Psychopathic cannibals

[Songleaves]

Similar to akiceabear, I too don't wish to debate psychopathy. But I will question the notion that cannibalism is a health hazard. I am unaware of any particular risks associated with eating properly cooked human meat. If anyone has any information on that, however, then I would be all ears.

[JesterHell]

Yes

Really?

You're trying to mash a 'Hollywood Psychopath' criminal stereotype into what is actually referred to as antisocial personality disorder by the psychology institution

Because, here a quote of myself.

Sociopaths and psychopaths are both "antisocial personality disorder" just with different symptoms,

and further down in that same post.

this is interesting, where you diagnosed by a professional psychiatrist? because the official term is "antisocial personality disorder" which is a catchall for both sociopaths and psychopaths.

So I do know this.

except the problem is you're taking a layman's totalitarian view

Totalitarian view? how did you get that?

I know about the problem getting accurate data ASPD because as one psychiatrist said sociopaths/psychopaths don't seek help and have no motivation to get better, its generally society and the law that want's them to be "Fixed" while they are perfectly content being what they are.

As for violence I'm sure not all people with ASPD are violent criminals they just don't have any moral qualms about being violent to get what they want, there is also some evidence to suggest that really ruthless businessmen, you know the ones that will do anything they can get away with to succeed have sociopathic tendency's and like many psychological conditions they aren't mutually exclusive, you can have multiple conditions and can make it difficult to tell where one ends and another begins impacting data gathering further.

As for empathy I think fits rather well was an analogy I read.

Have you ever slept on your arm and woken up with it feeling dead or numb? you can still feel it there but finer sensations are dulled to the point to where its almost unnoticeable, well that's what having ASPD is like, your empathy is numbed making it easy to ignore or just not notice at all.

that doesn't read as totalitarian to me, I'd also like to point out that I use ASPD in this post as well.

from cherry picked

Do you mean I cherry picked the article's? because its not like I looked at a hundred articles and chose these as the best, I looked for ones from people with professional qualifications and they seemed to support my stance so I used them or did you mean that I cherry picked from those articles? I did that because I think its better then quoting the entire thing and gave the link so other could get the whole article if they wanted.

Disregard for laws and social mores' is not some sort of on/off switch

What do you mean by this? because I don't get what you mean by on/off switch. The evidence suggests they have a disregard for laws and social mores and while there may be groups or individuals whom they associate or "connect" with they only pretend to fellow/agree with the more general laws and social mores for their own benefit or avoid the consequences.

the things you're quoting are simplified guidelines regarding extremely complicated clinical diagnosis of inherently unique individuals

How else are you supposed to do it? by this I mean you don't explain quantum physics to a layman using the terms that an actual quantum physicist would use as it'll go over their head so of course I'm going to use the "simplified" explanations because I'm not a psychologist and a lot of the jargon they would use talking to each other would require me having studied psychology to fully understand.

the crux of the problem. You're trying to mash a 'Hollywood Psychopath' criminal stereotype into what is actually referred to as antisocial personality disorder by the psychology institution

No I'm not, how did you get this idea?

and backing it up using an article written by....drumroll....a criminologist.Had you actually bothered to pick out the Hollywood criminal view of psychopathy as presented by a guy whose activities include publishing books about serial killers,

The fact that one source is a criminologist does not change the others aren't nor does it negate the criminologist's opinion as He quotes in that very article the American Psychiatric Associations DSM-5.

The fifth edition of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), released by the American Psychiatric Association in 2013, lists both sociopathy and psychopathy under the heading of Antisocial Personality Disorders (ASPD). These disorders share many common behavioral traits which lead to the confusion between them. Key traits that sociopaths and psychopaths share include:

    A disregard for laws and social mores
    A disregard for the rights of others
    A failure to feel remorse or guilt
    A tendency to display violent behavior

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wicked-deeds/201401/how-tell-sociopath-psychopath

and instead investigated the root psychological concerns in the catchall morass of 'psychopath'

Everything I've read has supported that morality, empathy and social more are not concerns for those with ASPD, that they mimic the reaction's of those around them show disgust when other do and joy when others do with the evidence suggesting that the rare times when they do genuinely care its an exception rather then the rule, so what more "Investigation" do you want me to do?

you wouldn't be acting like psychopaths are some sort of Hannibal cutout who'll uncaringly start eating people when their plane crashes in the mountains.

so if morality, empathy and social mores are not  something they are concerned about why would they they care? what is the reason? the motivation? there are only two reasons I can think of.

        1. that they know about the potential heath risks and how that may effect them

as for exactly how unhealthy well there this.

If you eat human brains, you may contract a disease that will return the favor: kuru will eat your brain. Worse yet, there is no cure.

http://www.healthmap.org/site/diseasedaily/article/spotlight-why-cannibalism-bad-you-72612

- The world's first known cannibals ate each other to satisfy their nutritional needs.
- The cannibals belonged to the species Homo antecessor, related to both Neanderthals and modern humans.
- Homo antecessor appears to have preyed on competing groups, treating victims like any other meat source.

http://news.discovery.com/human/health/first-cannibals-nutrition.htm

Most parasites can be killed with a good cooking so only eat "very-well done" meat and I've also found vague unsubstantiated claims that its the organs like the kidneys and liver that are the worst for consumption but was unable to find any professional opinion on this.

        2. that they are merely pretending to care so as to hide their true nature

This is something that every source seems to think those with ASPD are capable of.


And even after all this you haven't given a reason why you think they would have a problem with cannibalism other then your personal opinion.
You also make the statement that I'm wrong and my source's are inadequacy but don't give any of your own? I'm open to changing my stance if you give me reason too but as of writing this you haven't.

Finally the whole purpose of this topic was about whether the in game psychopath should get a penalty from eating human meat it was never an argument that they like it just that they wouldn't dislike it or be disgusted and I said no then gave my reasons why when an opposing argument was made, also this game is already largely abstracted in many areas and an "In-Depth" simulation of psychology while awesome is outside the scale of this game so its just a question of what that abstraction means for psychopathy.

It is pretty much done by now, considering that we've had all arguments stated at least twice. we could just, like, make a poll or something, and when people post an actually new thought on the matter, it gets included.

first 3 options would be
1. Psychopaths should be unaffected by cannibalism(my opinion)
2. Psychopaths should get a minor mood penalty due to them not liking the health issues
3. Psychopaths should(for whatever reason) be just as disgusted as non-psychopaths

oh, and to entirely change the nature of the thread, what about some "high-functioning sociopath" trait that gives every trait +5/+10 or something, and makes the AI better, Sherlock(the TV series called "Sherlock", don't really know the "real Sherlock Holmes, or other tv series) like?

+1

Yeah let just stop the debate and get a vote so we can be done with this topic.

[Songleaves]

I'm familiar with kuru, but there are lots of animals that if you eat their brains you may contract a fatal prion disease (like cows and goats), and since in Rimworld you can only consume meat from humans I was limiting my discussion to people's meat.

[JesterHell]

I'm familiar with kuru, but there are lots of animals that if you eat their brains you may contract a fatal prion disease (like cows and goats), and since in Rimworld you can only consume meat from humans I was limiting my discussion to people's meat.

Yeah, I looked around a bit but couldn't find anything concrete its probably because its hard to get data on cannibals because they don't exactly put their hand up during question time.

That being said I don't see why the meat (muscle) would be dangerous if you have it very well done but I couldn't find any studies on it.

[quxzcover]

here's a easy test:

your standing at a rail road with a lever in front of you. there is a train and its heading towards a cross section. on the left there is a group of people tied to the tracks and on the right there is one person tied to the tracks. and you have to chooses who dies right?

question 2:
you come to a rail road and you notice a group of people stuck to the track. there is a fat person standing in front of you and you calculate that somebody his size could derail the train and save those people. do you push the fat guy onto the tracks and kill him and save the group of people on the tracks? or do you stand there and watch as a group of people get ran over by a train?

the questions are not very different though for some people they can be very hard. normal people would at least hesitate to answer. psychopaths would not hesitate to push the fat guy assuming they want to save the most people. They would also never in there life feel guilt for killing the fat guy or one person.

Honestly in a colony builder it shouldn't be that different. Do i save my colony (the people who i have manipulated to help me survive) and more importantly myself from starvation and butcher someone/eat them? or do we all stave to death? not that different from the question above. the difference being the people down the tracks are the rest of your colony and the person in-front of you being a raider, the possibility of the derailed train hitting you being disease. a psychopath wouldn't hesitate and would never feel guilty about it.

In my opinion any morale bonuses/de buffs that are not directly about the psychopath himself shouldn't count. as for cannibalism it should also not count because how is eating this other person be different than eating that bunny rabbit you hunted yesterday? or your pet Labrador? any colonist can kill all your pet dogs with no morale bonuses yet in a survival situation i would value the life of my Labrador alot more than eating the person who tried to kill me in the long run when i know there'll be no rescue ever. what will get me farther in the long run? for psychopaths its all about themselves so they wouldn't care.

Please correct me if I'm wrong about all of this. but i hope this puts a new spin on what you thought about psychopaths. i believe that psychopaths should not get any morale bonuses/de buffs that are not directly about the psychopath himself including cannibalism.