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Author Topic: Deterioration change?  (Read 2870 times)

Dukkha

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Deterioration change?
« on: September 26, 2018, 01:36:07 AM »

So hey, does deterioration no longer effect weapon and armor stats? (aside from market value)
I have to say, I really miss that mechanic of the game. It was a nice touch of realism that really kept me on my toes keeping all my equipment new and well taken care of. It was also great for story building. I really hope it gets reimplemented.
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5thHorseman

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2018, 01:42:12 AM »

No it does not, and I think it's sad too.

There's an argument that quality of gun doesn't actually affect accuracy but I don't really care if it's realistic so long as it makes things interesting. Maybe they could still shoot fine but jam a lot or take longer to reload, I don't know, but I totally agree with you a 5% hp gun should be in some way worse than a 100% hp gun. Ideally, it should be 95% worse :)
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BLACK_FR

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2018, 06:14:24 AM »

I proposed changes here - https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=45723.0 and made a discussion about it here - https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=45664.0

In short - health should affect efficiency for most of the items. And for those items where it's stupid it shouldn't affect wealth.
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Thane

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2018, 09:21:01 AM »

This was removed? Why would Tynan do that? A worn out thing should be worn out. A rusty and abused masterwork sword should be arguably worse than a brand new normal one and old guns should jam and if a vest has a bullet hole well there's always the chance that a bullet will again find that hole.  :/
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Dukkha

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #4 on: September 26, 2018, 12:25:58 PM »

I'm glad I'm not the only one who feels this way.
I know it was never a major mechanic but I feel like a disproportionate level of immersion has been lost to its removal. There's not the same sense of urgency to get a masterwork shotgun out of a fire, and no repercussions for leaving it in the rain.

If I could make any change it would be that the deterioration to effect ratio doesn't necessarily need to be linear, but I'd take it back in any form.
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vzoxz0

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #5 on: September 26, 2018, 12:28:45 PM »

I've been playing as if hp mattered on guns ... if I knew about this, I could reduce colony wealth considerably and maintain firepower simultaneously.
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Dargaron

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #6 on: September 26, 2018, 04:53:47 PM »

Seconded. I'd been replacing armor once it got close to 50%: that's expensive when you're wearing Power Armor!

This also gave a good incentive for players to make their own guns, rather than using looted weaponry from raiders: IIRC, most early-game raiders came with weapons in the 30-50% range, and it took quite a bit of time before a player could loot a 100% condition weapon which wasn't absolutely terrible.
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BLACK_FR

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2018, 01:26:34 AM »

So true. Some guy in suggestion section said that fixing (making good) wealth and raid systems is not a priority. I think that those mechanics are cruical for reasons above. Current system is not only not balanced but is also not fun.
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mebe

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2018, 03:13:39 AM »

Surely the easy solution is to get rid of the mechanic entirely and have damage effect the quality of the item (leave a masterwork shotgun in the rain for a week and it is no longer a masterwork). That would then automatically pick up on the quality bonus system.
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vzoxz0

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #9 on: September 27, 2018, 04:27:26 AM »

I think it should just go back to how it was. That means raiders with bad gear are worse than a prepared outpost, too, which makes sense.
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raydarken

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2018, 01:14:23 PM »

This change was news to me also, and I'm guessing the change had something to do with raid balance.

Surely the easy solution is to get rid of the mechanic entirely and have damage effect the quality of the item (leave a masterwork shotgun in the rain for a week and it is no longer a masterwork). That would then automatically pick up on the quality bonus system.
This makes sense to me as a solution. To simplify the quality of raider weapons I would have them start with always 100% durability, and then have a chance at poor craftsmanship. Come to think of it, raiders may already start with 100% weapon durability, don't remember off the top of my head. I've seen both perfect weapons and some damaged on dead/downed raiders, not sure if they came in with worn out weapons or not.

Anyhow, I hope this particular mechanic can be looked at again before full release!
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5thHorseman

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #11 on: September 27, 2018, 05:15:47 PM »

I'd love it if the entire "tainted" system vanished and whenever anybody died, everything they were carrying lost 50% (or so) hit points, coupled with this idea that number of hit points actually matter.
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Toolboxifier - Soil Clarifier
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rkagerer

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2018, 04:42:59 AM »

I'd love it if the entire "tainted" system vanished and whenever anybody died, everything they were carrying lost 50% (or so) hit points, coupled with this idea that number of hit points actually matter.
Agreed.  Although I think it should just applied to worn apparel, not their inventory.  After all, whatever they were wearing probably got a bunch of bullet holes in it (or torn up or blood on it or maybe the pawn simply peed himself...)
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5thHorseman

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2018, 05:00:23 AM »

I'd love it if the entire "tainted" system vanished and whenever anybody died, everything they were carrying lost 50% (or so) hit points, coupled with this idea that number of hit points actually matter.
Agreed.  Although I think it should just applied to worn apparel, not their inventory.  After all, whatever they were wearing probably got a bunch of bullet holes in it (or torn up or blood on it or maybe the pawn simply peed himself...)
Oh I didn't think of inventory, but yeah sure. Though I think armed weapons should also take a hit.
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Toolboxifier - Soil Clarifier
I never got how pawns in the game could have such insanely bad reactions to such mundane things.
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ertxyz

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Re: Deterioration change?
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2018, 09:03:20 AM »

I'd love it if the entire "tainted" system vanished and whenever anybody died, everything they were carrying lost 50% (or so) hit points, coupled with this idea that number of hit points actually matter.
Agreed.  Although I think it should just applied to worn apparel, not their inventory.  After all, whatever they were wearing probably got a bunch of bullet holes in it (or torn up or blood on it or maybe the pawn simply peed himself...)
How about losing the hit points when receiving the bullets then, instead of when dying? Clothing could lose quality proportionally to the wound severity and armor status. That way, the clothes from a downed pawn just about to die would be as useless as a dead one's, removing the "strip the guy before he dies" trick.
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