If i get a peace talk quest for a tribe that has a natural tendency to become hostile, then what's the point?
I'll get their opinion of me closer to 0, then it will slowly return to the value it was before. It's a total waste of time.
Peace talk quests should only appear for tribes which do not have a natural tendency for their attitude to sour over time.
If you can get them neutral, they'll start to send caravans and you can visit their towns and give them gifts. It's actually not that hard to appease them and keep them neutral, or even get them to be allies and keep them there.
They'll slowly degrade over time but it takes four *years* to go from ally to enemy. Some games don't even last that long. Even some wins don't ;)
You also get a 6k pop to social for your negotiator. Not bad in the early years.
It's not hard to try. It's nice to train your social pawn to recruit more people.
Though i leave the tribals alone but if it's the rough outlanders. Heck why not i will give it a try since their raids can be severe in late game rivaling the raid size of tribals, but with guns & power armor since they have elite mercs with them.
I don't like the "everything goes towards -80" deal. It should be balanced depending on where you're at, so you can stay at some neutral area. Why would someone just gradually slip into hating you?
If you're below -15, sure, slip to -80. If you're above -15, you should reset towards 0.
Quote from: vzoxz0 on September 17, 2018, 09:42:36 AM
Why would someone just gradually slip into hating you?
You'd have to ask my ex-girlfriends.
I did, but they were real busy at the time...
Presumably the Rough Tribes/Outlanders have a system of war and peace more in line with the city-states of Classical Greece or the old Sumer than the current international legal system: war is a normal state of existence between two political orders (read: your settlement and theirs), and it takes special effort (whether through honorable treatment of prisoners, paying of bribes or some other form of appeasement) to avert open conflict.
They don't slip into hating you. Without gifts and trade weighted in their favor, they become desperate and raid you out of necessity.
Taking their members' lungs, kidneys and clothes before taking one final organ to kill them and then burning their corpses with Molotov Cocktails is what makes them hate you.
Quote from: 5thHorseman on September 17, 2018, 05:58:00 PM
Taking their members' lungs, kidneys and clothes before taking one final organ to kill them and then burning their corpses with Molotov Cocktails is what makes them hate you.
How dare you make such accusation.
I merely take their lungs and kidneys, then, in exchange, I'll upgrade their legs into wooden variants and give them a free denture. And then I release them so they may live on. Really, I'm getting the short end of the stick here.
Quote from: christhekiller on September 18, 2018, 02:03:37 AM
I merely take their lungs and kidneys, then, in exchange, I'll upgrade their legs into wooden variants and give them a free denture. And then I release them so they may live on. Really, I'm getting the short end of the stick here.
Costing you
several sticks even!
Quote from: 5thHorseman on September 17, 2018, 05:58:00 PM
They don't slip into hating you. Without gifts and trade weighted in their favor, they become desperate and raid you out of necessity.
That's kind of corny, it's entirely possible to make a self sustaining colony in this game.
IMO factions should remain neutral at 0 unless the player does something to ruin their reputation. There should be some way to regain favor (or at least return to neutrality) with a faction without it constantly deteriorating. Sending pawns out on peace talk quests nonstop is just wasteful.
When I go to a peacetalk I come back with 60+ good will... How quickly are you wasting yours?
naturally warlike people will eventually attack their friends. Look at history....when warlike nations run out of people to make war against, they break treaties/alliances.
relations gradually slipping to -80 is the reaction of an aggressive and warlike or greedy people who, upon taking the 2 YEARS of no attempts to improve relations that it takes to go from 0 to -80, have finally decided "you know what? maybe they're not worth being friends with."
As to why go to the peace talks? the "success" result is usually a massive boost in relations...often 50 or more, and in my games, usually results in an instant cessation of hostilities (again, when it succeeds). When that happens, I have 2 years (8 quadrums at -10 each, and it needs to hit -75 to go hostile) to do SOMETHING nice for that faction before they'll attack me again...attacking a pirate outpost, fulfilling a trade request, or even periodically trading with their caravans will drastically extend that time.
In my games i've started playing with double factions (2 of each type) just so that i'm not friendly/allied with everyone except the pirates by the time 6 seasons go by. 8 decaying relationships instead of 4 actually means i'll consider those trade requests or pirate bases even if the reward is only marginally useful (11 prosthetic arms is still a "no" though, sorry)
Quote from: twoski on September 18, 2018, 05:34:18 PM
Quote from: 5thHorseman on September 17, 2018, 05:58:00 PM
They don't slip into hating you. Without gifts and trade weighted in their favor, they become desperate and raid you out of necessity.
That's kind of corny, it's entirely possible to make a self sustaining colony in this game.
IMO factions should remain neutral at 0 unless the player does something to ruin their reputation. There should be some way to regain favor (or at least return to neutrality) with a faction without it constantly deteriorating. Sending pawns out on peace talk quests nonstop is just wasteful.
I wonder if they tried that line when the Romans arrived. "You don't actually
need to add our country to your empire, because you're already self-sustaining!"
Quote from: twoski on September 18, 2018, 05:34:18 PM
That's kind of corny, it's entirely possible to make a self sustaining colony in this game.
It's possible for us. It's not possible for them. They don't even research anything.
Quote from: twoski on September 18, 2018, 05:34:18 PM
Sending pawns out on peace talk quests nonstop is just wasteful.
It would be if it was "nonstop" but one every couple years is far from "nonstop." I frequently piggyback it on an actual quest and just make sure one of my people has good social. Or, send the negotiator on their own if it's only a day away or so and you barely notice they're gone.