Alpha 15 unstable branch testing feedback

Started by Tynan, August 17, 2016, 03:02:20 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

shentino

Is there a way to get the unstable branch without having steam?  Last time I tried to buy this game on steam it choked during download and crashed.

Tynan

Thanks for the feedback everyone! I've already integrated some of it and am now pushing a new release candidate.

Please update and tell me what you think all around!

For targeted testing, I'm really interested in how the drug system works. Are there subtle bugs in the AI where they do the wrong thing in some situations? Is the economy balanced? Is it balanced overall? Tell me!

Change list

38a4938 Factions now refuse to send traders or military aid when it's too hot or too cold.
aaa6742 Train burning drugs at the campfire with a popup appears when the first drug spawns.
a9effa0 Tutorial now deletes trees and chunks on player's cover spots.
79f2d38 Addicts carry more drugs.
c49ec77 Fix: Colonists don't look in their inventory for joy or need-satisfying drugs.
d84864e Fix: CanUseIngestItem totally ignored by the code, leads to various bugs.
eba35d4 More robust against certain types of AI errors.
09c5faa Fix: Tribal traders often won't buy high tech things (e.g. yayo).
86d62ea Pirates are now Spacer tech level again so they can use drop pods and luciferium.
45fc4b4 Changed milk to RawTasty. Some drug rebalance.
b20a5dc Rearming traps now takes 150% as long.
af920ce Milk's tastesRaw is now false.
392bf93 Insect corpses are now in their own ThingCategory.
cfee7e0 Smokeleaf joint price is now 150%, mood gain is now 15. Increased smokeleaf speed production. There are now more smokeleaf leaves yielded per plant.
1276158 WanderOwnRoom mental state now lasts 2x as long.
d754b37 "high on Smokeleaf" -> "high on smokeleaf", "high on WakeUp" -> "high on wake-up"
Tynan Sylvester - @TynanSylvester - Tynan's Blog

Kruisboog

New build breaks previous saves.
Just a heads up.

Prettykrazy

I saw some posters mention how they would avoid the chemical interest/fascination trait and thought I would add my thoughts/experience to that topic before I begin my next playthrough.

As I mentioned briefly in the last post, during my latest playthrough I set a Forced Trait: Chemical Interest to all characters 50%, with 4/5 starting colonists with it and the last one being a teetotaler. With this setup I was definitely having a contrasting experience.

My teetotaler was the saddest of the bunch! Through all the hardships AND the good times, my poor Teetotaler was consistently the worst off mood wise. Some of the Chemical Interest pawns I had also had some pretty harsh traits like neurotic, volatile, nervous etc yet they were still usually quite well off, although admittedly there were some touch and go points where I had to micromanage their drug/joy/work times but overall I only had what felt like a handful of mental breaks with them, whereas the teetotaler was 90% useless from needing so much joy to compensate for the occasional animal death/filth and just generally not having a well setup base-at the time. Keep in mind I had pretty much all the drugs and beer available throughout, so it wasn't like any one drug was doing all the mood boosting.

The downsides of Chemical interest are far easier to manage than the negatives of teetotaler, let's compare briefly
Teetotaler negatives:
-unable to do drugs for joy/mood, thereby making each debuff is more significant.
-unable to do drugs for performance increase, making them less effective in bursts for such things like construction/crafting/hauling/etc
Doesn't sound like much does it, but in actual play(on Rough Cassandra) these inabilities really set them back in terms of work output and mood management

Chemical Interest negatives:
-slightly higher use of drugs for joy purposes, this requires a higher drug supply/sustain
-joints use for joy, as well as mood, increase food consumption a decent amount as well as lower productivity via consciousness and move speed
-drug/beer use whenever they feel like it ie binges and hangovers, this leads to times when you'll schedule work and be stuck waiting for it to complete when you otherwise wouldn't need to with a non Ch.In. pawn
-more drugs/beer required to sustain addictions, productivity and mood.

Overall I think the negatives are pretty even when you think about them in the context of a more average playthrough. Which mine was not, being that I was focusing largely on the drug policy and drug use overall. Although personally I would be playing mostly the same way if it were just a normal a15 official.
I haven't yet played with any Chemical Fascination trait pawns so I'm not sure how much more extreme they are compared to Chemical Interest. I'll probably avoid those just to be safe, until someone skilled enough tempts me haha.

I was thinking it would be neat to be able to force drugs onto a teetotaler but inflict a heavy long term mood debuff so it would be possible to boost their performance, but not mood, for brief emergencies but that's likely just my bias showing haha.

I'll be doing a more normal playthrough this next run so i'll try to grab one pawn of each trait if possible and see how they do in a less...medicated scenario. Also, starting without drugs on hand will allow me a better perspective of the progression/economy. I can't even tell you how useful drugs are during early game when there's filth and chunks everywhere, little space/comfort/joy and you just want everything done fast!

So far the drug system has added alot to my games and i'm enjoying what feels like a new layer to the mood system and growing/trade economy. Not sure if you have plans to expand on the system some day or what but even as is on the 0.15.1274 version, with all my rest micromanaging lol, I've been having alot of fun so as always thanks Tynan and keep on truckin.

Cheers PK

edit awwww yea a new version, just on time, was literally setting up my next scenario <3
I was mainly trying a top-down approach for the drug system last run, this time I will try to focus on watching individual AI a bit more, the use for joy trigger especially seemed worth checking out, not sure exactly how that works as I was mostly dosing them manually.

MikeLemmer

Quote from: Tynan on August 26, 2016, 03:18:43 PMFor targeted testing, I'm really interested in how the drug system works. Are there subtle bugs in the AI where they do the wrong thing in some situations? Is the economy balanced? Is it balanced overall? Tell me!

Well, after some thought... now I wonder if meals are overpriced. A meal sells for twice as much as a joint, despite being crafted nearly the same way (vegetables grown get processed). I suppose it all depends on potato yield vs smokeleaf yield... I'll have to pay closer attention to that.

I suppose the big question is, how much money do you want the colonists to make off a 5x5 field for a season?

NolanSyKinsley

Meals cost more because they spoil fast, and must be refrigerated/frozen. Drugs you can pretty much leave anywhere and I am not sure they even decay when open to the sky.

Grishnerf

please make turrets undeployable.
with the improved raider sapper machanic it is kinda stupid to just re-arrange your "killbox" that easy.
Born in Toxic Fallout
Drop-Pod Escape Artist

NolanSyKinsley

Quote from: Grishnerf on August 26, 2016, 04:40:49 PM
please make turrets undeployable.
with the improved raider sapper machanic it is kinda stupid to just re-arrange your "killbox" that easy.

I barely have time to get my colonists into firing position during a raid, much less play musical turrets....

Grishnerf

Quote from: NolanSyKinsley on August 26, 2016, 05:13:43 PM
Quote from: Grishnerf on August 26, 2016, 04:40:49 PM
please make turrets undeployable.
with the improved raider sapper machanic it is kinda stupid to just re-arrange your "killbox" that easy.

I barely have time to get my colonists into firing position during a raid, much less play musical turrets....

depends on the mapsize and if you instant pause the game on raid alert,
you should have plenty of time to setup.
of course it wont always work.
but i think it is kinda cheap to just switch your turrets around where you need them.
Born in Toxic Fallout
Drop-Pod Escape Artist

Wintersdark

Hmmmm; maybe bug encountered.  Not sure how to get logs as I can't find any other than output_log.txt in ~/RimWorld/RimWorldWin_Data (will search around after posting this). 

Anyways, had a drop pod crash, converted a bed to a Prisoner Bed and captured him.  He was placed in the bed which was flagged For Prisoners and Medical; treated and recovered.  After he recovered, he refused to use the bed (still  flagged For Prisoners and Medical) and instead slept on the floor.  This persisted until I put a new bed in the room and flagged it For Prisoners (only).  Sadly, it didn't occur to me to just turn off the medical flag - I've never had to do that in the past.

It was really wierd, though, to have him sleep on the floor beside the Prisoner flagged bed he had just gotten up from.

I have not yet updated to the latest build, as the previous post said it was not save compatible - running the build from last night.




In unrelated but more asked for feedback; drugs!

I'd figured I'd ultimately stick to a pretty drug free approach, as they seem on first blush to be more problematic than useful - I normally have no issues with mood management.  However, my first extra settler in this game had "Very Neurotic", "Volatile", and (IIRC) "Hard Worker" - he's a excellent worker, very fast, a gold mine really... but even when what would be Joyful for someone else, he's got minor mental break warnings.

Now I just keep him high all the time, and he's perfectly settled and happy. 

I love this; how easy it is to justify starting production.

Wintersdark

Quote from: Grishnerf on August 26, 2016, 05:38:19 PM
depends on the mapsize and if you pause the game on raid alert.
you should have plenty of time. of course it wont always work.
but i think it is kinda cheap to just Switch your turrets around where you Need them.

I guess if you're on a huge map, or a really snowy one maybe? 

I know on default sizes, there's no way you'd have time to do that unless they're waiting and preparing... and if so?  That's the whole point.

I'd much rather turrets remain movable.  In normal play at generally default settings it's not exploitable, but it's nice to be able to change your defenses if they don't work as planned.  I'd hate to see this removed.

NolanSyKinsley

Quote from: Wintersdark on August 26, 2016, 05:38:47 PM
Hmmmm; maybe bug encountered.  Not sure how to get logs as I can't find any other than output_log.txt in ~/RimWorld/RimWorldWin_Data (will search around after posting this). 

Anyways, had a drop pod crash, converted a bed to a Prisoner Bed and captured him.  He was placed in the bed which was flagged For Prisoners and Medical; treated and recovered.  After he recovered, he refused to use the bed (still  flagged For Prisoners and Medical) and instead slept on the floor.  This persisted until I put a new bed in the room and flagged it For Prisoners (only).  Sadly, it didn't occur to me to just turn off the medical flag - I've never had to do that in the past.

It was really wierd, though, to have him sleep on the floor beside the Prisoner flagged bed he had just gotten up from.

I have not yet updated to the latest build, as the previous post said it was not save compatible - running the build from last night.




In unrelated but more asked for feedback; drugs!

I'd figured I'd ultimately stick to a pretty drug free approach, as they seem on first blush to be more problematic than useful - I normally have no issues with mood management.  However, my first extra settler in this game had "Very Neurotic", "Volatile", and (IIRC) "Hard Worker" - he's a excellent worker, very fast, a gold mine really... but even when what would be Joyful for someone else, he's got minor mental break warnings.

Now I just keep him high all the time, and he's perfectly settled and happy. 

I love this; how easy it is to justify starting production.

Prisoner beds marked for medical will only be used for medical purposes, they need both medical beds and normal beds.

Tynan

New build is up with some fixes. Mainly to: raiders use drop pods way too often.
Tynan Sylvester - @TynanSylvester - Tynan's Blog

MikeLemmer

Alright, so I've been running colonies with 2-3 addictions starting out, and heavily rationing their drugs by putting them in the Stockpile, setting their policy to No Drugs, and letting them go into Withdrawal until I need them in top form (like when a raid occurs). I've done this for about 5-10 days and not once have they broken policy and stolen/binged on their drugs, which I store right next to the meals. Is this working as intended? Or should it be harder to ration their drugs while they're in withdrawal?

Tynan

Well they'll only have binges due to mood, so if you keep them happy enough, they should be okay.
Tynan Sylvester - @TynanSylvester - Tynan's Blog