[1.2-A8e] Rimfire - vanilla style gun mod (v2.6 / 12.01.2021)

Started by Alistaire, January 22, 2015, 03:55:59 PM

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POLL CENTRAL - 4 polls currently active, 3 closed

dd.mm.yyyy  [results] link to the poll

(30.12.2015) [results] Should weapons_guns.xml be split up into separate files for easy removal of weapons? (closed)
(05.01.2016) [results] Which of these considered weapon suggestions would you like me to prioritize? (closed)
(05.01.2016) [results] Which of these denied weapon suggestions would you want to see implemented after all? (closed)
(30.12.2015) [results] Which location do you prefer for polls?
(18.04.2016) [results] Which of these considered weapon suggestions would you like me to prioritize?
(18.04.2016) [results] Which of these denied weapon suggestions would you want to see implemented after all?
(30.04.2016) [results] !NEW! Which weapon types would you like to see added to Rimfire?

Alistaire

A big problem with adding more guns is, oddly, naming them. Rimworld is such a brat with weapon naming since Alpha 9, where the Lee-Enfield
became a Survival Rifle - a very broad name which doesn't describe a Lee-Enfield at all. To keep the mod close to the base game's naming, I
have to go through all kinds of twists and turns to come up with a new label.
If I just skip that part and call each Assault Rifle exactly that, instead of "Modern Rifle" and "Combat Rifle" (even though those are less than
descriptive names), that means people will open a trade screen and find 15 different guns with the same name.

The problem with adding an M16 and an M4A1 is that those guns are amazingly hard to describe in two words in a way that would still make a
difference to the reader. Therefore I added guns and rifles with unusual shapes, as to make it easier to give them names.

If you take a look at the earlier versions of Rimfire you can find the "WA-2000 Sniper rifle" which is now a "Marksman rifle". What this did is
blocking the addition of more marksman rifles. I'm still hoping for Tynan to make the names better than they currently are, even if it was as
much as changing "Assault rifle" to "M16 Assault rifle" and "Survival rifle" to "M1 Bolt-action rifle" (survival rifle is a stupid name).


So there's the problem with adding more guns - not the balancing, rather the naming. Sadly.

Iwillbenicetou

Did you add the M4A1, M4A4, AK47, Glock, and the MG60? maybe not all of them, since it's nice to limit yourself on weapons so you don't have Project Armory's selection
Mod Help! The basics on how to download mods!

NoImageAvailable

Quote from: Alistaire on July 13, 2015, 08:14:33 AM
The problem with adding an M16 and an M4A1 is that those guns are amazingly hard to describe in two words in a way that would still make a
difference to the reader. Therefore I added guns and rifles with unusual shapes, as to make it easier to give them names.

Well-known guns generally have some kind of characteristics commonly associated with them. I think you could come up with fairly decent names by looking at these common associations and deriving names from them. This can be anything from gun type, to producer, to common users, etc.

For example, the AK-47 is commonly associated with the Soviet Union as well as various Third World and irregular forces. Given the outline and a name like Soviet/Rebel/Guerilla/Insurgent rifle most people can probably figure out what weapon this is. An M4A1 is a shortened carbine version of the M16, which is in the game as the assault rifle. Calling it assault carbine would convey both its functionality as a downscaled assault rifle as well as its status as a derivate. Weapons with unique construction features could be named after such, for example a Famas could be called a bullpup rifle.

Basically when looking at commonly known guns you should ask yourself, what do people think of when they hear AK-47/M4/etc? How does this gun differ from other guns? Additionally some guns have nicknames which can also serve as inspiration, e.g. G36 and plastic gun.
"The power of friendship destroyed the jellyfish."

Othobrithol

Assault Carbine sounds good, but Plastic Gun isn't a commonly known nickname outside of fans/users. You should also, imho, try to avoid any names that identify with nationality or cast an opinion as to which side is "in the right" within contemporary conflicts. "Rebel Rifle", "Insurgent Rifle"  carry a rather judgemental connotation. And in the year 5500 I doubt anyone knows, or cares, who the Soviets were.

One angle you might be able to exploit is adding a third word to the naming in some cases to differentiate. A Kalashnikov might be a "Rugged Assault Rifle" to emphasize it's durable construction, while its description and stats demonstrate it comes at the cost of accuracy.

NoImageAvailable

Quote from: Othobrithol on July 15, 2015, 09:28:56 AM
And in the year 5500 I doubt anyone knows, or cares, who the Soviets were.

Well I doubt anyone would know who the Iraqis were yet we have an Iraqi rifle (somewhat strange considering the Galil is an Israeli weapon). But yeah, most of those names were simply off the top of my head and rugged assault rifle would fit the principle just as well. I don't think "rebel" carries much of a connotation either.
"The power of friendship destroyed the jellyfish."

Othobrithol

I had originally included the "Iraqi Rifle" in the list too, but edited out. It's what motivated the objection in the first place. First time I saw it, I was ..."wha?" and promptly renamed it (To Galil Rifle). As yes, I think you are right, "Rebel's" connotations are far lighter than "Insurgent"...there is a certain romantic nobility in rebellion.

Alistaire

Yeah I'm not happy about any of the names, such as the awkwardly named "3-line Rifle" (Mosin Nagant) as to not interfere with later line rifles I
or someone else might add. I haven't changed the defNames nor the XML comments above their defs, nor the gun list in OP because no one
would have a use for a list full of completely unrecognisable gun names when checking which niche guns they remembered.

When naming the Galil I just stopped trying. Soviet rifle would interfere with any other soviet rifles I could add, and I spent several hours
searching synonyms for durable, rebel and cheap, all of which suited almost every other gun similar to the Galil I could think of.

Mr. Picard

Hey, can you mod in a .500 Magnum, or the Barrett .50 Cal?

Loki88

I vote for the uncommon guns / ones I likely would not have heard of ( maybe have heard of 1 or 2, who knows ) on the grounds of adding flavour, variety, and extra individuality for this mod.

Cheers!

Cassgon

Quote from: Mr. Picard on July 20, 2015, 08:57:24 PM
Hey, can you mod in a .500 Magnum, or the Barrett .50 Cal?
You could name it the P.I. XD

Alistaire

Poll update

I'm back from holidays and it seems the poll still isn't decisive enough for me to focus on only common or uncommon weaponry. It took three
weeks to get a somewhat large amount of votes in, sadly, and the amount of votes isn't nearly as large as I hoped (about 10% of the unique
downloads count) so I'm not convinced polling features in the thread will give me useful results.
Of course polling "Common or Uncommon" without an "I don't care" option won't accurately represent everyone's thoughts on the topic, and I'll
try to add such options in later polls.

In other news I'll be either busy or very busy in the coming weeks and after that I'll be very busy or very, very busy (depends). Posting
suggestions in the thread will eventually get them in the mod, but I won't work miracles for a bit.




Quote from: Mr. Picard on July 20, 2015, 08:57:24 PM
Hey, can you mod in a .500 Magnum, or the Barrett .50 Cal?

They're added to the backlog, I'll see if I can work on them at some point.

Mr.Cross

Quote from: Alistaire on August 08, 2015, 12:49:10 PM-Snippets of being busy in the foreseeable future -

Alistaire not able to make miracles for the foreseeable future?! What is this world coming too! I hope i have at least entertained you for a second, As for not being able to work on this very often, we can wait. where as your life and job cannot. Just don't burn yourself out.
Claims to know most things.

Alistaire

Rimfire v1.7 for Alpha 12 released

A quick alpha update, literally v1.6 for Alpha 12. The code has hardly changed and there were no new weapons added,
but the DLL file was updated with the A12 codebase so you should probably still download v1.7.

zenfur

#103
Wow, that was quick. Great mod!

Also I have some feedback.

In my opinion current Multiple Grenade Launcher doesn't live up to it's description and my expectations. It's quite underwhelming. Possibly add another weapon working like this one, and here are few ways how you could spice this weapon up:
- make it shoot 3 particles with smaller explosion radius (+ shape) in quick succesion, lower damage a little and slightly increase aiming time, medicore scatter,
- make it shoot 6 particles like above, shot in slow succesion, double aiming time and warmup time, high scatter, lower damage.
- make it shoot a little faster, [add frag grenade (mortar?) shrapnel-like effect]and/or[increase missile speed]

One of these options would make me happ-ier :)
Little posts, quality posts.


Notice me, senpaaiiiiiii!!!!

Alistaire

You can apply those changes yourself, if you'd like:

- RimWorld906Win\Mods\Rimfire\Defs\ThingDefs\Weapons_Guns.xml
- Scroll to the bottom of the file
- Change <verbs><li><warmupTicks>, <statBases><RangedWeapon_Cooldown>
- Add <verbs><li><burstShotcount>, <verbs><li><ticksBetweenBurstShots>
- Go one def up to see the projectile of the weapon, change <projectile><speed>

The description is completely accurate though. Compare its stats with:

- RimWorld906Win\Mods\Core\Defs\ThingDefs
- Ctrl+F search GrenadeFrag

And you can see the launcher is superior to normal frag grenades in most aspects except for the warmupTicks (to simulate having to aim a
high weight weapon).

I love adding fragmentation to the launcher, but the mod relies on CombatRealism to do that. I really like how CombatRealism does it and
I won't add my own fragmentation effects for that reason. It's gonna get an update for A12 I read, so expect that soon.

Sorry if I won't edit the stats right now, but same as with the Carbines I'd rather get some concrete stats rather than speculations - you
might want to playtest your suggestions first.