[ POLL ] SeedsPlease Mod - Integration / Mechanics Ideas to Modpacks etc.

[Fearle55]

Hi Everyone,
First of all: I know it is regular thread and not actual forum poll. Reason is, forum poll allows "5" options max. Since I wanted to give you fellas more options than "5". I resigned from doing regular poll. Now...

This poll is about possible solutions to problem of implementation of "SeedsPlease Mod" into modded game setups and modpacks by various autors.
As an attempt to finding some common ground between people this poll has been created.

Here are few ideas how could SeedsPlese Mod be integrated into the game, since there are those who love it and those who don't really love it. Unfortunately there is no good solution for both.

Idea #1
-Seeds would be completly removed. Grow to your hearts content.

Idea #2
-Seeds would be completly removed for low level plants. But would be required for high level plants. (Merchant only). There would be a % chance of seed return if lost due to weather or temperature. For high level plants.

Idea #3
-Seeds would be required for all plants regardless of their level. However they would be craftable in some way, or obtainable in other ways. Perhaps ability to buy low level seeds from !! any !! friendly merchant. Perhaps improvment to map-generator to include some areas that can be harvested for low level seeds or cultivated, some distance from base as a drawback.

Idea #4
-Seeds are required for all plants. Seeds could be crafted, or bought from merchant. Seeds could be improved by crafter on a table (one-time upgrade, one-time use) for either:
1. Longer growth period, but better weather resistance (perhaps winter proof after final research tier, but very slow growth), smaller food yield after harvested.
2. Faster growth period, normal weather resistance, better yield, no soil requirement (except for stone etc. ofc.), no seed return after harvested. (for quick food when necessery - to survive short term crysis at a cost).

Idea #5
-Seeds are required for all plants. Can be crafted or bought from merchant. Can be genetically engineered for weather and temperature resistance. Can be created in "3D printer" after final research chain.
To give player self sufficient supply and relive him of too much micromanagement in later game period. As a reward, after surviving early and mid game period of seed management.
Perhaps upgrade that makes your seeds permanent. Until you delete them. After plant gives yield it returns to 0% growth and starts again. Infinite loop. (After final tier research upgrade, and after high cost artificial seed production).

Idea #6
-Seeds are required for high level plants only. Normal growth rate and normal food yield after harvested. Perhaps ability to improve mood when eaten. Low level plant do not require seeds. However "Grower" would have to do more maintenance work to care for those low level plants. He would have to go to the field every now and then, or perhaps after rough weather to do "Farmland Care Job" to sustain development of those plants.
Or do work on the soil, like fertilizing. Basically it would be something like "building soil blocks" job, wouldn't require any materials, only big chunk of time. This way player would be able to survive, but losing 1 or 2 colonists to do work, without time to spare for other tasks. Until better ways of survival are opened.

Idea #7
-Seeds from Glitterworlds. Very expensive, very resistant to weather and temperature, very rare. Grow 1 year straight day and night - outdoors (if at least lit 30%). Give high amount of food every 10 or 15 days.
After 1 year is over they give last yield and have only 20% chance to return seed. Rest die and is lost forever.

Idea #8
-Seeds are normal, no additional changes to what they are now. Except after plant gives yield it gives 400% or seed return. Those additional seeds cannot be used to farm. They can only be used as a food syntesizer material for low level foods like "syntesizer paste etc.", Similar to mechanics that are alredy in place, but used as additional substitute source.

Idea #9
-Suggested by user "Morkul". Allow to plant trees or bushes, that have yield cycle and allow to be harvested few or many times a year without replanting. For example Apple trees etc. Another take at this is that harvested apple already have apple seeds inside it. So perhaps allow to use "apple" - food itself, as seed for new tree. // Remove seeds for perennial plants and change the current crop output to double as seeds.

Idea #10
-"Farming Manuals". Yup, you can't plant what you don't know how to cultivate. Simply put. You have to buy a book for certain plant first. Your "Grower" must read it, to learn the skill. Once he successfully learned the skill, he can grow this certain plant, without seeds. This gives you some early hurdle to overcome. Once thats done you're in the green.
As an additional challenge, only that specific "Grower" who learned that book can cultivate this certain plant (not whole colony) Book could be lost or added to library afterwards.
UPDATE: Perhaps ability to talk to visitors and strangers, and if successful, they could teach your "Grower" or colony how to grow specific plants. Or ability to go on adventure event with possibility to obtain knowledge.
//Thanks to TLHeart - I got this idea after reading his response.

POLL RESULT: POLL IN PROGRESS

Whew

Well those are ideas for now, It would be great to have some feedback from you guys. Those numbers and ratios aren't final. My idea is to take "3" "Ideas" with most votes, and create final conclusion "Idea", constructed from those "3" winning ideas.

For those of you, who are interested to vote here are the rules:

1. You can have max "2" "Votes" for max "2" different "Ideas". You can use 1 vote, or both, or none. Up to you.
1a. If you dislike every presented idea, but still want others to know your opionion write #Dislike. I will count dislikes and present number of them on 1st post after poll is closed.
2. Vote format: Write: Idea#1, Idea#2
3. If you have good idea to improve on existing idea write it under your vote. I may consider it for final idea construct.
4. Important!! Make your mind before you vote. I will be very hesistant to count votes in edited posts. If i include them or not is not decided. Depends on you guys.

Anything that changes or any additional info i may have missed etc. will be edited into this (1st) post.

I expect this poll to be open for 7-10 days, it all depends on amount of community interest.
-Cheers

[Fearle55]

Added Idea#9. Thanks to //Morkul

[milon]

Idea#2, Idea#9

Suggestion: Like real life, plants require seeds to start, and may yield seeds (depending on grower skill, soil fertility, etc).  Certain low-level plants easily yield seeds, and higher-level plants give better nutrition/mood but seeds are harder to get.  Seed quality should be a thing too, just like furniture and clothing.  Better seeds = better nutrition & mood & chance for seed-yield.  Seeds can be bought from various traders, some spawn at the start with the drop pods, may be found wild, and *may* be craftable if you want to mod in a new research path, crafting table, etc (think GMO's).

[NuclearStudent]

How about, after your plants die, you can recover some of their seeds?

It keeps most of the system intact. However, you aren't completely screwed every time you have a crop failure.

[TLHeart]

People who hate seeds, will not like any of those suggestions.

#dislike.

I have played with seeds, and without.... Seeds only add a very temporary hurdle to overcome, and add nothing to the reality or immersion of the game. Seeds are rarely if every collected from harvested crops, as crops used for food are harvested before the seeds are ripe. One plant produces 100 to 1000's of seeds, not 1 or 2 like all the mods have.

[Fearle55]

TLHeart, I understand you very well. I played with seeds and without too. Depending on modpack i used, i had mixed feelings. I liked extra challenge to get certain seed type for first time. But management was in fact tedious. I think that i just got new idea to add to the list. I think it might be somewhat good alternative for some.

//Added Idea#10.

Keep your opinions coming guys.

-Cheers

[TLHeart]

Idea #10, instead of a book, can also be learned from visitors. Thinking along the line of the events from Misc mod, where you go on adventures. Don't need to go on an adventure, but you learn the new plant from the visitors. The way knowledge is passed along, from person to person.

Could also have plants be unlocked simply by research, but do not lock things like medical plants deep in the research.

The challenge of the early game, and not being able to plant everything right away, is a good goal. Seeds accomplish that, but add mid to late game tedious micro management. That is why I hate seeds, besides the fact seeds are not harvested from plants used for food.

Many many plants are cultivated without ever needing seeds, potatoes is a great example... Cut a potato into 1/8's, and plant those pieces... you will get potatoes.

The biggest missing part from the early game, is the hunter/gather phase... cultivating plants comes later in a societies development. Hunting is possible, but the gather of natural plants on the map, is barely implemented... yes we can swipe across the map saying harvest, and get a little here a little there, but there is no option to have the colonists gather on their own, just like growing on their own.

[Fearle55]

Well, I guess that we need something along map generator update with more lush vegetation, and new worktype like harvest with new "time" activity. Like Sleep or Joy, but related to autonomous harvest. This way it could be somehow automated. But that would go only for those tropical biomes. All kinds of deserts, thundras and ice biomes wouldn't benefit much from it, since there isn't much vegetation. Unless add some plants resistant to cold, which would be prepared and cooked somehow, before they could be eaten. Some kind of cooking repice.

About talking to the visitors, there is mod that allows you to improve relations by talking, and recruitment. Maybe there could be an option to talk, and ask about some knowledge, and if interaction roll were successful, you could get some random information. Be it farming or perhaps technology.

Either way, I don't really think that matter will improve much in modding category, unless main game gives some framework to work under it, as far as farming goes.

Or... maybe just befriend a faction and make them your farmers. They would work field for you. Give them some food and shelter in return for their work. Or hire farmer mercenaries for a season or two .

Anyway, those ideas that were put in 1st post, are mainly about the fact that the seeds would exist in game. I think main problem is, that people want it to be too realistic. Personally i don't mind to have to deal with seeds for some time early-mid game i think. But i definately wouldn't want to micromanage it forever. After all this is Space colony sim, not farming sim.

//Updated Idea#10

-Cheers

[Morkul]

#9, it's sort of my idea.

I actually started to make my own mod that at the moment have some perennial plants, that was not that hard to fix and I will add more of those. Then I have also started to tinkered with potatoes some and finally got the "food" potatoes to be the same thing as the "seed" potatoes.  Played with it some and for me it's much more fun and realistic.  Now I need to keep potatoes in stock so I can plant them next season.  Will test some but will soon continue to do the same to other crops.