Construction success chance penalties are really harsh

[YokoZar]

A max skill craftsman operating at 50% manipulation due to a hand injury or sickness will fail to build a wall 15% of the time.

This seems a bit over the top.

[Canute]

Why should a max skilled craftsman build walls anyway, why not your max skilled constructor ?
But did you ever tryed to do things single handed ? Try to wash your dishes singlehanded and report us how many you broke, 15% sounds fair.

Then you should look for a arm/hand replacement.

[Wanderer_joins]

If anything penalties are not harsh enough, 50% manipulation is terrible.

[SpaceDorf]

I reiterate your sentence

Your One Handed Construction worker, is so awesome he is still able to build a complete wall 85% of the times. Can you imagine doing this ? Building a wall with one of your hands in a cast ? ( which is the least that happens in Rimworld .. )
And there is a reason that sick or injured people don't go to work !

Don't get me wrong, I did not do this to shut you down, but change the perspective a little bit.

What I find to harsh is the 50% ressource cost for failure.
I could not care less about losing two bricks to a failed wall ..
but loosing 500 steel, 250 plasteel and 10 components to a failed shippart or similiar that really sucks.

Here I think a diminished returns function would be better, that reduces the ressource loss the more ressources are used.

[Albion]

Is it really 50% loss though SpaceDorf?
I don't have exact numbers but I think I remember it only being like 20-30% of the resources being wasted.

In regards to the fail chance I agree. 15% is not that much if you are severely dismembered. Remember that a lowered manipulation only affects work speed and failure chance. A skilled craftsman could still create a legendary table but might fail 15% of the time... Sounds okay to me. If anything it might actually be low.

[Nameless]

I thought resource loss from fail is more like 33%.

[Canute]

Try it out,
when you cancel a half build construction/crafting you just loose 33%.

[TheMeInTeam]

Failure rate is different from speed.  15% failure rate is pretty inane for a master class builder, 1 armed or otherwise.  It's even more ridiculous when you've a pawn missing a finger that is somehow failing a lot of builds despite being an elite builder.  That's complete nonsense from a plausibility perspective (I've done higher success rate stuff construction type jobs with more limitation than being down a finger, back when I was a teenager).  It's also borked from a balance perspective since losing < 10 hp body parts has effectively no counterplay whatsoever.

[YokoZar]

Failure rate is different from speed.  15% failure rate is pretty inane for a master class builder, 1 armed or otherwise.  It's even more ridiculous when you've a pawn missing a finger that is somehow failing a lot of builds despite being an elite builder.  That's complete nonsense from a plausibility perspective (I've done higher success rate stuff construction type jobs with more limitation than being down a finger, back when I was a teenager).  It's also borked from a balance perspective since losing < 10 hp body parts has effectively no counterplay whatsoever.

This is what I'm getting at.  If you are the world's greatest expert on construction and find yourself moderately sick or with a broken arm, you're going to work a little slower rather than catastrophically fail every 8th thing.

But in this game the opposite happens -- even at 50% manipulation your skill 20 constructor builds much faster than a healthy "professional" person.

[Canute]

If you are the world greatest expert, you haved worked years with both arms on this.
Your body/brain got these movements etched on the memory.
Now you just got 1 arm less, but your still remember the old mechanics, and this will cause the errors mosttimes.
Sure you could work like a lvl 1, think about every step, but then you better assign someone else for that job.

[Mkok]

The real problem here is the rarity of bionics. I once spent whole ingame year looking for bionic hand for my one-handed constructor. I visited bunch of settlements and called in bunch of traders. All They ever had were simple prosthetics, which are not enough to get you to 100% success chance. 

[Dashthechinchilla]

I always thought that the manipulation penalty should be scaled differently. My favorite tattoo artist cut his index finger off in wood shop in high school. Now he owns his own parlor and competes nationally. Yet my highly skilled constructor will fail building a wall several times because a scar on his neck is restricting his breathing.

[Bozobub]

If you are the world greatest expert, you haved worked years with both arms on this.
Your body/brain got these movements etched on the memory.
Now you just got 1 arm less, but your still remember the old mechanics, and this will cause the errors mosttimes.
Sure you could work like a lvl 1, think about every step, but then you better assign someone else for that job.

So, howzabout the expert who learned while being "disabled", hmm?

I am missing 2/3 of my right ring finger and the little finger is damaged (it's mostly useless).  Guess what?  I do just about all tasks as fast as before my injury, after healing and years of experience with the effects, and I have nearly full strength and dexterity in that hand; I even juggle!  I've also watched a man with a prosthetic leg breakdancing; very well, at that.

The penalties are FAR too harsh for minor injuries, *unless* you have them scale down to some minimum over time.  And yes, major injuries should slow you down, sure, but the penalties to success are rather silly.  Let me put it this way:  anyone who thinks minor injuries are a serious impediment to almost any craft has never met a smith or glassblower, that simple.

[erdrik]

...
So, howzabout the expert who learned while being "disabled", hmm?

I am missing 2/3 of my right ring finger and the little finger is damaged (it's mostly useless).  Guess what?  I do just about all tasks as fast as before my injury, after healing and years of experience with the effects, and I have nearly full strength and dexterity in that hand; I even juggle!  I've also watched a man with a prosthetic leg breakdancing; very well, at that.

The penalties are FAR too harsh for minor injuries, *unless* you have them scale down to some minimum over time.  And yes, major injuries should slow you down, sure, but the penalties to success are rather silly.  Let me put it this way:  anyone who thinks minor injuries are a serious impediment to almost any craft has never met a smith or glassblower, that simple.

^ This.

..., *unless* you have them scale down to some minimum over time. ...

^ I would especially like to see this in the game.

[TheMeInTeam]

This is what I'm getting at.  If you are the world's greatest expert on construction and find yourself moderately sick or with a broken arm, you're going to work a little slower rather than catastrophically fail every 8th thing.

But in this game the opposite happens -- even at 50% manipulation your skill 20 constructor builds much faster than a healthy "professional" person.

Haha true construction rate (crop growth and research too) are all tuned way faster than is humanly possible.  That scratches any realism argument for 1-armed construction though, and from a gameplay perspective the fail rate is annoying.  I'd rather it cause slower build speed and skip the "wasting materials" outcome.

If you are the world greatest expert, you haved worked years with both arms on this.
Your body/brain got these movements etched on the memory.
Now you just got 1 arm less, but your still remember the old mechanics, and this will cause the errors mosttimes.

That's not how reality works.  With one arm there would be a large number of tasks you straight up couldn't do in construction, and a bunch more that would need extra tools or otherwise unnecessary set-up time.  You'd see someone much more likely to fail catastrophically/waste resources if working while exhausted or under the influence of other impairments (drugs/withdrawal, severe illness).

There's also not a good reason that's how it should work in the game.

An acclimation mechanic would be nice too, but aside that I'd still rather see a slowed-down work rate over increased fail rate.