Said this a couple of times in the big 1.0 megathread but I should probably be polite and make it a formal suggestion.
There are various frustrations with the armor system. Pawns can't change quickly into armor, and in any event it has to be micromanaged. There's no good way of having decent armor and also good temperature regulation.
My suggestion - flak variants of clothes.
Rather than a specific "flak jacket" that always uses steel and cloth, the capacity to make a jacket out of whatever material you like, and fix wood/steel/plasteel/gold/uranium plates to it.
The plates would give a bit of a movement debuff but an armor buff.
Same with pants, dusters, cowboy hats, tuques.
If you ever split up crafting, this would be a good "dual skill" task requiring tailoring/crafting. As it is they're the same skill at the moment anyway so it wouldn't really matter.
I think this would make the flak stuff a *lot* more useful, and also would help with the lore/story stuff of having colonists armor be more ragtag and obviously patched together, rather than literal suits of plate armor/power armor.
For the head you have helmets. No need to make flak cowboy hats and tuques
Helmets don't do temperature regulation.
They do, but only a bit. Flak cowboy hats are unrealistic.
What exactly do you mean "unrealistic"?
well I'd imagine it would fall of your head if some one shot the top of it. it has no chin strap. also the divot in directs the built towards the center of the skull. Perhaps a hybrid? the advanced helmet with a wool liner a brim and a little vent in the top to let the heat out?
An armored Tuque and the rest seems fine. Tuques are already helmet-ish shaped and armored plates wouldn't hurt the insulation that much. Perhaps just call it an insulated helmet? Same with the jacket.
Instead of making all armor types have flak variants, why not just make the current flak recipes use all textiles? Use something like camel-hair to get a bit of a bonus to temperature. Use devilstrand, and get bonus damage resist. We've already got armor vests and power armor, for high amounts of armor and damage-resist. Plus, heavy plate-laden dusters and parkas makes no sense.
It doesn't seem that wild to me that someone in a frontier environment might want a cowboy hat with a brim to keep the sun off, but would rivet a couple of thin plates to it if they thought they might get shot. Idk I'm not married to the idea, it doesn't utterly beggar belief.
Certainly introducing Stuff to the flak recipes is how I figured this would go. It would be at the machining table not the tailor bench.
I think making flak recipes use textiles is a cool idea, the issue is we'd have to add more rules to the system that generates armor values for apparel since it wouldn't support it (just the way the rules fit together assumes essentially one material). So there's some complexity there both for us and for players who are trying to understand the system.
The more hours I put into RW the more I hold the belief that simpler is better.
This isn't to say I don't like the idea of using different textiles for different armor values but as Tynan says above, it's more work for little cost. I prefer the system we already have.
Quote from: Ser Kitteh on July 24, 2018, 07:35:49 AM
The more hours I put into RW the more I hold the belief that simpler is better.
Truely agreed.
As it's for me clothing could me more cliché instead of too detailed. A plate armor adds heat comfort , while a big fuzzy fur coat adds cold comfort. Both give moderate armor values. Maybe plate more shard and fuzzy more blunt.
Meanwhile flak armor gives no temperature bonus and higher armor.
Now I can decide if i need enviromental protection or do I go for full combat. If there is a clear line between combat armor and enviromental armor there might also be less confusion about what things are used what for.
To make this system work, there should be plate and fuzzy pants similar to the flak pants.
Same for the hat, a tuque give blunt armor, a cowboy give sharp (the shot the hat, not your head haha), whilst a metal helm give all armor.
I don't know guys. Personally I like added complexity to an armor system. I can see it throwing off balance (the more complex it is, the more likely edge cases will be missed), but in a game where you craft a LOT of stuff it adds variety.
Concepts from Dwarf Fortress like engraving and gem setting are, I think, very good and add a lot of value. While not directly applicable to RW right now, I wouldn't mind seeing them, or having a framework for modders to add them.
I think it could have a fixed "flak armor value" regardless of the textile used and only inherit textile's temperature stats. This way you would avoid the armor calculation complexity.
The same could be done for plate armors - they should require some textile (padding) for temperature control without affecting the armor values. Especially with plate armors there is the protection/temperature dilemma since you can't wear anything over them and by themselves they provide very little temperature protection.
Quote from: Tynan on July 24, 2018, 06:34:00 AM
I think making flak recipes use textiles is a cool idea, the issue is we'd have to add more rules to the system that generates armor values for apparel since it wouldn't support it (just the way the rules fit together assumes essentially one material). So there's some complexity there both for us and for players who are trying to understand the system.
That's fair enough. I presumed that the armor value for clothing was generated for that clothing, so you could come up with a final number by doing, say (70% * Stuff_Textile) + (30% * Stuff_Metal) or however you notate it in game, then just report the value of a Cloth + Wood Duster or a Devilstrand + Uranium Duster to the player in the info box.