Is RimWorld always going to focus around killboxes?

[SzQ]

So the problem might not be that game is focused on killboxes but rather that it's hard to see another solutions for average player.

The common injuries pawns would get such as scars has increased, as well as some Ai quirks.  I could usually get by with little to no turrets in other alphas but it's not worth to deal without them in this one.

So maybe we need turrets that can effectively compete with more threats like groups of enemies as well as snipers(edit^2, Increase energy consumption). Give pawns way to armor up in cost of much slower moving and faster rest decay etc. To addition various threatening events should be mixed. Like if raiders would really want to destroy colony they wouldn't focus on only one tactic per time. They could easily push for standard attack meanwhile dropping from the sky and bringing mortar.

Edit:
I mean that average player that got bored because of killbox probably isn't going to research enough defensive methods to run such game further.
For example i tend to build one wooden wall supporting roof and damage it until it's enough low hp. During raid i just snip that one piece of wall and collapsing roof is cutting enemies. It might seem obvious or not but i haven't seen such metod described anywhere. (not like i was looking hard)

[Perq]

I honestly find defending in early far harder than in late game. You have all the defensive positions you can get, all the walls and stuff - how could it be harder? Not to mention you get access to gear (especially armor) which makes probability of serious injuries FAR less likely.

I never use killboxes - I just make bunkers with covers and whatnot.

[Jibbles]

For example i tend to build one wooden wall supporting roof and damage it until it's enough low hp. During raid i just snip that one piece of wall and collapsing roof is cutting enemies.(not like i was looking hard)

I made this little mod a while back. Pretty much a pillar that has low hp so all it takes is one shot. lol I should start using it again cause it can be entertaining and sometimes risky. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1115374644

[Bolgfred]

In general I think killboxes are the answer to the question.
The point is not that killboxes are the problem, the question is.

AS there is only one type of attacking enemies there is only one answer to them.
As long as raiders/tribals/mechanoids follow the same scheme, there will be killboxes or comparable defenses or anything else that is equal to a bottleneck combat line to gain an advantage of the stronger enemies. And this fact leads back to the PO's point of 'alwasy going to focus around killboxes'.

To break with this there are different attack type needed. Sappers and drop dops are some good alternatives, but they tend to be anwsered same way as the regular attack because they follow the same target priority human, constructions, machine, furniture.

I think attackers in general should use more of their surroundings, like hiding in the forests to ambush lonely lumberjacks, or rampaging pyromanics who set the whole map on fire if not stopped, full sniper crews who focus people but stay away from the colony itself or just some thieves who try to grab items whilst avoiding combat if possible.
All these thing cannot be solved with a kill box as they cannot be baited like usual AI.
All-In-All I think the answer is diversity. The situation where the attacker does nothing but kill and destroy anything in sight should be the rarest type of interaction and not the major purpose, as this always leads back to the old busines: killbox and bunker.

[TheMeInTeam]

On high difficulties, playing with RNG early-mid game is a fool's errand.  The way combat is designed, a single shot RNG can kill a pawn outright or cripple it.  The obvious incentive is to avoid this.  That remains true late game, but the loss of 1 pawn when you have 15+ is less devastating.

Killboxes are the natural choice.  Early on, perimeter wall + doors are more efficient, as you can win via defeat in detail.  Sooner or later, however, you're outnumbed 2:1, then 3:1, and the enemies have weapons where you're one bad dice roll from dead in addition to super weapons like triple rockets (though these are quire handy vs sappers later).

So you work with what the game gives you.  Call in support, use mortars vs opposing sieges, beat down isolated raiders, whatever it takes. 

This can extend well into the end game, but micromanagement against a 50 man tribal raid until you kill 25 takes a long time and rapidly gets annoying.  Mechs are even worse, game forces you to speed 1 as you repeatedly take free pot shots and eventually kill it, taking damage only if your patience fails your execution.

Killbox at that point just saves time and effort.  I prefer miniguns + traps, but it's still in essence a kill  box...or more like a long narrow kill rectangle.  Same thing in practice.

[Bozobub]

The only problem with not expanding the Home Area, that I can see so far, is that your colonists don't do any firefighting for the emplacements w/o manual intervention.  But frankly, in combat I don't want them to, anyway ^^'.

[SzQ]

I am trying to teach myself to play like Yeti. Just look at this defense. It's so much fun and blood!
https://youtu.be/aFEOeJjjtd8

[Bozobub]

I like my way, simply cuz I came across it myself .  It IS nice having almost any enemy completely riddled with bullets and/or shrapnel from exploding turrets by the time my colonists ever see 'em, I have to say.

[Wheatley]

I force myself not to use killboxes. I build my colony like a town with buildings separated by alleys and streets. It makes battles a lot more fun when you're building road blocks and ambushing from side streets when they split up. It's can be fairly effective too, if a little micro heavy.

[Injured Muffalo]

I've been using my doorways for cover. Something I have been noticing is while these firefights go on (typically the enemy chooses to hide behind corners) is various numbers of enemies wander around in the background. I don't know why. So I only need to engage half or a third of the enemies at once.

Of course, I could add more defenders if they added more attackers, but they don't. So I hide in the doorways mostly or around corners where no doorways are convenient and let the rest do their normal thing or draft inside.

Note that I don't build doorways for a defense, I just use them during attacks.

[Guilty Omelette]

I never understood the hate for killboxes. They are fun to design, and they mean I don't have to train a new blacksmith because the previous one was shot in the brain through his power armor helmet by a stray bullet "because RNG."

[Tynan]

I'm pretty sure we solve killboxes for late-game v1.0. Let me know what you think when it comes out.

Of course for some raids, killboxes will still work. They're a reasonable thing to build, so if you're facing a frontal attack they'll be helpful (though less so due to some changes in shooting accuracy code).

But we've also added some new raid strategies (e.g. sapper, siege) which should help against killboxes, and balanced the usage of the ones that were already there.

Hoping to see a lot more varied battles in 1.0.

[Listy]

I'm pretty sure we solve killboxes for late-game v1.0. Let me know what you think when it comes out.

Of course for some raids, killboxes will still work. They're a reasonable thing to build, so if you're facing a frontal attack they'll be helpful (though less so due to some changes in shooting accuracy code).

But we've also added some new raid strategies (e.g. sapper, siege) which should help against killboxes, and balanced the usage of the ones that were already there.

Hoping to see a lot more varied battles in 1.0.

This fills me with trepidation, without some details...

For a long time all we've seen is threats getting more and more deadly. Improvements to AI's, counters being binned, new attacks etc etc.
Yet the tools to answer those threats have remained the same, or in some cases have gotten worse (remember turret ROF buff?)
As I've said before, I play big and long games. When you have 200+ manhunters or tribal raids, and raiders who appear in big numbers, then a killbox is mandatory.

Earlier this dev cycle I tried a tribal colony. So no electricity, that meant a lot of killbox strategies were not available. I went with the Great bows firing over Pilum chuckers heads idea. With the enemy attacking through a swamp that had almost every inch covered with traps. It worked but only just as we approached the first decade I had to develop electricity to cope.

Edit:
I wonder, is the problem numbers of enemies involved here?
Unless you have a killbox to cut down the incoming numbers, then the enemy will always overrun your lines.
There is nothing you can do to stop them from reaching you. Back in the day you had the option of the palsteel Equipment rack, and then the solar panel to limit the ability of the enemy to just zerg you. Now they'll get you, every damn time.

[Shurp]

Listy, the problem you describe is the problem of low lethality of Rimworld weapons.  Attackers have a fantastic ability to soak up damage and keep coming, and there's not a large DPS difference between weapons.  So standing your ground and fighting only works if you have a swarm of turrets or similar advantage, ie, "killbox".

Hit and run tactics can work, but only if your units have bionic legs or you invest in heavy micromanagement (door games, running street battles inside your base, etc.).

My recommendation is to find a mod which increases weapon lethality so that ten guys with machineguns can mow down fifty attacking tribals.  Miniguns might already do this if used properly (I've never taken the time to learn to use them so I don't know if they do).

[Ser Kitteh]

OR you could just increase sharp and blunt damage by 150% in the scenario editor.