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Author Topic: Issue of attraction and sexuality?  (Read 559 times)

Jandof

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Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« on: January 10, 2021, 11:11:53 AM »

Hi.

I’ve been considering trying out Rimworld. Now, when I heard about the new expansion, I almost bought the product. However, just before I did, something alarming caught my eye.

It seems in 2016 there was a scandal about different genders/sexualities and the factors affecting their attraction behavior. I was quite shocked to learn how all men were configured to be categorically more horny or that bisexuality was impossible among them. There were several other equally disturbing parametrizations, but I think people can understand which incident I’m talking about.

I’d like to know:
a)   Have these issues been amended? (If you ask me, there should be no difference between men and women in general and these should anyway be character-specific attributes.)
b)   Has Mr. Sylvester issued a public apology and abandoned his outdated sexist views?

The game itself seems to be quite interesting and I’m willing to try it out given that my worries have properly been addressed. However, this is a deal breaker for me. I try to always consume ethically and under no circumstances support chauvinistic bigots.

Thank you for your answer in advance,

BR,

Jandof
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Alenerel

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2021, 12:56:55 PM »

Quote
If you ask me

This is your opinion and nobody asked you. Coming here and calling people "chauvinistic" and "unethical" because they do not conform to your opinion is what is known in technical terms as an asshole (and many other things).

Better pass this game and maybe even unplug your internet if you get triggered to easily, for your own safety
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ThiIsMe007

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2021, 02:58:51 PM »

Nice trolling there, but let's pretend you're actually serious for a moment.

Rimworld arguably still has its fair number of issues, but the one you mention is definitely not one of them. The developer has proven times and again that he is willing to listen to his community, taking the best (for the game), and leaving the rest to mods within a well-documented and robust open-ended engine. If you don't like something, mod it out or change it for what you think it should be. There are already plenty of mods to be found on the Steam Workshop or on these very forums that allow the "parametrization" that you describe.

Keep in mind that this game has features like cannibalism, organ harvesting, drug usage, teen soldiers and other nowhere near "politically correct" shenanigans. If you're already horrified by the thought that the "sexual life" or identity of virtual pixels moving on your computer screen in a years old video-game could not match your RL expectations, I'm afraid to tell you that this game is probably just not for you.

Now about the particular incident that you mention, keep searching on Reddit. AFAIK, Tynan replied to the accusations a long time ago. In any case, the argument was (and still is) preposterous. If anyone believes that a game developer has to embrace whatever appears in one of their games, like someone working on a first person shooter hiding a compulsive murderer in RL for example, then this someone really needs to have some of their priorities checked.

Finally, FWIW, I've witnessed Tynan donating and contributing to "social causes" more than you probably ever will in your lifetime. Just go bother another gaming community already.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2021, 03:00:49 PM by ThiIsMe007 »
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Jandof

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2021, 04:39:58 PM »

I'm thankful for people taking the time to answer me, although somewhat offended by the hostility apparent in the answers themselves.

No, I'm not trolling. Neither was I explicitely saying anyone is currently chauvinistic or acting immorally. Still, the concern was valid then (as is apparent from the general reaction at the time) and it still is. I don't appreciate people suggesting this is irrelevant and only in my head when it's obvious they haven't clearly understood my point. My argument goes as follows.

I don't object to disturbing subjects (murder, cannibalism, etc.) presented in computer games within the context of the world. It is part of the allure. However, I oppose people expressing anti-equalist values or hostility toward sexual minorities.

If I can be certain that the developers are good guys and these phenomena exist only within the game world, I'm fine. Based on some of the responses in an interview I read, this didn't seem to be the case. Instead Mr. Sylvester appeared to defend his underlying sexual interpretations as valid representations of the real world. This is absolutely not ok and highly offensive.

I also object to being called "an asshole" and the implications I'm not contributing sufficiently for "social causes" (especially when the commenter has absolutely no idea who I am or what I do). Despite these alarming statements, I was relatively friendly and willing to give the game a chance. All I needed to know is that I'm not giving my money to a person, who thinks ill of women and sexual minorities. This is not an unreasonable demand.

I do hope the attitude we've seen in these answers doesn't represent the official stance of the company. Merely asking if something one finds offensive has been corrected, should not be a cause for other players to tell one go away and unplug their internet.

Well... I'll make my decision based on the reactions I get after these apparently necessary clarifications and I hope not to provoke any further (sexual?) anger.
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SeminarCaviar

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2021, 10:40:07 PM »

Nice trolling there, but let's pretend you're actually serious for a moment.

Rimworld arguably still has its fair number of issues, but the one you mention is definitely not one of them. The developer has proven times and again that he is willing to listen to his community, taking the best (for the game), and leaving the rest to mods within a well-documented and robust open-ended engine. If you don't like something, mod it out or change it for what you think it should be. There are already plenty of mods to be found on the Steam Workshop or on these very forums that allow the "parametrization" that you describe.

Keep in mind that this game has features like cannibalism, organ harvesting, drug usage, teen soldiers and other nowhere near "politically correct" shenanigans. If you're already horrified by the thought that the "sexual life" or identity of virtual pixels moving on your computer screen in a years old video-game could not match your RL expectations, I'm afraid to tell you that this game is probably just not for you.

Now about the particular incident that you mention, keep searching on Reddit. AFAIK, Tynan replied to the accusations a long time ago. In any case, the argument was (and still is) preposterous. If anyone believes that a game developer has to embrace whatever appears in one of their games, like someone working on a first person shooter hiding a compulsive murderer in RL for example, then this someone really needs to have some of their priorities checked.

Finally, FWIW, I've witnessed Tynan donating and contributing to "social causes" more than you probably ever will in your lifetime. Just go bother another gaming community already.
Just don't pretend what a waste of time.
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Ark

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2021, 01:34:06 AM »

Someone dug that old horse up again for melee training?
That article is four years old, based on decompiled code of alpha 15 game.
Since you read that, surely you read Tynan's response?
Another review two years later by the same website classifying it as one of the "bestest bests".
Polygon wrote an article in 2016 about the "problem", too.

If you really need the Kinsey scale, install the Psychology mod.

This is a non-issue.
I have never encountered anything in the game that made me think "Oh my god, the developer must be a chauvinistic bigot with outdated sexist views!".

I suggest buying it directly from https://rimworldgame.com/, that way you get both the DRM-free version and a Steam key.
Expect it to consume all of your free time for a year or two.
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Jandof

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2021, 07:22:01 AM »

I have never encountered anything in the game that made me think "Oh my god, the developer must be a chauvinistic bigot with outdated sexist views!".

I suggest buying it directly from https://rimworldgame.com/, that way you get both the DRM-free version and a Steam key.
Expect it to consume all of your free time for a year or two.

This is pretty much the answer I was looking for. I admit my original post may have betrayed the fact I was a bit tilted at first seeing something potentially sexist. Being a member of a minority myself, you must understand I'm very tired with people trying to box others into very traditional catergories and tell them what's "ok" for different sexes.

I never cared so much about the workings of the game itself, but only what it tells about the developers. It appears I may have overreacted (although I'd have prefered an official reply). Probably the initial sexual parametrization was not intended as a veiled attack, but rather tells about lack of awareness or poor attention to detail in this matter. I'm still struggling to understand why so many people consider men and women so inherently different, but I guess this is not the place for that discussion.

You know what... I'll give the game and that psychology mod a try. Even in the worst case, it's not that much misspent money and I think there's a good chance I like this one.

Thank you for your respective contributions.

Jandof
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Gblitzz

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Re: Issue of attraction and sexuality?
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2021, 10:05:11 AM »

What an interesting thread.
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