Positive mood bonus for defeating a raid

[Kermack]

The thrill of victory +10
3 days remaining

[Tynan]

I actually like this idea. The problem is that it can be very difficult to have the system detect "defeating a raid" in every case, even if you're the attacker or there are multiple fights. And should it feel different between defeating one naked dude vs a giant bug infestation? How do we detect that? It seems easy but it's not.

[DariusWolfe]

So, here's a thought: Maybe it doesn't matter?

Day 3: survived a raid - this naked mad-man with a club attacked our colony! He came charging at us, screaming, and I barely got my rifle up in time, but one lucky shot, and he was down.

Day 30: 4 raiders came, demanding we return their slave. We refused of course, but it was a tense fight until I managed to wing a couple of them, and the others broke and ran. I'm never going to get used to this.

Day 45: Sparkles broke into an old temple earlier today, and came screaming back toward the colony with a couple bug-like monstrosities on his tail. Luckily, we'd just gotten several automated turrets up, and I was able to take down the big one before it ate right through the wall.

It's a temporary buff that follows surviving a situation you might not. Hell, I had 3 dudes, in cover, shooting at a single raider with middlin' ranged skill; Raider downed on, one-shot killed another before the raid finally broke and ran (because my melee and dog took down his partner) I shouldn't have been worried at all, but the tides turned and I ended up the loser with one dead and one dying from a 2-man raid where I outnumbered them more than 2-1.

[Tynan]

Yeah but why would anyone feel great if one naked weirdo wanders into their giant turret line and gets shredded in one burst?

"Hooray, we won the battle!"? More like an execution.

Ditto one mad squirrel, etc.

[DariusWolfe]

Okay, you make a good point; there are outliers where it'd be weird.

But I think the general point is solid; Survival on the Rim should be celebrated, even if the victory isn't that big.

Maybe require the pawns to engage the enemy, and only have it apply to humans? Or, hell, make it only happen if someone is wounded, and only have the buff applied to those who were wounded? It'd help offset the pain penalties a bit.

[Zhentar]

I've always thought the opposite - colonists should get a mood bonus during the raid (or more accurately modeling reality, a lower break threshold), followed by a penalty afterwards, scaled by duration. People often "go numb" during stressful events (at least reasonably short ones) and then break down from the stress processing it afterwards.

[DariusWolfe]

Without getting into long-term effects like PTSD, that model only really works for those who haven't been trained or otherwise become accustomed to high-stress situations like combat. Once you're to the point where that kind of stress has become part of your daily life, you're often going to want to celebrate your victories shortly after, as testified by how many times I've seen a patrol sitting around raucously playing spades and drinking near-beer after coming back inside the wire (proper celebrations being a somewhat limited thing downrange.)

I would imagine after a month or two on the Rim, raids become one of those facts of life that stop freaking you out, like mortars and IEDs downrange.

Edit: you know, I wonder if there is actually some hidden mechanism that acts like you said tho', Zhentar? I don't think I've ever seen a break during a fight, including some that lasted way, way longer than they should have. Does being drafted perhaps give a hidden break-resistance?

[O Negative]

I really appreciate the idea of a mood boost after a raid, because it allows a player to recover from a potentially terrible situation. I honestly couldn't tell you how many times I've had colonies fall to mass mental breaks after a raid. You have to account for the mental debuffs people get from pain and possible lost loved ones, when you're thinking about this. Colonists with wounds who refuse to receive treatment for them are probably my biggest pet-peeve in this entire game, hahaha.

I definitely think there should be some kind of mental reward, regardless of whether or not you sustained any injuries, after a raid. It doesn't have to be a huge one. If it's possible, maybe you could temporarily store how many "points" went into the last raid, and use that as a variable in the mood gain calculation. Maybe just use something like "ticksSinceLastEvent_Raid" as a check to determine if colonists should get the buff. Not sure what the best way to determine if a raid is over would be.

Just my thoughts...

P.S. I don't think the argument of the mad squirrel (or any mad animal) scenario works here. Mad animals are a fairly easy event to get around, even in the early game, and aren't much to celebrate over So, the mental buff wouldn't be necessary to apply in that situation.

[Limdood]

Yeah but why would anyone feel great if one naked weirdo wanders into their giant turret line and gets shredded in one burst?

"Hooray, we won the battle!"? More like an execution.

Ditto one mad squirrel, etc.

Well...according to the game mechanics, I don't see how a colony with a turret line would trigger a raid of a single naked dude?

A simple little +5 "victory" mood for a day after defeating a raid (defined as that group of enemies all dead, downed, or fleeing...since I know the game already tracks this due to getting 2 simultaneous raids from the same faction and they "broke and ran" separately of each other).  Don't have it affect animals, just enemy raids on your base - with mood bonus for that base/map only.

Any raid, regardless of size, should give the bonus, since any raids after the initial few are balanced to colony wealth (and he initial few have the added threat the colony being relatively unprepared).
- Single animal insanity event should absolutely NOT give a bonus.
- Mass animal insanity should PROBABLY not give a bonus.
- Manhunter event could, or could not give a bonus.  I can see giving a bonus because they can occasionally be more dangerous than raids (especially wargs and boars) and are balanced to colony wealth like raids to provide a "suitable" threat, but its also a just a bunch of animals, and might be harder to define when exactly "winning" happens.
- Offensive raids again, could or could not give a bonus, since while it is a victory, and easily defined when "victory" happens, it is an offensive attack, and not successfully defending yourself against vicious, bloodthirsty, immoral pirates/savages (where it is much easier to convince yourself that you're "in the right"
- Caravan being attacked should probably line up with the "getting raided" choices, caravan attacked by manhunters should line up with base attacked by manhunters, and caravan attacking a trade caravan should line up with offensive raids.

[Razzoriel]

And should it feel different between defeating one naked dude vs a giant bug infestation? How do we detect that? It seems easy but it's not.

Triggers only when all attackers/defenders are captured, dead or flee. +5 base bonus, +1 for every raider/insect, with diminishing returns, up to +20 for a huge hundred-man raid/infestation.

Tag each raid/infestation "member" (raider/insect) with a "Raid1", "Raid2" tag, and so forth, so when you defeat/capture all pawns with the same tag the bonus occurs for all colonists in the map at the time.

[ymc]

I like the idea too, and I don't know if you'd even have to have a system to determine a victory from a close brush with doom. Just call it "Not today" (or something along those lines), and have the tooltip say something equally vague such as "We made it through, this time". If it went poorly, chances are you've got a ton of negatives anyway for pain and mourning, or starvation and cabin fever from hiding indoorslike a wuss.

It could even apply to things like fire.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpSOWfFtKJE (sorry, had to, haha)

In the meantime, I highly recommend:
New Colony, Edit Scenario, Add Trait -> Bloodlust 100% for all characters

There are some side effects to this of course, but you are talking about an across the board mood buff implying that pawns should be happy that they were attacked.

[Circledline]

I know of the points system, but would it be possible for you to set it up so when a raider is killed it counts the points that raider was worth and then give the buff from there? Say you kill a raider who had a value of 8000 points (not that I really have anything to compare). Divide by some really large number and viola, that's your mood buff, or have thresholds like you do with psychic drones ranging from minor to extreme. At <10000 points you get a +2 and at >50000 a bonus of +15 (I seriously don't know the scale for this). For player raids it could be determined not only by the amount of points the killed pawns were, but also the points or wealth of the destroyed structures such as walls, turrets, whatever they have there because I still haven't checked.

Perhaps make it so that killing a fleeing raider cuts the points added from them by half or maybe a quarter. Have sappers give a 10-20% bonus, same with tactical raids. During sieges it could also be a buffed rate like with sappers, or have points be given for destroying mortars (not sure how you'd do that).

An alternative to the above is simply taking the points of the raid (which was dictated by colony wealth) and on win simply give the appropriate mood. I'm sure this would make it a much simpler set of code than the above, but it would leave out systems such as taken prisoners, destroyed structures, etc.

Have the bonus be given to you once all raiders leave the cell. I have absolutely no clue how the game was made, but I once learned ways from classes of setting up systems like the above.

With my knowledge I shouldn't have any real say in this, but I do hope I add to the conversation. I would love to see these systems be implemented to the game.

[Perq]

While sitting in front of a computer, a victory might be a happy event.

But I highly someone who got shot and/or cut by knives/spears/whatever would be very happy about winning. :V
Especially if they weren't asking to be stranded on an alien planet, fighting with savages to survive.

[DariusWolfe]

But I highly someone who got shot and/or cut by knives/spears/whatever would be very happy about winning. :V
Especially if they weren't asking to be stranded on an alien planet, fighting with savages to survive.

While none of my friends or colleagues were ever stranded on an alien planet, I can speak with some small amount of certainty when I say that surviving, even with injuries, is definitely something that the survivors will celebrate.

And no, I'm not talking about anyone sitting behind a screen.

[Euzio]

I like the idea alot. I would think that even if its one naked dude getting shredded by turrets, the colony would still get a mood boost in the sense that "Hey! Our defences are solid and repelled a mad man!" and get a mood boost.

But naturally the scale of the raid (or even manhunter events) should correspond to the level of mood boost. And the raid would only end if the raiders flee/captured/killed (for manhunters it would be all killed or till they calm down).