[A17.1543] Stonecutting table allowed skill range is Construction

Started by Kubouch, May 24, 2017, 10:56:11 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

Kubouch

A skill requirement of a stonecutting table is Construction instead of Crafting. The job itself is Crafting (a guy with no Crafting can't cut blocks) but the allowed skill range is applied to Construction instead (a guy with whatever Crafting can cut blocks as long as his Construction is within the range). Screenshot in an attachment. Noticed in the A17.1543 testing build but appears also in 1546 (on the same save).


[attachment deleted by admin due to age]

ReZpawner

It's just another change to the game. Now you no longer gain crafting skill from using the stonecutting table, but you gain construction skill. A lot of things were changed, such as drug-making now gives intelligence, and so on. Don't think this is an actual bug, although I admit it feels weird.

Edit: For what it's worth, I think although it feels weird to us who are used to it being crafting, that it makes sense. I mean, we are making buildingmaterials after all, so one can probably learn a thing or two from cutting the blocks used. Much like the old masons in the middle ages.

Hammering a block of stone would hardly make anyone a good tailor.

Kubouch

Quote from: ReZpawner on May 24, 2017, 12:11:07 PM
It's just another change to the game. Now you no longer gain crafting skill from using the stonecutting table, but you gain construction skill. A lot of things were changed, such as drug-making now gives intelligence, and so on. Don't think this is an actual bug, although I admit it feels weird.

Edit: For what it's worth, I think although it feels weird to us who are used to it being crafting, that it makes sense. I mean, we are making buildingmaterials after all, so one can probably learn a thing or two from cutting the blocks used. Much like the old masons in the middle ages.

Hammering a block of stone would hardly make anyone a good tailor.

That sounds reasonable but stonecutting should require a construction job, then. Not crafting. I wanted to set a skill cap to the stonecutting table so that my highly skilled craftsman is not spending his time cutting blocks. Now since the cap is set to construction and my crafter is not a constructor and does not have a high construction skill it is impossible to prevent him from cutting blocks.

Razghul

It´s simply wrong to have it assigned as a crafting job while gaining construction experience and the bills being limited by construction skill. It messes up the whole job assignment. Making stoneblocks for construction could be a construction job, yeah, but then it needs to be assigned to construction in the job assignment as well.

r3doctober85

I have been crafting stone blocks for a year now in game and they will not level up at all. They are still stuck at the same experience that they were before.

O Negative

Stone blocks now give construction experience instead of crafting. 1 year wasted :P

r3doctober85

Yeah... i just checked... lol i wish i would have seen that sooner... Too bad because i only have one construction person and like 3 crafters @@

O Negative

No worries, it's not your fault. It's not exactly intuitive for X job to give Y experience.

Now you know ;)

ymc

#8
I would say that this is still a bug then. I cannot assign a construction worker to the stonecutter's table, even though that's the only thing it's used for now.

[attachment deleted by admin due to age]

DariusWolfe

It's only a bug if it's not intended behavior, which it is.

Enough complaints about it though, and misunderstandings, that Tynan may rethink the current implementation, but it's not a bug.

ymc

If it is working as intended, how does one get their crafter constructor to use that crafting construction Stonecutter's Table but not use the smithing tailoring Crafting Spot, thereby wasting all the bills and materials that you were hoping your crafter would use to level up their crafting so that one day they can become a successful tailor-smith?

The mess that drug manufacturing is now is what will end up happening here. Instead of fixing whatever root problem they thought there was with making stone blocks earn drug / tailoring / smithing skill, they just moved it to construction without checking the other flags to make sure it still worked. That's a bug, introduced by a quick hack to fix a different problem, plain and simple.

Following the logic that got us to this point, somebody who crafts constructs stone bricks for a living shouldn't be as good at constructing crafting leather furniture as a tailor, so that should give crafting xp now, but your tailor should have to be assigned to construction in order to do it because it's not really a tailoring job. ::)

[attachment deleted by admin due to age]

sadpickle

Hoping this is merely an oversight. It is aggravating to say the least. Blocks are my go-to way of training low-level crafters into something of worth, WITHOUT blowing through say, textile stocks. This is even more important now that farming has been nerfed.

DariusWolfe

Set minimum skill levels. Since the bills take into account Constructing rather than Crafting, you can ensure that crafters (unless they *also* meet the construction minimum skill you set) will not make stones, or drugs in the case of intellectuals.

If your constructor is incapable of crafting, then you can't. Right now, with no evidence to the contrary, and at least circumstantial evidence to support it (it was mentioned multiple times in the A17-unstable thread, which Tynan and co were reading regularly), this is also working as designed. It even sort of makes sense, if you squint; Whatever background stuff disables crafting but not construction is focused on the table-based crafting, rather than the building of things like walls, beds, etc. (Personally, I think the whole 'Disables' aspect is bunk, but it's part of Rimworld-as-designed, and if you don't like it, there are mods that "fix" it.)

Edit: Your second image is a really weak example, considering that they STILL wouldn't be able to do it, as they're unable to do Construction, either.

drunetovich

So how do I actually level crafting now? Only by making wood swords?

DariusWolfe

Swords, clothes, guns.

If you're wanting to grind for skill gain, I'd go with stone, since I believe it's supposed to take longer to work with... I know it does with furniture and art, but I'm not sure if it's the case with weapons. Also, set the bench outside, or in a less-than-ideal temperature, so you get a speed penalty.

Or just don't grind. I think (and this is pure supposition; If Tynan ever explained his reasoning, I missed it) that's part of the reason why rolling joints is now supposedly a non-skill job, and stone is now constructing; It was being used to grind skill gain, rather than to make things you needed, and was leading to uber-skilled smiths who would regularly make extremely high quality stuff for sale and use, and throwing off the intended balance of the game.