MELEE SKILL REBALANCE
= DESCRIPTION =
This Mod is an attempt to bring more utility to Melee Skill highlighting its impact on close quarters combats. Currently the main changes are:
- Altered skill progression/curves/defaults so what appears in-game tooltips as Melee Chance gets closer to real chances to land a hit on the enemy. The overall effect sought is that highly skilled fighters become deadlier while low skill fighters become much worse at dealing melee damage compared to Vanilla. Non Skilled entities will show their 60% chance to hit, as it was already the case inside the melee evaluation code. Their combat effectiveness will change based on their current health status.
- Created a "Parry" mechanic as a 3rd type of result on any melee attempted. The chance a regular hit turns into a "Parry" is based on the Melee Chance of the target. A parried attack has different effects on its target based on a few factors:
* If the target is wearing any piece of Apparel able to absorb damage, the full damage of the attack will be absorbed by it. Vanilla Personal Shields are an example of this change, they will try to absorb the damage of a melee attack that's parried.
* If the target is wielding a Melee Weapon, no wound will be suffered but the Weapon will loose HP as a fraction of the attack damage. This fraction is reduced the higher the Melee Chance of the target. The weapon will be dropped to the ground if a hit was strong enough to destroy it.
* An unarmed target will suffer half the damage on a Parry. A pawn wielding a Ranged Weapon falls on this category also.
* Parry chances are reduced the more parries a pawn does between his/her melee attacks.
- Pawns have a Melee Mode order players can change. Each mode modifies regular hits and have a chance ("Chance" in Mode tooltip) to trigger a special effect. For a special effect to happen the Pawn has to have effective hit chances equal or higher than the inherent difficulty of the stance ("Threshold" in the tooltip). The current modes are:
* Kill: Regular Damage on normal hits. Double damage on Special effect.
* Capture: Half Damage on normal hits. "Anesthezise" Incapacitation on Special effect.
* Stun: Half Damage on normal hits. Short stun on Special effect.
* Disarm: No Damage on normal hits. Enemy weapon droped to the ground on Special effect.
- AI Pawns use Attack Modes based on individual goals & capabilities.
= ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS =
pardeike (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=50744): Without Harmony, gracefull detouring wouldn't have been possible. His input on safe access to private methods have been a very valuable lesson.
haplo (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=161): For inspiration on how to make my own art and for his excellent tutorial on modding.
= INCOMPATIBILITIES =
Currently this mod Detours 2 Vanilla methods using Harmony Library:
- Rimworld.Verb_MeleeAttack.TryCastShot()
- Rimworld.Pawn_DraftController.GetGizmos()
ATM the mod leaves no traces on your savegame, meaning it's safe to use on an ongoing game and safe to be removed without further considerations.
= KNOWN ISSUES =
- Parry counters are reseted on reloading.
- Attack Mode settings are reseted to "Kill" on reloading.
= TODO =
My current focus is to learn modding... Thus why my 1st goal is a mod that players aren't afraid to test, that's why no savegame trace is a must for now. If enough brave souls offer feedback and/or find this usefull, this are the next steps (In no particular order and, OFC, heavily shaped by the feedback I may gather)
-
Parry Saturation. ATM the number of concurrent fighters attacking the same defender do not alter defender's parry chances. This is not ideal and will be changed sooner or later.-
Full Harmony library integration. I'm holding Sources publishing until I can show a decently clean code were all interactions derived from using detours go through Harmony Library, not just Detours themselves. I have some issues using Traverse tool that I need to investigate/report in Harmony channels.-
Make melee weapons that are destroyed while parrying to be droped with a few hp instead. For better visualization of what's going on and for users of repair mods to have a chance to keep their best melee weapons.-
Melee Combat toggle buttons to customize Pawn behaviour regarding "safety" while meleeing and/or allowing different "Attack Modes".- Parry Chance Stat. As a standalone so apparel/traits can affect defensive chances independently of offensive chances.
- Better Sounds/Visual notifications when a Parry happens.
-
Make this mod fully compatible with other mods that do not relay on Harmony without user patches.- Better Sounds/Visual notifications when a Special effect happens.
-
Make AI better at selecting which Attack mode to use. ATM they default to "Kill Mode".-
Find a way to notify players that their Pawns may be trying an attack mode that has no chance to trigger a special effect because their current target is just too skilled at Melee.= POWERED BY =
Harmony 1.0.9.1 (https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=29517.0). Detouring Library.
= DOWNLOAD & INSTALLATION =
This is the latest version (https://github.com/oreganor/Melee_Rebalance/releases/download/1.4.0/Melee_Rebalance_1.4.0.zip) on the GITHUB repository (https://github.com/oreganor/Melee_Rebalance) of the project. If you want to access older versions, just browse on the "Releases" Tab and get the .zip of the one you want.
To install, simply unzip it into your [Rimworld Install Path]\Mods directory.
= PERMISSIONS =
Feel free to use/reuse, tear apart, the Mod and its sources at your leasure. I would appreciate to be credited if you think this mod is useful enough and/or provided some fun for you in any way or form ;).
= CHANGELOG =
1.4.0:
- AI will now use different Attack Modes based on individual pawn's goals & capabilities.
- Tweaked Attack Modes thresholds & chances.
- Reduced Parry counter penalty.
1.3.2:
- Added overlays to Attack Mode button to describe effective chances of a special effect to happen.
- Compatibility with "Defensive Positions" mod.
1.3.1:
- Using Shortcut "M" (Misc 7) as default.
- RTS behaviour on Attack Mode button when multiple pawns are selected.
1.3.0:
- Added Attack Mode command.
- Added Basic Localization: English.
1.2.1:
- Fixed Null Error while attacking Buildings.
1.2.0:
- Full integration with Harmony Library.
- Parry chances of a pawn are reduced the more parries it has to do between his/her melee swings.
1.1.0:
- Melee weapons badly damaged on a parry are droped to the ground.
1.0.0:
-Initial Implementation.
[RESERVED]
A point that should be made here I feel is also on important stats for melee. Now maybe I'm not well read on the topic but as I understand it manipulation has no effect on melee quality, which is pretty stupid if you ask me. Something to potentially rectify here.
QuoteA point that should be made here I feel is also on important stats for melee. Now maybe I'm not well read on the topic but as I understand it manipulation has no effect on melee quality, which is pretty stupid if you ask me. Something to potentially rectify here.
Good point and, certainly can be defined, as I'm already using the Def that contains the conditions affecting a given stat... So far Vanilla defines only 2:
100% Consciousness
40% Perception
The way modifiers are applied is normalized so, in principle, there wouldn't be a problem to add your suggestion. I will do some numbers on the common causes (and how bad/good they can become) to get a figure on the weight to add manipulation as a factor affecting Melee Chances.
Thanks for the feedback.
Sounds like a great mod, I'll look forward to trying this out!
Quote from: TAA6 on March 23, 2017, 03:08:52 PM
A point that should be made here I feel is also on important stats for melee. Now maybe I'm not well read on the topic but as I understand it manipulation has no effect on melee quality, which is pretty stupid if you ask me. Something to potentially rectify here.
I think ideally manipulation would affect armed but not unarmed combat, so losing fingers would reduce a pawn's effectiveness at wielding a sword, but scyther blades, as a hand replacement with 20% manipulation, would retain their tradeoff of producing highly specialized melee super-soldiers who can't really do anything else.
This looks like an excellent mod, hope it becomes well-known in the community. That's part of the reason I'm stoking the reply train to keep this post up there.
Definitely going on my mod list!
Will keep an eye on this mod. Greatly interests me since i think the way melee combat worked was very bad.
Also put on Steam :P ?
YES! A simple balance mod to ass some flavour to the melee combat is what I have been looking for, gonna keep an eye on this one!
Could you consider a critical attack working a bit like the stun attack bears have also adding more dmg to the equipment and body parts maybe start with 150% at under 10 melee and 250 % dmg above 10 melee?
I think these changes would balance the whole issue of not making close quarters fighters?
Add cooldowns to parry. Higher melee skill, lesser cooldown. So that when engaged with many opponents, pawns wont be able to parry every attack. Well except for that Godlike 20melee pawn who can parry attacks every 0.2 seconds. 😂
Will try that out for sure
Thanks for the detailed feedback.
QuoteCould you consider a critical attack working a bit like the stun attack bears have also adding more dmg to the equipment and body parts maybe start with 150% at under 10 melee and 250 % dmg above 10 melee?
I think these changes would balance the whole issue of not making close quarters fighters?
The idea I have for special effects is a toggle button were players can select the intention their pawns go with into a melee and when a "critical" happens the selected special effect is triggered (This is what I meant on the TODO section as "Attack Mode" buttons). The current draft I have is like this:
- Killer. Double Damage.
- Capper. Double Pain.
- Defensive. Disarm/Stun. Depends on what I find easier to implement. Disarm is the more attractive because there is a lot of tactical depth into it... But it has a lot of potential fallout to check regarding how AI reacts to it. Stun, on the other side, is very easy to do as there is a current mechanic for it... "Surprise Attacks", which is what Animals trigger when they "hunt" unsuspecting prey.
QuoteAdd cooldowns to parry. Higher melee skill, lesser cooldown. So that when engaged with many opponents, pawns wont be able to parry every attack. Well except for that Godlike 20melee pawn who can parry attacks every 0.2 seconds. 😂
The draft I have for Parry Saturation is based on the concept of Parry counters. The more a Pawn accumulates the less His/Her melee chance can reduce attackers'. The Parry counters reset to 0 each time the Pawn attacks. The reasson is mainly technical, because allows me to evaluate EVERYTHING into the same Method (Thus controlling the Impact my mod has on the overall code). As a secondary goal, I want that weapon speed matters more than now... To balance the fact that slow hard hitter weapons can still easily one shot Pawns on a lucky hit. So players can find tactical use for a variety of scenarios:
- Slow Big Weapons. Better for 1 v 1 duels. Better chance at disabling in one hit versus higher max ammount of parry counters between swings.
- Fast Small weapons. Less chances to disable in one hit versus lesser max ammount of parry counters between swings.
In BOTH cases, the current showstopper is the same... Implementing them REQUIRES leaving something "saved" (Either because I need to store states that evolve over time... Or because I have to create a new entity ingame that will leave a trace on the savegame itself). ATM, I'm not confident enough in my modding skills to allow this to happen, because 1st I want ppl to get a feeling on how it looks... And for that they should be able to jump in, install the mod and be able to remove it without consquences if they do not like what they see.
Once my learning process allows me to create safe and clean ways to disable this mod with "savegame" entities... I will proceed to add "fancy features" like the 2 commented.
QuoteAlso put on Steam :P ?
Partially linked to my "still-to-learn" moding savegames... Steam is a nightmare for the average user that just subscribe to mods if they do not leave savegames intact. I know I'm missing a lot of audience, but I prefer to be honest about my current knowledge limits and expose this mod on a channel were users are more aware of the implication this important step has. In time, I will add it to the workshop when I feel it's rich, fun, diverse and robust enough to justify a potential lost savegame in the worst case scenario after an autoupdate.
I know that in the permissions I stated I don't mind what you do with this mod now or in the future... So can't really blame anyone that uploads it to the workshop directly. Please, if you do, at least warn the subscribers about what I comment here, that at some point this MOD will leave savegame traces and then they will be exposed to all the autoupdate madness Workshop may trigger.
Definitely excited to see how this'll turn out. I feel it'll synergise very well with my Better Shooting Skill mod
Quote from: oreganor on March 23, 2017, 07:26:50 PM
In BOTH cases, the current showstopper is the same... Implementing them REQUIRES leaving something "saved" (Either because I need to store states that evolve over time... Or because I have to create a new entity ingame that will leave a trace on the savegame itself). ATM, I'm not confident enough in my modding skills to allow this to happen, because 1st I want ppl to get a feeling on how it looks... And for that they should be able to jump in, install the mod and be able to remove it without consquences if they do not like what they see.
Once my learning process allows me to create safe and clean ways to disable this mod with "savegame" entities... I will proceed to add "fancy features" like the 2 commented.
As a software engineer, I have to commend your discipline. This is an unusually careful and responsible attitude.
Initial feedback: Melee weapons break pretty darn fast.
Had a colonist fight off a wild hog with a club. The club broke pretty fast from all the parrying. Some way to mitigate weapon from taking damage could be nice i guess.
Some suggestions:
- a parry should 100% interrupt the current attack of the parry one entity.
- maybe introduce riposte too. When the entity who parry got enough skill (10+) he got a chance for a extra mellee attack if he wield a mellee weapon.
- Range weapons should be damaged too an a parry.
- Mellee attack should general have a chance to interrupt the others attack. Do you can still shoot at someone who poke you with a knife ?
Thanks CHjess and Canute for the detailed feedback:
QuoteInitial feedback: Melee weapons break pretty darn fast.
Had a colonist fight off a wild hog with a club. The club broke pretty fast from all the parrying. Some way to mitigate weapon from taking damage could be nice i guess.
ATM balance is focused on High Tech melee warriors, wielding Steel Weapons and using personal shields, so they don't become Godly Killing machines. So it's a bit of a small scenario for such a rich game as Rimworld.
Was the colonist skilled in melee? ATM a parrying weapon receives (1 - Melee Skill) * Original Damage / 2. With a minimum of 1 point of damage. So the better a pawn is in melee the less damage his/her weapon receives on a parry. Notice that material of an item has a HIGH impact on its resulting HP.
As with everything related to fine tuning, the scenario & mods you play with have a saying in all of this. Can you ellaborate a bit more on the kind of game you are playing? I'm interested in adjusting the mod so ppl playing in different ways find it useful.
Quote- a parry should 100% interrupt the current attack of the parry one entity.
That would backfire, because high skilled fighters parry a lot... If they wield a slow weapon, they will be effectively denied of any chance to attack by a less skilled warrior wielding a faster weapon.
Quote- maybe introduce riposte too. When the entity who parry got enough skill (10+) he got a chance for a extra mellee attack if he wield a mellee weapon.
Ripostes are typical of most RPGs with some focus on melee mechanics, so I thought on them, the problem is the ammount of blows that is currently exchanged between fighters on the typical melee duel in Rimworld (Even without this mod on). If I had to make Ripostes common enough to matter, a skilled pawn subject to attack from multiple sources will become a killing machine because his applied DPS will be amplified by the number of attackers. I prefer to keep giving players a way to deal with a powerfull melee enemy by sending multiple fighters against it.
There is also the technical problem of triggering actions ON ANOTHER PAWN in the "tick" of the pawn that can potentially receive them. Sequences like that can be sabotaged easily as "first" and "last" can't be clear nor assumed. In time, when I get more familiar with modding, I will be able to do "stunts" like that.
Quote- Range weapons should be damaged too an a parry.
The initial tests of this mod damaged any weapon hold... Until I saw what did happen when an AI shooter lost its weapon. It was very easy to exploit for a Human Player.
Quote- Mellee attack should general have a chance to interrupt the others attack. Do you can still shoot at someone who poke you with a knife ?
I see that you are concerned about that painful scenario on vanilla when your melee pawn has managed to dodge all ranged fire, able to reach it target... Just to be shot miserably to death at point blank :). It's one of the original issues that drove me to make this mod for "personal use" in the 1st place.
I plan on including "interrupting" mechanics as a result of good attacks in the form of Disarms & Stuns. It's the "Attack Mode" button that's in the TODO list.
= NEW VERSION 1.1.0 =
Changes:
- Melee Weapons that would be destroyed on a parry are droped to the ground instead. If there is not enough room nearby for the weapon, it will be destroyed instead.
Warning!!!: Your melee pawns will be droping items on the ground with low HP... They will not last much exposed, so if you value a melee weapon and want to repair it... Do not let it linger around in the open too much ;).
For as long as I don't move the project to a GITHUB repository, I will keep the current version and the previous as attachments on the Original Post. Just in case you find something you don't like on the current version and prefer to keep using the old one.
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
Sorry for delaying the answer to your very usefull comment, PetWolverine:
QuoteI think ideally manipulation would affect armed but not unarmed combat, so losing fingers would reduce a pawn's effectiveness at wielding a sword, but scyther blades, as a hand replacement with 20% manipulation, would retain their tradeoff of producing highly specialized melee super-soldiers who can't really do anything else.
I documented the different efects on manipulation as requested by user TAA6 on Vanilla and on some very popular mods, to find 3 issues:
- Most hediffs affecting manipulation ALSO affect conciousness. Meaning that to simmulate Melee Skill degradation due to temporal hediffs is enough with the current weight of modifers.
- Some Unarmed Melee Enchancing Bionics reduce the efficiency of the Body Part chain they are attached to. In turn, Body Part chain efficiency degrades any Capacity they are linked to. Sadly, Manipulation is a component on most upper limb definitions.
- Loosing completely a Body Part chain, triggers a loss on efficiency also. Which should affect BOTH Armed & Unarmed melee Capacities.
So I see now why Ludeon left manipulation out of melee modifiers :)... It's more important to simmulate the Productivity degradation ATM, while leaving the option to specialize pawns as melee fighters.
I need to think carefully on how to do this WITHOUT forcing other content creators to redefine the way their Parts/Bionics/Hediff behave... Vanilla gives me tools to do it such as creating new Capacities, spliting Melee Chance stat between Armed and Unarmed... This is a hard nut to crack, so it will be very enlightening to solve it gracefully, but I will add it to the pipeline. I need to do a decent Draft even before adding this to the TODO list.
Quote from: oreganor on March 25, 2017, 04:50:57 AM
Thanks CHjess and Canute for the detailed feedback:
QuoteInitial feedback: Melee weapons break pretty darn fast.
Had a colonist fight off a wild hog with a club. The club broke pretty fast from all the parrying. Some way to mitigate weapon from taking damage could be nice i guess.
ATM balance is focused on High Tech melee warriors, wielding Steel Weapons and using personal shields, so they don't become Godly Killing machines. So it's a bit of a small scenario for such a rich game as Rimworld.
Was the colonist skilled in melee? ATM a parrying weapon receives (1 - Melee Skill) * Original Damage / 2. With a minimum of 1 point of damage. So the better a pawn is in melee the less damage his/her weapon receives on a parry. Notice that material of an item has a HIGH impact on its resulting HP.
As with everything related to fine tuning, the scenario & mods you play with have a saying in all of this. Can you ellaborate a bit more on the kind of game you are playing? I'm interested in adjusting the mod so ppl playing in different ways find it useful.
The colonist survived, barely. It was very early on and i did the "Start with nothing" challenge :P . Also i know all about this with materials.
The colonist in question (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/547140/Rimworld/Darius.jpg) had a melee skill of 12 something with burning passion. Also was a Brawler in question if that matters. Did a lot better against a horde of manhunting hares with a steel gladius :P.
Feel like this calls me to make a mod that let
Smiths mend melee weapons in a sensible way ;) . A
Anvil, the
Weapon and the appropiate
Stuff it is made out of.
QuoteAlso was a Brawler in question if that matters. Did a lot better against a horde of manhunting hares with a steel gladius :P.
So you found that turning to a faster and sturdier weapon felt better?
I chose the "balance" point regarding pawn skill versus unskilled entities (ie ALL animals) at exactly 10, so going higher will make your pawn harder and harder to be hit.
On the current test version I finnaly found a way to implement "Parry Counters" so it will become increasingly difficult to defend against multiple concurrent targets in the near future :), although.
On the subject of Brawler Trait, I have pending an investigation on why on the tooltip of melee chances it doesn't seem to have an effect... Because I considered it overpowered combined with this Mod for the advertised x 1.75 bonus to Melee Chance. I need to go back to it... Because Brawler + skill above 10 should make your pawn a deadly foe with this Mod against animals.
Quote from: oreganor on March 25, 2017, 04:50:57 AM
Quote- a parry should 100% interrupt the current attack of the parry one entity.
That would backfire, because high skilled fighters parry a lot... If they wield a slow weapon, they will be effectively denied of any chance to attack by a less skilled warrior wielding a faster weapon.
Thats intend, the one with the slower weapon got draw into defence, thats why the ripose comes in handy. He got chances for counterattacks.
And with the backpack function, you can carry a second weapon. Slow weapon vs. range, fast vs. mellee.
Quote- Range weapons should be damaged too an a parry.
QuoteThe initial tests of this mod damaged any weapon hold... Until I saw what did happen when an AI shooter lost its weapon. It was very easy to exploit for a Human Player.
Isn't any weapon a mellee weapon at first hand, and at emergency you can shoot with them.
If you don't want that range weapons got damaged, then you should remove it for mellee only weapons too. And just keep the reduced damage on a parry.
And the parry ability of range fighter wouldn't happen that much ,Except a brawler raider got a mellee weapon. So these exploid wouldn't count that much, but that should be tested.
QuoteAlso was a Brawler in question if that matters.
Mmm... Apparently if ILSpy info is corrent and my understanding of Ludeon code is correct, I have an idea on why Brawler doesn't have an impact on reported melee chances (My debug code is telling the same... Not a surprise, because I use what vanilla games calculates as Melee Chance, which is what Vanilla game uses to determine if a melee attack lands or not).
The code responsible of calculating ALL stats of pawns is ignoring StatFactor tags defined on Traits (Honors StatOffsets, although)...
...I may miss something here because I swear that young animals got their stats changed when changing Lifestages and those are defined precissely as StatFactors... But on another entity.
Quote from: oreganor on March 25, 2017, 08:33:11 AM
The code responsible of calculating ALL stats of pawns is ignoring StatFactor tags defined on Traits (Honors StatOffsets, although)...
This is at least hopefully going to be fixed in Alpha 17 though... but then again, traits like Careful shooter, Trigger-happy and Fast walker work fine. It's only Brawler AFAIK that is broken
QuoteThis is at least hopefully going to be fixed in Alpha 17 though
Ah k, so it's a known issue then? (I was about to fill a bug report)
It is indeed a known issue. I think the original bug report for it was filed a few months ago, but I can't remember off the top of my head.
After checking, it has indeed been filed and resolved: https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=2586
Have you considered increasing the changes of hitting vital areas with highly skilled warriors? It would make sense that the level 20 person is aiming for the throat, eyes and head areas compared to the wildly swinging level 0. Also, perhaps you would consider even hitting internal organs as well? Like some sort of martial art.
= NEW VERSION 1.2.0 =
Changes:
- Full Harmony Library integration. Thanks to pardeike work and advices, not only detours, but access to private data/methods goes through Harmony Library.
- Parry chances of a pawn are reduced the more parries it has to do between his/her melee attacks.
Some remarks about Parry Counters mechanic:
- Parry Counters only accumulate in the case of successful parries or hits that go through one.
- The current penalty for parries beyond the 1st one is a flat -25% chance per extra parry (-50% for 2, etc, etc). I'm not happy with the way it's evaluated AFTER skill normalization happens ingame. I want that pawns with effective skill chance above 100% can also "negate" this penalty as they do with other factors like wounds, fatigue, etc. ATM trying to alter this would require "touching" deeper methods used by Vanilla that would increase the chance of a "mod collision". Once I get more practice with modding, I will revise this to see if I can make Elite fighters to be able to parry more times before seeing their chances reduced.
- Weapon Speed gives a net advantage in 1 v 1 duels. The faster pawn will sometimes manage to connect 2 or more attacks between swings of his target, meaning the 2nd and following hits will have less chances to be parried. Obviously this is amplified if the same pawn is been attacked by multiple enemies. Take this into consideration when having to deal with a Veteran Figher as enemy.
- If a Pawn is retreating from melee, will not have his/her parry counters refreshed, meaning that hitting a fleeing target will become easier over time.
- ATM Parry Counters AREN'T SAVED. This means that if you save in the middle of a melee combat, when you reload, ALL pawns will have their parry chances back to full. It's a small discrepancy that I hope you don't mind for the sake of been able to keep this MOD savegame friendly for now.
This will be the last version I deploy as an attachment. The next one will come as a download from a GITHUB repository and will contatin also the source code of the mod. It may take a bit longer than the previous updates as I have to refactor/clean my chaotic code full of test/debug/trash lines ;).
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
Keep up the good work!
I genuinely think at some point you should suggest this mod to be integrated into vanilla, when it's at the right stage
QuoteHave you considered increasing the changes of hitting vital areas with highly skilled warriors? It would make sense that the level 20 person is aiming for the throat, eyes and head areas compared to the wildly swinging level 0. Also, perhaps you would consider even hitting internal organs as well? Like some sort of martial art.
Thanks for the feedback. Yes, I have considered it at draft time... Then I checked how incredibly detailed Bodies are modeled into Rimworld's code and...
...Decide to model extra lethality in a simpler way as I described in the TODO list.
My next target, after code cleanup -> GITHUB migration, will be to add "extra lethality" options in the shape of toggle buttons in the UI.
It's not the kind of detailed effects you seek... But it's how far I can go for now regarding increasing lethality of Expert Fighters while keeping a decent chance of providing to you what I promised.
= HOTFIX VERSION 1.2.1 =
Changes:
- Fixed Critical Null error while attacking buildings.
I said that 1.2.0 was the last version to release as attachment, but due to the extremely disruptive nature of the bug and how simple it was to fix (I commented the wrong line by accident :( ), I prefer to release this fix now while I'm still cleaning and preparing the github repo. Sorry for the inconvenience.
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
Fast responce author ! :-)
But from my side as user of the mod, i don't care if you just made an attachment, put it on any download hub or github.
I just want click on a link and get a download.
Nice to know you're posting about these updates too, so everybody who posted on this can be up-to-date :)
Melee needed some love on this game, nice mod, keep the good work! ;)
Really nice mod! Makes it so Melee battles are better and more Intense, also Makes it so Raids are alittle more fun!
= NEW VERSION 1.3.0 =
Changes:
- Added Attack Mode command.
- Added Basic Localization: English.
Current Attack modes are the following:
| (http://i.imgur.com/Xe7g0EM.png) | Kill Mode
In this mode your pawn fight regularly and occasionally will do double damage.
|
| (http://i.imgur.com/A7C4xbF.png) | Capture Mode
In this mode your pawn will do half damage and when a special effect happens will inoculate a powerful anesthezise effect on the target. This means you will not be able to affect mechanicals with this effect... So watchit.
|
| (http://i.imgur.com/cSiDH7E.png) | Stun Mode
In this mode your pawn will do half damage and occasionally Stun his/her opponent for around 10 seconds. Ideal to suppress powerfull enemies or to be able to move away without been staggered.
|
| (http://i.imgur.com/q0nDgyW.png) | Disarm Mode
In this mode your pawn will NOT DO ANY DAMAGE (He is aiming at enemy's weapon) on a regular hit, but when a special effect happens, the opponent will drop his/her weapon to the ground. Remember that plenty of Mods and Vanilla opponents' weapons are instantly destroyed when touching the ground... So don't expect to go around wielding too many Inferno Cannons ;).
|
Each Mode has a Threshold and a Chance (You can check them on the tooltip). Threshold controls the effective melee hit chance a Pawn has to have to be able to trigger the special effect of the Mode. The chance that a regular hit triggers the Special Effect of the Mode, surprinsigly :), is the Chance. A numeric Example should make all this clear (I hope :) ):
Gronan (90% melee chance) and Wally (30% chance) are fighting each other... Gronan is trying to Capture (T: 40%, C: 25%) and Wally is simply on Kill (T: 20%, C: 33%). Leaving other factors aside, Gronan effective chance to land a hit against Wally are 63% = 90% * ( 1 - 30%). As Gronan's effective chances are higher than his current mode threshold he has roughly 16% chance per attack to incapacitate Wally (Effective chance 63% times chance of special effect of the current mode 25% = 16%). Meanwhile Wally has a tough challenge as his reduced effective melee chances 3% = 30% * ( 1 - 90%), aren't enough to activate Kill Mode special effects... He has to find a way to reduce Gronan's parry chances to be able to do double damage.
Probably this feature will require a lot of feedback to fine-tune it properly, so I hope you all find this fun enough to test and report back.
Some Comments on the Release:
- I think I'm approaching the limit of what I can achieve without leaving savegame traces. Parry counter reset, Attack Mode reset and having to relay on Anesthesize mechanics (Instead of using a new type of wound) may detract from your experience while using this mod. I would love to hear specific feedback on how anoying this issues are versus how much you like the addon.
- Sadly I have met the 1st mod incompatibility with Defensive Possitions (Not a surprise because was one of the mods I have been inspecting to learn "how to do things"). I'm sure there will be more, because the entry point BOTH mods use to inject new command buttons is very attractive because it has an inherent additive nature on Vanilla. My current priority is to be able to solve the collision so users of BOTH mods can enjoy all features provided FULLY.
- The current localization support is just "Barebones" (I will add a Spanish Language translation at some point). I have seen some users like to provide Localization data for their prefered Mods. Before I consider this Mod stable, there are a lot of things that may be added that may require translation, so if you like to see Mods in your prefered language and like to provide a translation I recommend that you wait for the Mod to grow a bit more before making the effort of creating a Language File. It would rock to have such translations, but it's not nice to include something that may become obsolete the next version and then those kind contributors may feel "obliged" to keep adding updated versions of their Language files.
- Finnally I was able to move the entire project to a GITHUB repo, for automatic source management and for you to be able to access old versions if you don't like what the newer ones bring. The sources are still the product of how I approched this whole project as a learning excercise... I think there are far better examples on this forums for you to learn/start a project from, I hope they become better over time.
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
So, let me get this straight. If I get a very fast-attacking weapon, the chances of proc'ing the special effect will increase? Because let's say you apply a 10% chance of proc'ing. Obviously, a 2s cooldown weapon will proc less than a 1s cooldown one.
QuoteSo, let me get this straight. If I get a very fast-attacking weapon, the chances of proc'ing the special effect will increase? Because let's say you apply a 10% chance of proc'ing. Obviously, a 2s cooldown weapon will proc less than a 1s cooldown one.
Yes... Not only that, but remember that if your weapon is faster than your opponent's... You will be able to saturate his defenses occasionally, meaning you will get higher chances to connect and posibly be able to trigger special effects from the Hard Modes (Check the tooltips).
On the receiving end... With this changes on, if your pawn is been attacked at the same time by multiple enemies, he will not only parry less... But may allow less skilled enemies to trigger special effects on your pawn they wouldn't be able on 1v1 duels.
Yeah, i'd seriously consider you getting the first step for rebalancing to normalize percentages, or at the very least apply some curve behaviour (min/max percentages with hardcaps). I see a huge potential on your changes so far, though, good job.
If you want a suggestion for further improvement, make parry weights for weapons. A shiv, for instance would have a parry weight of 1, and larger weapons, such as the spear, of 8. Larger difference in parry weights reduce your parry chances by a factor of N, where N is the difference between the parry weight.
Example: Gronan attacks Wally with a spear. Wally is equipping a shiv. Let's say in your normal circunstances, Wally has a 10% chance of parrying Gronan and Gronan also has a base 10% chance to parry Larry's attack. However, since Wally is equipping a shiv, he only has 35% (formula: ((8-1)*5)) of his original parry value (because it's really hard to deflect a spear with a makeshift knife), dropping to a 3.5% chance. On the other hand, Gronan receives his full parry percentages (10%), because a shiv is rather easy to deflect, being small and unwieldy compared to a spear.
Thanks for the detailed feedback.
Quote
Yeah, i'd seriously consider you getting the first step for rebalancing to normalize percentages, or at the very least apply some curve behaviour (min/max percentages with hardcaps). I see a huge potential on your changes so far, though, good job.
Luckily it's done already by default on the game itself. I only had to add a hardcap on parry chances (90%). Still can be improved, because I want highly skilled fighters that are able to deal with penalties derived from health conditions (Normalized internally by Vanilla) also to cancel some of the Parry Counter penalties... For doing that, sadly, I need to dig deeper into vanilla normalization process, which will invariably mean higher chance of collisions with another mod that may do the same. So I hope that for now, this will suffice.
QuoteIf you want a suggestion for further improvement, make parry weights for weapons. A shiv, for instance would have a parry weight of 1, and larger weapons, such as the spear, of 8. Larger difference in parry weights reduce your parry chances by a factor of N, where N is the difference between the parry weight.
Nice suggestion... What in some RPGs is modeled as "wielding difficulty" or pairs of Weapon Size vs Parry Size.
The issue with adding new "per weapon" mechanics is the vast array of mods that add new types of items to the game... I would actually have to classify a potential unkown ammount of new items.
As I want ppl to add this mod into their prefered playstyle immediatly... I would like to avoid triggering "unexpected" gameplay interactions because a given "new weapon" is not classified properly.
That's why I forced myself to relay strictly on Vanilla stats/concepts. In the current system, the smaller weapon should have less HP than the bigger one meaning it would be able to whistand less parries. It's a weak relation, I know, because it full of anomalous cases... But after inspecting most popular Mod additions they more or less follow the logic:
- Heavier/Bigger weapons = More HP.
- Faster weapons = Less damage per hit.
As you can guess I can't forsee in detail how each player will combine what this mod provides with the repertory of items his current mod suite offers.
On a related topic... I have a Draft to provide an independent Parry Chance Stat, not just for the looks, but to allow weapon creators to add Parry Chance offsets derived from gear. I think this could address what you look for indirectly, by making some weapons increase/decrease the Parry Chance of their wielders. This feature, sadly, is one of those requiring leaving potential items ingame with a stat definition that WILL NOT be recognized in the event a savegame is loaded without the MOD responsible of creating them active :(, so for now it's a feature on Hold.
To be completely honest, this huge amount of game-breaking (in a good sense) changes you have in this mod outweights the restriction you want to impose on the mod to not break vanilla saves.
EDIT: About parries. A guard in a weapon adds tremendously in effectiveness to parry incoming attacks, but it means nothing if the enemy is swinging a huge, heavy hammer at you. The case "dagger parries two-handed axe" is the woe of all parry mechanics, and you mentioned the perfect correction: size differences. Vanilla Rimworld can only go so far regarding combat, and your suggestions improve it drastically, though I'm highly skeptical of the "Capture Mode"; if you could mesh together the Capture+Stun mode for something used for both capturing and disabling pawns.
Double damage means higher chance of maiming. I'd be careful with that mechanic; a flat, small percentage bonus would be more predictable and less rage-inducing. Though I'm perfectly fine with that as a way of saying "you can kill them more easily", not everyone has the same understanding.
That would be great to have a specific key binding to cycle modes instead of override the key to use weapon.
That would be great too to to able to set the combat mode of multiple selected pawns.
Razzoriel, you take the "parry" by the word. But parry in this case is just the overtopic for all possible kind forms to avoid/reduce damage.
You are right you can't parry a 2h hammer/axe with a dagger like you could do it against a sword.
But evade/dodge the hammer swing with an agile dagger fighter is possible or ? Since other damage reductions beside parry arn't in (yet) just let it simple and let them just parry all.
But I think too, kill and capture mode should work different.
Maybe kill mode , aim at special body regions like head/organs but with lowered hit chance and longer aiming time.
Similar for capture mode, only would work with blunt weapon and aim at head, with a percent chance to get incap. from the blow.
Disarm/cripple mode, aim at hand/arm.
You take into presumption that because a pawn has a dagger, he is more agile. A parry is what it is; a deflection of an incoming attack with your weapon. You can't deflect attacks with a weapon if the size difference is too big. There are variables I'm not even considering here, such as a caveman's club being big and heavy, and thus ineffective in deflecting attacks compared to a sword with a fullhand guard, such as a rapier.
Look, Rimworld takes into consideration real wounding and combat mechanics into their code. I won't mind the same vanilla principles to be applied there; knives being able to block gladii, sure I can get through that. But not full-sized swords and spears. At the same time, I think a sword can block another sword or even a mace when properly wielded, but not a spear.
If you want to bring the argument that melee skill should override size differences, I'd say yea, maybe, but its also important to note the more complicated the code gets, the harder it is to balance everything and keep it in-line with vanilla. A simple parry coeficient in a weapon which is set against other weapons would be enough to drastically reduce the parry discrepancies.
Thanks for the feedback, Wishmaster.
QuoteThat would be great to have a specific key binding to cycle modes instead of override the key to use weapon.
Certainly, not only great... Is a must have. I will check why the injected button is "hijacking" the Weapon use key... I probably did something wrong.
QuoteThat would be great too to to able to set the combat mode of multiple selected pawns.
Isn't it working for you? That's the whole point of selecting exactly that Detour... To take advantage of Vanilla multicast when multiple pawns are selected. One caveat, activating the button brodcasts "Use NEXT mode" to all pawns... Which is not equal to "Put ALL pawns" into this mode, as the resulting pawns will not have THE SAME attack mode, unless they all were in the SAME mode before selecting them. Do you think it's more intuitive as a "reset" button? Because I can try to mimic what vanilla does on binary controls when, on multi selection, you get a button per unique state of any member on the selection... The problem with a multistate button is that you can potentially fill the UI while showing all available options.
Oh never mind... actually it is not working only when at first, selected pawns don't have the same mode. Still something to be fixed maybe.
QuoteOh never mind... actually it is not working only when at first, selected pawns don't have the same mode. Still something to be fixed maybe.
I already internally fixed the shortcut problem to use the Default M (Misc 7), which I find mnemotechnically easier to remember ("M"elee is a term that's used over different languages, even :) ) while preventing the "hijacking" from happening.
As the error is not crippling I will hold releasing a new version until any of the following happens:
a) Find a solution to your multiselection suggestion. Certainly, players used to RTS controls EXPECT that the result of an order applied to a group of units leaves ALL units on the same state.
b) Solve the incompatibility with "Defensive Possitions". I depend on a report I made to Harmony creator to even start with a solution... So.
Any (Or been optimist BOTH) of the above points really qualify for a subversion release. I don't want to spam users with a version per minute approach ;).
= NEW VERSION 1.3.1 =
Changes:
- Using Shortcut "M" (Misc 7) as default.
- RTS behaviour on Attack Mode button when multiple pawns are selected.
Some comments:
- Attack Mode button now leaves ALL selected pawns in the same state, instead of the previous behaviour were EACH selected pawn used the next attack mode. This behaviour is more intuitive as it matches the generalized behaviour of how most RTS games approach multicasting orders to groups of units. Thanks to Wishmaster for pointing BOTH problems solved into this release.
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
I'm getting an empty zip file whenever I try to download the release versions... :/ what do I do?
That's weird... Maybe it's the browser. If you have problems with yours, try to use this link (https://github.com/oreganor/Melee_Rebalance/releases) (it's the repository itself) and there you will find all the zip files. Latest version is 1.3.1.
EDIT: All links use HTTPS... Check that your browser/firewall/setup is allowing you to use them.
For some reason I can only download the source code but it doesn't seem to be functional in the game. The full release version gives me an empty zip file though. I used the repository link but it gives me the same issue.
Mmmm... Browser (Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer, etc) and OS (And their versions if possible)? Happens with this mod only? Crazy ideas:
- Your Antivirus is detecting an unsigned dll and deleting the zip file.
Check the attachment on this reply... It's a bandaid, but may help you spot the issue. It's the zip file of the current release.
[attachment deleted by admin due to age]
I tried with chrome, Internet Explorer, and microsoft Edge and yeah it only happens with this mod. I even restarted my pc and the attached file gives me the same issue. I turned off everything antivirus related as well. I'm on windows 10 version 1607. But when I try to download the file it doesn't even attempt to download it. It just gets a zip file and then puts nothing in it.
holy shit I got it. It was an issue with the windows extraction program. I used 7-zip and it worked.
Edit: Thanks a lot for your cooperation and quick responses. I can't tell you how much I appreciate it and your mod. Also I confirmed it works in game. Again thank you for helping me figure that out. I would've been so frustrated if I had to play this game without this beautiful mod.
Ah k... That's the next thing I was going to try, to send you a .rar instead. Glad you found the issue and reported back... I was about to enter into "Real Exotic Issues" mode :). Hope you enjoy the mod.
No the archive is working, just window's don't like this compression because it isn't zip i think.
You can open it with winrar or 7z but not with windows explorer.
Yes this is what we found out. For some reason it doesn't like whatever compression it's doing. On a sidenote, I love this mod. It would be really cool to eventually see a ranged version of this that allows you to target certain body parts.
Perhaps the attack modes could use the same modes as melee for simplicity.
For example, the kill mode would give you like a 25% percent chance to hit your target in the neck or any subcategory which includes the head (so long as it has a "neck" node).
The capture mode could target the legs
The disarm mode could target the arms
The stun mode could target the body exclusively with a slightly increased hit chance.
You said you were reaching the limits of what you could do without breaking save games but I believe these things could be implemented without too much difficulty as you have already done an amazing job with the melee side of things.
Of course I don't want to take the utility away from melee so I would assume that ranged attacks don't get the reduced damage or special effects like the knockout, they just allow you to target specific body parts provided you have a good enough shot on the target. Using the threshold system you already put in place, you could say that you'll only get the headshot bonus % if you already have at least a 30% shot on your target.
If nothing else this will at least make me consider putting a damn helmet on my colonists for once.
= NEW VERSION 1.3.2 =
Changes:
- Added overlays to Attack Mode button to describe effective chances of a special effect to happen.
- Compatibility with "Defensive Positions" mod.
Some comments:
- Now each time a Drafted pawn attempts a melee attack, his/her Attack Mode button will change based on how likely the Special Effect was to be applied to his current target. Some Examples:
| (http://i.imgur.com/CQoB2C5.png) | No Chance
This Pawn didn't have a chance to Disarm his target on the last attack attempted.
|
| (http://i.imgur.com/q8AHUcc.png) | Low Chances
This pawn had low chances to Stun his target on the last melee attack attempted.
|
| (http://i.imgur.com/wLdnIMo.png) | Decent Chances
This Pawn had decent chances to Capture his target on the last attack.
|
This Overlays will change dynamically over a fight... So pay attention to them to know when a given Attack Mode has a decent chance to trigger the effect you look for. While paused, you can scroll over the different modes to know what would have happened if the Pawn would have been using another Mode. I hope this helps at figuring out what happens "behind the scenes", take the best decission while in-fight, and understand better the role each Mode can play on a given situation.
- After some intense headbanging, now I developed a strategy to deal with Detour Collisions from Mods that do not use Harmony. The 1st benefit is that now you all can enjoy full features of this mod while having "Defensive Positions" active.
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
Thanks for the enthusiastic feedback, Pokk720
QuoteOn a sidenote, I love this mod. It would be really cool to eventually see a ranged version of this that allows you to target certain body parts.
Sadly, there are already mods around that try to "spice up" ranged combat. I wouldn't like to force users to choose between mods. I try hard to control how much Vanilla features my mod uses/tweaks so more players can find a "spot" to use this mod without making others obsolete/less interesting...
...I'm trying to ADD content so players can have more options to tweak their game experience, that's all.
I see. One of the best things about this mod is it's compatibility. It makes it a must have. But I personally don't use any of the ranged combat mods because I find that none of them add as much dynamic to the game as this mod does.
I'm still pulling for someone to make a ranged targeting system. I'm tired of having to shoot every toe off of an elephant before I can take it to be butchered.
Help! Had a Tribal raid and one of the enemies went mental trying to decide whether to attack the nearby door or the nearby colonist. He constantly flicked between "Melee attacking Slate door" and "Watching for targets" while my colonist killed him, and then my FPS plummeted.
I checked the dev log and this error is tallying up into the thousands:
System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
at MeleeRebalance.VerbMeleeTryCastShotPatch.Prefix (RimWorld.Verb_MeleeAttack,bool&) <0x0008d>
at (wrapper dynamic-method) RimWorld.Verb_MeleeAttack.TryCastShot_Patch1 (object) <0x0002b>
at Verse.Verb.TryCastNextBurstShot () <0x0001a>
at Verse.Verb.VerbTick () <0x00028>
at Verse.VerbTracker.VerbsTick () <0x00034>
at Verse.Pawn_EquipmentTracker.EquipmentTrackerTick () <0x00057>
at Verse.Pawn.Tick () <0x001b1>
at RimWorld.Planet.WorldPawns.WorldPawnsTick () <0x00170>
at RimWorld.Planet.World.WorldTick () <0x00017>
at Verse.TickManager.DoSingleTick () <0x001d7>
Verse.Log:Error(String)
Verse.TickManager:DoSingleTick()
Verse.TickManager:TickManagerUpdate()
Verse.Game:Update()
Verse.Root_Play:Update()
I've tried restarting the game, getting rid of the pawn (But the error is that there is no pawn to reference, so that shouldn't have any effect anyway), turning Melee Re-balance off. The error remains and is slowing my game to a crawl.
Any advice?
I assume Melee_Rebalance you were using was the last version (1.3.2), right?
QuoteI've tried restarting the game, getting rid of the pawn (But the error is that there is no pawn to reference, so that shouldn't have any effect anyway), turning Melee Re-balance off. The error remains and is slowing my game to a crawl.
Just to clarify... You got into the bugged state playing normally, you saved, turned Melee Rebalance Off, reload and you got the same error? Or the game just halted? (Can you try to do exactly that... But activating Dev Console on the Menu BEFORE loading?. Some errors aren't critical enought to show Dev Console BUT may be leaving your game into a "semifreezing" state). It would rock to have the Dev Console report of were Vanilla is failing even with my Mod off.
It would rock even more :) to have BOTH savegames, the original & the one with MR off still triggering the anomalous state... Can you upload the savegames somewhere (google drive for example) and send me a link so I can take a look at them?
In the meantime, I will try to reproduce the state... It may have to do with the Pawn loosing his weapon unexpectedly on a parry... Just by chance, do you remember seeing a forbidden melee weapon nearby?
UPDATE: After checking multiple scenarios I've isolated 2 possible causes of that error. Both seems to suggest that effectively, Vanilla, somehow "lost" target/attacker data and that's why MeleeRebalance fails and why that savegame keeps failing even WITHOUT the Mod on. But to keep investigating I REALLY need that you confirm me EXACTLY which version of the Mod you were using at the time of the error you posted. The chances that you have met a truly Vanilla bug is high... Because the 2 vulnerabilities on my mod are the same vulnerabilities Vanilla has on the situation you describe. OFC, the interesting part would be to know how your game reached that state in the 1st place... :). But that part of the investigation comes later.
= NEW VERSION 1.4.0 =
Changes:
- AI will now use different Attack Modes based on individual pawn's goals & capabilities.
- Tweaked Attack Modes thresholds & chances.
- Reduced Parry counter penalty.
Some comments:
- All pawns with Humanlike intellect (Animals and other primitive entities still default to "Kill" mode) will take now in consideration their own skill and their current target state to select an appropiate Attack Mode with decent chances to trigger the associated special effect. Combined with the tweaks on Attack Modes you will see, generally speaking, that skilled AI fighters will try to minimize the damage an enemy does to them trying to stun, disarm or even trying to incapacitate their targets in a single hit. This means you have to keep an extra eye on mentally unstable Skilled Melee colonists... If they suffer a Major break that puts them into Berserk trance, they will be deadlier than before.
- The next focus will be on the different auditive & visual notifications the Mod uses to bring your attention to what happens on the game. This means it will take more time than the previous features, as I need to explore how the underlaying engine does them and then trying to make my poor artisthical skills to yield something that really comes as an improvement of the current state... So I'm not even sure I can make the whole situation better :).
The mod is STILL savegame friendly. When/If I do something that leaves a trace on the savegame I will clearly announce it.
The "Latest" file link downloads an invalid .ZIP
Melee_Rebalance_1.4.0.zip shows as invalid.
Another user got a similar problem and we traced the issue to the unpacker tool he was using on his W10 machine... The .zip itself is a regular zip file made with Winrar 5.21. Can you check that the tool you are using to access it can deal with it? For example, you can try to download the source code .zip files on the repository to see if you have the same problems. Those are generated automatically by Github using specific widely known "standard" zip tools.
(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/1b/45/55/1b455574bea0d6a57fd7faa7232d80e2.jpg) | I've noticed that a lot of ranged weapons list a rating for the range Touch, which I'm guessing is melee range.
But they don't sound like they're firing shots, and the animations look like they're basically attempting to bayonet or bludgeon their opponent with a ranged weapon.
Does this mod make changes to what happens when a guy with a pistol meets a guy with a club? |
QuoteDoes this mod make changes to what happens when a guy with a pistol meets a guy with a club?
Not specifically... When you are armed with a weapon that's not classified as a melee weapon Pawns melee with their unarmed melee stats (You can check them on their Descriptions) This is vanilla behaviour, I don't go as high in the code as to change anything related to that... I just work ONCE a Pawn decides to use a melee attack.
ATM a high skilled pawn in melee will be able to use Attack Modes with or without a melee weapon equiped... The only "drawback" they have is that they can't "shield" themselves on a parry completely by letting their melee weapon eat the damage, they always take some damage. Obviously most Pawns do less damage unarmed than armed (But with the repertory of Bionics some mods give... This may not hold true in all cases :) ).
AFAIK nothing prevents a ranged weapon to be ALSO labeled as a potential melee weapon... My code just checks for that flag to distinguish which ones can be used to parry.
I can investigate to see if ranged weapons used as makeshift melee weapons are somekind of tag I can detect from inside melee resolution so they can be used to parry... But ATM I can't force pawns to use a given weapon, that's decided by the AI modules.
oreganor,
I think it is realy time to rename the mod archive from .zip to .7z or .rar.
Or use .zip compress methode that is compactible with windows explorer ! :-)
I use .rar myself but... For some reasson packing binaries on Github in zip format has become somehow a "standard". I suppose that as Github compresses sources using it, most modders prefer to use the same format on all associated files (We don't have to... When uploading binaries you can select a lot of compressed formats, at least I tried .rar, .7z and they all are accepted) but I see the logic behind, and been new to this, I prefered to follow the "common etiquette" most mods published on Github show.
At first i want honor you, you give us gamer/downloader a straight link to the download archiv. Not like other they just point to github !
But, it can't be github, when i use the the github function to clone/download the master i am geting a .zip file that works with windows explorer.
When i download the Source code (zip) i am geting a working zip archive either.
I am sorry i have no clue how you upload these things on github i just thought you generate the release file by yourself and put there.
But currently you are the only one, from many other github project i encounter this problem, you should maybe take a another closer look into this.
Don't forget the dump steam workshop windows user ! :-)
Thanks for the report... So far all ppl having problems with the .zip file I link (The one I generate using winrar) also got problems with the zip files generated by github.
I will investigate if I can spot the problem on the packaging phase.
On Winrar, when you add files to an archive you can select
Archivformat "Rar , Rar5, Zip".
When i select Zip, then winrar normaly generates a filename with zip, and that archive works with win explorer.
Maybe you setup your winrar to use Rar/rar5 methode but keep the zip ending.
Not at home ATM... But that could be perfectly possible. I don't remember the exact command line I used on the autopack script, but thanks to your point it's the 1st thing I will check when I arrive.
QuoteOn Winrar, when you add files to an archive you can select
Archivformat "Rar , Rar5, Zip".
When i select Zip, then winrar normaly generates a filename with zip, and that archive works with win explorer.
Maybe you setup your winrar to use Rar/rar5 methode but keep the zip ending.
Absolutely spot on!... My scripts were using rar.exe, which DO NOT generate zip format (even if you try the option). Meanwhile, the UI, relays on Winrar, which generates valid zip files. That's why I was been puzzled on why "sometimes" it did work and sometimes it didn't (I was mixing zip file creation methods).
Now EVERYTHING uses Winrar executable and generates appropiate .zip files. I've replaced the last release "zip" file with a true zip, not a rar in disguise. Thanks a lot for pointing this out... Probably I have been making this mistake YEARS without realizing it until now.
If it's not much of a hassle, can you check that it's working now on your side as it should?
Yep, working perfect now !
Still not fully compatible with Defensive Positions eh?
Mmm... Nobody has reported issues since I released the version (1.3.2) that was tested with it. Which kind of issues you have with both activated?
The option to switch attack type. Using kill, capture, stun or disarm doesn't appear as an option when I have Defensive positions installed. There is only the Defensive position button. When I uninstall Defensive poisitions, your options appear.
Weird, since 1.3.2 both buttons should appear. A possible explanation is that a new release of DP has changed something that affects how I do the "patch".
Can you tell me which versions of this mod and DP mod are you using? Latest on both?
And did you tried to move the modload order maybe that can help too.
QuoteAnd did you tried to move the modload order maybe that can help too.
I did an specific effort to patch the detour in a way that mod load order wouldn't be affected by it... An user could even load MeleeRebalance BEFORE hugslib (The requirement for DP... And the responsible to really loadup defs and detours) and still work as it should.
Not at home ATM (But reading DP changelog, doesn't seem it has changed since I did my compatibility) and still awaiting for version confirmation by Zhivago... But another possibility is that a 3rd modification is trying to access the button adding code, which will be a permanent "compatibility menace" :) because it's a very attractive spot to add command buttons for mods that want to provide users with extra orders for their pawns.
But to provide help to Zhivago, after what I learned with the "winrar" problem... I better go 1 step at a time :).
I do run a rather extensive mod collection. I will do some more testing and then give you an indepth response.
QuoteI do run a rather extensive mod collection. I will do some more testing and then give you an indepth response.
Much appreciated, I would like to fix as much incompatibilities as possible so users can integrate this mod in their prefered gamestyle.
I like a developer that's committed to their user-base :)
For reference, I run a large mod collection. It's called "Rimworld++ 2.0"
Here is a link to the mod collection I use: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=902774116
Here is a link the mod load order I use: https://gist.github.com/DrZhivago1/e1c764e46de33748421e803e624ba53e
Here are the steps I have taken in testing your mod:
I deleted your mod from my mod folder.
I then downloaded your mod, version "Melee_Rebalance_1.4.0.zip" from the releases section on your github.
I put your mod into my mod folder and proceeded to test different load orders.
I made it last in my load order, I put it underneath architect sense, I placed it directly above "Defensive Positions", and I placed it directly below Defensive Positions.
For each of these 4 tests I always restarted the Rimworld client, started a new game, and your mod was the only mod being moved in load order. Your melee options did not appear.
I then deactivated "Defensive Positions" and tried to test load orders.
I loaded your mod in the same load order as "Defensive Positions", I loaded it last, and I loaded it underneath Architect Sense.
For each of these 3 tests I always restarted the Rimworld client, started a new game, and your mod was the only mod being moved in load order. For each of these 3 tests your melee options appeared and were useable.
Throughout all of my testing, I never got any new error logs.
Ok no new error logs,
but the question was, do you got both buttons, the one from Mellee rebalanced and the one from Def. Positions ?
Quote from: Canute on April 19, 2017, 12:52:10 PM
Ok no new error logs,
but the question was, do you got both buttons, the one from Mellee rebalanced and the one from Def. Positions ?
Quote from: Dr_Zhivago on April 19, 2017, 12:36:34 PMYour melee options did not appear.
Only when I removed "Defensive Positions" did the melee options appear. The defense positions button and the melee attack type button never appeared together.
Thanks for the detailed test and the exhaustive mod list, Dr_Zhivago, I will get it and investigate the issue.
Still can't reproduce the situation. A couple of questions, Dr_Zhivago:
- With Defensive Possitions on AND Melee Rebalance on, when you draft a pawn with a ranged weapon, you get the "Allow firing" button? It you don't, can you check if you get it when you DISABLE Melee Rebalance and keep Defensive Possitions on?
- Can you open the debug log RIGHT after starting RIMWORLD (But BEFORE loading your colony) with BOTH mods on? A series of yellow lines starting with "Melee Rebalance:" like the following should appear:
Melee Rebalance: Defensive Possitions Mod active. Adapting Detours.
If they do appear, can you post the entire log somewhere so I can take a look at it? Or report back IF NOTHING related to Melee Rebalance appears in the initial log?
-With Defensive Positions AND Melee Rebalance active, drafted pawns with ranged weapons have the "allow firing" button.
-Here is a link to my debug log RIGHT after starting Rimworld and BEFORE loading my colony, with BOTH mods active: https://gist.github.com/HugsLibRecordKeeper/19c2e5019ea9f4c367ee93e4803a4a29
Your mod appears to have no logs upon startup.
Couple questions for you:
-Did you install the entire mod collection I linked above?
-If so, did you load the steam mods, external mods, and mod config from a completely vanilla Rimworld?
Edit
The debug log posted above is made by doing this:
-Using an entirely vanilla rimworld
-Installing the mod collection I posted above (ie: subscribing to steam mods, installing external mods, and installing the mod config)
-I then installed your mod and loaded it directly beneath Defensive Positions, as you can see in the debug log.
Perfect, thanks again for the detailed reply... For some reasson MR is NOT detecting Defensive Possitions when installed through steam (It does detect the same version when installed manually from this forums), that's why there is no debug info coming from my Mod, it only appears when it detects a mod that has to adapt to...
...I need to dig a bit on the differences regarding loading order/identification between an "external" mod and one that's referenced on mod_config through its ID on the workshop. It's very strange because what I do, in fact, is checking the reference of the .dll of the mod itself, which is the same doesn't matter what... There is still the possibility of WHEN I check for it.
I discarded any 3rd mod interaction after you confirmed that ONLY removing DP made the button back, the way the Detour is made, if there were another collision, it should also supress MR WITHOUT DP on. I'm assuming that, as you didn't mention it, the ONLY portion of MR that doesn't work when DP is on is just the button... Your pawns should be parrying and defaulting to "Kill Mode" as on MR versions prior to 1.3.2.
The fact that you are seeing at the same time "Allow Firing" and DP button, is possible because DP Detour is working properly in "chained mode", which is exactly what my own detour follows, just to Add and let the rest of the system keep on adding buttons.
EDIT: Will not be at home until tomorrow but there is another difference between an "external mod" and one installed through Steam... The Physical Path of were the .dll file resides, which is part of how some internal calls of Rimworld identify the mods... From memory, mods installed from this forums usually reside on a "descriptive" folder, meanwhile, workshop mods have their numeric ID as folder name... It's perfectly possible that I did some stupid mistake as to compare strings instead of references while "detecting" DP .dll.
Glad we've *hopefully* figured out the issue. If I can provide any other help, let me know.
QuoteGlad we've *hopefully* figured out the issue. If I can provide any other help, let me know.
Attached is a Candidate version of Melee Rebalance that changes the way Defensive Positions is detected so it doesn't contain ANY reference to physical paths. It should fix not only the problem of Workshop mod detection but also prevent failures if for some reasson a user decides to change the default folder name DP is distributed with.
It's a dedicated fix to be sure it solves the apparent source of your problem... I still want to experiment to see if I can get a more robust way to detect a Mod pressence, this one can be "confused" if multiple versions of the same Mod are active at the same time (It's a strange situation most users/mods aren't expected to be... But it's a matter of code robustness). If I don't find a better way, I will "elevate" this fix to a true hotfix in a few days.
It would rock that you report back how it looks after you use this Candidate Version.
[attachment deleted by admin due to age]
Candidate Version appears to work fine. It also now has the debug logs that you previously mentioned
Nice, enjoy all the features of the mod then. In a few days I will release a hotfix with the changes of the Candidate version included, so you can use the same versions as any1 else.
Thanks a lot for the help provided that helped improving this mod.
With teamwork, anything is possible! Nice dedication to your work.
Ok one more thing you might add to the mod.
Do you ever curse the thing that you can let a group of pawn attack with click, but you never can let the group mellee attack the target.
When you got a group of pure mellee fighter with weapons you got the button, but not when they are unarmed (because of bionics) or carry a ranged weapon (A1000 with bajonett).
Or when you want safe a confused pawn, because it is to cold for him, or a manhunter/raid is incoming. But you can't mellee attack him when you don't carry a mellee weapon.
So i think a button for mellee attack when a pawn is drafted would be nice.
Is this mod discontinued? Or is it still compatible with A17?
In its current form, it's discontinued. A17 includes a rebalance of Melee Skill progression/levels and a new dodge mechanic that makes a skilled melee combatant inherently more resistant, nullifying the main objective of my mod...
...Only the "critical" mechanics are worth saving, but as a rewrite of the mod (even the name do not apply now :) ).
Tbh I have been so busy this months that I haven't even installed the new A17 version to play it :). When I retake Rimworld I will create a new mod that contains melee combat extensions, but no promises on when it will happen.