Unstable build feedback thread

[iamomnivore]

And predators are passive now. Once there are no animals they could hunt for, they'll stand there until a new proper animal spawns. And when you attack them, they don't go manhunter for 100% chance anymore. They'll fight back until you flee, then they'll leave you alone. I wish this was a thing only in peaceful difficulty.

I'll second this concern. The dangerous predatory animals was an exciting part of play. And, sure it added some micro (I had to check hunger levels) but, it added to the mystique and sense of danger from the land itself. This may be quite the overhaul, to pull off ... It'd be a nice "wishlist item" to see varying behaviors (and previous, challenging behaviors) in higher difficulties. Thanks for everything guys. You're killing it.

[Syrchalis]

I feel like there are too little healer mech serums around. A single one should be thrown in regularly with a request/stash/camp, simply because there is so many permanent injuries and ailments in the game you have to make choices anyway - but I usually don't even get one of these during a normal playthrough (by normal I mean I take my sweet time to take off).

Also in general I feel like there is too little quests in general. I would prefer there being more than you can realistically do, so you can choose which ones you want to do first. It also makes balancing the rewards much easier, because data is a lot more relevant.

What I'm trying to say is - if there was like 10-20 quests in your proximity at all times, covering most rewards, it would quickly become apparent what people go for the most and which ones are just too bad to risk anything for.

[Lanilor]

I want to add to that trap critique. You can just spam them now without worrying which makes them incredibly stronger and it is just weird that friendlies walk over them and nothign bad happens. It makes it easier and it may be annoying for some people. For me it was just normal that building traps has the risk that they hurt the wrong pawns. That's how weapons work. Same with firendly fire, that's also annoying, but I hope that won't be removed too.

Now a bit story time:
I'm around 100 days in (boreal, small hills, cass intense, naked, last patch and this) and I currently get caravan requests like crazy. I have 5 open requests and one finished a few days ago. I like that there is more, but this seems a bit too much or at least I would like to see more diversity. Most quest are either "give 20 [random apparel]" or "give 10 [random weapon/grenade]". There is much room to improve this:
- Mix different types of apparel and weapons
- Request furniture too
- Change the minimum quality (so they want 4 excellent duster or 1 masterwork shirt)
- Request specific material types (only bluefur duster, or at least only leather/cloth/devilstrand)

When I though about the new sniper turret, I thought about a high precision turret. It turns out to be not and in a raid, if it hits or not is just random with 14% chance to hit at max range. It has very high damage and fire rate, but this is not what I expected with a sniper turret. I got a raid where it hit once or twice before the enemy was in close range and with the minimum range it doesn't work at all in close combat. That could be prevented by clever positioning, but the weird feeling from a the low precision is still there. I would like it to be slower, but more precise. And maybe a bit more range than the autoturret or less for the autoturret, so they differ more.

In my last game a few days ago, one of my colonists actually got hunted by a cougar. I thought it was fun and a nice (and kinda realistic) element of the game. It created a little part of the story. Now this is gone and it makes me a bit sad. I want my story to be created by things like this. An incident that happens because of the right circumstances on the map and maybe that is somewhat my fault because I didn't foresee and care for it. Not just a random event that tells "now your story contains plague".

Being at diseases I would really like to see improvements here. I know that is a lot of work. This game I got my first random disease a day 5 or 6 (no sickly pawn) and both my colonists got fiberous mechanites. Around day 13 I got another disease and one colonist and the prisoner got sensory mechanites. At least these diseases weren't really bad ones, but it was just so random. Then it was quiet for long, I don't know exactly but around day 50 I got flu on half of my colonists. There could be a small system for each disease that makes it more unique and you have a chance to influence it. For example flu starts on just a few colonists and they spread it to people being in the same room. So you can just influence it by managing where colonists are or you just don't care about it, get a flu epidemic and fight it with more meds.

After the changes for random pawn death on down, I can get way less prisoners. In fact I have only gotten one in the last half of the game and I only had 5 colonists most of that time. Also that raiders from a refugee chase always die and never just get downed feels kinda weird. I had two refugee chases where that happened and after that I was curious if that was just bad luck or not, so looked at the code and saw how it works now (but I won't post it here to prevent other from theorizing around it). I think the downing system in general is now better than it was before. It's just that this felt a bit too extreme.

In winter I let my freezer door open to safe power and as a result, a large amount of the animals run there to get my meals. This is kinda realistic but from a game perspective, it was just free meat since my cook could just make a short break and kill the animals. Not really a fun way to hunt and this is even worse now that animals trigger traps too. I like the idea that I can make animal traps now with a bait to be more effective, but it can be abused way too much.
Same goes for manhunters. Since they walk around my base when I'm inside, they just get in the traps and the problem solved itself with enough traps. Earlier I had to fight them with my colonists or I have to stay inside until they are gone. Now I can also let the traps do the work (or a part of it) without a downside. I got a manhunter pack of 9 or 10 lynx recently. I stayed inside for the night and  in the morning a few of them were dead or downed and I could kill the rest. And I have 17 traps, so nothing really impressive or hard to archive in the midgame. (I could even stay until they are gone if they are too powerful and I still get the loot of the ones my traps killed. (Or just door cheese.))

Grenate raids are fun to fight. I tend to say more bad stuff since that is obviously what I like to get changed, but this is just something I had to write, since it was one of the nice raids I remember from the first half of this game.

I was surprised when I tried to sell simple meals to a city. I knew caravans don't buy them, but that cities also don't is weird. And caravans still buy meat which rots even faster than meals is kinda weird too.

I never need to research mortars (early), because I can just wait for the first siege and get my first two steel mortars from them. It's nice and convenient, but also makes the system a bit questionable. For mortars of better materials I would still need to research them, although there isn't much reason for it since (I belive) material doesn't affect cooldown or accuracy.

To add something to the trade request: Instead of a simple offer it could be an actual request. So when they ask you have a day to respond if you do it or not. If not, it is gone and if you decide to do it, you get reputation loss when you can't fulfill the deal in the given time.

Winter in this region reaches mostly -10°C but went down to -20°C some days and during the cold snap in late fall. (I also got a cold snap in both falls around the same time. Probably just luck, but it felt a bit like this is how the climate just is in this region, which is nice). What disturbs me is that I still have no need for good clothing or wool clothing. Pawns are mostly inside and when they are outside to haul something, a short time in the cold is no problem. Half of my colonists didn't even wear an outer layer clothing since I traded my dusters and all leather in the fall for antigrans and vanometrics in a request. So I wish clothing would be more relevant for the temperature and also that some come with a (small) tradeoff for movement speed and work speed. (This applies to plate armor too). it doesn't have to be much to have a bit impact, it would just gives the system a lot more depth. And the stronger impact of temperatures would make me to actually think about which colonist need what clothing in what biome/season instead of just giving everyone the same stuff every game.
And parka should protect legs too if duster does.

That's for now what came into my mind after playing for half of the day. I'm really bad at writing more about what happended at my colony because I forget a lot and the stuff that bothers me sticks longer. Also It's 2 am here now, I'm really tired and I already needed an hour to write this in a somewhat decent english while being half asleep, so forgive the probably 100 mistakes I made.

[Oblitus]

I want to add to that trap critique. You can just spam them now without worrying which makes them incredibly stronger and it is just weird that friendlies walk over them and nothign bad happens. It makes it easier and it may be annoying for some people. For me it was just normal that building traps has the risk that they hurt the wrong pawns. That's how weapons work. Same with firendly fire, that's also annoying, but I hope that won't be removed too.

Friendly fire needs a nerf too, actually. Because currently protecting shooters with melee specialists, while heavily enforced, is also very dangerous because it puts melee under crossfire.

[Jstank]

I'm going to + 1 on the trap rebalance. I think that it was fine the way it was. There should definitely be risk involved with using them.

[Arq]

What if traps only triggered on entities (any or maybe only hostile) that were under attack?  Sure, anyone can see the danger and carefully navigate it under normal circumstances.  But doing that is much trickier in a stressful situation where you're dodging bullets or a bludgeon.  It would change traps from being totally passive defense to a semi-active one that enhances an active defense.  It would potentially make trap corridors less viable (and thus remove them from the grand balancing scheme).  You could engage hostiles with a pawn at the end, but you'd likely need multiple pawns with lines of fire to endanger multiple hostiles with the trap corridor.

I'm not sure how I'd like unaligned wildlife to interact with traps.  People have mentioned making inadvertent meat farms by accidentally baiting wildlife with farms or grass, which seems undesirable.

It'd be a pretty dramatic functional change, and I'm not entirely satisfied with this proposal, but trap hallways (which seem to represent the majority of their use) always just seemed like a cheesy way to downsize raids.  I wouldn't classify them as particularly 'fun', mostly they were just 'really darned useful if you don't like getting shot'.

[quietsamurai98]

Build is up!

----
...
Simplified rules for trap springing. They now never spring on you or allies, and always spring on anyone else. Deadfall traps can now catch wild animals.
...

One "issue" I've run into is Thrumbos being downed by deadfall traps.

[attachment deleted due to age]

[Greep]

Speaking of thrumbos, it's still pretty easy to kill them under the right circumstances.  Probably not a bad thing, but this was pretty amusing.

[attachment deleted due to age]

[Lanilor]

I want to add to that trap critique. You can just spam them now without worrying which makes them incredibly stronger and it is just weird that friendlies walk over them and nothign bad happens. It makes it easier and it may be annoying for some people. For me it was just normal that building traps has the risk that they hurt the wrong pawns. That's how weapons work. Same with firendly fire, that's also annoying, but I hope that won't be removed too.

Friendly fire needs a nerf too, actually. Because currently protecting shooters with melee specialists, while heavily enforced, is also very dangerous because it puts melee under crossfire.

Maybe we should remove friendly fire? Or weapons in general because they are dangerous?
Sorry for being sarcastic, but this game once was something special because it was dangerous and risky and a lot is going wrong and not optimal at all in your games and that is an important part of it. Now it's getting more and more causal and friendly and my colonies are rainbow-unicorn-camps where everyone is happy and get everything they want. Of cause that is also because I improve, but you can't deny the changes rimworld is going through. There is a lot good changing and improving. Some of these makes it loose its original individuality and style.

I never had problems with friendly fire since there are enough ways to minimize risk. Good positioning, repositioning, flanking, shield belts stay near melees or just simply not fire on the last enemy that all my melees are already killing.

Speaking of thrumbos, it's still pretty easy to kill them under the right circumstances.  Probably not a bad thing, but this was pretty amusing.

I notices that too. I got 2 thrumbo events in the last game and they are easily killable with a single pawn with cheese. But even in a "normal" way, they are easy to kill which makes them loose their style. Not "this is such a mighty and dangerous and special creature", just a big white rhino.

[SpookCrow]

People will complain if the thrumbo gets a buff and it's op to the point that it can't be cheesed and requires a good amount of pawns.

[Oblitus]

Just got a melee sappers raid from tribals. But my pawns are smart enough to make embrasures in walls to shoot staying out of melee reach, so it was an utter failure - they were shot like dummies in shooting range. Sure, you may think it has not enough drama from my side, but it is what you should expect to happen when a bunch of dirty savages is trying to attack a fortified base.

People will complain if the thrumbo gets a buff and it's op to the point that it can't be cheesed and requires a good amount of pawns.

Actually, that is exactly what happens now. It is just too dangerous to directly attack them and people are "cheesing" it.

[Serina]

https://imgur.com/a/sruXgXI
Psychic ship with two centipedes, two lancers and two scythers.

I made a pretty big mistake that caused the deaths of my animals which could have probably been avoided.
I released them too soon before the mechs were stunned by emp. I kind of panicked and hit release on the animals as soon as the centipedes started spraying, which was a huge mistake on my part.
I need more melee pawns w/ shield belt + power armor. Friendly fire was more of an issue for Beth (my only melee pawn w/ shield belt) since she mostly sustained bruises and a crack from the centipede's weapon.

Edit: I personally have never had a problem with thrumbo hunting (without cheese). I use two pawns with short bows, max range from the thrumbo and attack at the same time. When the thrumbo becomes manhunter, I use one pawn to kite the thrumbo around stone chunks while the other pawn is continuously shooting. Worked for me every time even on NB. You can do the same with two thrumbos but it requires more pawns.

I've also tried the "cheese" tactic of hiding behind doors, but found it actually wasted more time than necessary. For me, it was much more efficient to kite the thrumbo around. I have had some really close calls where the thrumbo was literally right behind my pawn, but managed to snag it on to some chunks which helped to slow its movement. I feel as though thrumbos are much easier to hunt now than in b18 because sometimes they flee while you're shooting them, which allows you to deal more damage, in turn affecting the thrumbo's overall movespeed for when it does turn manhunter.

[5thHorseman]

I'm not sure I'll ever need to hunt again.

In fact, I may need a bigger freezer for all this free meat. And rearming the traps is now a full time job.

(Note, they seem to be going through here to get to the grass inside my walls, because there is so little grass on the map in general)

[attachment deleted due to age]

[Injured Muffalo]

>Downed refugees can no longer spawn with bleeding wounds (so they don't die while the player is trying to rescue them).

I don't understand this. There should be stories about the one who died before he could be reached or whatever. It's your problem if you can't keep track of events, not the game's.

Also I am bewildered by the hunting animals change. Seems dull. 

I would like to request a small, UI feature that would help me and help anyone streaming Rimworld. Could the mod "Fahrenheit AND Celsius" get included in the game as another menu option for temperature? https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=937759575

Speaking of begging for unit options, can we have a pounds setting in the menu? Pleez?

https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=38197.0

[Oblitus]

>Downed refugees can no longer spawn with bleeding wounds (so they don't die while the player is trying to rescue them).

I don't understand this. There should be stories about the one who died before he could be reached or whatever. It's your problem if you can't keep track of events, not the game's.

If game says you have 7 days - you expect them to survive for 7 days, not die in a few hours.