Hello guys,
Im having gripes with the auto-equip system. Currently, a colonist will go for a new piece of clothing if it has higher hitpoints than his current one, regardless of protection value, which, in my opinion, doesnt make sense (almost wanted to make a post in the bug section). The screenshot shows such a case, switching a masterwork quality devilstrand duster for a good quality cloth one.
I made this thread to ask Tynan to please change that, as well as get some more opinions on the matter (maybe I didnt look into it enough) and some suggestions on how it could be changed.
My suggestion is to equip clothing with the sharp modifier as value (it seems to work with armor vests, the colonists seem to equip the piece with higher protection value), to just get the best protection for my colonists without having to force-wear or to forbid stuff everytime wearables with higher hp are lying around. Maybe something like a checkbox to go for the insulation value or heat protection value instead.
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Lol tynan what were you smoking when you made this system! i had no idea it was only on hitpoints as i havent paid much attention to it, but dang thats a huge glitch.
This feature definitely needs a fix / Upgrade whatever you wanna call it to make it viable in game and not just more micromanagement
I also wish that armor could be a different auto equip category for quality since we can't make it and can only use what we find or can find to buy. This way I can set my colonists to use only good+ clothes but any (power) armor they can find.
Clothing and Armor should be worn seperately and no one should auto equip unless its optional to let them auto equip to avoid mood loss.
http://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/32tcow/more_precisely_how_does_the_new_outfit_system_work/cqeevd3 (http://www.reddit.com/r/RimWorld/comments/32tcow/more_precisely_how_does_the_new_outfit_system_work/cqeevd3)
Within this link, Tyn describes how the selection system works... If he's changed it, it might be different since this was 30 days ago.
But it's still faulty.
Thank you for the link, laston, wouldnt have looked there. Been some time since I read c++ code, seems like only insulation and hitpoints are considered.
The bottom post by LCCX is exactly what I mean, smart guy, he anticipated what would happen ;D
Right now the system is doing the opposite of what it should do in the first place, reduce micromanagement. I find myself making dusters for my people in boreal and tundra, just because no raider brings along a duster in that biome, and so I dont need to force-wear everything, because thats no different from alpha 9 then.
By the way, talking about equipping, can guys pls not auto-wear personal shields? :P first thing a downed colonist does after he gets out of the med bed is going for a personal shield, even if hes not a melee guy.
Maybe you could let the combat skills decide if he should wear one or not, e.g. high melee skill = auto-wear, shooting skill higher = dont wear a shield.
Guess I ll make a separate post in the suggestions forum, before things get mixed up here :P
I, too, would like to see a separated system for armor and clothing as having my dudes toss a 50% HP power armor helmet away to wear a cowboy hat for combat slowly becomes annoying.
If you read my last post in the reddit thread you can see the current version that you're running (the first post I made is obsolete).
I'll quote it here
/// <summary>
/// Gives the score of the apparel ignoring anything it might replace.
/// </summary>
public static float ApparelScoreRaw( Apparel ap )
{
//Start with a base score, because we like wearing things in general over wearing nothing
//This gives things like personal shields a >0 score
float score = 0.2f;
//Offset for armor
float armorScore
= ap.def.GetStatValueAbstract( StatDefOf.ArmorRating_Sharp )
+ ap.def.GetStatValueAbstract( StatDefOf.ArmorRating_Blunt ) * 0.75f;
score += armorScore;
//Factor for health
if( ap.def.useHitPoints )
{
float healthPct = (float)ap.HitPoints / (float)ap.MaxHitPoints;
score *= HitPointsPercentScoreFactorCurve.Evaluate( healthPct );
}
//Factor for warmth if needed (note we ignore NeededWarmth.Cool)
float tempFactor = 1f;
if( neededWarmth == NeededWarmth.Warm )
{
var insulationCold = ap.def.GetStatValueAbstract( StatDefOf.Insulation_Cold );
tempFactor *= InsulationColdScoreFactorCurve_NeedWarm.Evaluate(insulationCold);
}
score *= tempFactor;
return score;
}
Alright apologies, you did consider sharp and blunt, just skimmed through and got stuck at the end of the thread, shouldnt have done that.
But something is still off, it is like sharp and blunt arent having much of an impact on the score or arent there at all, just tried it again with a 87% good cloth shirt and a 69% masterwork devistrand shirt (which is superior in every stat except hitpoints), my colonist always goes for the cloth one.
What about that 'clothing has to have at least X% hp so you can wear it' modifier in the outfit section, does that one somehow mess with the score?
Im kinda amazed that Im the only one here pointing this out, alpha 10f has been out there a while, am I the only one who is bothered by that?
I wrote it somewhere but never got serious about it, because it's hard to understand what exactly is wrong. But yes, it's something like that. The will pretty much prefer 99% shoddy over 70% masterwork
The balance is probably off, I'll make a note to adjust it before A11.
Thank you for letting me know :)
I still personally dont like that i cant set the material colonists can wear, I want uniforms dammit! :p
There is another small problem with the 'apparel optimizer' - technically a modding problem, but I mention it anyway.
The function only checks apparel in stockpiles. It should check apparel in any (valid) storage.
My colonists only dropped clothes, but never equipped new stuff. It took me quite some time to realize that I'm not using vanilla equipment racks. I modded them to hold anything and not just weapons - stuff on the ground is not very civilized :)
Quote from: Carry on May 17, 2015, 11:41:10 AM
There is another small problem with the 'apparel optimizer' - technically a modding problem, but I mention it anyway.
The function only checks apparel in stockpiles. It should check apparel in any (valid) storage.
My colonists only dropped clothes, but never equipped new stuff. It took me quite some time to realize that I'm not using vanilla equipment racks. I modded them to hold anything and not just weapons - stuff on the ground is not very civilized :)
Good point; let me look into handling that.
I assume a check for any container with the apparel tag in its def would be sufficient.
I believe there was a mod for this but should be included into the base build of the game. And that was to set it such that we can make colonists auto-equip gear according to the quality and HP % it had left. If there is a better quality item available in the stockpile they would automatically switch to it if their current clothing is below the value set. If not they will continue wearing it until the clothing breaks or there is a new set of clothes available in stock.
I've been having this issue whereby my colonist keeps auto-equipping a 30% condition armor vest and subsequently getting the -mood for wearing worn out apparel... I force them to drop it but when I try and check it to make it lootable so that they can burn it (I set my crematorium to burn anything below a certain quality and %), they just put it on instead and instantly get the negative buff.
IMO a possibly easy solution would be the ability to check materials clothes are made out of, i.e. if we could check devilstrand dusters and uncheck cloth (and all other) dusters, colonists wouldn't grab anything but devilsstrand dusters.
Quote from: Euzio on May 28, 2015, 03:58:59 AM
I believe there was a mod for this but should be included into the base build of the game. And that was to set it such that we can make colonists auto-equip gear according to the quality and HP % it had left.
You can already do that, the outfit manager has a hitpoint slider. :)
Quote from: Euzio on May 28, 2015, 03:58:59 AM
I've been having this issue whereby my colonist keeps auto-equipping a 30% condition armor vest and subsequently getting the -mood for wearing worn out apparel... I force them to drop it but when I try and check it to make it lootable so that they can burn it (I set my crematorium to burn anything below a certain quality and %), they just put it on instead and instantly get the negative buff.
I've noticed this with personal shields. My guy can be wearing nice clothes, but as soon as he puts on his worn out shield generator he's like "my clothes suck". It would be nice if colonists looked at armor/shields differently than they do clothing.
Quote from: Devon_v on May 28, 2015, 05:39:18 PM
I've noticed this with personal shields. My guy can be wearing nice clothes, but as soon as he puts on his worn out shield generator he's like "my clothes suck". It would be nice if colonists looked at armor/shields differently than they do clothing.
I managed to circumvent it somewhat. I recruit them, tell them to go to my stockpile (ones with the orbital trade beacon), and then force them to drop the low condition item. It remains forbidden for my colonists to pick up. Then when a combat supplier rolls along, I just sell it to them since its impossible for me to burn it in the crematorium. Somewhat troublesome but at least it works. Though whenever I get raided by pirates and they drop those combat armor gear, my colonists will still auto-equip them after they cremate their bodies... So i'm usually forced to check each of my colonists in the aftermath of a raid to ensure none of them are equipping faulty items.
or just set the durability slider on the cloths to 50% and better, no micro of cloths... and you can still force them to wear a shield if you want to.
Quote from: TLHeart on May 28, 2015, 10:38:34 PM
or just set the durability slider on the cloths to 50% and better, no micro of cloths... and you can still force them to wear a shield if you want to.
I've set that for the crematorium to incinerate any item of clothing below 50% with a quality rating of below normal. However, it does not prevent colonists from still auto-equipping that item. There doesn't seem to be a way currently to make it such that colonists themselves have sliders so that we can set it such that they do not auto-equip a certain quality of clothing. I remember browsing through the mod forums and there was a mod for this but its not been updated.
Quote from: Euzio on May 28, 2015, 11:31:46 PM
There doesn't seem to be a way currently to make it such that colonists themselves have sliders so that we can set it such that they do not auto-equip a certain quality of clothing.
Uhh... http://i.imgur.com/y0kUkKG.png?1 (http://i.imgur.com/y0kUkKG.png?1)
It's in the Outfit manager.
The outfit manager works fine, I recommed making 2 different outfits for your colonists, one for brawlers with shield checked and another one with shield unchecked, else your guys will always go for a shield after an unwanted hospital visit :P
Would be great though if we could check and uncheck certain materials there, as well as for stockpiles.
For shields, I would just recommend to make your colonists force wear them before every raid instead of allowing them in outfit category. Shields wear down when they are worn and you only need them during raids, so having them always on is a waste.
Since I am anal enough to love a good bit of micromanagement, I have 9 different Outfits set up (on a 40-member colony, I should add. I'm anal, not deranged).
Alpha - Snipers : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Cowboy Hat - 80% to 100%, Excellent to Legendary
Beta - Assault : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Cowboy Hat - 80% to 100%, Excellent to Legendary
Gamma - Power : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Cowboy Hat - 80% to 100%, Excellent to Legendary
Delta - Melee : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Cowboy Hat - 80% to 100%, Excellent to Legendary
Snipers - Alpha : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Armour Vest, Kevlar Helmet - 60% to 100%, Good to Legendary
Assault - Beta : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Armour Vest, Kevlar Helmet - 50% to 100%, Normal to Legendary
Power - Gamma : Power Armour, Power Armour Helmet - 60% to 100%, Normal to Legendary
Melee - Delta : Pants, Button-down Shirt, Duster, Armour Vest, Power Armour, Personal Shield, Power Armour Helmet, Kevlar Helmet, - 60% to 100%, Normal to Legendary
Birthday Suit : Nothing
I do it this way so that as soon as a raid is flagged I can get everyone into the right battle dress without having to think, just swap them for their reciprocal outfit. I use Birthday Suit if my stock of new clothing gets high enough by getting everybody in the buff then setting them back, group by group.
Come to think of it, despite my earlier assertion, I may possibly be deranged after all.
or perhaps an option to select clothing selection priority list? defense, quality, condition, insulation, etc.
Sometimes I get colonists who doesn't want to dress for the weather even though I've provided adequate gear. They just prefer to walk around complaining it's cold instead.
Here's a thought. If colonists are able to carry a spare meal with them, then why not other things as well? If a colonist could, say, have a backpack (new item idea, Tynan?) then in their backpack they could put their food and maybe also spare clothes. In this way, a colonist could decide that their vest is slowly wearing out and decide to put a spare one in their backpack. When the one they're wearing dies out, they'd put on their spare one immediately. I guess Tynan would need to enhance the inventory system to cater for something like this, but I imagine it would open a lot of possibilities regarding the way colonists manage themselves. Joy from finding and keeping shiny objects? Carry a few grenades for throwing during combat then fall back to shooting? Carry medkits for in-field dressing of wounds? What else?