[Request] Friendly fire - please remove while hunting, tweak while fighting

[ThiIsMe007]

Previous threads on the same topic (for reference) :

https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=18755.0
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=22125.0
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=5519.0
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=21726.0
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=6311.15

Jagged Alliance 2 (+mod113) is my favorite game ever.

As I understand it, the combat system in Rimworld takes from JA2. Friendly fire exists in (modded) JA2, and it's a fun and essential feature to have. Without it, tactics and clever positioning wouldn't matter as much, and a victory against difficult odds wouldn't feel so rewarding. In Rimworld however, friendly fire is nothing like it, and is slowly becoming a chore to me.

Hunting - when my colonists go hunting, I need to micro-manage them all the time to avoid them shooting their comrades. This is very frustrating, but there seems no way around it, since the pathing AI gladly and frequently puts tamed pets or idle colonists ("going for a walk") in the middle of a firing solution, as if to troll me.

Now I've gone hunting wild life in RL quite a few times. While I don't pretend to be the most experimented, I can vouch for everything to be done to avoid accidents. These remain extremely rare, and I have yet to see one serious over a couple of years.

While it is true that they can happen, none of these accidents are lethal if proper coordination is set up before. This is why large groups are officered by experimented hunters, and avoid densely populated areas, or with known paths for joggers, for example. In smaller groups it's even easier since hunters tend advance together, side by side, and never fire more shots than necessary, sometimes only one after another.

Fighting - when my colonists fight raiders or other nasty stuff (mad animals, aliens, etc.), I welcome the additional risk of friendly fire. As I said above, winning a battle comes with learning how to properly position and use your troops. It's only fair, since it appears to happen on both sides.

However, here too I have to ask that stuff gets tweaked, since wild life or unengaged pets in game are more than eager to wander around on the battle field once fire is initiated. Real beasts, as massive as kodiaks, flee from explosions and gunfire, not to mention distracted human pedestrians. Tamed pets, like hunting dogs, don't move around their masters when they are shooting, in some kind of dance to fetch extra bullets.

Conclusion - I don't mind being challenged by clever mechanics (and more often than not keep playing without reloading if I am bested, to acknowledge them and learn), but not by game mechanics which make no sense to me, or on which I have no leverage despite my attention and efforts.

Therefore, I would favor removing the "friendly fire" feature plain and simple outside "fights against red targets", and tweak it during these, so that tamed animals stay put behind colonists, till they are told to attack (and "released"). At that point they become fair game to bullets (and melee damage), like enemies. If that's not technically possible, they should not be considered as valid targets for "friendly fire", since unlike colonists we cannot control them directly.

I would appreciate if someone could create a mod to do so, or point me to one already existing. Thank you very much for reading.

[BlackSmokeDMax]

If you set a zone for them and then set the animals to no master during battles, they will stay completely out of your way. When battle is over, set the master back to normal.

I do think the best method would be a button to 'Stay in assigned zone during draft' somewhere in the animal interface that toggles on and off, rather than going through the rigamarole of setting and un-setting masters.

[ThiIsMe007]

If you set a zone for them and then set the animals to no master during battles, they will stay completely out of your way. When battle is over, set the master back to normal.

I do think the best method would be a button to 'Stay in assigned zone during draft' somewhere in the animal interface that toggles on and off, rather than going through the rigamarole of setting and un-setting masters.

I agree with you, I can do that (and already do that for the animals that I do not wish to stay anywhere near the battlefield, like frail herbivores).

However, as you said it's still rather cumbersome to go through each time, and also it basically nullifies the value of the taming skill.

As I see it, your colonists either spend time honing shooting/melee or other skills like taming, hoping that the risk of taming a dangerous beast that could kill them in a couple of hits will pay off as the pet protects their master on the battlefield later. If I have to send them back, I might as well send the master with them, at which point I have to ask why bother at all with animals in-game ?

Finally, one thing I forgot to mention with friendly fire is that skilled shooters (>10) tend to fire on friendlies with equal glea and frequency than colonists who couldn't tell the muzzle from the grip on a gun if their life depended on it. Yet the description of their skills in-game also says that they could be famed for their extraordinary talents... on a planetary level.

I am not sure what to make out of this either.

[stigma]

Wouldn't the ideal fix just be to have animals respect allowed zones even when they are master-bonded? Then, if you WANT animals to participate in battles you just leave them restricted. If you DON'T want them to then assign them to a zone around a safe part of the base. Swapping these around as-needed during gameplay is also much simpler since you can just drag&swipe multiple animals in one action - which assigning masters requires a click->findmaster->click for each animal which is much slower and gets even more slower the more animals there are.

It seems like the whole problem comes from bonding ignoring zone restrictions.
If having animals be safe at home while bonded is OP, then I guess you could probably make the game take that into account (ie. animal not being able to access master works as not being bonded in terms of mood penalities) - but this seems like a very minor issue and probably not worth the workaround.

-Stigma

[Havan_IronOak]

I'd personally like to see bonded pets simply stay to one side or the other of their masters (heel) unless trained for release style fighting.

[Serenity]

I fully agree that animals should respect their zones. I like them when hunting, but in combat they can get hurt needlessly. Unbonding them is just a hassle.

As for friendly fire during hunting. It's annoying with animals again. They get hit far too often.

[Havan_IronOak]

One could make the case that a bonded animal should be with its master when the master is hunting or fighting if it can help (and stay out of the way)  If that's the case, the animal should also tag along at other times e.g. when an animal trainer is attempting to train a dangerous beast.

[Serenity]

Yeah I think it definitely looks cool when they hunt together. But if they get close to the prey, the hunter keeps shooting and hitting the animal. Same issue as in combat.

[Havan_IronOak]

Agreed. That's why they need a "heel" command.  If they'd stay behind their guy or even at his side that would cut down on the friendly fire. Animals are still relatively new in RimWorld and I don't think Tynan's worked out all the kinks yet.