"Construction failed" is getting ridiculous now

[mumblemumble]

I suppose maybe skill should play a bigger relivance than sight, for some things. I think a blind constructor level 20 could manage things just fine.

Also, the single eye loss has always bothered me - really a single eye is around 80% effectiveness, and eye damage should average out

[hoffmale]

Is he fully healthy, tho? My lvl ~18 constructor turned from super-fast and fail-safe into slow and sloppy after losing his eye.

As someone who has very little vision in one eye (Can just about read the letter on the top row of an eye chart), and an eye hand coordination problem, anyone want to explain to me how come I can build small, fine detail, models with out failing 1/5 times or so it seems?

Eyes can be damaged in multiple ways. Being near- or farsighted is just a natural deficiency that works differently than, say, having a big scar right on your eyeball or being unable to move your eyeball because the muscles for doing so have been irreparably damaged.

That said, having a fully functional other eye, a human can still see quite a lot (through 3D vision gets a bit quirky without input from both eyes). It most likely will still have some repercussion on perception in some ways. Yes, when nearsighted you are still fine doing miniature models, but you will most likely have problems when doing stuff at a distance (say, ball catching or archery) - at least I do, even with glasses, and my vision is poor enough that I can't read from my screen unless squinting hard without glasses.

Also I must have had constructors take damage before, how come I've never noticed it before?

In A17, the likelihood of smaller/inner body parts being damaged got increased by a lot (I think at least doubled in most cases), so those parts getting hit is now a lot more common than before.

[erdrik]

I think in reality you can't just determine skill based only on current condition of the persons physical "tools".

If someone started learning how to sculpt having only 2 fingers and a thumb, then eventually when they get to masterwork level, they are going to be a master sculptor regardless of the disability. But if they became a master sculptor before losing their fingers then they are going to need time to relearn their craft with their new limitations.

Id wager Listy can "build small, fine detail, models with out failing" because Listy has had poor eyesight long enough to adapt to that limitation.

Perhaps colonists that have permanent disabilities, like missing or impaired body parts, get a new skill that starts at 0 and over time grows as they do things relating to those body parts. That new skill could act as a multiplier to the actual skills that apply to the tasks they are trying to do, to simulate them overcoming their disability.
(there could even be new traits related to the new skill, and it could also be subject to growth modifiers like passion)

[Draconicrose]

That IS a ridiculous failure chance! I haven't played A17 long enough to notice if it's coming up more than in A16 (all my A17 constructors are nabs), but if that is the case it really needs to be tuned down at least a little. I've known plenty of "constructors" in real life with scarred hands and old eyes who made things just fine (miniature boats especially! )

[Listy]

Im a bit curious about the straight edges of that water(at least it looks like water?)...
Do you have mods installed?

See here:
https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=33143.0

New colony or tweak things with the Dev tool.
Fun fact, using the set terrain also applies a roof zone over the tile.

[YokoZar]

Vision and manipulation should probably affect construction speed, not success chance.

[BoogieMan]

I've been seeing a lot of failures. I thought it was just me.

[cultist]

Anyone with a skill of less than say 5 is going to do a very bad job in A17. It's not just construction.

Could it be that there are multiple failure checks for long projects, meaning stone walls have more chances to fail because they require a lot of work?

[Perq]

Well, a Godlike constructor shouldn't have much problems building a brick wall because he only has one eye. Lol.

From the moment he lost his eye all I'm doing is search for replacement because of how much resources I'm wasting with him building. No other suitable builders, too. :C

[Sola]

Missing an eye makes sense, then.  Similarly, being stoned on smokeleaf, food poisoned, or suffering from advanced illnesses (reduced consciousness) will also cause problems.

The issue isn't with A17.  The issue with with an impaired builder.  Get a bionic eye as soon as you can.

[Perq]

Which is left to RNG. :V

Being stoned, sure. Poisoning, yeah. But missing an eye is hardly enough of a reason to FAIL building a brick wall. Especially given how frequent it is, recently.
More so - poisoning and being stoned are pretty temporary statuses that can be dealt with quickly. If you notice your builder being poisoned, you can stop him from building for the time being (and potentially wasting tons of resources).
If your builder lose an eye in the middle of the game, and then game decides to not spawn an bionic eye on vendors for ages, you are pretty much fighting a war of frustration.

Might be A17 tendency to cut off things, tho. I mean, survival rifle is capable of shooting of an arm with a single shot.
Fingers are flying left and right. Missing eyes, ears and noses are almost natural state of every pawn. :@
At this point I'd prefer to pawns simply die more, really.

[Limdood]

Anyone with a skill of less than say 5 is going to do a very bad job in A17. It's not just construction.

Could it be that there are multiple failure checks for long projects, meaning stone walls have more chances to fail because they require a lot of work?

to me, this is a big problem.  people have skills.  generally everyone is pretty decent at something.  The skills system no longer represents this.  Prior to A17, 5 was an ok value to have a skill at.  Now with 5 feeling like "fairly incompetent" at a given skill, it means that MOST pawns are only BARELY competent at one thing, and many pawns suck at everything, especially young pawns, who lack skills, passions, and any other benefit to make up for being young.

You'd think an 18 year old would be a huge boon in survival game, but in Rimworld, an 18 year old is almost strictly worse than a 35 or 42 year old.

Either lower skilled pawns need to be more competent (which simply reverts the A17 changes and wouldn't be ideal) OR pawns need to start with higher skills.  A multiplier of 1.5 or so on skills would mean that (rounded down) skill values of 2, 0, 1, 5, 11, 8, and 4 would become 3, 0, 1, 7, 16, 12, and 6....now i have a pawn who starts out GREAT at something, pretty darned good at another, and passable, with potential at two more things....where previously i had a pawn pretty good at one thing, and with the potential to be good at one more.

Also, it feels like a "skilled practitioner" should succeed at BUILDING A BRICK WALL pretty much all the dang time.

[eadras]

Checked a few of my healthy constructors' success rates.  Skill 13 was 100%, skill 5 was 93%.  So yeah, the issue the OP seems to be having is the weighting of manipulation, sight, and consciousness into the failure rate.  That's a valid argument, especially given how easily and frequently fingers and eyes are damaged in A17.

[Seriously Unserious]

Which is left to RNG. :V

Being stoned, sure. Poisoning, yeah. But missing an eye is hardly enough of a reason to FAIL building a brick wall. Especially given how frequent it is, recently.
More so - poisoning and being stoned are pretty temporary statuses that can be dealt with quickly. If you notice your builder being poisoned, you can stop him from building for the time being (and potentially wasting tons of resources).
If your builder lose an eye in the middle of the game, and then game decides to not spawn an bionic eye on vendors for ages, you are pretty much fighting a war of frustration.

Might be A17 tendency to cut off things, tho. I mean, survival rifle is capable of shooting of an arm with a single shot.
Fingers are flying left and right. Missing eyes, ears and noses are almost natural state of every pawn. :@
At this point I'd prefer to pawns simply die more, really.

There is a mod, I think called "Advanced Prosthetics" which allows you to build more advanced prosthetic parts, including bionic eyes. You have to put in extra research and build a more advanced prosthetics bench to be able to do them, so there is an added cost to gaining this ability to balance it out. I've been using this mod right from the start of my Rimworld adventures and it's a godsend, especially if missing body parts are more common then in the past.

[Listy]

Checked a few of my healthy constructors' success rates.  Skill 13 was 100%, skill 5 was 93%.  So yeah, the issue the OP seems to be having is the weighting of manipulation, sight, and consciousness into the failure rate.  That's a valid argument, especially given how easily and frequently fingers and eyes are damaged in A17.

I think the issue here is failure rate. I mean the Screen shot I posted earlier, two builders with a failure rate of 90% and 93% building a 17 tile long wall and they failed six or so times. That looks like there's something messed up in the code.

Guess I'll have to test it.