Zombie Mode:
* killed people get zombies (good melee attack, perhaps some more health, fast) and attack everyone.
* activate-able button on start
* or special zombie-missions (raiders are zombies)
Sexual reproduction:
* female and male can sleep in one room
* kids cant work
* but you can grow them up
(Do you know the game "Beasts and Bumpkins"? play it! It s nearly the same gameplay, just with farmers and knights; I loved it!(the AI was crap, but the gameplay was awesome!) you can get a lot of new ideas from it)
Oh, and when u build the new sound-files: please do them kind of funny as in "beasts and bumpkins" :)
Zombies: WHY!? Seriously, WHYYY!? Even CoD moved away from zombies now, I mean, CALL OF DUTY MOVED AWAY FROM ZOMBIES! We really can do without more pointless zombies put there cuz' zombies. It was getting ridiculous two years ago, now it's a friggin apocalypse!
Kids growing up: Nope. Kids miiiiiiight get there, they won't be growing up tho.
Why are you so heartless? Why do you want to bring poor Zeds here so cruel Player can order his colo... henchmen to brutally annihilate them? Isn't suffering of poor, desperated raiders enough for you?! :'(
Someone probably will do mod for that, Tynan have more important things to focus on.
Personally, i think this 'zombie-mode' idea could be really interesting, whether a mod or actually built in, it would add an exciting gamemode; though the only way i can see it working is this:
1) Zombies activate when you want them too, but after that, cant be turned off
2) Zombies are always present (they roam around the map and spawn around the map, obviously not in your compound!
3) Zombies attack in groups as do raiders, but only melee attack - these 'horde attacks' would be spontaneous; an unpredictable wave system.
4) Finally, they aren't traditional zombies, think of them more like an alien parasite that can be on their own, or use hosts - Think of The Flood in Halo, or the Rakghoul from Star Wars (expanded universe).
However, i think this should be more of a mod, because i cant see it being a top priority or really what the Ludeon staff want to do straight away (particularly Tynan with his initial ambitions, as we're still 'pre-alpha'!), though it would be amusing to see Rhopunzel's interpretation of an alien zombie parasitic plague!
Quote from: AmalgamSnow on December 24, 2013, 05:28:03 AMFinally, they aren't traditional zombies, think of them more like an alien parasite that can be on their own, or use hosts
So basically you're saying they are not zombies, they are... uhm... zombies. Alien zombies. Cuz... zombies. ARGH.
My hallo kitty zombies hate aside, I simply don't see the "interesting" part of it. So now instead of suicidal raiders you have suicidal melee raiders... Put down a turret, gghf, n0 w8, ggbb. In CoD clones at least there is some pretence of tension as you need to actively defend yourself. Here? I'm sorry, I just can't see it being fun at all.
Sure, zombies are a great stuff and are a real meat for gaming. If done good. And doing a good zombie game is not at all about "just randomly slap zombies into anything". Zombies without the tension and feeling of impending doom combined with at least the same amount of hope for survival and actual chance of fighting them are... well, are hello kitty zombies. If they lack these elements, there is absolutely no reason for them to be there in the first place and in the end they are in only to get these few more buck from people cheated to buy the game cuz zombies.
Rimworld would need to be MASSIVELY reworked to get to a point where zombies would work in it, and so I cannot see a reason why include them at all. Horde mode? Sure, boommuffalos all day erry day. There. And if you're going to add something more, why not at least try to be creative about it? Alien fauna/flora threat, now, that sounds exciting to me. Zombies don't.
Quote from: Galileus on December 24, 2013, 06:00:36 AM
Quote from: AmalgamSnow on December 24, 2013, 05:28:03 AMFinally, they aren't traditional zombies, think of them more like an alien parasite that can be on their own, or use hosts
So basically you're saying they are not zombies, they are... uhm... zombies. Alien zombies. Cuz... zombies. ARGH.
The key word here was
traditional - the concept that you die from any means and if you're infected by the virus (from any means, not necessarily being hit/bit) you are almost immediately reanimated.
NO!
This "alien zombie" requires access to the body, because it's a
parasite which requires a
host.
For someone who sure posts alot, you are darn critical 50% of the time! (please take note of the bold/underlined, just so you understand)
Perhaps if you cared to have researched my examples (Flood and Rakghoul), you wouldn't have even spazzed out like this. Personally, an alien parasite sounds much more enjoyable than:
Quote from: Galileus on December 24, 2013, 06:00:36 AM
boommuffalos all day erry day.
Also, rimworld would not need to be "massively reworked"; it can be something done over time, the first step is to add a new model of the AI raiders, which will be dubbed by said parasites name; though there's alot more of them, and they attack more frequently than raiders.
Now, the second part is why i said it would be better off as a mod, because the aspect of adding a mechanism to reanimate the dead via parasitic hosts is more complex for it literally requires you to modify the actual mechanics behind the all the animates (that is your colonists, raiders, and muffalos, boomrats, and f$%k it, boomuffalos too at some point im sure!).
Still though, threat of alien lifeform has been discussed i believe and will, eventually come, this will appeal to all, as it's a key aspect of sci-fi; another reason why i suggested 'zombie mode' as a mod, because:
A) not everyone like's zombies!
B) More horror than Sci-fi!
C) Its optional (so it isn't
needed it to be in your game)!
Quote from: AmalgamSnow on December 24, 2013, 06:43:49 AMFor someone who sure posts alot, you are darn critical 50% of the time! (please take note of the bold/underlined, just so you understand)
Perhaps if you cared to have researched my examples (Flood and Rakghoul), you wouldn't have even spazzed out like this.
I may be critical, but I do back up my opinions with good argumentation. And that does not consists of "spazzing out". Anyhow, first - traditional zombies are not "20XX movies/games zombies" (these are modern zombies), something worth noting, and second - cause of infection really is a minor point seeing how many zombie spin-offs we've seen. Especially with the huge e-drama behind some of them, where community would argue something is not "zombies" because it's "the infected"... and... you know... different name being the whole point... I simply do not buy such a minor trick as "unzombyfing something", especially if then you go on and call this whole scenario a "zombie mode". I'm sorry, but I don't know how to take your point serious if you go right back to calling your not-zombies being the meat of a zombie mode. For me it can be dire cheerleaders on pink ponies, if they are in a zombie mode? They are zombies. Zombie proxies, whatever. Still zombies.
Keep in mind, this is my personal opinion, and I will call "infected" "zombies". I'm badass like that.
QuoteAlso, rimworld would not need to be "massively reworked"; it can be something done over time, the first step is to add a new model of the AI raiders, which will be dubbed by said parasites name; though there's alot more of them, and they attack more frequently than raiders.
Now, ironically... after suggesting me to do research on some zombie-like thingies I do not really care about, you completely go and miss my point. You say adding zombies can be something done over time, while I already stated you need to play to advantages of whatever you're putting in. These two just can't go together, I'm not talking about massive mechanical reworking, mechanics would work, sure. But without a rework, you have no strengths to play too, and that's the problem here. Now, we're talking about it as a out-of-the-box feature here - I do know you suggest it as mod and I do absolutely agree with that, but talking workload and order with mod just makes no sense. And when doing out-of-the-box feature, you don't just slap it on one piece at a time. Especially talking about something you definitely see big here. It still doesn't have a lick of sense to me - just add something that would be in game anyway, expand on your flora/fauna/danger and THEN slap all that into a horde mode. Done. No sidestepping for making zombies, no time wasted, better core game with or without other modes anyway due to expanded verse. Win win scenario! Now, with adding something like full-fledged zombie or hoard mode with something not common to the game (aliens or zombies) you just slap something random with no glue on it - it does not cooperate with your core, it's not flushed out enough to be interesting, and if it is - it actually takes away from the core. You need to play to your strengths, always!
TL;DR - Horde mode is a great idea if it plays off of elements natural to rimworld. It then works to strengths already in game and in natural environment. A horde mode with outside elements - like zombies or aliens - does not have the necessary depth and interaction of elements to go well.
Now, this is exactly why giving up on it as a suggestion and keeping in mind for future modding project is the only real way to go. Because you don't risk cheapening your core, you don't need to care about it at all in fact, and you can expand upon your mod as far as you wish. And I must say I'm a bit lost on the whole suggestion/mod thing right here, so if your comment was about "reworking this in a mod", consider the wall of text a waste of your time ;)
Quotethreat of alien lifeform (...) as it's a key aspect of sci-fi
I VERY strongly disagree with that comment. I would really recommend you to read up upon legends such as Strugatsky brothers, Dukaj, Lem, P.K. Dick, Isaac Asimov or some of O.S. Card works. Darn, watch Firefly. Firefly - the grandfather of this game! Sci-fi is a setting and form that has NOTHING to do with aliens. You can get aliens in your medieval romance if you buy it cheap enough. Doesn't mean nothing. Sci-fi can be - and luckily very often is - a study of human nature, a political thriller or even a medieval romance.
QuoteStill though, threat of alien lifeform has been discussed i believe and will, eventually come
I would ask you for backing this up. As far as I remember, Tynan stated no-aliens policy.
On regard to the aliens, yes i take your point that authors such as asimov (who might i add wrote atrocious stories, but had great ideas!) can create sci-fi that doesnt require organic aliens, but the concept, particular in his 'I, Robot series'; i would consider that alien to humanity (in it's current state) (if we just suddenly popped an android = alien to us); i suppose it's how you interpret the term 'alien'.
My bad on the believing some for of alien flora/fauna would be implemented, but liekwise, that muffalo seems pretty alien to me xD; otherwise, it'd be a brown furred buffalo :)
Damn. No, it does not matter if aliens are mechanical or biological, they are still not a crucial part of sci-fi. Hell, to actually state that aliens are a crucial part of sci-fi, you would need to define aliens as "something unknown". And at this point you could say greek tragedy is vastly based on aliens, and you would be right. Darn, there are sci-fi detective dramas out there, and in that you would need to actually state that "murderer is an alien, because you don't know who he is" to actually carry your point. No, it does not matter how you interpret the word alien, your statement is simply wrong - because only interpretation that would carry it also makes it redundant for that word to actually exist.
I'm sorry I push it so far, but as a HUGE (metal) fan of almost everything sci-fi, I find it actually insulting to the genre to simplify it in this way.
As for alien fauna and flora - I wouldn't necessary put a strike on that. I do not know how far Tynan's policy goes, but I'm quite sure he's not liking idea of any "high" alien races - considered intelligent.
You can interpret a word in many ways for a genre (which is a generalisation of a topic BTW) - for me, the whole concept of a sci-fi movie is that it IS alien, which as you said is "something unknown" (Thanks for supporting my argument there), it's distant from our current position as humanity in our ever expanding real universe. Now if you really want, we can go into depth around the semantics of:
A) Simplification
B) Sci-Fi
and C) Alien
But i'll "find it insulting" if you dont appreciate that for the majority of the community here, simplification is the necessary means of communication, because of specific barriers such as:
A) Language
B) Opinion
And C) the whole "tl;dr" policy
But for the sake of the fact we're straying off topic of a possible mod you have no interest in:
Let us agree to disagree! :)
I agree with Galileus, everything doesn't have to be "something unknown" for it to be sci-fi. To input something that is similar to zombies into the game wouldn't fit well with what Tynan is seeming to suggest of how he wants the game to go. You keep suggesting about putting it into a mod. I would do that. Make a suggestion on the Mod section of the Forums and someone might make it for you. It seems highly unlikely that a "zombie mode" will be put into the game.
I'm all for a zombie invasion IFF its done right. What I mean is:
1) Have an explanation of why they are HERE, other than, because we can. Why would alien-zombies be interested in a small-backwater rimworld, over a large heavily industrialized planet? How would alien-zombies have found them in the first place?
2) Have zombies that make sense for the universe. If they are created from a plague, how did that plague get spread? How did that plague get offworld? How did the plague get here? How was the plague created?
3) Have zombies that act like walking, corpses. Not Left 4 Dead zombies. Not COD zombies. But old-school shambling hordes of zombies. I hate it when zombies becomes whatever someone wants it to be and slaps the name zombie on it. A zombie is a resurrected corpse, not an olympic gold medalist for running, jumping, climbing etc...
@ tech, not my idea, not my thread, i can't move it to mod, i was suggesting that this should be a mod to ben.
Quote from: Galileus on December 23, 2013, 05:34:53 PM
Zombies: WHY!? Seriously, WHYYY!? Even CoD moved away from zombies now, I mean, CALL OF DUTY MOVED AWAY FROM ZOMBIES! We really can do without more pointless zombies put there cuz' zombies. It was getting ridiculous two years ago, now it's a friggin apocalypse!
Kids growing up: Nope. Kids miiiiiiight get there, they won't be growing up tho.
Unfortunately I completely fail to see your point. Call of Duty did not move away from zombies to aliens because they said "Oh, well I think that zombies are a little too ridiculous." They made the switch to aliens because they needed something new, exciting, and profitable. I'm sorry to say, but your assumption seems at least a little naive.
He was only saying how the zombies were not implemented correctly. By not being implemented correctly, it lacked gameplay making the zombie mode seem terrible.
That brings up another issue though, TechnicPyro. What is a well implemented zombie mode or game?
Quote from: maxthebeast11 on December 26, 2013, 08:07:51 PMUnfortunately I completely fail to see your point. Call of Duty did not move away from zombies to aliens because they said "Oh, well I think that zombies are a little too ridiculous." They made the switch to aliens because they needed something new, exciting, and profitable. I'm sorry to say, but your assumption seems at least a little naive.
I've never even mentioned <why> CoD moved away from zombies. Never used "ridiculous" vector either. And my opinion is the same as yours - they needed something new and exciting, because Zombies got boring as hell. Seems like every game lately was pumping out zombies like candy, indie devs split into indie game devs and indie zombie game devs, some games even released their spin-off zombie versions... Then needed to put their foot down and say: "We strongly pretend new CoD is something new!". Not that they managed too, in my opinion, but still. And let's be serious, zerg rush mode was a nice change from zombies!
Anyhow, seeing how I agree with you on why they changed zombies to zergs - I have problems understanding why you call my view naive :P
Quote from: TechnicPyro on December 26, 2013, 08:13:13 PM
He was only saying how the zombies were not implemented correctly. By not being implemented correctly, it lacked gameplay making the zombie mode seem terrible.
Exactly! Thanks, Tech! ;)
Quote from: palandus on December 27, 2013, 12:25:42 AM
That brings up another issue though, TechnicPyro. What is a well implemented zombie mode or game?
I touch on that subject in one of my posts here.
Palandus, read some of Galileus' posts. He refers multiple times how a zombie modes should be implemented. What CoD did was slap down some zombies and said "Here! Have some fun!" Although the games can be fun at times it lacks quality. Games such as "The Walking Dead" and "The Last of Us" really nailed it on the head by offering a unique gameplay to the player. I know this is a comparison of a mode to an entire game, but each aspect of a game needs a certain amount of attention by the producers (or producer) to enhance the gameplay. I think this would distract Tynan from what he wants to accomplish with RimWorld and would not be correctly implemented (story wise) into the game. I'm not saying this is a bad idea, just something that shouldn't be focused on by Tynan. This idea could still be added as a mod for a different experience, but it doesn't fit with the style of RimWorld unless there was a TON of effort put into making it work.
EDIT: There is already a mod that has been made that has zombies come in waves. The thread name is [CustomScenario] Base Defense/Zombie Rush V2.0.
wasn't one of this games prototypes a zombie game? i believe it didn't work out, and if the zombies were strong and fast, it wouldn't work at all. no zombies are fast and strong. its one or the other
Quote from: Creepypastaanime on December 28, 2013, 02:26:58 AMi believe it didn't work out, and if the zombies were strong and fast, it wouldn't work at all. no zombies are strong and strong. its one or the other
I would actually argue with that ;) BUT! Keep in mind, there are two schools where it comes to what is a proper zombie is - and in the end of the day both are right and none are better.
Still, I believe in one that puts tension before the zombies - instead of concentrating on nailing zombies (pun not intended) before concentrating on tension. For me - it does not matter WHAT are the zombies, how fast they are, if there are some unique infested or if you really need a headshot. Any of that works -
as long, as they build tension. The whole point of zombies is building that tension - in the end of the day they are not all that important per se. Zombies are a metaphor for the whole setting - they outline and present the situation. Everything in the scenario - hope, fear, desperation, lack of safety anywhere, constant terror - is represented by zombies. It's not the easiest concept to grasp, because most people thing zombies = atmosphere. It's not quite so easy. In horror atmosphere is not build by monster's presence - but by lack of it. With zombies, it's not possible - so you end up with that major tool void to you most of the time. You still have the scenery, music, pacing, camera and all that secondary stuff. Most importantly you have survivors - and you depend on them a lot to flush out the terror around. But zombies are not the element that builds the atmosphere of desperation - they simply represent it. And this is why they are scary - because they forbid you to get a break, close your eyes and forget about your situation. If you think about it they are not scary by themselves - especially classical ones. Slow, clumsy, easily taken out... But it's their never-ending presence that terrifies. It's the fact, that they will constantly remind you how f* you are, and how bad your situation is. And with that in mind, the fact of their ability to infect more people only worsens that situation - because suddenly your friends and family become the part of this once-human terror.
It can be all done with classical zombies and modern zombies. Runners, leapers, not-zombies-because-infected zombies... you name it. In the end of the day, I believe the fact they nail that atmosphere (like in L4D or Dead Rising) is much more important than deciding if you go with classical or modern zombies. And that's why zombie modes like in CoD fail miserably - without that tension, zombies by themselves are simply boring.
im not saying fast zombies won't work because i like slow zombies better, im saying that fast zombies would break the bounds of rim world. you would have zero time to react and would basically be relying on turrets. everything in rim world moves rather slow, fast zombies won't work for that. also, i meant to say no zombies can be fast and strong, cause that is an infestation that you will lose to in 5 seconds.
Well if he can pull off something similar to the flood from halo, i believe it could work (they have to be extremely extremely rare and (maybe come from a rare alien drop-pod disaster, ) then it would start infecting and slowly build up until it attacks your base. Maybe it would rarely infect colonists but focus instead on the other creatures.
I seriously think there is some potential for an interesting story (which this game is about) here.
And this way it WOULD have tension.
Which would work very well in my opinion.
Hmm?
I suggested a very tension filled "The Thing" type disaster on the story teller incident thread Not to be tooting a horn here, but check it out maybe?