Musings on ammo

[ZestyLemons]

I think a simple system of having some kind of ammo pile would be enough, or just a stockpile for ammo.

Make some ammo, have it hauled over, and set some kind of preference for how many magazines of ammo each colonist should keep a hold of. More mags = more weight, so a slower colonist. Now, reloading would be a really welcome change to weapons, it'd REALLY break-up the diversity of weapons, and allow for some sick maneuvering when your colonists or enemies are reloading.

I can just imagine all the new xml weapon tags.
<reloadTicks> and <magazineSize> and <reloadSound> and dear god it'd be amazing.

[Mathenaut]

Cooldown time between shots would have to be cut big time if you want to incorporate reloading.  Really, it would just shift the weight of the damage done into bursts, while keeping the same dps.

[ShadowDragon8685]

Cooldown time between shots would have to be cut big time if you want to incorporate reloading.  Really, it would just shift the weight of the damage done into bursts, while keeping the same dps.

This would be preferable, because as it is now, colonists run up into firing range and stand there derping for what feels like forever, like it takes them that long to remember "Oh hey, I've got a gun!"

A momentary set-up time after moving should be enforced, or else an accuracy penalty for shooting from the hip, but that would favor the defenders, because entrenched defenders are already sighted in while the zerging raiders won't be; so they'll either be derping around for a bit, or firing with wildly reduced accuracy.

[keylocke]

i'm not sure who's post this was.. but i read somewhere about the diversification of ammo.

ie : it's easier/cheaper to manufacture pistol ammo than sniper rifle ammo.

this way, people aren't always gonna choose guns with a stronger caliber, 'coz ammo economics/logistics will have to be factored in when choosing your gear.

this also makes melee more viable, since melee does not consume ammo. (turrets should use ammo too)

so.. if you say "reelizm" doesn't change a thing.. lol..
i think it's obvious that ammo and item degradation will clearly change how people fight in rimworld.

it's not just "entrenching" your men with higher supplies, players would have to think about the most efficient and the most "economical" way of winning a battle.

save your ammo when you really need it. don't build so much turrets 'coz it can easily drain your ammo stock.. etc..

[Evul]

Personally I like ammo it adds a new factor of 'oh fuz'.

[skullywag]

I'm pretty sure it'll happen eventually. It seems like a natural progression for the game. With how well modelled the injury system is having magical guns with magical bullets seems like it would erk Tynan eventually. Guessing its a case of HOW to implement it. I personally have some ideas but they depend on a more indepth inventory system for pawns without that its very difficult

[Mathenaut]

Cooldown time between shots would have to be cut big time if you want to incorporate reloading.  Really, it would just shift the weight of the damage done into bursts, while keeping the same dps.

This would be preferable, because as it is now, colonists run up into firing range and stand there derping for what feels like forever, like it takes them that long to remember "Oh hey, I've got a gun!"

A momentary set-up time after moving should be enforced, or else an accuracy penalty for shooting from the hip, but that would favor the defenders, because entrenched defenders are already sighted in while the zerging raiders won't be; so they'll either be derping around for a bit, or firing with wildly reduced accuracy.

I would put the 'setup time' as a variable for certain weapons.  The M24 and gattling, for example, could require a second or two after moving to start shooting-  while small arms would fire immediately.  The weapons themselves could have a 'magazine' stat that determines how many shots the weapon will fire before a 'reloading' downtime (where higher shooting skill will decrease the reload time).

I'd even introduce a trait that grants a cover bonus while reloading.  Though, I'd prefer that melee weapons get something similar to boot.

[Evul]

I'll also think that a ammo restriction will nurf the weapons and force the player to build smarter defenses.

But if that is done weapons should have a larger scare effect and be more dangerus.

[TrashMan]

Hmmm...a scare effect for a weapon? That ain't a bad idea.

I'd say some powerful weapons would have  a deteriorating effect on morale, causing enemies to run for cover or retreat (at least temporarily).
You do NOT want to be at the other end of the minigun when that thing starts shooting. Powerful weapons would also have downsides.
If maintenance is in, that would also mean highly-advanced weapons would require more maintenance (they degrade fast).
Other weapons may have ammo issues (expensive ammo or massive consumption)

[skullywag]

Theres some changes that need to be made to the core game to facilitate an ammo system, I could be wrong but currently a weapon has no clue when its been fired so tracking how many shots its had since last reload wouldnt be possible on the weapon itself, projectiles are just spawned at the pawns location and sent to the target, the gun def does nothing but define the stats of the shooting. Also we'd need a more indepth inventory system to handle ammo and stuff, I dont doubt this is coming in the future, it seemslike a perfect fit.

Personally id like the current weapons to be ditched and some new improvised weapons made,I dont like the perfect guns and the amount of them being available, I have a private weapon pack thats very fallout like, currently I have:

improvised crossbow - fires metal bolts slower than original pistol - causes pierce damage
improvised 9mm pistol - First gun fires slower than original pistol, slightly faster than crossbow - causes bullet damage
Machine pistol - adapted version of the above allows burst fire
Single barrel shotgun - Hits harder than the above but close range only
Improvised Rifle - longer range but very slow to fire

Theres some others in there im playing with, the look of the guns is very worn/very improvised. I feel this fits more in line with Rimworld than a pristine m16. Im debating releasing it but i have some work to do on it first. Id like them to use an ammo system so i may wait until I know if ones coming.

[ZestyLemons]

Little bit of a bump, but I feel this topic generated a lot of cool discussion and deserves to be recognized still.

[TrashMan]

yesyesyesyesyes



I want to burn trough all my ammo in seconds, but I also want to send everyone running from Puff the Magic Dragon.

[StatikMilk30]

It would be a good way to make melee weapons more useful. Because lets be frank, if you have a guy who gets pissey if you put a gun in their hand and only wants a stick to kill people with you send him to the liver harvesting room. Also it would be cool to just have large scale melee battles, like a group of knights raid your settlement and you just wasted all of your bullets on trying to kill a turtle for 5 days strait.

[Cimanyd]

It would be a good way to make melee weapons more useful. Because lets be frank, if you have a guy who gets pissey if you put a gun in their hand and only wants a stick to kill people with you send him to the liver harvesting room.

I keep seeing people saying they kill brawlers, instead of using them, because of the gun morale penalty. Why would you do that? "Everyone must be holding a gun, no exceptions" seems like a ridiculous combat strategy. You don't win fights in the game by having everyone line up and see which side has the most guns, you win them by using cover, killboxes, turrets, mortars, melee, armor, anything that can give a low number of people an advantage over a high number of people and/or exploit the AI if the enemy's numbers are overwhelming.

Obviously a colony that was entirely or even mostly brawlers would be terrible, but I don't think a colony with none is as good as one with one or two, and they're rare anyway (like all traits). Brawlers, careful shooters, trigger-happies, and people without any combat traits all have their place in combat.

[Matthiasagreen]

It would be a good way to make melee weapons more useful. Because lets be frank, if you have a guy who gets pissey if you put a gun in their hand and only wants a stick to kill people with you send him to the liver harvesting room.

I keep seeing people saying they kill brawlers, instead of using them, because of the gun morale penalty. Why would you do that? "Everyone must be holding a gun, no exceptions" seems like a ridiculous combat strategy. You don't win fights in the game by having everyone line up and see which side has the most guns, you win them by using cover, killboxes, turrets, mortars, melee, armor, anything that can give a low number of people an advantage over a high number of people and/or exploit the AI if the enemy's numbers are overwhelming.

Obviously a colony that was entirely or even mostly brawlers would be terrible, but I don't think a colony with none is as good as one with one or two, and they're rare anyway (like all traits). Brawlers, careful shooters, trigger-happies, and people without any combat traits all have their place in combat.

Actually a colony of brawlers (IMO) would be kind of good. Hide in base behind closed doors. wait for raiders to start pounding. Jump out, incap anyone nearby, jump back in and wait for the next person dumb enough to knock on the door.