I've been playing Rimworld since the days of Alpha 7 (that's quite a few alpha versions prior to Steam Release). TBH, I think overall the game has been made much easier since then ... manhunter packs would instantly target doors if your colonists were inside, and toxic fallout was much worse (its been strongly nerfed since -- originally nothing would survive, including trees or plants, and it could persist for years).
Part of me longs for those days, and yet some things seem a bit overpowered -- like a drop-in mech attack. Dropped right in my kitchen, and the Scythers that emerged one-shot killed (that is, the first shot instantly killed) a colonist that was behind cover despite having both power armor AND a power helmet. They also one-shot killed both of my colony Wargs. This despite my having a significant numbers advantage. I've defeated several Poison ships only by using snipers, slow-kiting the mechs at range by continuously focusing my snipers on the fastest mechs with ranged weapons. However, the drop-in mech attack gave no opportunity for this, and ultimately it destroyed most of the equipment in my kitchen, its walls, and the equipment in a general purpose room which had the dining table, recreational equipment and my electric tailor stations and research desks.
Power armor and helmet is expensive, but seems a waste that Sycthers with charged lancers seem to completely negate it. One-shot kills despite armor or how tough wargs are supposed to be seems a bit imbalanced now in relation to everything else.
Unfairness is a part of Rimworld, though, and I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing. It does seem like Scythers are a bit too strong, though, if the "best" armor that is hard-to-get is mostly useless against them along with genetically engineered super-animals.
Do you mean lancers or scythers? They got split into two types now. Lancers are dead if you get in close and melee them. In a small space they are doomed. Scythers can be nasty though I have had success vs them in drop pod raids with a melee in plate and helm holding the door and several shooters behind them. If you have 3 melee in a row in front of a door then all 3 can melee the single scyther that can get out at a time.
Use melee fighters.
Scyther drop raids are the reason I put Deadfalls in my hallways. They can't be melee'd safely (which is proper) but they also deflect lots of bullets, which kinda sucks.
Well, on the bright side, it sounds like you're playing Beta 18. In 1.0 they're changing how armor works so that instead of mitigating damage and still having your level 20 melee guy in full power armor getting punched to death by a bunch of one-armed nobodies and taking ALL the hits at 1 damage....
Armor is being changed so that attacks will deflect entirely off of body parts if armor is high enough. Theoretically you can fend off a massive group and take no hits if you have good enough armor, soon.
Spears are actually very effective against mechanoids, since spears often target internals and the only internal that a scyther (or lancer and centipede for that matter) has is... the artificial brain.
As a result, with a spear, or ikwa, it isn't too uncommon to one-hit kill scythers. Longswords, gladii and knives are also decent since they are also capable of stabbing, but they don't stab as often as ikwas or spears so they won't be as effective. Stay away from clubs and maces though; they are basically traps in their current state.
Quote from: XeoNovaDan on July 14, 2018, 06:05:33 PM
Spears are actually very effective against mechanoids, since spears often target internals and the only internal that a scyther (or lancer and centipede for that matter) has is... the artificial brain.
As a result, with a spear, or ikwa, it isn't too uncommon to one-hit kill scythers. Longswords, gladii and knives are also decent since they are also capable of stabbing, but they don't stab as often as ikwas or spears so they won't be as effective. Stay away from clubs and maces though; they are basically traps in their current state.
There's no way this lasts more than a few versions.
It's lasted for a fair few builds (I discovered and shared this info like a week ago, also technically been a thing since B18), but yeah, this strat will probably be nerfed at some point.
Quote from: XeoNovaDan on July 14, 2018, 06:05:33 PM
Stay away from clubs and maces though; they are basically traps in their current state.
Hello darkness my old friend
All it takes is for Tynan to make a couple more internal "organs" for mechanoids. Then hitting the brain with say a 33% chance could mean something. However, I dont understand why Lancers and Scythers have drastically different armor values. Arent they the same mechanoid, only programmed to have different functions? A 5%-10% difference as reinforcements or whatever would make sense, but Scythers currently are just a little below a Centipede's armor, while being so fast.
EMP grenades help greatly. I usually have a couple of pawns with them equipped in case of a mech drop. If I get a different raid, they go and swap out.
At least in 1.0 I've had okay luck fighting them in melee, but it's very RNG heavy. I had a raid where a lancer one hit a pawn and then a scycther ran up and did the same. But, this colony is on day 216 on Cassandra Extreme without reloading and those two times were the only times it's happened.
Quote from: Razzoriel on July 15, 2018, 12:15:53 PM
All it takes is for Tynan to make a couple more internal "organs" for mechanoids. Then hitting the brain with say a 33% chance could mean something. However, I dont understand why Lancers and Scythers have drastically different armor values. Arent they the same mechanoid, only programmed to have different functions? A 5%-10% difference as reinforcements or whatever would make sense, but Scythers currently are just a little below a Centipede's armor, while being so fast.
Scythers may have good armour but very low HP so they die easily. If you set your base up right they aren't an issue (not talking about making a killbox)
Yesterday I had a scyther attack, and about 8 colonists with mid-game weapons unloaded on it. It managed to move from rifle range all the way to 2-3 tiles away from my colonists before it died. It was laughable how much punishment a single scyther takes.
Quote from: ZaPhobos on July 14, 2018, 05:51:41 PM
Well, on the bright side, it sounds like you're playing Beta 18. In 1.0 they're changing how armor works so that instead of mitigating damage and still having your level 20 melee guy in full power armor getting punched to death by a bunch of one-armed nobodies and taking ALL the hits at 1 damage....
Armor is being changed so that attacks will deflect entirely off of body parts if armor is high enough. Theoretically you can fend off a massive group and take no hits if you have good enough armor, soon.
No, I'm playing experimental 1.0.
I meant lancer. My pawn in power armor was killed in a single shot by a mech at range, as was my warg.
I always get the impression when complaints about scythers pop up that people aren't taking advantage of the new Stopping Power mechanic. It's very effective for kiting.
Scythers only move at 4.8 which is only marginally faster than an unencumbered colonist at 4.61.
Anyone with a bionic leg can simply outrun scythers.
Even someone in power armor with a bionic leg moves marginally faster at 4.84
Squirrels are actually faster :P
Revolvers followed by Pump Action shotguns have the shortest firing cycles and can very effectively slow scythers to a crawl. They're not the most effective damage dealers as the armor penetration on both is reasonably low but since all you really need is for the scythers to be slower they work just fine.
It doesn't really matter how many shots they shrug off so long as they don't actually touch you.. and stopping power can provide that. Especially combined with emp.
Charge lances of your own are worth considering as well - Fairly long firing cycles so you have to be a bit careful with positioning but they've got stopping power and excellent armor penetration. A charge lance shot to the leg of a scyther will halve its move speed even before factoring in stopping power.
Bolt-action rifles of course are the best of both worlds - Faster firing cycles than charge lances, better armor penetration and range than shotguns and revolvers while still having the stopping power required.
Lmgs can be used too although I find them to be quite inaccurate. Maybe if you're firing into a large crowd but *shrug* can give it a whirl.
Mostly though you just don't want scythers to be able to touch you and well.. that's just not very hard if you're willing to let them do a bit of damage to whatever structures you happen to have around where they land.
If they're running at you from a map edge then there's a fair chance you can use critical mass to simply gib them as they run in - Autocannons will blow them to bits.
It sucks to have them land in your kitchen but.. if you can move pawns out of that room what is there that they can really destroy? A stove and some doors? A lamp?
It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking you have to prevent every enemy from doing any damage to your base but.. strictly speaking it's often the correct call to let them do some damage while you engage them piecemeal and in ideal scenarios.
As for Lancers.. well shield belts and melee are a pretty hard counter to them. They're very fragile and not much of a threat when you close in on them. They're actually faster than Scythers at 5.00 but they won't attempt to flee from you and their speed can be leveraged against them as they'll follow your colonists around corners.
Exchanging fire with them can be dangerous but *shrug* often it's optional. Mechs aren't tactical geniuses.
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All of this is not to say that scythers and lancers aren't dangerous in their own ways - and if they catch you unprepared or they're engaged in a scrappy manner they've got very volatile weapons that have a fairly high chance of murdering your pawns.
I've certainly experienced the "oh god that's a scyther and I'm not prepared for this" and had someone's leg immediately lopped off.
And the always classic "Oh god that's a charge lance and there's no way to break line of sight" only to have it dome someone.
And in large, mixed groups it can be hard to separate out the two kinds. It's manageable in my experience though.
It does suck but ultimately the best course of action with both types of light mechs is to not let them even attempt to do what they're best at in the first place.