weapon maintenance and reverse engineering

[Kegereneku]

Myself I would like to repair object with no loss in quality.

It's already so damn hard to HAVE any quality or say, A GUN (outside farming raider) that using 50 of steel or 20 of plasteel to repair those would be more than acceptable.
You aren't going to find "Good" weapon by the dozen, and a legendary weapon with 10% HP is not different from a 100% shoddy.

As for producing weapon, don't bother with the "risk destroying weapon during analysis", we will all reload save until we have our damned fun (and gun). Just make high-tech weapon impossible to produce or very very costly (one would think that being able to build starship give you enough knowledge for guns).

[Tobias]

Myself I would like to repair object with no loss in quality.

It's already so damn hard to HAVE any quality or say, A GUN (outside farming raider) that using 50 of steel or 20 of plasteel to repair those would be more than acceptable.

That's why I came up with the two-fold process of maintaining and restoring. So you can "quick and dirty" fix your weapon if it's a cheap one and if you capture a legendary one you can restore it to almost mint quality. For a price (resources and timewise) of course.

[billycop32]

Myself I would like to repair object with no loss in quality.

It's already so damn hard to HAVE any quality or say, A GUN (outside farming raider) that using 50 of steel or 20 of plasteel to repair those would be more than acceptable.
You aren't going to find "Good" weapon by the dozen, and a legendary weapon with 10% HP is not different from a 100% shoddy.

As for producing weapon, don't bother with the "risk destroying weapon during analysis", we will all reload save until we have our damned fun (and gun). Just make high-tech weapon impossible to produce or very very costly (one would think that being able to build starship give you enough knowledge for guns).

fear not brother, for the quality of a gun never decreases in my system! only the max HP fluctuates depending on whether it's a restore(very costly but restores Hit point max to mint or near mint condition) or a maintenance (free or cheap,but the max HP decreases)

think of it this way if it helps
your regular joe can perform maintenance, like cleaning a gun. but over time the accuracy decreases due to wear and tear anyway, so you have to take it to a gun shop where they get into the guts of the gun and restore it.

that's what my system is trying to emulate.

[Kegereneku]

The distinction between "maintenance" and "restore" imply an unnecessary complexity.
We aren't talking of emulating soldiers job, but a repair-job/bill of sort in Rimworld.

Just being able to use the Smith table to repair gun from 30% to 50% (depending of skills) while using metal would be good enough.
But as of now I see no mechanic that allow to take a specific/targeted item at a table which seem like what would be needed.

[Tobias]

The distinction between "maintenance" and "restore" imply an unnecessary complexity.

I see no harm in doing so. Two different bills on the smithing table. Nothing too complex.
A specific item is indeed impossible to select, but the detail slider could be modified with little work the narrow it down so that the "legendary" item is the most likely one to be worked on.

[Kegereneku]

There is a harm, accumulating frustrations from this and 10 others features made more complex than needed. Simplicity isn't a bad things nor cheap, it take a lot of thinking in cutting off unnecessary complexity to make a game better.

In our case, the only thing we need to address is one "REPAIR" job that raise items HP, why design 2 ? You don't need to 'maintain' the weapon/clothes every 3 days but only repair it once.

The error to avoid is transposing all aspect of a feature from reality.

[Tobias]

unnecessary complexity

I don't see that as an unnecessary complexit but as an addition to the experience.
Sure, a simple "repair to 100%" function works as well (and it works a lot better than a function where the item durability is decreased with each repair alone - those are annoying), and I won't complain when it implemented like that.

Bottom line: I think we can agree that we definitely need a "repair weapon" bill for the smithing table.

[billycop32]

I propose a small alteration. we can adjust each weapon's "max HP deterioration rate" based on how advanced it is. a simple pistol will have little to none, while machine guns will go like hot cakes.

[Kegereneku]

I am against any suggestion that require a regular maintenance of weapons.

We have more than enough things to do to keep the colony alive, and the only problem is to make healthy once and for all, items that aren't. Not create a constant (unnecessary) need for regular maintenance (not all of us want to play with more than 10 colonists).

Practical Example :
After a raid, I retrieved a Masterwork gun/sword (or gun-sword who know).
Problem : it's HP is at 20% making it worthless for battle or selling.
Wanted solution : A way to restore its health to 90% in a easy, cost and TIME worthy way. Then never worry about it again unless serious harm happen to its user.

[Darth Fool]

That sounds an awful lot like:
Problem: don't have super weapon.
Wanted solution: Give me super weapon.
Not everyone wants to play a colony where everything is handed to you in a drop pod.

[Kegereneku]

I prefer it to

Problem : no way to ever have/keep good quality ITEMS unless you are insanely lucky of grind for years to buy one.
Wanted solution : a BALANCED way to repair items through a skillful process.
Suggested solution : Rimworld is now about soldiers maintaining their weapons everyday or every time they fire them, no time is left to do any other jobs or exploration.
(I am exaggerating as much as you did)

Note that myself I didn't and wouldn't suggest "reverse engineering". Meaning the only awesome weapon you'd get would have been the one you found on cadaver and repaired through a costly process asking for costly material and preferably the best crafter for actual result (else you'd waste material for a loosy 1% restoration)

Point is :
You can balance any features until itself work fine.
But you can only erase redundant features or features that encumber the rest of the game for little effect.

[billycop32]

actually if the maintenance is used in the current "bill" form, you could automate the process.
the point is so that weapons of all kinds can be balance in practice.

[Kegereneku]

Problem with automation is to filter the useless crap you won't want to repair, I don't see that possible or efficient with the current filters (Targeting one items would require a 'Clear All' -> manual select -> then filtering upper/lower HP and maybe quality), it also don't help if you need material for each repair and you don't want some stuff used.

IMO, the best would be a repair-job that only target items with a (haul-like)repair order.

I have nothing against this point of yours. Only against your suggestion that repairing weapon(items) should be something regular rather than a "do once occasionally".

[billycop32]

it is a do once occasionally.