So when is Tynan returning?

[StorymasterQ]

Coen, do you mean that Steam and Tynan returning discussions are being designated Godwin-level on this forum?

[A Friend]

Valid points. Proper discussion! HUZZAH.

Yeah, I myself thought that "6 Months" was a bit too much for a vacation. But I was never really bothered all to much by it unlike the usual detractors and I have a bunch of other games to keep me busy while I wait for the countdown.

And with the amount of scams and undelivered crap many Early Access games provide. Of course people have the right to worry and express it, especially if the game clearly has incredible potential like Rimworld. Especially those who only bought the game recently. But personally, I haven't supported that many EA games so I'm not as jaded and I still have hope for this one.

But things like this are just wrong:

this is exactly why I do not buy or support games until released anymore.  Taking a 6 month break while a game is in alpha is inexcusable and unforgivable. This dev will never see a penny of my money in this or any other game he  is involved with for life! I hope he starves. Devs like this hurt the entire gaming community. If you cannot finish, the DO NOT START!

[StorymasterQ]

Like granny said, if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all.

Well, someone's granny said that, not mine.

[TLHeart]

my granny always said  say what you mean, and mean what you say. Don't hold back, be honest.

[StorymasterQ]

Ah. Well, that reminds me of Hofstede and his cultural dimensions thing.

We're getting off topic, but I'm not sure if it's a good thing or not. If a topic goes sour, is derailing considered bad?

[Coenmcj]

Coen, do you mean that Steam and Tynan returning discussions are being designated Godwin-level on this forum?

It would seem so except I was thinking less comparing someone here to Nazism and more so along the lines of an endless cycle that shall repeat itself until a satisfactory outcome is observed.
Atleast after this 6 month break the Tynan returning discussions will cease to exist, (until someone necros them) then all we'll be left with is the Steam one.

speaking of Godwins law... I wonder if the 'cheapest ideas' thread of the count to 9000 thread have invoked it yet?
Edit : The count to 9000 thread has invoked Godwins law, Skissor played a hand in it, the Cheapest ideas thread has apparently not reached a sufficient density as of yet.

And with the amount of scams and undelivered crap many Early Access games provide. Of course people have the right to worry and express it, especially if the game clearly has incredible potential like Rimworld. Especially those who only bought the game recently. But personally, I haven't supported that many EA games so I'm not as jaded and I still have hope for this one.

Unfortunately due to a few rather public early access kerfuffles, there has been serious doubt placed on the indie crowd and whether they can finish to a satisfactory standard what they had promised in days or months past.
This has the effect of harming potential indies that were considering putting their ideas out there and even moreso those that were already in the middle of a project, harming both their sales and support meanwhile increasing hostilities towards people who have done nothing wrong as of yet, perfect example being Pooch.

Have faith, Just because a small few of these independant developers have gone MIA only to never return does not mean the rest of them will.

[Carlyscarlet]

He'll be back by Wrestlemania. Hell, maybe he is secretly training for a surprise debut at it, or a surprise entrant in the Royal Rumble. You'll just have to wait and see 

[RickyMartini]

Is taking a massive vacation mid-development normal, or generally acceptable?  Nope.  Is it Tynan's prerogative?  Definitely, that's the very definition of the word after all.

I mean, the thing is, Tynan said again and again that this game is basically done. So it's not really a mid-development abandonment. The game is finished as you are buying it now, and Tynan will only return to give it the Alpha 13 update and then release it on Steam as a finished game.
It will happen in the next months, and we all know that after that RimWorld is finished. It's not something that is left hanging in the future. We were already given the reassuring promise.

[A Friend]

Is taking a massive vacation mid-development normal, or generally acceptable?  Nope.  Is it Tynan's prerogative?  Definitely, that's the very definition of the word after all.

I mean, the thing is, Tynan said again and again that this game is basically done, but most people don't want this to be true. So it's not really a mid-development abandonment. The game is finished as you are buying it now, and Tynan will only return to give it the Alpha 13 upgrade and then release it on Steam as a finished game. It will happen in the next months and we all now that after that this game is finished. It's not something that is left hanging in the future. We were already given the reassuring promise.

But muh better faction interactions! noooooooooooooooo

In a more serious note. I'm going to argue against the "it's finished" part. I feel that the "Factions" needs to be more fleshed out. Right now it's just kind of there so you could know that the group of pirates that you're fighting are called the "Chicken Men".

Every other part of the game does not feel lacking or there's something noticeably missing. But every time I look at that Factions tab, I feel like it's an empty placeholder for something. Factions and interactions with them seems like an important feature for a game like this. But there's barely any aside from raids, useless visitors, etc. For a "story generator", having varying interactions with your game world and environment seems like something essential and not something that you can add later to pad the game up like more events and raid types.

I can't personally agree with calling the game "finished" with that thing staying blank like that. But well that's just my personal opinion. One that can easily be ignored, discarded and argued against.

Edit: Well it can be argued that DF, an inspiration for Rimworld also has a pretty simple faction system (atleast based on what I've encountered so far in the vanilla game mode). With only a few distinct factions and interactions pretty much just limited to trade and raids. But the sheer amount of chaos and fun that can result in your fortress alone without even interacting with the outside world dwarfs heh the dull nature of the factions in that game. (Did I use a straw man? Huh.)

Oh noes I'm going off topic!

[RickyMartini]

Well I also didn't reveal my opinion on whether I think this game is "finished".
But that's sadly what Tynan said.

6 months may seem like a long time but it'll be like 15% of the game's dev time by the end of it. Not a big deal in the grand scheme. Moreover the game has more content than was ever promised. The marketing page doesn't even mention animal taming/training at all. So I'm comfortable with what we're offering now.

[Saikar]

Honestly, both sides valid. The detractors are missing the mark though. It's not "inexcusable" to take a break during development; he doesn't report to us in any meaningful way. But it still feels really dangerous. I've worked on large-scale projects before... amateur video game design, novels, collaborative online efforts with other people. Dropping completely out of that for six months is psychologically deadly. Restarting work after so long of having your mind on other things is an enormous mental hurdle to overcome. I did my best work when I resisted the temptation to take long breaks, countering burnout by focusing the energy in different parts of the same project as opposed to other things entirely.

I put tons of hours into the game as is so I won't be super disappointed if this is all I gets. But there will still be that twinge of sadness that I couldn't see anything else be added, not to mention *another* reason to avoid early access before release.

[Regret]

The game being called finished does not mean there will never be another update or patch, it just means it is a complete game. There are plenty games out there that were sold as completed only to get more content afterwards.
It could also be that Tynan drops this project and starts something else next.
Either way, it takes some of the now traditional 'alpha's must update every 3 days!!1!one!' pressure off of the dev team.

[RickyMartini]

I think what I mean to say with "finished" is that Tynan already met all the goals he ever promised for RimWorld and he can easily afford a break. Whether Tynan considers a13 to be the last update was never confirmed.

[A Friend]

Oh, it's not that I think that there won't be another update or something. I'm pretty positive that Tynan will continue adding content to Rimworld.

It's probably just with the word "Finished". I just don't think that this and that feature should be considered "Optional Content".

[falcongrey]

Considering Tynan DID state at some place that while he was on his vacation that the work WAS continuing behind the scenes, I will wager there WILL be an update when or shortly after his return. His return is certain. This is not someone being hopeful, this is someone looking at a person's past behavior in doing what he says and saying what he means. Tynan said he was returning and wasn't done with Rimworld so that means Tynan IS returning and Tynan IS continuing work on Rimworld. Even working on it DURING his vacation. Just as many people I know still tend to do some work while on a vacation. (Considering he DID say he was doing SOME work while the majority was being done by another helping on the development.)

As for being finished, he stated very clearly, it is finished as in all the promised goals are met. Is it finished in HIS eyes? No in that he wants to flesh out the factions, add polish to many of the components, and add something else that I admittedly cannot remember and can't find the post... Will it ever be 'finished' in his eyes? Probably not when you consider most developers always will see something that can be or should be added or can be polished better. This is where he has to become his own project manager and make a decision that 'it is done'. Will he add more to it after Steam release? I personally think he will, considering how much he loves Rimworld.

It took a long time before I bought on to Rimworld, waiting for the Steam release. Why did it take so long? I was burned by one of the burned out indie developers who kept bending to the will of the mob in an effort to make them happy. That being said, it was Tynan's ability to deliver what HE promised and not bending to the will of the mob that got my attention. He would listen to the community, look at the game he was developing and then deciding if  it would fit in with the goals he sat up or would interfere. Only after that would he add things in that the masses wanted or suggested. It took every suggestion into consideration, which in my opinion, was remarkable. Tynan was also VERY active in the forum community. This was something I've only seen with one other developer so I kept watching. Finally, after I was convinced by his actions that even though a Steam release was not out, the game was well worth buying into and was convinced it would be finished though not as quickly as I had hoped. Tynan, in my opinion, has proven himself good to his word. He said he would return once his 6 month time out from the board and obsessive development was done. He said that development was still going on while he was away from the board, I believe this is true as he has always been true to all he said in the past.

In its current state, I play the game all the time. Why? Because it has the feel of a finished game and even feels better developed than most commercial projects. I play the game all the time. Why? Because it is fun and never the same game twice. I play the game all the time. Why? Because I still have high hopes for an Android Port of the game so I can play it even MORE all of the time! (Ok, that last one is a stretch...)