Messages

[Bisexual]

Spectrum traits amount to a sub-type identifier for any given trait. That is to say, it's not enough to just give the defName for a trait, one also has to specify the sub-type in order to narrow it down to a single trait. Technically that's called a composite key for you nerds out there

Traits can have one to five traits identified as sub-types of the general trait type, indexed on the range [-2, -1, 0, +1, +2]. 'Normal' traits are the same container format but just have a single sub-type record.

So go wild: Create any type of range your heart desires, with up to five entries in each one.

You still don't understand what I'm suggesting, yes I could make those trait arrays but pawns would still be limited to 3 traits each, I want pawns to posses one of the indexed range in every trait as an example, I copied the list of potential trait from my OP and bolded the traits that one pawn could posses.

• Sexuality

Homosexual - Bisexual - Heterosexual - Asexual - Zoosexual

• Appearance

Beautiful - Pretty - Normal - Ugly - Staggeringly Ugly

• Voice

Soothing Voice - Normal - Annoying Voice

• Natural Body Temperature

Cold Lover - Cold Tolerant - Normal - Heat Tolerant - Heat Lover

• Nerves/Willpower

Iron Will - Stead Fast - Average - Timid - Spineless

• Intellect

Too Smart - Smart - Average - Slow - Very Slow

• 

Masochist - Average - Sadist/"bloodlust"

• Psychic Sensitivity

Psychically hypersensitive - Psychically Sensitive - normal - Psychically Dull - Psychically Deaf

• Work-Ethic

Industrious - Hard Worker - Average - Lazy - Slothful

• Activity Level

Jogger - Fast Walker - Average - Slowpoke - Dawdler

• Merriment

Party Animal - jovial - Average - Grouch - Killjoy

• Living Decorum

Extravagant -Lavish - Average - Sparse - Austere

• Etiquette

Gracious - Affable - Average - Abrasive - Antagonistic

• Natural Mood

Sanguine - Optimist - Average - Depressive - Pessimist

• Love Propensity

Hopeless Romantic - Romantic - Average - Cool - Cold-Hearted

• Lust Propensity

Promiscuous - Amorous - Average - Cold - Frigid

• Combat Style

Careful Shooter - Trigger happy - Average - Brawler - Gladiator

• Hate Propensity

Zealot - Bigot - Average - Tolerant - Magnanimous

• Work-Ethic

Industrious - Hard Worker - Average - Lazy - Slothful

• Theism

Polytheist - Monotheist - Agnostic - Atheist - Anti-Theist

• Dietary Ethics

Vegan - Vegetarian - Omnivore - Meatatrian - Carnist

• Marriage

Polyandry - Polygyny - Monogamy - Open Monogamy - Polyamory

• Clothing Tradition

Exhibitionist - Nudist -Average - Prissy - Prude

• Drug Ethics

Chemical Fascination - Chemical Interest - Average - Teetotaler - Prohibitionist

• Cooperation/Competition

Collaborative - Communal - Average - Striving - Champion

• Nature/Industry

Naturalist - Green Thumb - Average - Gear Head - Industrialist

• Artwork

Artist - Creative - Average - Uncreative - Critique

• Gender

Hates Men - Dislikes Men - Average - Dislikes Women - Hates Women

• Augmentation

Prosthophile - Average - Prosthophobe

Basically a pawn would posses one trait in each and every array, most trait would be average or normal but many would not and it would create more unique pawns that have the appearance of personality, in the example above the pawn would be both jovial (funny:makes others laugh) and depressive (low mood: generally depressed) you know, kind of like how many comedian IRL suffer from depression and while you could have  those 2 traits and one more for a total of 3 in vanilla under the system proposed this pawn is also,

• Creative
• Striving
• Nudist
• Monotheist
• Trigger happy
• Psychically hypersensitive
• Stead Fast
• Cold Lover
• Bisexual

He has every other trait array as well (the one not listed), its just that hes average in them so they have no effect but because I also included pawn changing during play the fact that the pawn has the trait array is important as that trait could move during play from average to something else that does have an effect.

These two points (more then 3 traits per pawn and traits changing though play) require development from the developer and can not be modded as easily as just adding more traits, I could do that myself but that's not the main purpose behind this suggestion.

[nigh unchangeable aspects of a pawn with change only occurring with heavy effort or though events]

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/11/02/rimworld-code-analysis/

This is the reason why you will probably never see almost any of this. It's too easy to misconstrue, and make into a hitpiece by talentless hacks.
It would be like trying to fuck a hornets nest.

I didn't and still don't consider this an issue, its free publicly, nothing more.

Not an entirley terrible idea, but I'm afraid this would stir up more controversy than it would help

Not something that I personally consider to be an issue, the previous "controversy" didn't do any actual harm to Rimworld and was basically nothing more then free publicly.

Besides, bigger than this, I think an organic, fluid personality system, where people change over time would be MUCH better.

Then I don't think you really read what I posted, not that I blame you it is mess and unorganized but here the part where I addressed change.

Inherent and subconscious traits are nigh unchangeable aspects of a pawn with change only occurring with heavy effort or though events, such trait would be things like appearance, sexuality, psychic sensitivity ect.

Habitual and conscious traits are things learnt over the course of a pawns life and while easier to change then inherent or subconscious traits it would still be difficult and would require a concentrated effort.

So yeah I think traits should be changeable but that the difficulty of changing them is relative, for instance the willpower trait spectrum,

• Nerves/Willpower

Iron Will - Stead Fast - Average - Timid - Spineless

Would make it so that someone with an Iron will would be more resistance to changing themselves while someone who's spineless quickly caves to peer pressure to change.

Also the scale of change would make it harder, trying to make a Bigot become tolerant would be harder then making an "average" person become tolerant.

Note average in this case means:AvenueQ - Everyone's A Little Bit Racist

The system proposed is already present and is called spectrum traits. The rules for spectrum traits specify that any given pawn can have only one out of a set of spectrum traits; I'm not sure if that's enforced by the interface, but I've heard that only one applies.

Yes I know that it exists what I meant is that every trait should have an opposite and that every pawn should have every trait "spectrum" but fall some where differently along that line, that why every "spectrum" example has an "average" which represent no strong leaning one way or the other.

If it helps to understand what I was going for this suggestion was Inspired by the Dwarf Fortress personality system where every single dwarf falls somewhere along the line in every personality trait.[/quote]

http://dwarffortresswiki.org/index.php/DF2014:Personality_trait

Basically that, but simplified because if Tynan went full DF a lot of people would get upset over "needless" complexity...

So, I was cleaning up my computer when I found this text document from last year and in it was a suggestion I was working on for Rimworld about giving pawn more "personality" by reworking the traits system into a "personality" array, I'll be honest this suggestion should really be reformatted and cleaned up.... but here it is anyway.

________________________________________________________________


I think that the current trait system is a bit lack luster as it can be quite limiting at times and I don't think anybody likes the way sexuality take up one of the three possible traits, so I got to thinking about how to fix it and then remembered that I'd had a half formed idea back when pawn relationship was first being considered.

I think that all traits should be grouped into arrays and that every array should focus on one aspect of a pawns personality or character being decided into inherent/subconscious, habitual/conscious and beliefs/values.

Inherent and subconscious traits are nigh unchangeable aspects of a pawn with change only occurring with heavy effort or though events, such trait would be things like appearance, sexuality, psychic sensitivity ect.

• Sexuality

Homosexual - Bisexual - Heterosexual - Asexual - Zoosexual

I chose zoosexual over transexual because transexual is not actually connected with a persons sexuality, by which I mean a transexual whom feels like a woman in a mans body might be sexually attarcted to women but with a zoosexual it is about sexuality in that it directly relates to sexual preference, also I think that zoosexual could be used to discribe people with a preferance to "furry" partners like the "trananimals" that exist in the rimworld primer's lore rather then just beastiality.

• Appearance

Beautiful - Pretty - Normal - Ugly - Staggeringly Ugly

• Voice

Soothing Voice - Normal - Annoying Voice

• Natural Body Temperature

Cold Lover - Cold Tolerant - Normal - Heat Tolerant - Heat Lover

• Nerves/Willpower

Iron Will - Stead Fast - Average - Timid - Spineless

• Intellect

Too Smart - Smart - Average - Slow - Very Slow

• 

Masochist - Average - Sadist/"bloodlust"

• Psychic Sensitivity

Psychically hypersensitive - Psychically Sensitive - normal - Psychically Dull - Psychically Deaf




Habitual and conscious traits are things learnt over the course of a pawns life and while easier to change then inherent or subconscious traits it would still be difficult and would require a concentrated effort.

• Work-Ethic

Industrious - Hard Worker - Average - Lazy - Slothful

• Activity Level

Jogger - Fast Walker - Average - Slowpoke - Dawdler

• Merriment

Party Animal - jovial - Average - Grouch - Killjoy

• Living Decorum

Extravagant -Lavish - Average - Sparse - Austere

• Etiquette

Gracious - Affable - Average - Abrasive - Antagonistic

• Natural Mood

Sanguine - Optimist - Average - Depressive - Pessimist

• Love Propensity

Hopeless Romantic - Romantic - Average - Cool - Cold-Hearted

This trait would impact how probable a pawn is to starting or accepting of relationships.

• Lust Propensity

Promiscuous - Amorous - Average - Cold - Frigid

This trairt would impact how probable a pawn is to accept a one-night stands or to cheat on a SO if they have one.

• Combat Style

Careful Shooter - Trigger happy - Average - Brawler - Gladiator

• Hate Propensity

Zealot - Bigot - Average - Tolerant - Magnanimous

This trait would impact a pawns acceptance of differing values in other traits, some people dont judge while others do and this affect social interactions and the easiest method I think as a non-coder that having opposing sides of the same trait "group" act like the abrasive trait to each other while "average" gives neither a bonus or negative, an example being Work-Ethic.

• Work-Ethic

Industrious - Hard Worker - Average - Lazy - Slothful

Lazy vs Hard Worker = - 0.1 to all social interactions
Lazy vs Industrious = - 0.2  to social interactions
Hard Worker vs Slothful = - 0.2 to social interactions
Slothful vs Industrious = - 0.3 to social interactions

After all have you ever worked with someone who you feel is not pulling their weight? how did that make you feel about them? but there are also positives for when they "align"

Lazy vs Slothful = + 0.2 to social interactions
Slothful vs Slothful + 0.3 to social interactions
Hard Worker vs Industrious = + 0.2 to social interactions
Industrious vs Industrious = + 0.3 to social interactions

Under this system bigots would suffer an extra -1 to social interactions when traits conflict while the tolerant would get a bonus +1 to a max of 0 (no negative).



Finally Beliefs and values represent the things a pawn believes like monotheists, polytheists and atheist while values represent things like vegetarian and vegan.

• Theism

Polytheist - Monotheist - Agnostic - Atheist - Anti-Theist

• Dietary Ethics

Vegan - Vegetarian - Omnivore - Meatatrian - Carnist

• Marriage

Polyandry - Polygyny - Monogamy - Open Monogamy - Polyamory

• Clothing Tradition

Exhibitionist - Nudist -Average - Prissy - Prude

• Drug Ethics

Chemical Fascination - Chemical Interest - Average - Teetotaler - Prohibitionist

• Cooperation/Competition

Collaborative - Communal - Average - Striving - Champion

• Nature/Industry

Naturalist - Green Thumb - Average - Gear Head - Industrialist

• Artwork

Artist - Creative - Average - Uncreative - Critique

• Gender

Hates Men - Dislikes Men - Average - Dislikes Women - Hates Women

This is separate from sexuality in that its a pawns general feeling to a gender not their "attraction" to them.

• Augmentation

Prosthophile - Average - Prosthophobe


So thoughts? please feel free to expand upon any of these ideas or tell me why I'm wrong if you disagree.

_____________________________________________________


So that was it, I just copy pasted it from the text document without refining it but I think its enough to understand the general idea.

A need for water and to use the bathroom are both idea that I support.

sanitation does exist. Though I'm not sure exactly what its effects are (does a sanitary hospital perform better than a dirty one?).

I'm fairly certain that by sanitation he means toilets and "night soil" not general cleaning.

I like me some fog of war, I'd personally put it in the scenario setting rather then options but that's because I'm against thing like being able to change game difficulty halfway though.

I think that pawns should have an inventory, by default you can carry things in your hands but certain equipment items could increase or decrease it a pawn overall capacity.

There could be back packs that enable pawn to carry more while hauling or holsters that enable you to carry multiple weapons.

Another one: Your colonists actually need to use the bathroom every now and then

I actually think this is a good idea honestly

Same here, then again I like simulationism over gamism so I'm biased.

I personally preferred it when you couldn't directly command pawns at all... thats because I'm more of a DF type player.

I can defiantly see the benefit of having some engineered plants and it is supported by lore with rocket fuel trees being a thing.

Maybe a plant that release some kind of drug in the air around it that improve mood and was engineered for population control or maybe weaponized plants like a super sized venus flytrap.

I'm however opposed of a plant that turn people into plant/human hybrids.

I'd prefer something like the plant from The Ruins

I don't think it really fit with what rimworld is at the moment and while I do think its cool there are a hundred and one other thing I want to see first.

Hey mike, suggestion:
If you post just to oppose a suggestion, quit the suggestions forum. It's borderline trollish I think and disrespectful.
That's my opinion at least. If you actually have something to add or maybe think of how a certain idea can possibly work, even if you personally don't "like" the idea, then this is the right forum for you

That's not the way forums work nor is should work, the entire point of this suggestion forum is to discus pro and cons not be an echo chamber for feeling good about your ideas and it never should be, A forum is by definition a

1. A meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged:
'we hope these pages act as a forum for debate'

And in a debate there people are both for or against an idea, what you suggest is an turning this forum into a echo chamber where only support is welcome and I don't like that idea at all.

It is disrespectful to the OP and I believe not in the spirit of a suggestions forum.

I disagree, I'd say its disrespectful not to treat the OP like a mature individual capable of handling criticism or derision and I believe it is perfectly in the spirit of the forum to oppose idea you do not support.

It doesn't add anything except perhaps making people dispirited and less likely to keep bringing up ideas.

It does "add" in the sense that it help the dev's gauge the support a suggestion has and as Winston Churchill said

Success consists of going from failure to failure without loss of enthusiasm.

if someone post a suggestion, gets it shot down and never tries again, that is not anyone else problem but theirs.

I know this because my profession is organizational counseling and there's statistics to that effect

The way you say that with pride make me think of you as a PC-SJW or IMHO one of the problems of modern society, people are not special snowflake and in the grand scheme of thing nobody really matters.

Here the same message in song form.

However if you encourage people to make suggestions (by refining ideas, even those you don't like, just to be courteous)

So encourage people to by supporting ideas I'm opposed to? No thanks, I prefer a brutal honesty approach and if it hurt people feeling I'll tell them what my brother told me when I was 7, drink a cup of concrete and harden the fuck up.

or at the very least keep unconstructive negative opinions to yourself, you're raising the overall quality.

If you where talking about people replying to suggestion with stuff like "this idea sucks, no" or what not I'd actually agree with you but given that your talking about someone whom calmly and respectfully disagreed and said why they disagree you, IMHO, have nothing to stand on.

Try it though, I think you'll like it better.

No, I like saying what I think even if that hurts other peoples feelings, make no mistake hurting people is not the goal its just a side effect or collateral damage if you would.

Is that a perfect system? No but I think its a hell of a lot better then this modern "safe space" stuff.

[stating that these diagnoses have been referred to (or include what is referred to) as psychopathy or sociopathy]

This game has no psychopaths. What!? I know, I know. The trait, it says "psychopath." The trait is wrong.

First some back story. I am currently a grad student for my Ph.D. in Clinical Psychology and already have my B.S. and Masters.

Simply replace every word "psychopath" with "sociopath" and all will be good. What's the difference you ask? Two men.

One walks into a bank, shoots 2 people, robs it, holds some other hostage, eats one, so and so forth. He is incapable of assimilating into society. They are always the black sheep and stick out as weird.

The second one is all those stories of serial killers and cannibals who live next door to you for years and you never knew. A sociopath is capable of assimilating flawlessly* into society so as not to be noticeable. They're actions are equally horrible and disjointed.

A "real" psychopath in this game, would do nothing but kill people. They would almost never work, haul, clean, hell even agree to join short of trying to trick you to get a nice shiny assault rifle to kill you with.

Psychopath is not a clinical diagnosis so I'm doubtful that you are what you say you are.

The DSM and International Classification of Diseases (ICD) subsequently introduced the diagnoses of antisocial personality disorder (ASPD) and dissocial personality disorder respectively, stating that these diagnoses have been referred to (or include what is referred to) as psychopathy or sociopathy

The fifth edition of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), released by the American Psychiatric Association in 2013, lists both sociopathy and psychopathy under the heading of Antisocial Personality Disorders (ASPD)

Modern diagnostic systems consider ASPD to include two related but not identical conditions: A "psychopath" is someone whose hurtful actions toward others tend to reflect calculation, manipulation and cunning; they also tend not to feel emotion and mimic (rather than experience) empathy for others. They can be deceptively charismatic and charming. By contrast, "sociopaths" are somewhat more able to form attachments to others but still disregard social rules; they tend to be more impulsive, haphazard, and easily agitated than people with psychopathy. ASPD is uncommon, affecting just 0.6% of the population.

Essentially, the term is not even recognized by the medical and psychological community in their "diagnostic Bible" the DSM. "The term 'psychopath' has been dropped and some of the previously psychopathic traits are now included under 'Anti-social Personality Disorder."

Despite its importance historically and contemporarily, psychopathy is not recognized in the current Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders, Fourth Edition, Text Revised (DSM-IV-TR). Its closest counterpart, antisocial personality disorder, includes strong representation of behavioral deviance symptoms but weak representation of affective-interpersonal features considered central to psychopathy.

It took me a total of 12 minutes to find 5 source that state that psychopathy is not a recognize diagnosis and that its traits fall under antisocial personality disorder (ASPD), so if you where truly concerned about the correct terminology then you'd have said that the correct trait name is antisocial personality disorder.

[You]

You never play for the stories.
You play for the strategy, and if the game is designed well, you get amazing stories.

That way the stories are 'real', and so, impactful.

Your wrong, just flat out wrong.

I play for the stories that revel themselves to me as I play, the strategy is something to distract myself while I wait for stories to happen nothing more, if Rimworlds pawns had more complex personality like dwarves from DF I'd play Rimworld almost as much as I play DF.

My favorite DF story is still the one time I caught a dwarf trying to frame (witness report) their "grudge" (enemy) for a crime that 6 other dwarves saw someone else do.


AN: the only reason I said your wrong is because you are telling other people what they play (or should play) for.

- martian, with red skin, looking as Hellboy and have the trait "hard skin", that give him some armor;
- thin man, looking like thin man, with trait "thin but thick" that have less hp but have some regeneration;
and many others.

Seeing as how you've used "Martians" and "Thin Men" as examples I feel like I have to point out that there are no true aliens in Rimworld.

RimWorld does not include:

    Faster than light travel.
    True aliens.

There will possible be other races of "xeno"human or ones based off of animals.

The Ordo Historia has recorded and gene-sampled thousands of differently-engineered and adapted xenohumans. Among other notable traits in this genetic library, one may find.

   

• Aquatic-adapted strains who can withstand breathing very high gas pressures and even survive days of immersion by exchanging oxygen through the skin (no true permanently-aquatic fish people have ever been confirmed).
• Soldier variants carrying any of a large number of traits that various militaries have seen fit to bestow upon their people. Typically, they have large muscles and perfect eyesight. Some have minimized metabolisms made to digest a single kind of long-lasting nutrient solution, to make army logistics easier. Their lifespans are short - usually between ten and thirty years - and they grow up very fast. But the most significant differences are psychological. Engineered grunt soldiers are obedient, sense pain only in a distant way, obsessed with learning about weapons and war, and carry a strong need to be part of something larger than themselves. They are deliberately lacking in abstract intelligence and creativity. Engineered commanders are highly analytical, fascinated with military history, utterly cold under pressure, and masters at spatial visualization.
• Radiological immunity is a very common adaptation; the Ordo estimates that most of humanity is more tolerant of radiation than our Terran progenitors.
• Some worlds engineer "perfect mates" for the rich and powerful. Such specimens are created with bodies to match the fashions of their home worlds and the tastes of their owners. They tend to be obsessively submissive and devoted, totally without jealousy or self-regard, artistically inclined and endlessly cheerful. Such traits do not last long in an unrestricted evolutionary environment because they are so easy to exploit, but engineered mates are sometimes kept in longsleep long after their creation, to be traded into a post-catastrophe market that can no longer create them. The main contact most of us will ever have with such specimens is through their descendants, who, while they have most of the traits of the original in only a very diluted form, still occasionally express Mendelian traits like impossible eye shades or streaks of multicolored hair.
• Fashion-driven genetic modifications are often applied during later life instead of prenatally, and are most often cosmetic and skin-deep. Variations in hair and skin color are common. More exotic modification add shining crests, color-changing skin and eyes, reshaped or elongated bodies, and colored nails, feathers, or fur.
• Gravity variations create new body structures. People from low-g adapted populations are lighter, taller, and weaker than those from weightier environments. The most extreme examples are the gravity dwarfs, 3-foot-tall xenohumans from worlds of over 2g of gravity. Their short and stocky shape lets them live and work in comfortably in such oppressive g-pulls. They even have a noted preference for short and underground dwellings. It's unresolved whether this preference is cultural or genetic in origin.

Such intelligence-enhanced animals are collectively classified by their degree of brain power and called by a specific prefix like so:

• Opti - Indicates enhanced but still sub-human intelligence. Optianimals can usually use tools, form long-term goals and organize into primitive social groups, but can't speak more than a few words, read, or think abstractly. Optidog, optipig, optiwhale, optimonkey.
• Trans - Indicates intelligence in the human range. Transanimals can read, use tools, form teams, hold conversations, and think about complex ideas. Transdog, transbear, transgoat, transsimian.

I did say its not gonna happen.

The moon effects both tides and eclipses which the player does interact with, also one of the inspirations of Rimworld is Firefly and here is the firefly star system.

"The star system is a star cluster, of the likes of the triple star system Alpha Centauri. It consists of five main sequence stars, around which orbit an assortment of 7 protostars, 6 gas giants, three separate asteroid belts, 75 planets, and 149 moons.[1] Four of the main sequence stars orbit a central star."



I kind of like what many consider "needless" complication or pointless detail, it's kind like how I love Shadowruns crunch, does it need to be so crunchy? of course not but I think its a better overall system because of it.

Having the actual orbit of the planet and its moon(s) be simulated at least a little would be cool, I never really like the randomness of the eclipse event.

I disagree, mainly because it would be calculations done for...almost nothing.

To use the (flawed) GNS Theory I'm a stimulationist, I like simulation in my video games and that's why I like Arma more then Battlefield so I would personally like the entire star system to be at least partially simulated, your Comms could detect trader when they enter the system but you have to wait until they enter orbit before trading and full planetary whether simulation with weather systems moving across the planet.

I know its not going to happen because Tynan's not a fan of full simulation, hell the only reason I still think DF is better is because Toady is willing to simulate almost everything...