Should the Avoid Friendly Fire mod be part of the vanilla game?

Started by The Man with No Name, January 07, 2018, 11:59:57 AM

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Nameless


SpaceDorf

Quote from: Dashthechinchilla on January 10, 2018, 09:58:16 PM
Per Wikipedia : According to the most comprehensive survey of casualties (both fatal and nonfatal), 21 percent of the casualties in World War II were attributable to friendly fire, 39 percent of the casualties in Vietnam, and 52 percent of the casualties in the first Gulf War. In the ongoing conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan, casualty rates are 41 percent and 13 percent, respectively.

Thinking about who was involved in those conflicts I further doubt the title of the self proclaimed best army in the world ...

But I think the same way, if friendly fire is possible .. weapon safety should also be possible.

Maxim 1   : Pillage, then burn
Maxim 37 : There is no overkill. There is only open fire and reload.
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BoogieMan

When related to hunting and not in actual combat, very much yes.

Jibbles

Quote from: BoogieMan on January 13, 2018, 10:30:11 PM
When related to hunting and not in actual combat, very much yes.

I got more than 8 hunters with assault rifles and I haven't witnessed any friendly fire.  They'll walk in front of each other and everything missing all the bullets that would most likely hit in other alphas.  Have the chances for FF decreased or is it has it been removed for hunting?

Bozobub

Thanks, belgord!

Jibbles

I tested this a couple of times. I drafted a group of pawns following an animal that is being hunted.  Yes a bullet will hit a pawn every now and then.  But if you were to draft the hunter then fire at the animal then the difference is quite noticeable.  More pawns are hit by more bullets. I was unaware of that so that's what made me think there was an update to hunting.

Scrabbling

Quote from: Jibbles on January 14, 2018, 02:23:02 AM
I got more than 8 hunters with assault rifles and I haven't witnessed any friendly fire.  They'll walk in front of each other and everything missing all the bullets that would most likely hit in other alphas.  Have the chances for FF decreased or is it has it been removed for hunting?

Bullet interception while hunting was removed in A14. And the friendly fire chance in general was decreased in A15.
This means hunting accidents can still happen but they are rare: It is not enough that a fellow colonists walks between the hunter and his prey (that would be intercept) but the hunter has to miss and the bullet then must land in a tile with another pawn to accidently hit him. And this isn't that likely.
It might happen more often if you hunt with weapons with a forced miss radius like miniguns or grenades where "missing" is the weapon's modus operandi.

Edit@Topic: Nah, keep friendly fire in the game. Or make it setting, preferably with default = enabled. Just don't remove it. The one change I would like is if I could choose the default for "Fire at will" when drafting. In 4 out of 5 combat situations I don't want "Fire at will" enabled or only for a few colonists and not for the majority.

whitebunny

No.
What little depth the vanilla combat already has, it should stay.
If anything i would like things to move more towards something like the combat extended mod built into the core experience.

No offense to anyone working in this fantastic game but it always hits a point not too far into any playthrough where things get quite stale and a little boring/repetitive. We need little things like these to keep the game interesting instead of making it more of an ant-farm like experience.

The Man with No Name

What about a middle path, in which colonists use something like the Avoid Friendly Fire mod, but pawns with the Psychopath or Trigger-Happy traits ignore it? That should remove most of the really dumb and game-spoiling friendly fire incidents, yet still provide potential "drama" events of colonists shooting each other, which some people seem to enjoy (and not that the Avoid Friendly Fire mod removes the possibility of these events), plus an increased strategic layer of utilizing such units pawns in battle without accruing collateral damage.

This issue has a diversity of opinion - why not represent that diversity in the game? Combining both points of view in the game means that everybody's opinion is being represented.

Texaskimo

I'd like to see friendly fire implemented as a chance based on shooter skill (independent of any accuracy effects). What I mean is a shooting level 0 pawn will happily blaze away no matter who run across the field of fire, while a shoot level 10 pawn has a much higher but not 100% chance of holding fire when a friendly is running in front of the sights.

TheMeInTeam

Quote from: Scrabbling on January 15, 2018, 12:29:11 PM
Quote from: Jibbles on January 14, 2018, 02:23:02 AM
I got more than 8 hunters with assault rifles and I haven't witnessed any friendly fire.  They'll walk in front of each other and everything missing all the bullets that would most likely hit in other alphas.  Have the chances for FF decreased or is it has it been removed for hunting?

Bullet interception while hunting was removed in A14. And the friendly fire chance in general was decreased in A15.
This means hunting accidents can still happen but they are rare: It is not enough that a fellow colonists walks between the hunter and his prey (that would be intercept) but the hunter has to miss and the bullet then must land in a tile with another pawn to accidently hit him. And this isn't that likely.
It might happen more often if you hunt with weapons with a forced miss radius like miniguns or grenades where "missing" is the weapon's modus operandi.

Edit@Topic: Nah, keep friendly fire in the game. Or make it setting, preferably with default = enabled. Just don't remove it. The one change I would like is if I could choose the default for "Fire at will" when drafting. In 4 out of 5 combat situations I don't want "Fire at will" enabled or only for a few colonists and not for the majority.

I just wish AI hunting were viable.  It still isn't, because of how the game positions the hunter exposing you to animal revenge nonsense.  Much safer/more practical to draft a firing squad and gun down the critters, and you 0% FF chance that way if you micro well, rather than just "rare".

FF itself is fine in the game.  You do get a grace distance and its existence adds to how you consider your own (and enemy!) positions.  I don't see why taking it out makes the game better, and arguably it would hurt combat depth.