Release after fully healed.
4. Rinse and repeat until muffalo dies.
Optional:
5. Tell cook to butcher muffalo and cook meals out of its meat.
6. Tell crafter to make muffalo leather dusters. If possible cancel the unfinished duster halfway.
In muffalo dies too quickly then use a charge rifle. Higher risk but higher down chance.
Same can be repeated with thrumbos(with higher risk of course), and gives a much higher reward for your shooters and doctors, as a thrumbo can take up to 100 injuries and are almost impossible to kill before downing them.(However it is too dangeous to release the muffalo back out into the wild again, euthanize them and then get their horn , leather and meat for extra skills and $$$)
The point of this explot is to get bonded, right?
Why leave the duster half completed?
Quote from: Alenerel on November 23, 2016, 09:11:59 PM
The point of this explot is to get bonded, right?
Why leave the duster half completed?
Good point, it'd suck if your pet Muffalo you were using for target practice died. Your doctor would be very unhappy.
Turning the incomplete duster back into leather allows your tailor to get more experience from the same leather. Assuming you have a leather shortage.
Quote from: Wanderer_joins on November 23, 2016, 10:37:47 AM
Quote from: Zhentar on September 23, 2016, 04:42:30 PM
Shooting inanimate objects gives you 6xp per shot (incidentally defined in a constant that calls it "practice"). Neutral animals, which carry the risks you mention, gives 50xp per shot. Actual combat gives 240xp per shot. Shooting at incapacitated combat targets still gives the same 240xp, even though the risk level is on par with the inanimate object.
You can shoot at mechanoids around a poison ship with zero risk, zero movement.
Or use a short bow long range a sleeping animal always miss but free exp
Quote from: Shurp on November 24, 2016, 12:46:00 AM
Quote from: Alenerel on November 23, 2016, 09:11:59 PM
The point of this explot is to get bonded, right?
Why leave the duster half completed?
Good point, it'd suck if your pet Muffalo you were using for target practice died. Your doctor would be very unhappy.
Turning the incomplete duster back into leather allows your tailor to get more experience from the same leather. Assuming you have a leather shortage.
Does it have to be a pet? I thought you could rescue downed wild animals. The operations tab always appears with any animal if they are in an animal sleeping spot.
@alenerel: When the colonist makes the duster they gain crafting skill. By cancelling midway you can reset the amount of work they have to do to make the piece of apparel while saving some resources(I think?) out of the muffalo leather, giving them more time to learn the crafting skill. It's an exploit that can be used very early game with making bows.
EDIT: Here's a video (https://youtu.be/ujgbxqILG2U) to show you how steps 1-4 work (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=17919.msg279750#msg279750). Credit to GrayStillPlays.
Quote from: jmababa on November 24, 2016, 03:28:15 AM
Or use a short bow long range a sleeping animal always miss but free exp
I don't think you get the same exp on a sleeping animal vs a moving target, and once you hit it, you've to move.
Thanks guys! Skills exploit for Alpha 15 V. 2.2 is coming out!
Exploit No 25 V2.2
1. Tell your sniper to shoot at a WILD muffalo. Depending on if you want to further train your medicine or shooting skills take step M2 for medicine or S2 for shooting
M2. Once muffalo downed, tell your doctor to rescue and tend to its injuries. Proceed to step 3
S2. Equip colonist with a pistol(fast firing cycle). Put them at the maximum possible range for the muffalo and tell them to shoot at it. Because the muffalo is technically still considered a "pawn", you still get the skill points as if they are able to move. Proceed until muffalo dies of blood loss or dies of bullets.
3.Release after fully healed.
4. Rinse and repeat until muffalo dies.
Optional:
5. Tell cook to butcher muffalo and cook meals out of its meat.
6. Tell crafter to make muffalo leather dusters. If possible cancel the unfinished duster halfway.
In muffalo dies too quickly then use a charge rifle. Higher risk but higher down chance.
For Medicine: Same can be repeated with thrumbos(with higher risk of course), and gives a much higher reward for your shooters and doctors, as a thrumbo can take up to 100 injuries and are almost impossible to kill before downing them.(However it is too dangeous to release the thrumbo back out into the wild again, euthanize them and then get their horn , leather and meat for extra skills and $$$)
Euthanasia: For an interested passion doctor, they get more than 1000 xp from euthanasia.
For Shooting: It is probably better to use small sized animals like chinchillas or rabbits (Decreases hit chance) and do step 1 by beating them up with bare fists(melee skills). If you are that desperate, set up a dumping stockpile zone in front of the downed animal and fill it with chunks :D
For mechanoids, they do not have blood loss, so they can continue to be in the state of paralysis for years. Therefore, build double sandbags around them as well as hide them under a dark roof, and then put more sandbags around your sandbags. Then cover it up with a roof.
Then cover your colonist with a roof. And put sandbags around them.Then cover that all up with a roof. Et cetera.
Credit: GrayStillPlays
TBH I dont think that rescuing animals to learn medicine isnt an exploit at all. Thats how it worked for hundreds of years irl and it also requires micromanagement.
The only part a bit exploity is that you can heal the animal relatively quickly and hunt it again.
In fact I use the same technique with captured raiders if I dont want them. Peg peg jaw. Uninst peg peg jaw. repeat. It gives massive exp. We could say that this is actually exploity but since we cant study corpses (which would be the proper way) I see this as the equivalent.
Not sure if this is an exploit,
I have noticed that the firefoam poppers once activated foam their surrounding area for a very long time (possibly forever or until cleaned).
I manually activate the poppers in my kill box or around whatever turrets I may be using. I then zone the area accordingly so that the foam never gets cleaned. I find this completely nullifies any fire whatsoever (better than stone floors). This is especially effective against Mechs with inferno cannons since it basically just turns it into a canon. This also seems to help a lot with turrets as it prevents them from ever catching fire or causing a lot of damage when they explode.
this is the biggest exploit ever, you can just make a freezer trap and kill the trade caravan and guess what all the free loot, and not even the faction goodwill decreases.
exploit raiders or manhunter meet door they will attack door open it and click shoot on enemy they'll attack door while you kill them while door open not even a scratch for your colonist or tribesmen
Edit: forgot to say have someone repair door while you do this
Yeah, I've seen that done before. That's just raider logic. So is attacking a random wall so that a roof will fall on top of them and kill them.
Killing carravan "accidentally"
have anyone figure this out yet?
Build a one wall with designated roof above the caravans. Make it so there will be one spot hole next to it. Then your builder deconstruct it(from the safe one hole spot). Boom, roof falls! Repeat until the mufallo's dead. It's an "accident" so they wont get triggered.
it takes some time to do and ruin the game economics so I never do that. Just found the exploit on random occasion.
Bruh, thanks. I really love those killing caravans exploits :D
Tho its a shame that they will be fixed soon
I put wires by my turrents, away from the ones with power, so, I dont have to have colonist go turn them on, I am simply click on them and redirect power.
I managed to kill a caravan in my previous game, and two caravans at the same time my current game.
Previous game - I had a thrumbo running around my base and an NPC caravan of 5 or so wandering too. I waited until the caravan got in between the thrumbo and myself and shot at the mighty beast. It went manhunter and attacked the nearest NPC. 4 of them were taken out and the last one fled (with the thrumbo chasing). After the NPC left the map it came back to my base and walked into a hail of bullets.
Current game - I called in 2 bulk traders that showed up at the same time and hung around my killbox area when I was raided by a group of 20 or so pirates. Lucky for me they were also on the side of my base that let them path into my killbox. The magic happened when a few of the caravan people were wandering in and out of the killbox (entry was via a door) and were attacked outside the killbox by the pirates, causing the rest of them to rush outside to assist. I netted 100 components, assorted food, and a good amount of silver from that fight.
There is definitely a lot to fix about caravans.
You'd probably best wait for A16 to make that assertion.
Take a downed scyther and surround it with sandbags. Then put a roof over it. Tell your colonists to equip pistols and shoot at it from max range.
Because shooting at enemies goves you 400 xp compared to inanimate onjects
Quote from: Spdskatr on November 28, 2016, 04:58:14 PMTake a downed scyther and surround it with sandbags. Then put a roof over it. Tell your colonists to equip pistols and shoot at it from max range.
Because shooting at enemies goves you 400 xp compared to inanimate onjects
Heh. I just hunt ^^' .
BTW, the answer to your last signature question is "Three." =)
Quote from: Bozobub on November 28, 2016, 05:30:18 PM
BTW, the answer to your last signature question is "Three." =)
No, that's the answer to: 'How many answers are there to the question "How many consonants are in the answer to this sentence?"?'
It's AN answer, if you haven't figured that out already.
----
And the downed scyther means you can continue to use it for years and years and years(downed scythers don't die of blood loss and their wounds don't heal). Literally. And gain 400 xp every time. If that isn't an exploit...
Shooting melee enemies from long range and using sniper rifles for their intended purpose is an exploit huh.
Technically a winning strategy as it pertains to the currently only way to "win" the game (the ship), but not major :
you can have cryptosleep casket next to each other (despite being on top of the access circle, which is not allowed) if you place them quickly enough.
Screenshot :
http://i.imgur.com/ppTT2Gk.jpg
As you can see, I'm using way less room than I would otherwise, due to overlapping crytosleep caskets, which is normally not allowed.
Quote from: cmitc1 on November 27, 2016, 10:07:25 PM
I put wires by my turrents, away from the ones with power, so, I dont have to have colonist go turn them on, I am simply click on them and redirect power.
This. More efficient than power switch.
Quote from: Spdskatr on November 28, 2016, 04:58:14 PM
Take a downed scyther and surround it with sandbags. Then put a roof over it. Tell your colonists to equip pistols and shoot at it from max range.
Because shooting at enemies goves you 400 xp compared to inanimate onjects
It doesnt have to be a scyther, it can be a downed turket or other things. if the location isnt good enough put a sleeping spot and rescue the turkey there, then stop rescuing him and shooting him :D
Placing a 1x1 zone of hay/strawberries outside/within killbox to draw animals from the other side of the map all the way to the base seemed like too much of an exploit so I stopped doing it in Alpha 14 so not sure if fixed. Animals shouldn't be able to sense higher grade food from kilometers away.
Sry for my english, guys, not my native language. Several tricks or exploits, found so far
1. Dealing with sieges several ways :
a:) full cave base with fuel generators and trees plantations. Self explanatory, dont forget to dig up to map edge, to funnel heat away
b:) put several single walls all around map, mark zones around as home, turn off firefighting for all colonists.
c:) put cheapest wall all around map edge, just as one big fence
2. Tundra map, tribe plantations : build big room, cover with roofs 75-80% but dont make one big hole, just lots single holes for trees and heat up room with torches. Since it take about one torch for every 3-4 holes, you will get huge surplus in trees and foods. You still can use roofed areas for something else, and room itself have beauty bonus from trees
3. Starting room, no shared room debuff and no outside debuff. Make one big fence on start, put beds all random inside, colonists surprizingly think if room big enough and no roof its probably one of Ritz-Carlton apartaments
4. Ice sheet tribe trick. Just balance thing, not a big deal. If you killed all your pets on start, and all animals on map, you almost guaranteed getting at least one animal spawn each day, probably game counts animals on map and spawn more if there no animals at all
5. Door exploit, you can make colonists insta pass between rooms, without interacting doors at all if you use design like that (red lines show colonists paths)
(http://i.imgur.com/B4tKXyJ.png)
The giant room one is nice... So is the tundra plantation. Only problem is, what about raids? A massive room is going to skyrocket ur wealth, which consequently makes raids harder.
If you build a giant room in the mountain, it's just going to open you to infestations. So I wouldn't consider them exploits, but definitely cool tactics that I would no doubt try out.
I don't know if this has already been reported, but as it seems to me a very important issue I post it:
(http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/103976952083778830/5AAC4C0E3A8DB317E5773B0AADEFFD7E94BC6AD8/)
Raiders would just jump into these deadfall traps. Basically any base can include a long corridor out of deadfall traps and most raids will just fail.
Deadfall traps seem to be too strong, I mean who'd walk right into it?
No one would walk into known deadfall traps just because there is no other open entrance. The raiders should start breaking down walls if your only entrance is filled with known deadfall traps. Unknown traps are a different story. It might be hard to program but if raiders are running down a hallway and two or three unknown traps get triggered they should be smart enough to find another entrance rather than keep heading down that obviously trapped hallway.
Don't know if this is the right thread or not, but the LOOT situation is out of control. Some mechanoids showed up to attack my colony. Immediately afterwards (because Cassandra is bored and throwing a pile of random events at me) an Exotic Goods Caravan shows up and promptly gets slaughtered while all my colonists are in the locker room suiting up for battle.
I got a psychic insanity lance, two lungs, two thrumbo horns, a liver, an AI core, oh, and a Plasteel Large Sculpture. Profit!
I gotta unload all this loot before the next raid shows up or I'm totally screwed :)
I see the Reconnect vs Flick Power exploit remains in place for A16.
Basically instead of using the flick power option (or a power switch) one can turn items on/off by using the reconnect power button to reconnect to a dead piece of conduit. This exploit would be solved easily imo if reconnecting power required the same interaction as flick power. However the reconnect power should remain an option of course because of isolated power networks.
Anyway if this has somehow never been mentioned, now it has!
I haven't built any caravans yet but this came up over on reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/5lcnex/safest_place_for_meat_during_a_heat_wave_pockets/
"...had a heat wave destroy about 800 meat and all 100 of my prepared meals... reloaded a dozen times, but I couldn't fix the issue fast enough... prepare a caravan and packed ALL food & meat, which took like 30 seconds. Right as they're done packing up, cancel the caravan, draft them, and do stuff manually. The characters will run around with 100s of meat in their pockets and none of it spoils."
Also I hate to mention this one myself but it does seem out of wack.
The deep mining scanner can easily be switched on/off without any effect on the deep mining itself. So you can put it on a switch, or flick it on and off manually, for the brief times when you need to find more resources. Then leave it powered off for 99% of the time.
I like this of course, because the power usage is ridiculous, but it also seems weird that this would have such a high power use but not need to be on for deep mining to work. So I am not sure if this is an exploit, but it feels unbalanced. Basically that mining works without the deep scanner being powered.
Quote from: pdxsean on December 31, 2016, 08:13:58 PM
I haven't built any caravans yet but this came up over on reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/5lcnex/safest_place_for_meat_during_a_heat_wave_pockets/
"...had a heat wave destroy about 800 meat and all 100 of my prepared meals... reloaded a dozen times, but I couldn't fix the issue fast enough... prepare a caravan and packed ALL food & meat, which took like 30 seconds. Right as they're done packing up, cancel the caravan, draft them, and do stuff manually. The characters will run around with 100s of meat in their pockets and none of it spoils."
Yeah, there will have to be a broad rework of inventory later. I'm currently using the caravan-cancelling exploit to have my luciferium-addict carry all the luciferium on him, so animals can't accidently eat it.
As for the Deep Mining Scanner, that's the same issue that all power-requiring devices that aren't used 24/7 have, including stoves & sewing tables. I think "turning it off" is only a minor exploit, but I would fix it by making its construction require uranium (like the cryosleep caskets) and removing the power requirement entirely.
Quote from: pdxsean on December 31, 2016, 08:20:34 PM
The deep mining scanner can easily be switched on/off without any effect on the deep mining itself. So you can put it on a switch, or flick it on and off manually, for the brief times when you need to find more resources. Then leave it powered off for 99% of the time.
I like this of course, because the power usage is ridiculous, but it also seems weird that this would have such a high power use but not need to be on for deep mining to work. So I am not sure if this is an exploit, but it feels unbalanced. Basically that mining works without the deep scanner being powered.
I really wouldn't call that an exploit. The power usage is high because you're scanning the entire map, but once you KNOW where something is (not what it is, just where it is) you don't need it because while you're drilling you don't need the scanner to tell you "still there. still there. yep, still there". It's not like the resource is going to move on you.
- You can end a colonist's food or drug binge by setting his bedtime to the current hour. He will finish his smoke or whatever, go to bed, and the binge will end right away. Might not work if his rest bar is already full.
- You can trade resources in far corners of the map by making a zone around them.
- You can keep a colonist or prisoner unconscious for an indefinite period of time by beginning to euthanize him, then cancelling. I don't know if this is an exploit, because it seems like a reasonable thing to be able to do (put someone under with a command) but the way it's done is very "workaround" and doesn't require medicine.
Minor exploit: all pawns standing on a square benefit from a comfy chair there. So if you have four crafting spots all with the same access point you can have four colonists piling into the same chair.
Are these colonists or cats? :)
Quote from: Shurp on January 01, 2017, 08:13:10 AMAre these colonists or cats? :)
If you've played the game, you know the answer is cats.
Right now sleeping enemies won't get up when you move around them. As a good builder can build a room in like five secons, you can build a wooden room around someone and set it on fire while they sleep, or do some other crazy shit like farm siegers for loot that comes down from the skies every day. Works especially well against thrumbos, since there are few of them and the reward is so great. They are basically free stuff right now. It shouldn't work unless the enemy is drunk or something, or at least have a percentage of agroing them.
Yes, enemies wake up if someone nearby gets shot; they should wake up if any construction occurs nearby too.
And since you necro'd this thread, I'd like to add my own exploit note. Assigning a dumping stockpile to the square that your dead colonist is rotting on removes the -10 unburied colonist penalty.
I present to you... The Thrumbo Killer 6000 Mk.2 Lite
Take down thrumbos with ease!
Only for a cheap price of a few hundred stone and 25 wood! (turret is optional)
(https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=17919.0;attach=18154)
[attachment deleted by admin due to age]
FYI TL:DR I didn't read through all 400+ posts...
@Tynan, I have heard from Youtubers (Blitz) and I am sure you already fixed this, but if you put up sufficient lighting it greatly lowers the chance for an infestation.
Also another bug, when you get raiders and you set up blueprints (example a wall) the raiders will attack and try to destroy the blueprint (I think discovered by Yeti (YouTuber).
This is definitely more of a strategy than a tactic, but abandoning building altogether, immediately forming caravan, and leveraging stealth raids makes the game pretty easy to beat. I've done it in 3 hours. I don't think I'm particularly 'good' or anything, rather it's a bit of an exploit. Most of the time is spent just staring at the globe and once the various 'caravan lag' pawn ticking glitches are dealt with you can see that may mean a victory in less than an hour of game time. Some of the odd things that make me think this strategy is an exploit is that I find myself getting around temporary debuffs by marching people through the wilderness & totally depriving them of joy without much consequence while stacking tons of fine / lavish meals and drugs to bring their mood up when they need to raid. Also I've grabbed hundreds of Luciferiums by reloading pirate bases and stealth raiding them repeatedly, which essentially ends the struggle of supplying the caravan. Sometimes the raids are so easy because the pirates congregate on one side of their compound and getting into the storage is as simple as beating down a door, taking the stuff, and leaving with no stealth really involved at all. I at least expected to pay a big price to make the friendly AI launch, and was pretty shocked when I learned it was free. Also the caravans call into question the weight of silver as currency, as compared to the weight and value of Luciferium and other items. Another odd, exploit feeling thing about it is I've given up on medicines entirely as they seem to give no benefit at all to the wounds while the caravan is moving (and it always is with this strat).
I don't know exactly if it's an exploit.
I play in permadeath but sometimes, some events are really too impredictable and unaffordable. Warg manhunter pack appear between my colonists and my base for example.
I just use ctrl-alt-delete, force the game to quit and thanks to the not perfect auto-save, I can resume my game before the bad events.
Oh, and the most common, one colonist trigger opponents then turn around my fighters.
Opponents follow him while fighters shoot at them.
When they decide to attack an other colonist, I just move this one around and again...
Oh, and a other one using transport pod.
I just order to fill a transport pod with simple meal (340 per transport pod then I don't launch it.
So I store 340 meals in one tile without any need of refrigeration.
Just a quickie: is it considered an exploit that you can reap the impressive room bonus twice from the same room if you combine the dining room with the rec room?
Quote from: hwfanatic on January 14, 2017, 01:42:22 PM
Just a quickie: is it considered an exploit that you can reap the impressive room bonus twice from the same room if you combine the dining room with the rec room?
I combine the dormitory, the dining room and the rec room in one very big and very impressive room and it works perfectly.
In my opinion, it's not an exploit.
Looting bases to get unlimited glitt meds/luciferium for free:
Get in, loot, get out, get back in: their stock is renewed instantly
Quote from: NeverPire on January 13, 2017, 05:16:46 PM
I play in permadeath but sometimes, some events are really too impredictable and unaffordable. Warg manhunter pack appear between my colonists and my base for example. I just use ctrl-alt-delete, force the game to quit and thanks to the not perfect auto-save, I can resume my game before the bad events.
You can also go to your saved games directory and just copy the save to another filename. You can do this as often as you like. Then just load the previous save without bothering to exit the game.
Permadeath is a choice... nobody's forcing you to do it. I don't bother because it discourages trying new things. "Hey, let's see if I can take down that centipede with a plasteel gladius... oh, wow, that didn't work. Reload!"
Quote from: hwfanatic on January 14, 2017, 01:42:22 PM
Just a quickie: is it considered an exploit that you can reap the impressive room bonus twice from the same room if you combine the dining room with the rec room?
Imagine Viking dining hall :D
You can bring in a large harvest quickly by making your pawns form a caravan (with everything from the harvest in the caravan), leave the map, then reenter. You can also use this trick to make people incapable of hauling actually haul things.
Preparing a caravan with muffalos and a huge amount of items in less than two minuts.
Order to create a caravan with one colonist, the muffalo and only the heaviest items you want to transport.
Then, create one other caravan with only colonists and all the others items.
Without any muffalos, these colonists will directly pick up items and leave quickly.
Once both caravans in the world map, merge them.
The textile industry is the secret to infinite money with low effort. A medium sized group can focus most of their energy making cotton, and then sell the raw cotton via player made caravans. Each cotton sells for over 2$ (on lower difficulty) and only weighs .03 kg meaning you can easily generate thousands per year and transport them to nearby settlements to exchange for whatever you need.
Quote from: Forfor on January 16, 2017, 04:36:12 AM
The textile industry is the secret to infinite money with low effort. A medium sized group can focus most of their energy making cotton, and then sell the raw cotton via player made caravans. Each cotton sells for over 2$ (on lower difficulty) and only weighs .03 kg meaning you can easily generate thousands per year and transport them to nearby settlements to exchange for whatever you need.
I've been wondering if Corn is more efficient, since it grows slower but produces more in a harvest, meaning less labor spent growing them. Math is 7.25 days for 16 corn at 2.00 per corn, or 4.4 silver per day vs 2.71 days for 5 cloth at 2.80 per cloth, or 5.16 silver per day. Not sure about the price of other crops, strawberries may be better at 2.50 per berry, but I don't know how fast they grow.
Also somewhat of an exploit, placing your colony next to another colony that is located on flat ground (preferably arid shrubland) means you can spend only a few hours travelling to reach them, then instantly teleport back.
The advantage of cotton is that anyone who's good at crafting or refuses to grow things can mass produce parkas which are incredibly value efficient. My excellent plasteel longswords were selling for about 500ish. My mid-quality parkas were selling for over 300.
If you have a good crafter, making cotton for him to work with makes financial sense. But why are you guys forgetting about Smokeleaf? *Everyone* can make them, and at 11s per 0.01kg it beats everything - even silver. In fact, now that I think of it, why am I even selling it? Everyone buys it, you can store 11x the value on a single tile... I should be stockpiling joints and using them to buy what I need.
And seeing as there is no interstellar DEA, why are joints so valuable?
Fair enough. I missed smokeleaf because I try to avoid drug production overall XD
Quote from: Forfor on January 16, 2017, 07:11:45 AM
The advantage of cotton is that anyone who's good at crafting or refuses to grow things can mass produce parkas which are incredibly value efficient. My excellent plasteel longswords were selling for about 500ish. My mid-quality parkas were selling for over 300.
Make alpaca wool T-shirt, much more faster to create than a parca and even a shoddy alpaca wool T-shirt is sold 400
Sniper rifles vs psychic/poison ships. You can fire from out of range and the mechanoids will not come to you if you're firing from max range.
Sniper rifles vs centipedes. You can fire, retreat, fire, retreat, and kill an unlimited number of centipedes using this strategy.
Stripping nearby raiders/escape pod people that are otherwise condemned to death to avoid the "D" on clothing. Maybe not an exploit, but certainly a little weird.
"Did his heart stop beating before or after you got the shirt off?"
"I'm not sure. It was right around the same time."
"No, this is important. I *need* to know this. If you did not get the shirt off him in time, it cuts the value of the shirt by 80%, and anyone who wears this shirt will be perpetually unhappy while they wear it."
"I'm really not sure. Is it THAT important? I mean, he was going to die anyways..."
"But did he die WHILE WEARING the shirt?"
In response to a previous post, parkas are NOT a exploit. They require 130 materials and a ton of work to complete. While they do increase the net value of the materials used (if craftsmanship is positive) you're also wasting a pawn for half a day to do it. That's the equivalent of "going to work and getting paid for it". Making furniture out of wood is much faster, uses more easily obtained resources, and generates more silver per work-point. Additionally, you *always* have a good constructor, whereas you may not have a great tailor.
Quote from: Shurp on January 16, 2017, 07:22:51 AM
If you have a good crafter, making cotton for him to work with makes financial sense. But why are you guys forgetting about Smokeleaf? *Everyone* can make them, and at 11s per 0.01kg it beats everything - even silver. In fact, now that I think of it, why am I even selling it? Everyone buys it, you can store 11x the value on a single tile... I should be stockpiling joints and using them to buy what I need.
And seeing as there is no interstellar DEA, why are joints so valuable?
I find smokeleaf to be weight efficient, but labor intensive compared to growing. Considering I can visit my neighboring colony in about 4h in game time, the labor required for Smokeleaf is much higher.
Hmmm. I generally have my whole colony stop what they're doing at Harvest Time so my fields clear out pretty quickly and I haven't been paying attention to farming labor. But you're right; since grow time per unit for smokeleaf and cotton is about the same, you can get a multiplier by having a good craftsman improve the value. But he has to be tailoring nonstop with an endless supply of cotton for it to really pay off.
I usually have my craftsmen spending their time making power armor instead :)
It's really that a smokeleaf joint is worth like 2 silver more than leaves, doesn't train crafting as much (lots of running back and forth, even if you have stockpiles surrounding the crafting area).
The reason I like corn is it's only growing and hauling (and hauling can be skipped or abused via caravan forming). Your good crafters can still do whatever is most profitable and don't really factor into this sort of work. I grow enough cotton for my crafters, but I have about 150 tiles of corn per grower.
EDIT: Berries require a similar amount of work, but is worth more than cotton per plant, comes up at around 5.6 silver per plant. Still takes more labor than corn, though.
With infinite silver, a bunch of trained dogs can really clear a field, and they can feed off the infinite corn. 0 animal filth from them means that they don't make extra work for my cleaners.
EDIT: Seems like the proper hauling abuse to haul lightweight items is:
1) Form caravan, taking everyone (or just a few people if there are only a few thousand units to haul).
2) Select all of the good you are trying to haul, such as Corn.
3) Once all colonists have picked up the items, draft them.
4) Move colonists to stockpile.
5) Cancel forming caravan.
6) Undraft.
Your pawns will dump all that they were carrying onto the ground around them, which should be the stockpile area.
Seems like raw food should really weigh 0.05kg at least, since a meal is 0.35kg. At the current 0.03kg, we have quantum stoves that add mass to the meal.
Quote from: NeverPire on January 16, 2017, 09:10:48 AM
Quote from: Forfor on January 16, 2017, 07:11:45 AM
The advantage of cotton is that anyone who's good at crafting or refuses to grow things can mass produce parkas which are incredibly value efficient. My excellent plasteel longswords were selling for about 500ish. My mid-quality parkas were selling for over 300.
Make alpaca wool T-shirt, much more faster to create than a parca and even a shoddy alpaca wool T-shirt is sold 400
Then there's the matter of storage efficiency. Parkas fit the most material to a single warehouse square. Selling t-shirts puts more burden on your constructors.
Quote from: b0rsuk on January 17, 2017, 02:23:55 AM
Then there's the matter of storage efficiency. Parkas fit the most material to a single warehouse square. Selling t-shirts puts more burden on your constructors.
With the kind of storage I show in this picture, there isn't any problems.
Therefore, a lot of players since A16 have decided to establish their bases near an allied base and can so almost drectly sell their production.
I precise all the storages in this picture are composed of a few wood pillars (walls) and a roof, no more and they are reachable from anywhere.
[attachment deleted by admin due to age]
Quote from: Shurp on January 16, 2017, 06:32:32 PM
Hmmm. I generally have my whole colony stop what they're doing at Harvest Time so my fields clear out pretty quickly and I haven't been paying attention to farming labor. But you're right; since grow time per unit for smokeleaf and cotton is about the same, you can get a multiplier by having a good craftsman improve the value. But he has to be tailoring nonstop with an endless supply of cotton for it to really pay off.
I usually have my craftsmen spending their time making power armor instead :)
I do the same thing, I set all my colonist to farming and suspend all bills until after harvest. Production at benches is for the winter months. :P I do have to say, I've been making yayo as my main source of income. Almost all trader types take it, and it is decently priced for how easy it is to make.
Worst is sniper/hunter rifles and kiting everything in the game, especially caterpillars and scythers etc.
But ...
Because of the ease of taking advantage of exploits making the game easy, you slowly get threats which are so ridiculously strong you can ONLY overcome them by taking advantage of exploits, and then the underlying design is broken.
example: If you remove snipers/hunting rifles from the game or nerf them, a couple of scythers or a single caterpillar will total your colony.
I remember the times I got a small mechanid assault on my tribals before they got sniper rifles or turrets. That was instant game over.
One suggestion is to include another type of assaulting 'faction', which assaults with a swarm of small, individually weak units. Difficult to balance tho.
Quote from: Lightzy on January 17, 2017, 05:11:55 PM
example: If you remove snipers/hunting rifles from the game or nerf them, a couple of scythers or a single caterpillar will total your colony.
I remember the times I got a small mechanid assault on my tribals before they got sniper rifles or turrets. That was instant game over.
just wait with 3-4 People behind a Corner and let the scyther come around.
when it aims at you (warmup time) you own it in close range with 1 volley of Charge riffles.
no injuries.
the scythers always appear first at your base (movement Speed)
i rarely use sniper rifles in my games and have not really a Problem with not using it.
Quote from: Lightzy on January 17, 2017, 05:11:55 PM
One suggestion is to include another type of assaulting 'faction', which assaults with a swarm of small, individually weak units. Difficult to balance tho.
Tribal raids are exactly you are proposing.
Quote from: Grishnerf on January 17, 2017, 05:55:09 PM
just wait with 3-4 People behind a Corner and let the scyther come around.
when it aims at you (warmup time) you own it in close range with 1 volley of Charge riffles.
no injuries.
the scythers always appear first at your base (movement Speed)
i rarely use sniper rifles in my games and have not really a Problem with not using it.
I'm saying they're a problem before sniper or hunting rifles and your solution is mass charge rifles, ok. Good job.
Quote from: NeverPire on January 17, 2017, 07:21:16 PM
Tribal raids are exactly you are proposing.
[/quote
No, tribal raids are exactly what YOU THINK I'm proposing. I'm talking about much more numerous, small threats. Tribal raids only get big towards endgame, if you have like 20 colonists and a map-sized colony. Before that they're pretty small. Small enough for like, a killbox of 5-7 turrets and some traps to handle. And before THAT, they're the same size as pirate raids.
Quote from: Lightzy on January 18, 2017, 09:27:44 AM
No, tribal raids are exactly what YOU THINK I'm proposing. I'm talking about much more numerous, small threats. Tribal raids only get big towards endgame, if you have like 20 colonists and a map-sized colony. Before that they're pretty small. Small enough for like, a killbox of 5-7 turrets and some traps to handle. And before THAT, they're the same size as pirate raids.
Let's think about players who don't use any kilbox before asking for more numerous raids.
Quote from: Lightzy on January 18, 2017, 09:27:44 AM
Quote from: Grishnerf on January 17, 2017, 05:55:09 PM
just wait with 3-4 People behind a Corner and let the scyther come around.
when it aims at you (warmup time) you own it in close range with 1 volley of Charge riffles.
no injuries.
the scythers always appear first at your base (movement Speed)
i rarely use sniper rifles in my games and have not really a Problem with not using it.
I'm saying they're a problem before sniper or hunting rifles and your solution is mass charge rifles, ok. Good job.
it was just an example.
it works the same with shotguns or assault rifles.
you just abuse the warmup time of the scyther behind a Corner in Close range.
just your Statement, that without sniper rifles you have no Chance against few scyther made me laugh, thats all.
A few plasteel traps (2-3 max per scyther) are enough to kill them and the time centipedes come, you have already rearmed your traps.
Also a non-argument, because you can spare plasteel for traps you're probably not in a big problem to defend against raids anymore.
Though personally I think stuff like caterpillars should simply smash traps apart rather than get injured
You do not need plasteel even. Regular steel traps have a good chance to kill the schyter with one hit. Not once I was arming my men to defend against mechs only to notice, that I have a bunch of time until centipeeds arrive due to schyters being beheaded by the traps
Quote from: Lightzy on January 19, 2017, 04:25:13 AM
Also a non-argument, because you can spare plasteel for traps you're probably not in a big problem to defend against raids anymore.
Though personally I think stuff like caterpillars should simply smash traps apart rather than get injured
Rock traps work too, but you need twice more traps, it's all.
Quote from: Shurp on January 16, 2017, 07:22:51 AM
If you have a good crafter, making cotton for him to work with makes financial sense. But why are you guys forgetting about Smokeleaf? *Everyone* can make them, and at 11s per 0.01kg it beats everything - even silver. In fact, now that I think of it, why am I even selling it? Everyone buys it, you can store 11x the value on a single tile... I should be stockpiling joints and using them to buy what I need.
And seeing as there is no interstellar DEA, why are joints so valuable?
I too am a fan of selling joints. They just have so much going for them, and I feel they're a little bit exploity. Here's why.
1) It's easy. Joints are labor-intensive, yes... but it's bottom-rung unskilled labor almost anybody can do. If you have a Grower with 4 skill (and I hope you do) and anyone physically capable of crafting and hauling then you can start your own smokeleaf farm. Unlike most other options which require some level of skill, the barrier to entry to begin cranking out joints is so low you have to be careful you don't trip on it. Even tribals can do it from day one.
2) It's free. The only cost to setting up a smokeleaf farm is space - You need space for the farm, space for the stockpile, and space for the crafting spots. So, roughly the same as for any industry. However, you need nothing else - Other industries might get you more money for the work unit, but other industries also require things like power or steel or components to even start them. It's hard to go wrong with free.
3) It's convenient. Joints might as well have 'legal tender' written on every one because every caravan will buy them. You can use them in place of silver for most intents and purposes. Again, you can make more money per work unit by selling armchairs or parkas or even corn I hear, but it's much harder finding someone to buy it. With joints any old caravan or trader who shows up will be happy to relieve you of them until they run out of silver. This makes it very easy to amass huge sums of silver for the things you really want to buy.
4) It's useful. You know what one of the nice things about having tons of smokeleaf on hand is? Mental breaks aren't that big of a problem anymore. I forbid drugs to everyone so they don't burn through my stash, but I can authorize a hit or two in the event someone's on the verge of a breakdown. This gives me a nice bonus while pursuing economic security that most other crafts don't provide.
I've yet to find another good money-making method that offers as much as smokeleaf does. It might not be the best option in every single category, but unlike other trades which have advantages and drawbacks (beer has to be climate-controlled, armchairs and clothing tie up a high-skill pawn, corn is hard to sell, flake/yayo need expensive drug labs, etc) smokeleaf only has one drawback - high labor time - that's easily mitigated by the fact it's something all but the most useless colonist is capable of helping with. All in all, it just seems like the best general choice for economic independence.
I forget if this has been mentioned, but it bears repeating if so. If you have a colonist you want to get rid of that is a loved one or relative of another colonist and you don't want to incur the mood debuff for their death, you can tell them to form a caravan and settle a new colony next door then immediately abandon it. The pawns you sent there vanish without technically dying so nobody in your main colony gets upset about it.
I used his trick in my sea ice challenge playthrough when I let Engie's husband join the colony but he had an annoying voice, couldn't haul, clean or do medicine, had no useful skills, and got himself hooked on Flake immediately.
To throw up a quick firebreak, you can construct stone walls and just leave the placed stone without finishing construction.
Regarding smokeleaf, it's good universal currency, but if you are using your own caravans to trade, all colonies will buy, and for most of the game you are hard pressed to produce 10+k silver of smokeleaf a season. If you can, it's harder to find useful things to spend that silver on, although I've been dumping mine into luci.
well I found that making a single square road around my base and covering it whit dead falls spikes work really well.
since the rode got a movement of 100% enemy's naturally want to walk om it
i don't really need to cover it completely whit trap. and if the wall of your base is 2 thick, grenade raiders will stop after destroying 1 wall and continue walking on traps. I even made the roof to cover the dead fall traps. this way weapons drooped wont deteriorate
I regularily had grenadiers bomb their way through thicker walls than that in A15. Anyway, I think that was removed in A16 and they only mine walls now.
Quote from: Thyme on January 22, 2017, 03:01:27 PM
I regularily had grenadiers bomb their way through thicker walls than that in A15. Anyway, I think that was removed in A16 and they only mine walls now.
I already have grenadiers attacking a three thick wall with grenades even if a path with traps was clear not far in A16.
Well this is only an exploit within the phi client, but seeing as how phi is very wide spread I may as well tell people about it. If you have a friend online with the phi client you can save the game, send them any number of your resources, then reload the save and repeat for an easy duplication method.
You can also turn devmode on, spawn any number of items and turn it off again, but that's none of my business.
PS: Mods don't count, as these thread is for vanilla exploits. Tynan can't possibly be responsible for other peoples work. ;)
Quote from: Thyme on January 22, 2017, 03:01:27 PM
I regularily had grenadiers bomb their way through thicker walls than that in A15. Anyway, I think that was removed in A16 and they only mine walls now.
They always blow through walls. Which is annoying. Even without "advanced tactics".
With traps/turrets being so ridiculously killy, I suppose this was a must, but a better idea would be to somehow limit traps/turrets (1-3 use traps, ammo upkeep for turrets)
If a turret is behind deep water and there's no path to it, raiders will not fire at it, even if it's only a couple of tiles away. Especially if the attackers are sappers the turret just fires away while the raiders mill around and die.
Shooting any member of a sapper raid causes everyone in the raid to stop digging and mill around aimlessly.
Decoy doors.
Place a bunch of doors randomly around the map. When raiders come they will scatter to attack doors randomly. A big raider group will break up into small groups and individuals that can be easily dispatched.
Mod edit (Calahan) @ slamo - I have merged your three posts into one to avoid you infringing upon forum rule #10. Please can you edit your existing post in the future rather than creating multiple successive posts. Thank you.
Quote from: slamo on January 23, 2017, 03:18:42 AM
Decoy doors.
Place a bunch of doors randomly around the map. When raiders come they will scatter to attack doors randomly. A big raider group will break up into small groups and individuals that can be easily dispatched.
Mod edit (Calahan) @ slamo - I have merged your three posts into one to avoid you infringing upon forum rule #10. Please can you edit your existing post in the future rather than creating multiple successive posts. Thank you.
This combined with trapped roads makes for the perfect Sniper Nest
T TT T T
TWDWT
TS S T
To block fire wthout any materials, simply a line of graves.
Quote from: NeverPire on January 26, 2017, 01:00:21 PM
To block fire wthout any materials, simply a line of graves.
This is true, graves should spread fire and not deconstruct. Since you buried the body, even if it is on fire, the fire will just go through
Quote from: Listen1 on January 26, 2017, 01:18:28 PM
Quote from: NeverPire on January 26, 2017, 01:00:21 PM
To block fire wthout any materials, simply a line of graves.
This is true, graves should spread fire and not deconstruct. Since you buried the body, even if it is on fire, the fire will just go through
Only if it's flowers on there.
You can also do this with stone wall blueprints if you have materials. Can cancel afterwards for all resources back.
Quote from: Pushover on January 26, 2017, 08:59:30 PM
You can also do this with stone wall blueprints if you have materials. Can cancel afterwards for all resources back.
Graves are faster (two tiles directly blocked instead of one) and you can also use only blueprints.
Graves shouldn't spread fire. It's soil with (if) a dead body one to two meters deep underground.
To stop fires I simply cut all plants (3 tiles wide). This is mostly grass which doesn't take long, combined with natural choke points it's done in no thyme.
With the difference than these graves can be used so I kill two birds with one stone.
Extreme Low Temperatures living is very exploitable in my option say -75 and lower winter temps.
Raids can be laugh event able when 10 of their score drop before attacking, then First guy I down sends them all running.
I never starve on ice sheets as every Raiders, and caravans just freeze walking to and form my colony. I can always feed my Colonist a steady diet of fine meals made with rice and people.
Its nice of them to bring me all of their silver and guns like some kind of Cargo Pods event though. But How did they even get to my colony just to die in less then a game hour.
I explore a cheep solution in this post. https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=30000.msg305225#msg305225 (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=30000.msg305225#msg305225)
Quote from: NeverPire on January 13, 2017, 05:16:46 PM
I don't know exactly if it's an exploit.
I play in permadeath but sometimes, some events are really too impredictable and unaffordable. Warg manhunter pack appear between my colonists and my base for example.
I just use ctrl-alt-delete, force the game to quit and thanks to the not perfect auto-save, I can resume my game before the bad events.
Oh, and the most common, one colonist trigger opponents then turn around my fighters.
Opponents follow him while fighters shoot at them.
When they decide to attack an other colonist, I just move this one around and again...
if you rage quit what is then the purpose of permadeath? If you are going to do that you should just go and play with permadeath disabled
Quote from: FreyaMaluk on January 27, 2017, 07:21:55 AM
Quote from: NeverPire on January 13, 2017, 05:16:46 PM
I don't know exactly if it's an exploit.
I play in permadeath but sometimes, some events are really too impredictable and unaffordable. Warg manhunter pack appear between my colonists and my base for example.
I just use ctrl-alt-delete, force the game to quit and thanks to the not perfect auto-save, I can resume my game before the bad events.
Oh, and the most common, one colonist trigger opponents then turn around my fighters.
Opponents follow him while fighters shoot at them.
When they decide to attack an other colonist, I just move this one around and again...
if you rage quit what is then the purpose of permadeath? If you are going to do that you should just go and play with permadeath disabled
Hey NeverPire plays a softer Ironman nothing wrong with that. It is an exploit permadeath is a control to keep us form going back. If you can get around its not serving its function. I'm for a setting to make AutoSaves less of a cushion closer to how NeverPire plays.
There are several ways to get around permadeath, both in RimWorld and other games that offer this game mode. And I am very sure that Tynan won't, even if he could, do anything that interferes with the functioning of the operating system or the computer itself.
So if anyone expects Tynan to disable the ctrl-alt-delete function, or disable the reset/power switch, or stop the O/S from launching task manager, or anything like this. And no Tynan isn't going to visit everyone's house and glue all their plugs into the socket and their power switches to "on" either. Then you are going way way way outside the definition of "exploit strategies" that Tynan is looking for. If a player wants to get around permadeath then they will, and no game developer in their right mind is going to interfere with some of the options available (let alone the options they have no ability to control).
So can we please get back on the topic of actual exploits in the game, and not the various ways of avoiding permadeath, or other matters relating to it (which in itself is an entirely voluntary game mode).
I mentioned this on reddit, but I'll say it here too:
If you have a colony adjacent to somewhere you can send a caravan, you can haul infinite weight into your base. To reproduce this, settle next to an outlander town, send 1 guy to it, and buy as much steel as you possibly can. You can have 500kg of steel on one guy. If you try to move anywhere, you can't, but since you can instantly enter your own colony from any bordering hex you can transport that 500kg.
Once the colonist does enter, he goes straight into "unloading inventory", dragging that entire 500kg of steel to the stockpile in one go. Quite heroic, carrying over 10x his alleged capacity, and at full speed!
The most obvious solution is to introduce a travel time into base like there is to enter a trade spot. Even a small travel time would be enough to block moving with too much weight.
Using chickens to delay mechanoids attack for days.
Mechanoids attack slowly, I simply push some of my chickens in a area just before my gates. Mechanoids try to kill them and, especially when chickens are sleeping, fail 99% of the time due to their small size and the fact that mechanoids always stop at the max range.
It concentrates the raid then with some brawlers and a EMP mortar, I kill all of them without any risk.
PS : Sorry Calahan for the permadeath commentary, it's a old post when I didn't really understand what an exploit means.
Quote from: Lord_Orion on January 27, 2017, 07:53:39 AM
Quote from: FreyaMaluk on January 27, 2017, 07:21:55 AM
Quote from: NeverPire on January 13, 2017, 05:16:46 PM
I don't know exactly if it's an exploit.
I play in permadeath but sometimes, some events are really too impredictable and unaffordable. Warg manhunter pack appear between my colonists and my base for example.
I just use ctrl-alt-delete, force the game to quit and thanks to the not perfect auto-save, I can resume my game before the bad events.
Oh, and the most common, one colonist trigger opponents then turn around my fighters.
Opponents follow him while fighters shoot at them.
When they decide to attack an other colonist, I just move this one around and again...
if you rage quit what is then the purpose of permadeath? If you are going to do that you should just go and play with permadeath disabled
Hey NeverPire plays a softer Ironman nothing wrong with that. It is an exploit permadeath is a control to keep us form going back. If you can get around its not serving its function. I'm for a setting to make AutoSaves less of a cushion closer to how NeverPire plays.
I never said Tynan has to control this exploit, did I?...
What I said was that if you atl+ctr when the game gets "unfair" or "difficult," what is then the purpose of a permadeath run? I'm not expecting Tynan to actually fix this exploit, I'm just giving my personal opinion on the matter from a gamer point of view. Besides, I didn't bring this particular example to this forum, I just commented on it.
Quote from: NeverPire on January 27, 2017, 12:09:28 PM
Using chickens to delay mechanoids attack for days.
Mechanoids attack slowly, I simply push some of my chickens in a area just before my gates. Mechanoids try to kill them and, especially when chickens are sleeping, fail 99% of the time due to their small size and the fact that mechanoids always stop at the max range.
It concentrates the raid then with some brawlers and a EMP mortar, I kill all of them without any risk.
PS : Sorry Calahan for the permadeath commentary, it's a old post when I didn't really understand what an exploit means.
This works for every type of raid really... sappers and grenadiers killing themselves while trying to murder all your chickens is hilarious. xD
When there's a delayed raid or a siege, they don't decide to attack until a certain number of them are DEAD. So when I send a colonist to harass them with a survival rifle, each of the raiders takes a turn getting shot at. I wound as many raiders as possible. Then, when it's time for attack, the alive fraction of the original are limping, have shaky hands or can't see. If I'm able to equip more than one long range colonist, they often take so much damage in the final chase that they run away before reaching my colony. In the end, I'm able to kill several invaders wound others, and rout the rest without exchanging fire.
Quote from: FreyaMaluk on January 28, 2017, 10:09:51 AM
Quote from: NeverPire on January 27, 2017, 12:09:28 PM
Using chickens to delay mechanoids attack for days.
This works for every type of raid really... sappers and grenadiers killing themselves while trying to murder all your chickens is hilarious. xD
It doesn't work well for classic raids because any brawler can kill chickens easily, while receiving some friendly fire of course.
Quote from: b0rsuk on January 30, 2017, 02:51:49 AM
When there's a delayed raid or a siege, they don't decide to attack until a certain number of them are DEAD. So when I send a colonist to harass them with a survival rifle, each of the raiders takes a turn getting shot at. I wound as many raiders as possible. [...]
I was doing it wrong all the time! Always thought it's best to simply kill as many as possible. Though, when raided by preparing raiders, a portion of them will chase your sharp shooters when they're under fire.
Double-Farming:Crops of cannot be planted on any tiles adjacent to trees. However, if you plant the trees AFTER sowing your crops, they will both grow side-by-side. You can grow 60-70% intact fields of crops between freshly planted trees to nearly double the productivity of farmland. Some micromanagement is required since the default tree placement is dumb, and you cannot replant crops without clearing the trees (so long-growing crops are ideal), but it's worth it when suitable farmland is scarce.
...It is also clearly an exploit, since it gets around the prohibition on planting crops next to trees and making tree-farming "free". Not quite free since it does take some of the land and you can't replant until after harvest-time, but it still lets you get more out of your land than was likely intended.
edit: have a picture! (This is part of the exploit report and not just me crying out for attention. Honest!)Quote from: Hans Lemurson on January 31, 2017, 12:48:53 AM
Here is a picture of my glorious fuel-farm and its double-cropping exploits. It is recovering from a fuel shortage caused by my failed attempt to expand the operation.
(http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/169284679330350427/A5E5474E7B72D4E0F45E067E4F881267E8278CE8/)
Here we can see Poplars growing happily among Potatoes and Devil-Strand. The trees in the potato-patch were planted randomly by the pawns, and the ones in the Devil-Strand were planted under my firm and direct guidance. The random-pattern has 24 trees in a plot, but the carefully-ordered patterns in other plots have 30 trees.
Growing multiple crops was common back in the days of my grandparents. Nowadays, oddly, it's illegal. It was done for the reasons Hans mentioned: Productivity because farmland was "scarce" (Farmers had much less farmland, they had to grow that way). I don't really see it as an exploit, as RimWorld is a harsh place (and it takes a lot of micro). Up to Tynan to decide. ;)
Quote from: Tynan on March 21, 2016, 04:46:51 PM
I just figured out how to kill the infestation bugs without a real fight. Just dig a long tunnel and shoot them from a distance with the survival rifle. Easy. I'm pretty sure some of you figured this out before me too!
So let me just request that if you find an exploit strategy, please report it. These kinds of things are basically bugs, and they break the game (even if people sort of "like" them, they harm the overall experience). So please report them!
I'd love to hear about any exploits you know of in this thread. Are there other no-risk ways to defeat infestations or sieges? The ones I know of are:
- Shoot infestation bugs from long range
- Open the roof and let infestation bugs freeze
- Shoot siegers with sniper rifles (until they attack)
Sometimes when the invaders do siege they will seek iron on the map, and often they try to pick up iron from places near their colony in groups of 2 people, the unbalanced is that they do not attack you, so you can easily kill them and Wait for them to come again and again until they decide to attack your colony
Sorry if i made any mistake,I translate this from portuguese
Thanks for the info everyone. These reports are useful.
I don't think we can fix them all but I'm try to grab the most important and fixable ones.
One note: Please try to only post exploit reports. Please do NOT post:
-Discussions about what is or isn't an exploit
-Ideas to solve exploits or discussions thereof
-Low-effort "me too" posts
Thanks!
How to render ancient cryosleep caskets toothless:
(http://wstaw.org/m/2017/02/05/coward2_png_750x750_q85.jpg)
By the way the scarabs at the bottom are peaceful - might be a bug. Not only they don't attack the guy who came out of the casket, but even my colonists.
From another thread. Pretty cunning:
Quote from: TaurecI order often two ore more caravans at same time, when they are hostile together. They fight on my market place. I can get their stuff, heal the wounded and become either new colonists or better standing to the factions. *g*
A fairly simple and
natural fix would be trade caravans from hostile factions trade insults but not shoot each other.
Quote from: b0rsuk on February 05, 2017, 09:48:59 AM
By the way the scarabs at the bottom are peaceful - might be a bug. Not only they don't attack the guy who came out of the casket, but even my colonists.
It has already happened in one of my games so I think it's not a bug. You can even tame them but they don't breed.
In my knowledge, it's the only way to get tamed scarabs.
The strange thing is that cryo people have scarab bites scars and wounds but scarabs don't attack them.
You can easily exploit that if you want by injuring some of scarabs and let them fight cryo people.
I was watching Rhadamant's play through and noticed that if you dig out an area where rock and deep water meet you can shoot from the outcropping without the AI actually firing back at you.
A lone colonist with a personal shield is nigh invincible in the face of charge blaster & minigun centipedes, as long as they're kept at a sufficient range. This by itself makes it easy to use a decoy to split off centipedes from a raid. But the personal shield at least prevents them from dealing damage to the centipedes.... or does it?
(http://i.imgur.com/tq2enpT.png)
Just line 'em up and let them take each other out (well, not all of them, but good enough).
I think smart Micromanagement does not count as an exploit :)
Since everybody can become a victim to friendly fire.
And sometimes the slugs get lucky, two or three hits from a salvo can ruin your day.
It's not something I would really be inclined to call an exploit either, but Tynan's OP makes it pretty clear that he wants to hear about tactics that significantly mitigate combat risk (and a few posts up makes it clear he's not interested in arguments about what to call those tactics).
In that screenshot, Arseny is bleeding because he did take a hit or two while running around to switch which centipede was shooting which. But even injured he could outrun them and wait for his shield to recharge before resume encouraging friendly fire.
It's an exploit because - repeating what I've heard - you're exploiting the fact that friendly fire in this game is deadlier that direct fire. If you're putting lots of rounds in the air and there's an ally on the way to target, he will take more hits than an enemy would take with unobscured line of fire. If this holds true, and my own experience suggests it does - provoking a centipede to shoot another is more effective than directly shooting a centipede.
So the exploit would be, if I started shooting at the tile behind the enemy to get more kills =
My shielded melee dude took out a 6 man grenadier squad that way today.
Rushed the one with the triple launcher, and was the only survivor in a six tile radius.
Still downed, but no permanent damage :)
How to get around "dumb labor":
I just shot up a siege and now there's all this steel lying around. Erisen refuses to do "dumb labor". But if I tell her to go build a solar generator she'll happily pick up the steel and haul it back to base. I just have to remember to cancel the build job when she gets there. (Someone else can carry it the last 5 feet to the stockpile.)
Too bad I can't think of any way to get her to carry the packaged survival meals instead.
Easy Shrup!
Draft Erison and move him to the steel
Start a caravan
Tell Erison to pick up said steel
Redraft Erison
Move Erison to the desired drop off location
Go into Erison's inventory and drop the Steel
That is a big exploit with caravan's right now!
Quote from: Jstank on February 08, 2017, 09:00:15 PM
Easy Shrup!
Draft Erison and move him to the steel
Start a caravan
Tell Erison to pick up said steel
Redraft Erison
Move Erison to the desired drop off location
Go into Erison's inventory and drop the Steel
That is a big exploit with caravan's right now!
To be honest, everyone should be able to do hauling. I mean, they can carry stuff when on caravan at all times. Not to mention that when they are building stuff they are hauling.
While it might add some to the flavor of the game (and some silly stories), it causes way too many problems and exploits.
Another problem: pawns carrying things while on Caravan and then holding something in their hands while hauling.
Haven't read all the thread, but here's my five pesos.
1. Get some money to buy an artifact, that drives crazy (or downs) anyone on the map.
2. Use it on some wealthy caravan – works especially nice if the pawn has another one artifact + a lot of loot.
3. Yep, the reputation gets worse, but there's enough cookies to sell, so it could be compensated by a bribe.
I did not wanted to post here. Obvious reasons. Eh.
- research ship reactor
- build ship reactor
- build walls around it 1 tile away
- build roof
=>Power under the roof. Like geo power but placed where you want it.
- make killbox
- place firefoams in crossfire area
- throw molotov when raided
=> better than rock chunks and provides no protection for attackers
- place bill for sniper rifle
- wait for >50 work left
- click on unfinished rifle and cancel it
=> crafting training & no material wasted
- surround base with 2 lines of graves
- fire can't burn graves
=> fire proof perimeter
Quote from: taha on February 09, 2017, 10:52:37 AM
I did not wanted to post here. Obvious reasons. Eh.
- research ship reactor
- build ship reactor
- build walls around it 1 tile away
- build roof
=>Power under the roof. Like geo power but placed where you want it.
- make killbox
- place firefoams in crossfire area
- throw molotov when raided
=> better than rock chunks and provides no protection for attackers
- place bill for sniper rifle
- wait for >50 work left
- click on unfinished rifle and cancel it
=> crafting training & no material wasted
- surround base with 2 lines of graves
- fire can't burn graves
=> fire proof perimeter
1. Hardly an exploit. Ship reactor is massively overpriced for just energy.
2. Eh, well, I'd call it creative use of mechanics, and not an exploit. Would it work that way, anyways? :P
3. Canceling a project in progress does waste material. Check how much you get back when you do so.
4. This is kind of an exploit since graves don't cost anything. You can do similar thing by covering the ground with concrete (or anything else). Think graves should be able to get
overgrown by plants, so these plants can burn. Arguably,
full graves should overgrow faster... :V (kind of fertile ground, eh?)
Graves being overgrown could add another thing pawn could do - take care of graves of their beloved ones .-. (these pesky raiders can rot, tho. :V)
@Perq Lol, what exactly are you going to use Uranium for? No one builds ships anymore anyway. Our buddy Charles Whitman will take us to Glitword. :P (He even have a van. And cookies.)
Love the "creative use" thingie. Thx.
Mass meal production-
-make dispenser blueprint and 3 hopper blueprints side by side
-cancel dispenser and replace with stove, having the middle hopper lined up on the stove's interaction spot
- build objects and place a 5x5 restriction zone around the entire production area
-invert restriction and have everyone except the cook in this zone
-set bill make simple meal forever/until you have x/, radius very small, drop on floor
-have a meal storage outside production zone (in cooler/on chairs with table)
this abuses the mechanic of a pawn accessing an adjacent hopper to get material for cooking without moving
hoppers by themselves can also be used to "override hauling" as cooking is a higher job priority, to get raw food to critical areas
i personally see it as a "feature" and would like to see hoppers reworked for easier placement
Quote from: Perq on February 10, 2017, 02:49:45 AM
- surround base with 2 lines of graves
- fire can't burn graves
=> fire proof perimeter
Or you could just use the Cut Plants order when threatened by fire. But have fun digging your ditches all day!
Plants don't grow on graves. So graves are a *permanent* firebreak, unlike cutting plants which you have to keep cutting.
I don't have to keep cutting it. I only have to cut it once in front of the advancing sea of fire. Flashstorm is quite rare, and you can see incendiary mortars coming too.
You can also just make a single tile of concrete around your base. 1 steel a piece and you are fire-proof.
My exploits:
1. No need to deal with poison/psychic ships - place 15-20 IED mines around them, shoot the ship, and you have a ton of dead centipedes. No hassle and lots of platsteel/steel from disassembly at the cost of silver/ai core/ scyther corpses being potentially destroyed in the blast.
Suggestion - any movement in a 2-tile radius of the ship will cause the robots to come out. This will still allow you set up defenses but get too close and you better be ready...
2. Popping in and out of doors to deal with manhunters. They will attack the door but give up after awhile and just wander. Stronger animals can destroy the doors (even platsteel)
Suggestion - Have animals try to break in a little bit longer each attempt. If they attack now for 15 seconds after you go in they should attack for 30 seconds. Won't 100% solve this, but will make it more annoying and less viable to do the pop-in/pop-out strategy.
You can also just cut the grass and put 2 tiles of chunks on top so they don't grow back. But anyway, back on topic.
even more exploity you could just build wooden floor ..
Social Exploit i just found.
If you have an anesthetized colonist and tell that colonist to drop their weapon, they will NOT drop their weapon and will become "rescuable." You can repeat this as much as you want tuntil the anesthetic wears off....for 1 medicine per colonist, you can get a colony wide +15 "rescued me" social impact with each other colonist.
Reported this on bugs.
Exactly.
Exploit: If you target a door with Molotov's cocktail enough times, you will eventually miss and fling it to the other side. Useful for when the bugs decide to drop in.
Just found this out by accident. I often raise chickens as well as other animals but i found it quite messy and labor intensive when it comes time to slaughter them, leaving corpses to be hauled and blood to be cleaned. So i was trying to alleviate some of that when it came time to slaughter my last batch of chicks.... I set up a 1x1 animal zone in my freezer and restricted the chicks to be slaughtered to go there. Once slaughtered there was a massive stack of chick corpses in the 1x1 area and my colonist began hauling them to separate spaces in my freezer because I have animal corpses allowed there. i quickly realized this was going to overflow my freezer, so i disallowed chicken corpses to be stored anywhere else and forbid the corpses. I can un-forbid the corpses one at a time as needed or en mass for butchering as needed. Tested this on another save with Muffalo. Had 13 Muffalo corpses in a 1x1 area in my freezer.
(http://images.akamai.steamusercontent.com/ugc/92725562077545600/6D26C63850DB3FD613B80B051B895F276F346FFC/?interpolation=lanczos-none&output-format=jpeg&output-quality=95&fit=inside%7C1024:576&composite-to%3D%2A%2C%2A%7C1024%3A576&background-color=black)
Nice .. for chicks you can even skip the slaughtering part, because they should freeze to death pretty quickly ..
How to take out a poison/physic ship in 3 easy steps
Step 1: Build your structure
(http://i.imgur.com/aoWMsuu.png)
Step 2: Melee attack ship from within your structure to under half health. Do not kill the ship as the hull is protecting your colonist from the mechanoids. Forbid the outside door so your colonist doesn't go outside. This works because the AI around the ship doesn't attack your safe zone. PS My screen shot has those silly bricks in the way. Close the door when you try this at home!
(http://i.imgur.com/yk0taF3.png)
Step 3: Wait for mechanoids to clear the area. Kill all mechanoids with your kill box. Once the mechanoids are clear from the ship finish off the ship.
(http://i.imgur.com/NYOL3rm.png)
Note> The only thing that can go wrong is if a syther/centipede spawns in the same spot as your colonist. This is why you have to build the second outside area. If that happens your colonist will magically be thrust through the closed door. the Syther will be on the other side and immediately notice that it is trapped. At this point it will break through one of the outside walls to escape. Don't worry being trapped will automatically trigger the group to attack the base. Keep your colonist inside until the mechanoids advance, then kill the ship.
Special thanks to https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6XG9r7oJU1ixftFf_73LNw (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6XG9r7oJU1ixftFf_73LNw) Bjorn for showing me this!
This tip might just Safe my desert tribe
To defeat Centipedes or Sythers, I send one or two people out in personal shields, and have everyone else line up behind them. The mechs will target the shield users, leaving everyone safe (as long as they have worse cover than the melee units). As soon as someone gets hurt, I just send them out of sight until they have their shield back.
Shielded bait is extremely effective. I took out a pair of centipedes with a shielded non-violent pawn and her grenade-toting buddy.
I did that too .. but the bunker was nice for my useles club pawn to train on the ship part .
To add to the poison/psychic ship, I always find that i can send one sniper out and get them to shoot the ship, the Mechs come out but do not agro as the sniper is out of range, the Mechs just sit walking about the same area all I do is tell my sniper to attack any centipedes and because he misses he usually kills everything else before killing the centipede. So far it has worked everytime and I only need 1 Pawn with a weapon to go there. So far this has always been the case for me.
Quote from: Jstank on February 26, 2017, 03:35:10 PM
How to take out a poison/physic ship in 3 easy steps
Step 1: Build your structure
Why don't mechanoids attack doors or walls when ship is harmed ?? They do attack even walls once in raid mode.
I think they attack structures if a structure attackes them i.e turrets, because I have had them land next to my base before and they shot the walls down, but otherwise I havnt had them shoot any walls except in raids like you said.
In case it hasn't been posted, batteries can be used in place of conduits to expensively avoid Zzzt. :(
Quote from: MarvinKosh on March 01, 2017, 02:28:46 AM
In case it hasn't been posted, batteries can be used in place of conduits to expensively avoid Zzzt. :(
It's more cost-effective though to use Solar Panels or Wind Turbines as your conduits. Why this should result in a MORE stable electrical system is unclear.
Quote from: Hans Lemurson on March 01, 2017, 03:27:32 AM
Quote from: MarvinKosh on March 01, 2017, 02:28:46 AM
In case it hasn't been posted, batteries can be used in place of conduits to expensively avoid Zzzt. :(
It's more cost-effective though to use Solar Panels or Wind Turbines as your conduits. Why this should result in a MORE stable electrical system is unclear.
The stability comes in the form of distributed load. Haven't you noticed the conduit grids within the bounds of each device?
When I build my conduits, I build a closed grid of redundancies that evenly distributes the load as well as providing backup routing when one is broken by fire or attack. I can't remember the last time I had a conduit blow.
Quote from: travin on March 01, 2017, 11:48:43 AM
Quote from: Hans Lemurson on March 01, 2017, 03:27:32 AM...Why this should result in a MORE stable electrical system is unclear.
The stability comes in the form of distributed load. Haven't you noticed the conduit grids within the bounds of each device?
*Ahem*
(https://morbotron.com/meme/S05E01/379562.jpg?b64lines=V2luZG1pbGxzIGRvIG5vdCAKd29yayB0aGF0IHdheSEgCgoKCgoKCgo=)
Hey everyone, can I please serve up a reminder of Tynan's most recent post in this thread, specifically the one relating to forming discussions about the exploits (or not) being posted.
Quote from: Tynan on January 31, 2017, 02:45:23 PM
One note: Please try to only post exploit reports. Please do NOT post:
-Discussions about what is or isn't an exploit
-Ideas to solve exploits or discussions thereof
-Low-effort "me too" posts
Thanks!
If anyone wants to discuss any of the exploits being posted in this thread in more detail, then please can you create a separate discussion thread to do so, and not have that discussion in this thread (as per Tynan's request). Thank you.
(if I get time I will probably split several of the most recent posts into a separate thread. So if a bunch of posts disappear at some point in the next day or two, that is where they have gone).
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't strictly run the numbers, but I believe breeding animals, at least in the case of chickens, is an exploit because it produces substantive value from nothing. I suspect it's the same with other animals but to a lesser degree--more if you're using chickens as feed.
Chicks at all stages, roosters and hens all seem to eat the same nutritional quantity. Most chicks naturally cannot eat and do not need the same quantity of nutrition as an adult. And roosters don't need the same nutrition that hens need to lay eggs. Yet I understand they all eat the same portions of feed per day. Accordingly, eggs are a spontaneous generation of resources because it cost nothing more to produce them.
The market also provides varying prices for each stage of chick growth and between hens and roosters. Presumably a higher price for hens is that they can reproduce or lay underfertilized eggs. It presents an unfair loss to buyers because the market doesn't reflect their true value, especially if fertilized. Though considering the additional meat value produced from hatched eggs, that's an additional spontaneous generation of resources. But not everyone can or wants to breed chickens so they can't take advantage or offset their losses from an uncorrected market. If other animals also suffer from these same conditions, they're also spontaneously producing resources. It's an exploit.
To fix it wouldn't require anything more than nutrient needs adjusted on a curve and slightly more demanding for females when they're pregnant. Overall this change would make agriculture and breeding a more balanced and predictable affair without significant gameplay impact.
Hmm...I did get a bit off-topic, didn't I.
(https://morbotron.com/meme/S05E01/378528.jpg?b64lines=RXhwbG9pdCBkb2N1bWVudGF0aW9uIApkb2VzIG5vdCB3b3JrIAp0aGF0IHdheSEgCgoKCgoKCkdvb2QgbmlnaHQh)
Anyways how about an
actual exploit report also dealing with chickens!
One Good Egg Un-Spoils the Bunch:Quote from: milon on March 01, 2017, 04:54:12 PM
Quote from: Hans Lemurson on February 28, 2017, 06:05:35 PM
Another oddity that goes into exploit territory is that temperature-spoiled fertile eggs will still stack with live eggs, and can thus be revived. If you lost a bunch of purchased eggs due to improper handling, you only need one good egg to make up for it.
I think there's a saying about one good egg unspoiling the bunch, right? ;)
Yeah, stacked items aren't handled separately - once things get stacked they're averaged together (I think) and tracked as a unit. Which is efficient, but has some side effects.
Technically applies to non-chicken egg-layers too, but chickens are the only cool ones we care about.
Here's my favourite combat exploit that I can't wait to be fixed.
Position 1 or more gunners by your door that has enemies outside. Have another pawn open the door. As the door is opening move that pawn back into the base. During the open and close animation, enemies can't get in, and they never seem to fire at you. Meanwhile your gunners are free to fire through the opening. If you use a stone door, the slow animation can get you two volleys per round. It can be tedious to manage, but it's a very effective.
Also, if you surround poison/psychic ships with landmines before shooting it's basically an instant take down.
Quote from: Dukkha on March 02, 2017, 04:59:12 PM
Here's my favourite combat exploit that I can't wait to be fixed.
Position 1 or more gunners by your door that has enemies outside. Have another pawn open the door. As the door is opening move that pawn back into the base. During the open and close animation, enemies can't get in, and they never seem to fire at you. Meanwhile your gunners are free to fire through the opening. If you use a stone door, the slow animation can get you two volleys per round. It can be tedious to manage, but it's a very effective.
To add to this I find a lot of the time if the enemy are engaged trying to break a door after seeing a pawn go through it, you can just shoot them from outwise with another pawn as most of the time they seem to stay agroed on the pawn inside.
Just found a new exploit. My colony has two doctors. One is in bed recovering from minigun friendly fire. The other one is binging on smokeweed and refuses to do anything useful. Solution?
Click the "Restrict" tab, assign doctor #2 to sleep. He immediately runs to bed and stops binging. then you can draft him to wake him up and tell him to fix doctor #1.
I wouldn't feel so bad about using this exploit if 60% of my colonists weren't forbidden from doctoring. This trait system is really obnoxious...
Im using following exploit to toggle my gunturrets on/off:
I have 2 powerconducts near my turret. One powered and one dead system.
By using the reconnect button i turn my turret off/on.
Quote from: MisterSpock on March 13, 2017, 05:04:14 PM
Im using following exploit to toggle my gunturrets on/off:
I have 2 powerconducts near my turret. One powered and one dead system.
By using the reconnect button i turn my turret off/on.
That's just genius, honestly.
I think I will use that for my sunlamps haha.
Ah, I don't kniw if this is really an exploit or a bug...
I have my stove in the freezer. Bills are set to drop on floor. The stove is surrounded by max stacked meals. Now if my cook produces meals they teleport to the next free or not maxxed stack/tile. Like magic.
Bug or exploit?
Quote from: MisterSpock on March 13, 2017, 05:04:14 PM
Im using following exploit to toggle my gunturrets on/off:
I have 2 powerconducts near my turret. One powered and one dead system.
By using the reconnect button i turn my turret off/on.
Brilliant
telling an anesthetized colonist to drop their weapon makes them "rescuable" even if they are in a bed. This means each colonist can successively show up and get the +15 "rescued me" social impact.
QuoteChicks at all stages, roosters and hens all seem to eat the same nutritional quantity.
That's not true. Chicks have a stomach size of 0.06, barely enough for a single unit of haygrass.
Another Exploid in A16:
Colonists gets unhappy if a family member is gone. (Sold or died)
This can by bypassed atm by abond the family member with a carawan.
How get to easy luciferium and artifacts:
- Travel to a free tile and settle.
- Find a shrine and open it.
- If you are lucky enough and the shrine is only defended by centipedes, bait them far away from the structure.
- Pick all the stuff, leave.
Well somehow this does not work if it is defended by scythers
Handgrenade exploit
If you have a perimeter wall set up and entrance gates, when a raid comes you can order a colonist or two to spam a chokepoint with grenades. This works especially well with EMP grenades and molotov cocktails, because these deal little or no damage to stone walls.
You can use the same exploit to open ancient danger rooms easily. Breach a single point, spam the breach with EMP grenades, lure mechanoids out with a shielded person.
Animals always return from caravan trips with their hunger bar at least ~50% filled, even if you just create a caravan to herd them off the map then immediately return. Doing it once in every two days or so will keep them fed without wasting any food on them.
Quote from: GiantSpaceHamster on March 26, 2017, 04:07:54 PM
When a prisoner goes berzerk, if you can build a wall in front of the door before they break through they will stop trying to break out. Just remove the wall when their mental break is over.
Quote from: b0rsuk on March 25, 2017, 11:09:37 AM
Handgrenade exploit
If you have a perimeter wall set up and entrance gates, when a raid comes you can order a colonist or two to spam a chokepoint with grenades. This works especially well with EMP grenades and molotov cocktails, because these deal little or no damage to stone walls.
You can use the same exploit to open ancient danger rooms easily. Breach a single point, spam the breach with EMP grenades, lure mechanoids out with a shielded person.
How is this an exploit and not just strategy?
Because infinite grenades.
Also, if there's a raid coming you can uninstall your mortars and other objects right before combatants clash to prevent raiders from attacking them.
Quote from: b0rsuk on March 27, 2017, 04:30:18 PM
Also, if there's a raid coming you can uninstall your mortars and other objects right before combatants clash to prevent raiders from attacking them.
Similarly, I've noticed that if a raid comes while I'm in the middle of adding a layer to my outer wall, the raiders go for the half-constructed wall segments (which have had blocks hauled to them but haven't been built). Canceling construction instantly causes them to come to my killbox instead and prevents the loss of materials from having the walls break.
Quote from: PetWolverine on March 28, 2017, 06:37:51 PM
Quote from: b0rsuk on March 27, 2017, 04:30:18 PM
Also, if there's a raid coming you can uninstall your mortars and other objects right before combatants clash to prevent raiders from attacking them.
Similarly, I've noticed that if a raid comes while I'm in the middle of adding a layer to my outer wall, the raiders go for the half-constructed wall segments (which have had blocks hauled to them but haven't been built). Canceling construction instantly causes them to come to my killbox instead and prevents the loss of materials from having the walls break.
Yup, that's a biggie, I've noticed that as well. Realistically, anything that is a priority target other than a colonist pawn in a raid is going to be abused to get raiders to act stupid. And even then... energy shielded pawn decoys and jogger snipers.
Mini-exploit... If you build your exterior doors of different materials, it is possible to see which doors raiders are going for. Especially useful if you are also using the raiders-attack-useless-external-doors-to-nowhere exploit to identify which type of raiders will be part of the first wave.
Molotov Cocktails can be thrown through diagonal walls.
Ancient crypto caskets count as a target for raids apparently. Making this quite a low effort trap.
Edit: Which in itself reveals the other exploit of infestations not fighting back to snipers. This scyther is still going at it days later.
[attachment deleted by admin due to age]
Reminder:
Quote from: Tynan on January 31, 2017, 02:45:23 PM
Thanks for the info everyone. These reports are useful.
I don't think we can fix them all but I'm try to grab the most important and fixable ones.
One note: Please try to only post exploit reports. Please do NOT post:
-Discussions about what is or isn't an exploit
-Ideas to solve exploits or discussions thereof
-Low-effort "me too" posts
Thanks!
Let's keep this thread clean. Please only post to report an exploit you've noticed. Anything else will be silently deleted.
Apologies if this has been posted before, i haven't looked through the whole thread and came up with this the other day. This is a modification of the efficient kitchen setup others have came up with, but this one lets you grab cooking materials through walls in order to bypass the low temperature work speed penalty on the stove while still keeping the extreme work speed benefits and the ingredients frozen when the cook is done.
(https://i.imgur.com/CaJJwAQ.png)
Brief explanation: diagonal walls are airtight keeping the cold in the fridge, you also need to place stools on the 1x1 vegetable and meat stockpiles in the opposite corners or the colonist will not pick up the items through the walls and will properly path around.
Sieges will pickup any useful resource on the map, not just the ones they spawn on their own. This means you can build a one square stockpile put steel there, and wait for one enemy to come wandering to pick it up, when you shoot him another one will come wandering.
I haven't had enough time to test this idea enough to be sure, but it seems to work: Removing the home zone from your growing zones seems to keep raiders from igniting them on fire. Has anyone else seen this?
You can hugely boost a room's beauty by leaving the floor as soil and planting Daylilies inside. Easily creates impressive rooms without much effort or resources.
I think that flowers should be fully grown first before they create beauty.
@Mattk50: Couldn't reproduce your kitchen setup in A17 (had to replace the wall between the 2 ingredient stockpiles with a door, which makes that way less exploit-y). What is your setup for the tile the colonist is standing on? If I had to guess, it's a stockpile for meals and a dining chair, but I'm not sure (and that's the only major detail I don't get from your screen shot)
Quote from: ReZpawner on June 03, 2017, 05:59:11 PM
Paint the floor with wires. Unless Tynan or Ison got wise to it and fixed it, that should keep the hives from spawning.
Quote from: hoffmale on May 31, 2017, 08:15:45 AM
@Mattk50: Couldn't reproduce your kitchen setup in A17 (had to replace the wall between the 2 ingredient stockpiles with a door, which makes that way less exploit-y). What is your setup for the tile the colonist is standing on? If I had to guess, it's a stockpile for meals and a dining chair, but I'm not sure (and that's the only major detail I don't get from your screen shot)
a17 fix. Diagonal application of doors and walls has changed drastically.
It's not a real exploit, but now that "worn by a corpse" wear give malus and doesn't sell as good as normal one, i just undress downed ennemies.
And this make me think that a good strategy for early game, is to craft metal or wood club for all my pawns at the craft spot before the first raids. It is quite fast.
Then you can smatch all raiders, chock them, undress them, and have early full wear without crafting, and sell the rest. plus you can recruit l lot faster and sell unwanted prisonners.
Early chance of ko ennemies instead of dying make this efficient
Imade a real good start at randy extreme compare to my other games.
It's possible to cheese outputs quests with just a handful of colonists equipped with sniper rilfes; enter the outpost and stay at the edge, shoot hostiles until they get in range to shoot back, leave area and rejoin it immediately and repeat the whole process until they start to flee.
Repost from the "Sappers" thread:
For a non-tribal start, it's not hard to lure sappers into a killbox. Put all your turrets somewhere else. Wait for sappers to show up and decide to path through the (apparently safe) killbox. Then plant your turrets there. Laugh as killing commences.
I'm going to repost this in the "exploits" thread since it seems too easy. Sappers should rethink where they're attacking when turrets show up.
If a colony animal is sleeping on a sleeping spot, deconstructing the spot (which is instantaneous) will wake up the animal. I used this to get my untrained, sleeping turkeys out of the way of a night raid.
Here's a somewhat complex exploit regarding ancient dangers on temporary caravan maps, as spelled out in step by step instructions on reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/6mdynm/psa_always_take_a_peek_at_the_ancient_danger/
Perhaps a new exploit...
I am in years 7 and i often order carawans. But i dont have use for tribal traders. What could i do with tribals?
Just started to call for shaman traders. They have good loot after all. I circle them and then the shooting beginns.
But i realise, mostly more than 5 pawns could be rescued. They go to prison, i patch them up and let them leave. And after this, my relationship is good enough to call another trader!
I know: When bandits attack, they have a chance to die (even if the wounds arent deadly). When a raid with 40 tribesman attack, mostly 4-6 "could" be rescued. If i have a carawan with 12 pawns, much more will go to prison after i raid them, like ...4-6.
Could be a Mod issue, but i dont use many mods and.. if it would, why should it seperate between raiders and visitors?
Mods: More Furniture [neeee], Trading Spot [neeee], Refugee Stats [neeee], Set up Camp[neeee], Hugs Lib [neeee], Medieval Times [Perhaps], Effencie lights [neeee], EPOE [neeee], More Vanilla Factions [neee]
I avoid using exploits of any kind in my "serious" playthroughs (which is Cassandra second-hardest setting with permadeath). I even build my bases like a village open in the wild several buildings close to each other rather than one giant base walled off with few entrances (with killboxes no less) as possible. This way always felt like the "proper" Rimworld experience to me.
But even then there are some things that I just can't drop even though it's detrimental to the Rimworld experience I'm aiming for.
Kiting mechs with a pawn wearing a shield for example. If I don't do this I just suffer too much casualties. I feel like mechs are too much OP compared to other attack events... or at least that's what I'm telling myself when I'm tricking them lol.
Another thing, making and selling wake-ups out of neurotrainers turns out too much of a profit in my opinion.
With a mountain base, I can make absolutely insane amounts of money just selling excess blocks. In fact, I don't even need a mountain base to do that. Somehow I keep having enough blocks to make hundreds of silver. Animals also produce WAY more fabric than needed, so there's always enough leather and hide to sell to pay back most things I buy just with that.
Quote from: thedee05 on March 21, 2016, 05:50:04 PM
Bugs don't attack doors so it is easy to pop out shoot at the bugs and pop back in when they come at you. The retreating bug has it's back turned when it heads back so you pop out again and get a enfilade shot on it. Makes it really easy to deal with them even in close quarters.
what if someone used both that door trick and the long tunnel trick? extreme exploit found
A door-based exploit to build a table indoors while having the pawn outdoors to avoid outdoor penalty and tight space penalty.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/6nd160/cheesy_stonecutters_table_placement/
I call in military aid to kill thrumbos.
With max rep, it doesn't cost too much to call in allies. The fur and horn by themselves repay with good profit the cost of buying back reputation.
Any loot weapons from dead allies is a bonus.
It does take a bit of work and planning to pull ofd so.maybe it isn't a pure exploit.
It also exposes me to some risk in case Randy throws something else at the same time.
Still feels cheesy though.