Steam ranting & RimWorld's status

[TLHeart]

"Abandoned" is a ridiculous term to use for this. Recreational anger doesn't become you. Frankly I'm disappointed to come back and see you still at your old game of constantly accusing me of various moral shortcomings and transgressions.

The game is worked on every day - as was described on the blog. We're full steam ahead over here; I'm just not taking time out to give daily updates because it would slow down progress. Truthfully, I don't like wasting time managing PR; it's better spent on the actual game.

Since the next update will represent six months of work, it will be gigantic compared to previous ones.

If anyone wants to keep claiming the game is "abandoned", I'm open to betting some cash on this. Any takers? We'll go by the dictionary definition of "abandoned". TLHeart? We can start with a $1000 bet. Or more! After all, it's free money for me since I know the answer

milon feel free to delete off-topic posts here and/or warn/ban violators; off-topic thread pollution is a rule break after all.

Not a game Tynan, perception of the public is what drives sales.... and a 6 month break, announced or not is a warning sign and is perceived by some that the game has been abandoned. and the developer has ran off with the kickstarter money... It has happened so often with EA games.

And by the dictionary use, which one? as there are over 50 different definitions.



And since you NOW feel that PR is less important, it shows just how little you understand marketing. PR is what drives sales, not leaving a game in limbo for 6 months.

No I won't take your bet, as if you read and understand what I said, For 6 months the game has been abandoned, with NO game updates to the community. A few posts here and there, and a blog post of empty drival about how great the next update will be....  all actions I have seen before by developers who do ABANDON the project. The word abandoned touches a nerve.

Looking at the Mantis report, Ison has fixed over 50 bugs that we still have to play the game with, because you needed a 6 month long break.

Instead you want everyone to never question what is happening...

[RemingtonRyder]

EA Games (or Electronic Arts as they're styling themselves these days) have shareholders. Shareholders want their dividend. They almost don't care about game development, just the bottom line.

So if games are being made shit because the bean counters say 'nope, that's not going to make a profit, can it' then that's another problem entirely from what you're perceiving.

Tynan has taken a break, fully expecting there to be a slump in sales, because he thinks that it is the best thing to do in the long run. He probably knew that people would start to get restless on the forums without a new release to tide them over. But yeah, as you can tell from his post, he is still disappointed that it just takes a few people throwing accusations about the game being abandoned and suddenly the shit hits the fan, if you'll pardon the invective.

Frankly, the only thing that matters is when and how Tynan delivers the next release. And I don't mean 'the release date is what matters' I mean 'the release is what matters' because apparently, short of an intrusive documentary following Tynan's everyday activities, nothing less is going to pacify that element which insists the game is abandoned.

Not a game Tynan, perception of the public is what drives sales.... and a 6 month break, announced or not is a warning sign and is perceived by some that the game has been abandoned. and the developer has ran off with the kickstarter money... It has happened so often with EA games.

[skullywag]

As i keep saying ludeon studios is still hard at work on the game. Nothing more needs to be said.

[RickyMartini]

Tynan is still active, Ludeon Studios is still coding, a dev (Ison) is active, we have all the reason to believe it's still working, and the past years have showed that tiny breaks will be resolved again. End of the story.

[TKS]

I'll be the middleman of these bets 

[RedStorm58]

Not a game Tynan, perception of the public is what drives sales.... and a 6 month break, announced or not is a warning sign and is perceived by some that the game has been abandoned. and the developer has ran off with the kickstarter money... It has happened so often with EA games.

And by the dictionary use, which one? as there are over 50 different definitions.



And since you NOW feel that PR is less important, it shows just how little you understand marketing. PR is what drives sales, not leaving a game in limbo for 6 months.

No I won't take your bet, as if you read and understand what I said, For 6 months the game has been abandoned, with NO game updates to the community. A few posts here and there, and a blog post of empty drival about how great the next update will be....  all actions I have seen before by developers who do ABANDON the project. The word abandoned touches a nerve.

Looking at the Mantis report, Ison has fixed over 50 bugs that we still have to play the game with, because you needed a 6 month long break.

Instead you want everyone to never question what is happening...

I don't see what your point is.....

[Granath]

Well, well, well....ain't this thread a nice "how-do-you-do"?

Look, I'm one of the people who won't buy it until it's on Steam. I don't want to deal with some half-assed distribution platform for Rimworld while the vast majority of the users (those who purchased prior to the "maybe no Steam keys" announcement and those who purchase once this is released on Steam) are on a different platform. I've had some pretty negative experiences with smaller distribution platforms - Desura,  ViaTech, Direct2Drive and others - and I'm unwilling to go through that again. Everything from some of those platforms going out of business to having to fight to get a key years after I made the first purchase to bugs...no thanks. Plus, I want to be able to use features like Steam workshop. So when it's on Steam or Ty will guarantee me a Steam key when it is released on Steam I'll buy it. Until then I won't.

With that said, it was my response to Ty's post when he announced his vacation that ultimately drove him to re-think and delay the Steam release. Yep, I helped cause the delay in the Steam release. I knew that a long vacation would cause major PR issues even on a more controlled and limited site like this. Exhibit 1 is this thread. Exhibit 2 are the threads linked from this one. Imagine if he had released this on Steam and then vanished? They'd be burning him in effigy on the Steam forums! I'm glad Ty followed that advice. I think he'll be far better off for it. I don't begrudge the vacation either.

So I'm looking forward to Ty's return, the next patch, the Steam release and my inevitable purchase of the game - all in the first half of 2016.

[Toggle]

Plus, I want to be able to use features like Steam workshop.

It's very unlikely the steam workshop will be used though, considering even a simple, small update for a mod can completely break a saved game.

[Laos]

This thread is a great example of what a double edged sword the idea of "community involvement" can be. Tynan trusts us to come on board, take suggestions, help craft the vision, and when he decides to take a break and focus on his personal life after over two years (i think it was like two and a half years of active development or something if you include pre-kickstarter stuff) of hard work people begin to get resentful. The game has offered me hundreds of hours of gameplay -- something I can't say for the dozens of $20 videogame kickstarters I backed. It's getting so much more in the coming weeks, and yet people continue to act entitled or conspiratorial. So now I can't imagine the frustration Tynan is having after putting this much effort in, and the community feeling "betrayed" for something they hardly deserve at this point. He's promised future developments, and it's clear Tynan has many ideas he hopes to put into an upcoming build. But now we have this kind of rhetoric over and over which is extremely toxic to game development. He didn't promise any road maps, timelines, or features that are being ruined or lost over this personal time off. In fact, the lack of any Greenlight or steam releases demonstrates he's not trying anything sinister like a cash grab or something before he just jumps ship. Considering he's someone who writes books on game development I imagine Tynan isn't looking to tarnish his reputation.

I agree with Granath. Trying a steam release or new build right before this big a release would have been a disaster. I think what i'm also getting at is that Tynan owes no one here very much as an indie game maker. He's already gone above and beyond what he was framing in his kickstarter in November 2013. Unless you're one of the 225 people who bought the "pirate king" package, you're patiently waiting on those high tier features, but the game has developed and offered a lot of amazing mechanics none of us expected when we backed it. And even then, hardly anyone paid close to the AAA experience that is like $100-120 for all the bells and whistles in a Battlefront or a Fallout 4, and this game already offers tons of replay value, etc. etc. I don't want to try to come off like a fan boy. I mean hell, he's still answering backer support questions via Twitter -- he doesn't have to do that, but it is the right thing to do, so he does it.

That said, I look forward to seeing Tynan continue builds once he's back in full swing. "Ran off with the kickstarter money" is an embarassing claim for a game that received more updates than other indie kickstarters I've been a part of. Not to mention compared to kickstarters where the developers after just one year call it quits. I think Train Fever is one that comes to mind, or other, one-man shops that push out even fewer updates and don't communicate at all with the community. This isn't on Steam and Tynan isn't going on some marketing blitz trying to show off a game he is asking people to buy unfinished. He is pretty transparent compared to most devs I've beta tested with.

The only "problem" here TLHeart is that Tynan trusts the community, so he gives us a much looser leash than other development groups do. So he decides to focus for a while on his personal life and you feel cheated, so now maybe Tynan will keep a tighter leash, which bugs me and the others who choose to reciprocate that trust in Tynan's work decisions. Maybe we won't get so much in-depth access in later builds because of the way people acted in his absence.

[RickyMartini]

Nice post Laos, I just wanted to point out that Tynan did in fact Greenlight RimWorld.

[Laos]

Nice post Laos, I just wanted to point out that Tynan did in fact Greenlight RimWorld.

Fair point. I guess to rephrase you can't buy it and hes not pushing it out in steam sales and so on to cash in the hype

[RemingtonRyder]

It's very unlikely the steam workshop will be used though, considering even a simple, small update for a mod can completely break a saved game.

Tynan has previously said that he intends to use the Workshop. Something to bear in mind is that the way in which a game uses the Workshop is entirely dependent on how the developer integrates it into the game.

So for example, if the game were to cache previous versions of downloaded Workshop mods then it would be possible to have mod version control in the game, allowing 'old' saves to still be playable.

Other games, such as Skyrim, simply use the latest modlist regardless of what modlist a save was using.

[Toggle]

I thought it was said it wasn't to be used? Huh.

[Coactum]

Not a game Tynan, perception of the public is what drives sales.... and a 6 month break, announced or not is a warning sign and is perceived by some that the game has been abandoned. and the developer has ran off with the kickstarter money... It has happened so often with EA games.

And by the dictionary use, which one? as there are over 50 different definitions.



And since you NOW feel that PR is less important, it shows just how little you understand marketing. PR is what drives sales, not leaving a game in limbo for 6 months.

No I won't take your bet, as if you read and understand what I said, For 6 months the game has been abandoned, with NO game updates to the community. A few posts here and there, and a blog post of empty drival about how great the next update will be....  all actions I have seen before by developers who do ABANDON the project. The word abandoned touches a nerve.

Looking at the Mantis report, Ison has fixed over 50 bugs that we still have to play the game with, because you needed a 6 month long break.

Instead you want everyone to never question what is happening...

When you buy an early access game, you're gambling with your money. You sound like someone who may have been stung a bunch of times in the past. I bought Towns, Spacebase, I got pretty involved with early access and I totally get it. I definitely don't think Rimworld has anything in common with these titles though. If there was a 1.0 slapped on Rimworld tomorrow, I'd be more than pleased with where it had gotten to, knowing I've already put a hell of a lot of hours into it.

Everything seems to suggest this isn't the case at all though. Tynan is developing a game and has offered people to help fund it's development in exchange for updates prior to release. That doesn't mean he's chained to the project. Go do something else for the time being and check back every now and then instead of sitting winding yourself up, not many people seem to really share your concerns so maybe it's just you, no offence intended. If you're splashing out on early access titles then I'd be willing to bet you've got a good few finished titles to keep you busy until then

[Ulf]

mod: This topic has been split off from a thread in General Discussion, Questions about Steam keys.

so easy to save the link to the download from the developer on your own flash drive. And 400 games, how often do you actually play all those games? Steam adds just another layer of garbage to navigate, and their DRM locks.... I much prefer to purchase without those internet access required locks.

Well, there are not only steam, but also GOG, which do not use DRM copy and online registration. Prison Architect has geschaft by Steam on GOG, like other good games. Should Rimworld eventually appear on GOG, I pay gladly for a second time for the game.

Translated with Google.