Suicide

[Thirite]

Absolutely should have as a mental break. I wondered why it wasn't in the game already.

...

This is a pretty good idea. I would make "Chronic Depression" a disease hediff like how Asthma works- it needs treating via antidepressants every so often. If colonists are untreated for too long their mental breaks get locked to sad wander, hiding in room, sleeping all day, and attempting suicide.

[4myGod]

I too would like to see suicide.  Here are my thoughts on it though:

Its only possible in extreme conditions: family death, multiple person family death, husband/wife leaves them.

When it happens, there is a short timer to save them if anyone is nearby they will rush to help like an injured person.  This makes it so that the suicidal person you will want to keep around other people.

Even if there is no one around to help if the suicide is complete there is still a chance for failure (eg. shot off body part, cut off arm w/e) and blood loss needing medical attention.  Or they succeed and that person insta-dies due to suicide.

[Thirite]

Already implemented in the excellent RimDisorders mod by SeveralPuffins
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=33075.msg336955#msg336955

Their mods in general are excellent too. I particularly recommend 'Razzle Dazzle' and 'Rumors and Deception'.

[Limdood]

I think this is a terrible idea.

1) suicide is a real, current problem, and as has already been pointed out in this thread, SEEING and being reminded of suicide can lead to REAL WORLD suicides.  It's a TERRIBLE idea from an "effect-on-real-people" standpoint.

2) getting a "you die, lol" effect in any game isn't fun.  There used to be an event in rimworld that picked a colonist at random and said that he was a secret double agent from a hostile faction.  That colonist would suddenly belong to a hostile faction with no hope of it "wearing off" and your only option was violence (as he would actively attack you) - maybe if you got lucky, you could capture him and try to recruit him...from scratch.  People hated just having a "your pawn is dead" event, which is essentially what that was.  That event was written out ~5 alphas ago BECAUSE it was a no-fun event that just pissed people off.  Making it a "slow process that the player could notice and prevent" is no better, as NOTHING in the game behaves like that, despite several events in the game that COULD work off of requiring the player to notice.  In other words, its a TERRIBLE idea from a gameplay and game continuity perspective.

3) It adds nearly nothing to the game.  Like an earlier "rape" idea on the grounds that "well, it exists in real life, just like other bad stuff in rimworld," suicide adds nothing to the game.  berserk mental breaks already serve the role of "most extreme break" quite effectively, posing danger not only to the berserking pawn, but to all surrounding pawns as well.  features added to the game NEED a better reason than "because it would be realistic" - there has to be a gameplay reason to add any given feature, and this has none.  It is a TERRIBLE idea from a game-design perspective.

[Harold3456]

I feel like suicide is both a good and a bad idea.

Implementing suicide and suicide attempts could make RimWorld an even more intense and better game than it already is. On the other hand, there are people who wouldn't respond well to this. Like, at all.

Agreed. Great idea in theory, must be careful in execution. At the end of the day this game IS escapism, even if it's generally bleak. As others have said, renaming it will in itself help, and then having it occur in a less conventional way as well. For the name, I would recommend "DESPAIR" as in "A DESPAIR event". A DESPAIR event could involve the pawn abandoning the colony (always a good dramatic device), refusing to eat or sleep. For added tension, he could do so when the other colonists or asleep, and the game could tell you straight-up there is no possibility of apprehending him.

PS: The only game I've seen do suicide is This War of Mine, which is a VERY bleak game that's meant more as artistic expression than fun pastime: it exists as a game second, and first as a reminder of the things refugees of war will do to survive. Rimworld gets dark, but I don't think it has ever tried to match the darkness of This War of Mine's tone.

[IronSquid501]

Suicide attempts seem like they'd happen before berserk imo, so it's probably an excellent mental break to have, not to mention the most realistic. After all, for every depressed person who goes on a killing spree you have tens of thousands who commit suicide irl.

[4myGod]

I understand that suicide is a real life problem, but so is husbands leaving their wives or wives leaving their husbands and yet we have that in the game.  Also people going crazy and killing people is a real problem, and we have that in the game.

I don't think suicide is a 100% chance of loss of your character.  It simply means if you have a guy who just lost family members or was left by their spouse, you should probably keep them in the base near others so that if they start to attempt suicide then others will rush and prevent them.  Even if they are able to complete the suicide attempt, it can still fail resulting in losing body parts, bleeding, and needing treatment.

In my opinion, I'd rather have someone depressed who I keep at home so I can prevent their suicide than to have someone with the plague.  It also seems more realistic to me that a person who suffered the loss of a family member was suicidal and not that they went on a killing spree in a berserk stage.

[Perq]

Once again an idea is opposed bombarded with but we might offend someone. FFS, there are plenty of things that are present in our world and plenty of people who will get offended by anything and everything.

Let me remind you people one thing: THIS IS A VIDEO GAME.

Saying that suicide shouldn't be a thing because it might trigger someone into doing it themselves is ignorant and disrespectful. Someone who wants to commit suicide doesn't do that because video game characters did it. Making it so shallow is offensive. :|
If someone has serious issues that may lead them to commit suicide they shouldn't be playing a video game about killing people and divorces.

Your logic leads to covering everything in pillows because someone might hurt themselves.

Actual gameplay implementation can be thought out to make it balanced and meanigful, but if you begin the conversation with but muh someone's potential feels I have little hope in having constructive discussion.

[ReZpawner]

Let me remind you people one thing: THIS IS A VIDEO GAME.

It normalises it. It's a bad thing. Read a book.

[Sola]

I'm on board with O Negative here.  Suicide, rape, sex slaves, and getting hit by bolts of lightning happen in the real world, but some things should just not be included.

Foamy's rant notwithstanding... Yeah, people become an hero in the real world, but you know what else people do in the real world?  Drink water, take showers, urinate, have children, buy/sell slaves, build a second story on their house, stand beside traps they're rearming (as opposed to on top of them), eat food at a table instead of in the freezer, and go fishing.  None of these are in the game either;  And although it would require more coding, I feel these options would add more to the game without touching on sensitive subjects or relying on cheap sensationalism.

Additionally, mods already exist with this functionality.

[A Friend]

Unlike rape, I fail to see the issue with implementing depression and suicide aside from controversy (which I don't really care all that much about). With my suggestion,

TL;DR - Extreme Mental Breaks gives pawns "Depression" in their health tab. It builds up when they're sad or bad things happen to their friends and families and they recover when they're happy and have lots of friends. They'll only attempt suicide when they reach 100%. So, it's more of a disease than an event you have no control over.

I believe that it can be an interesting feature. Acting as sort of a disease that's tied to the relationship system. But it should definitely not be as common as berserk.

Although quite dark and falls on the "not funny" side, I think there's room for it in Rimworld. Providing a more serious story of loss, tragedy or hope in contrast to the wacky adventures of Cannibal Carl and his cat who smokes weed.

If you believe that this mechanic can influence people in real life to kill themselves then I'd like to see studies about it. Otherwise, it holds as much proof as violent video games makes people violent.

[cultist]

Let me remind you people one thing: THIS IS A VIDEO GAME.

That argument is at least 10 years too old. Probably more. The idea that video games is a cultural safe space that doesn't interact with the rest of society and doesn't have to consider the impact of their message died a long time ago. Most people have accepted that video games can be just as influential as any other cultural work, for good or bad.

[Thirite]

Once again an idea is opposed bombarded with but we might offend someone. FFS, there are plenty of things that are present in our world and plenty of people who will get offended by anything and everything.

Let me remind you people one thing: THIS IS A VIDEO GAME.

Saying that suicide shouldn't be a thing because it might trigger someone into doing it themselves is ignorant and disrespectful. Someone who wants to commit suicide doesn't do that because video game characters did it. Making it so shallow is offensive. :|
If someone has serious issues that may lead them to commit suicide they shouldn't be playing a video game about killing people and divorces.

Your logic leads to covering everything in pillows because someone might hurt themselves.

Actual gameplay implementation can be thought out to make it balanced and meanigful, but if you begin the conversation with but muh someone's potential feels I have little hope in having constructive discussion.

This times a hundred. I've always tried to keep my personal life out of the public view but I think this is important. I've had Major Depressive Disorder aka chronic depression since I was around 8 years old. And it would not "trigger" me in the slightest if a pawn attempted or successfully killed themselves in a videogame. If you need everything covered in trigger warnings and pillows in a virtual space to not have a mental breakdown your problem is not depression, it's having the mind of a baby throwing a tantrum.

Stop trying to play the part of content police of what "might offend people". The whole world is offensive. Grow up.

[ReZpawner]

Thirite, this may come as a surprise to you, but you're not the only person on the planet. Nor are you the only person who has gone through depression. There are others out there who may not respond in the same way that you do. Grow up.

[Limdood]

yet again. 

This is an idea with a potential drawback, possibly a very BIG drawback.  It also has almost no positive impact on gameplay.  It adds nothing meaningful to the game other than "look at this real-life thing we added that doesn't significantly change the game in ANY way but might piss people off"

This isn't about losing potential new customers and players of the game, this is about taking the game in a direction that pisses people off that ALREADY PLAY.  And you're trying to do this for NO gameplay benefit, and quite possibly, significant DAMAGE to the current gameplay (pawns just dying from low mood...argue it all you want, thats what you're proposing.  If you played the sims and your sim just randomly died while walking around because they got sad, you'd be PISSED OFF!  Despite rimworld being more in-depth and darker, the gameplay impact is still the same)