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RimWorld => General Discussion => Topic started by: GeorgeSteven on September 15, 2021, 02:43:47 AM

Title: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: GeorgeSteven on September 15, 2021, 02:43:47 AM
Shared this game to a friend, and due to his questions i've realized this game is truly uninformative and not noob-friendly information-wise.
He is not that kind of "ok lets google" boy who cries for google's help any time he meets some problem or lack of information so he decided to go through the game himself, in the last hope he might ask me for problems he can't get through without major spoilers from my side. So by now, we have:

(not true) - Pawn beauty stat - game shows beauty everywhere, in traits, in bionics, in items. But where can we get current pawn beauty ? The main menu does have nothing, we have to go to... social interaction of opposite pawn, kekw.

- Mechanics-Parasites - ok, we have treating info. What does it do?Due to flu/plague/infection we know it reduces infection severity, but here it does nothing ? What is the difference between 70% and 20% since it does not change anything in the description? No less pain, no less debuffs, nothing. Newbie patches his wounds and being curious when this thing is going off (if), thus we have million google requests about that stuff (just checked).

- Warm up and aiming speed - this game says a lot about aiming speed, but the weapon description does not have that stat. Instead, it has "warm up" parameter which stands for MEEELE HIT TIME due to description, nothing about shooting. Meanwhile it's straight up the aiming time stat we are looking for, who could have guessed.

And there are million things like that around the game you may sit in front and ask yourself Why why Mr developer why you persist why don't you just add few rows into the description and do not force people to google stuff they should not in theory.
Thoughts?
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: RawCode on September 15, 2021, 10:22:57 PM
do you expect multiple pages of descriptions for absolutely everything?

do you know any game with such "feature?
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: cybergatory on September 17, 2021, 01:33:38 AM
How about what buildings can you place down then reinstall later.  low-tech research bench, move that around as much as you like.  hi-tech research bench, no, you have to deconstruct and rebuild it.  how would i know that?  any indicators anywhere?

or, how much something would cost to build at a crafting table?  nope, you have to build the crafting table first.  the game is huge, and complex, and desperately in need of some documentation.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: Canute on September 17, 2021, 02:24:28 AM
I agree, there could be added alot more useful information/gameplay mechanics at the descriptions and tooltips.

At last for your 2.problem with the bills there is a nice mod WikiRim.
Which allow you to look at each item, to see what research is needed, at which place it could crafted and show the bill with resources need.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: Tynan on September 17, 2021, 03:27:37 PM
There are a lot of numbers in the game and we certainly didn't show everything perfectly.

I will look at these specific cases for future updates.

If there's any other specific feedback missing, please let me know what it is.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: Tynan on September 17, 2021, 04:13:32 PM
This one

Quote
Mechanics-Parasites - ok, we have treating info. What does it do?Due to flu/plague/infection we know it reduces infection severity, but here it does nothing ? What is the difference between 70% and 20% since it does not change anything in the description? No less pain, no less debuffs, nothing. Newbie patches his wounds and being curious when this thing is going off (if), thus we have million google requests about that stuff (just checked).

I don't really understand - can you clarify?
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: RawCode on September 17, 2021, 06:44:39 PM
Muscle parasites
Nanite infection

do not display information about how much tendings required to solve infection.
or probably display it in some non informative way.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: Tynan on September 17, 2021, 06:57:03 PM
Good points - will look at that again.

Regarding beauty - the stat is there, but it's hidden if it's 0. You'll only see it if it's positive or negative. This will be changed in next update.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: Bozobub on September 19, 2021, 12:58:08 PM
THAT is how a good dev handles things. ;D

Well done, Tynan.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: SetArk on September 20, 2021, 08:42:16 AM
do you expect multiple pages of descriptions for absolutely everything?

do you know any game with such "feature?

Well.. I hate to compare but.. CDDA, if i'm not mistaken Zoboide.
Those infos could be added and no harm would be done you know. 
The biggest harm, i feel, would be a real life social stigma that could start controversies on that matter.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: josefrees on September 21, 2021, 01:22:54 AM
Clicking the info button is very helpful. I’ve learned a lot about game and different items/ mechanics just by clicking that i button whenever I see it.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: ExampleHat on October 24, 2021, 02:01:30 AM
Muscle parasites
Nanite infection

do not display information about how much tendings required to solve infection.
or probably display it in some non informative way.

Thanks to your comment (and Tynans work), it is in the game now, todays update added "- Display current and required total tend qualities in the tooltip for hediffs with HediffComp_TendDuration comp. (Muscle parasites, athsma, gut worms, etc...)"

Good job!
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: MECHARAUSER on October 28, 2021, 01:29:43 PM
Muscle parasites
Nanite infection

do not display information about how much tendings required to solve infection.
or probably display it in some non informative way.

Thanks to your comment (and Tynans work), it is in the game now, todays update added "- Display current and required total tend qualities in the tooltip for hediffs with HediffComp_TendDuration comp. (Muscle parasites, athsma, gut worms, etc...)"

Good job!

Yes, and in exchange for that turrets' refire delay has been removed from stat overviews for no logical reason whatsoever, so as much obscurity was removed, more was added in other places.

So now, it is impossible to know the refire delays of turrets without tampering with game / mod files, or reading through off-game sites and such.

Such information is critical when comparing one static defensive option against another and now it's gone because...well, I'll never know. Absolutely do not understand why it even had to be just randomly purged to begin with.

Hoping that this is rectified soon.

To mention it on the side, I'm not trying to crap talk anyone, but this choice is extremely confusing for me, especially seeing how a lack of information in many places already makes rimworld a staggeringly intimidating experience for most newcomers.
Most of my friends just straight nope out of it when I try to introduce them to rimworld, and I myself am still learning new things everyday...mostly because the game didn't tell me something it should've.
Like how, for example, turrets do not actually receive cover bonuses. When hovering over one, it shows you the calculation but it doesn't actually run them. There's a mod recently released that fixes this.

I'm genuinely just wondering and pondering on why this course of action, removal of information from an info overview tab, was chosen.
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: ExampleHat on October 29, 2021, 03:43:12 AM
Huh, I didn't even now about the refire delay (or the missing vover issue), but also almost never use turrets. Was it really in there in the version before and now removed in the last update?

Did you report these things as bugs? Because I get the feeling that the dev reads those pretty carefully.

Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: Bozobub on October 29, 2021, 09:33:21 PM
There's a fine line to walk here.  TOO MUCH info can easily be even more of a barrier than not enough, frankly, at least if it's at a "top" layer (displayed all the time).
Title: Re: This game is quite uninformative.
Post by: MECHARAUSER on October 30, 2021, 09:42:00 AM
Huh, I didn't even now about the refire delay (or the missing vover issue), but also almost never use turrets. Was it really in there in the version before and now removed in the last update?

Did you report these things as bugs? Because I get the feeling that the dev reads those pretty carefully.
I haven't yet, but I'll go ahead and do that now.