Unstable build feedback thread

[dnmr]

Seeking other feedback on the scythers, if anyone has some experience. Too easy? Too hard? Just right?

midgame'ish colony at 250k on cassandra hard, scythers seem ok so far. They pretty much force you to have some melee guys to hold them at bay, and with decent armour and some evasion from melee skill you can usually stall scythers enough to let ranged pawns dps them down. They add some panic factor but don't feel too too OP right now imo

[Madman666]

I've just done a speedrun, crashlanded, extreme, to test the quests. Now they are always worth it. Quests used to be relatively harder than home threat until mid game, now they are easier, even early game. Even if you doesn't like the item, you should just go there to clear the quest at some point, to get the diplomatic reward and get another bandit camp.

Thats really good to hear. Quests are supposed to be worthwhile endeavor, not a death trap, should you not have 10 people available in full space marine armor set. Though i will also do some experimenting to see how it plays out on different wealth levels and difficulties to say for sure.

[Tsevion]

Seeking other feedback on the scythers, if anyone has some experience. Too easy? Too hard? Just right?

So I definitely think they're a bit overtuned... particularly in conjunction with drop pods. I've lost several people this colony to drop pods with scythers, and it's hard to come up with good counterplay. You have limited time as they destroy furniture and doors in a a rather short time. Ideally you use EMP grenades, as fighting without them is pretty much certain death. Last night a group came in, and they downed my EMP grenadier in  a single hit as he popped the door to toss one in (which admittedly was bad play, shoulda had a melee breach the door with him behind them, but they were getting close to breaking out and I panicked a bit). After that even with 5 or 6 pawns shooting, 2 melee pawns in front, and 4 or 5 animals, against 3 scythers in close quarters losses were substantial: 2 dead alpaca, 1 dead pig, 1 dead Elephant, 2 dead colonists (1 melee, 1 ranged), all colonists having injuries.

On the flip side, if they land outside my base, traps make short work of them. It seems you just changed traps back to hit colonists or at least colony animals again (as one took out one of my Alpaca on 1958), which is sad ... If that's not a bug it's rough, back once again to weird door hallways and such. Personally I'd prefer if traps had a large speed debuff for colonists/allies but couldn't trip (possibly allowing tripping if wandering confused or on fire).

[JavaWho]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1435124242

Above is a link to pawn social dialogue.  I have seen this a few times.  I have never tried to court myself or tried to woo myself. It does read quite funny.  Maybe it is intended?

I do love reading the new dialogue, but it may need a second look.

[alfons100]

Hello, first time poster here, I just wanted to give some feedback for 1.0 and Rimworld as a whole _{prepare for a great wall of text}

One is the balance around the materials on the game, right now it is simply always Steel, or plasteel when it is available. Of all the materials in the game, there is basically no blunt-resistant stuff at all. Yes I understand that you want that Impact damage is generally less resisted, as it should, but it still means that my melee fighters will always get one or two punches in fights despite being well armored.

Thats why Uranium should have greater blunt-armor properties since it doesn't have many good niches other than flammability compared to plasteel, not sure on what the exact number should be but it should be the best at doing that. As right now it has very little redeemable qualities other than great health and no flammability, so Plate armor out of uranium(Could you make flak-vests out of all materials or was that a mod?) would be more resistant to punches and such alike. But less towards sharp threats.

Also some sort of textile materials that are more impact resistant than others, maybe Synthread should be because I have realised that Synthread... is now a really bad material. Other than durability it seems. Would make sense since blunt damage is a very primitive damage source, so incase they were to get in a social fight, they'd be ready for that because it is a very 'casual' material.

Now, to keep the balance of blunt damage still being less resisted. A fully decked out blunt-defense set should still not have as much Blunt defense as a full Sharp-armor oriented set. If there's a raid where you can ensure there is little melee sharp damage happening and you got a sufficiently powerful Shield-belt, then such equipment would be appropriate.

Oh and another thing, regarding the weapon properties of metallic stuff. Plasteel is basically the best, no matter what. In my opinion, Steel, Plasteel and Uranium should be more balanced on focusing on it's own thing. Plasteel has a bit lower cooldown and is the greatest at Sharp damage, but the blunt-bashes are much weaker. Uranium is the KO-king while having okay Sharp damage but great Blunt damage, however, the cooldown should be around 115%, instead of 135%. Still having it be a Skill-requiring material. And steel is a nice mix between blunt and sharp. 100% attack speed like right now. So a Longsword that can do good pommel bashes and slices is possible. Hurray for variety.

---

And another thing related to armor, Social chat impact could have a little tweaking so it is dependent on material. So each textile got a social chat modifier. Now to balance this out the social chat impact values could be reduced in turn so it isn't much less or more than vanilla. Maybe Dusters/Jackets also have a little bit of Social-chat impact bonus so this doesn't only apply to cowboy hats and tophats. Like, 5% or so.

Rare and snazzy textiles got higher social chat impact, such as Synthread, Bearskin, Thrumbofur and similar. Maybe you can craft/buy a gold-sewn fabric which is really expensive but gives a large social chat bonus. Devilstrand may have lower because I can imagine it looking ugly. Also discourages having extreme formality policies where everyone is wearing the same red.  Materials such as Light-leather or.. uh, Human skin got lower than average. This gives choices in clothing materials a second option-thought if you want Insulation. Perhaps quality affects it too.

Lets say, A Cowboy hat has 10% base social-impact. Thrumbofur has a 200% modifier,
This cowboy hat now has +20% social-chat impact. Simply, really. Not sure if it is possible but perhaps Human-skin got a negative modifier? -50% or something.

---

And finally, the Social-system should be more punishing where immoral actions as organ-harvest, murder, cannibalism and such should have much larger reputation losses. Killing someones friend, butchering them, and eating them gives less goodwill with another colonist than being a little ugly. Yeah, right.

Maybe have more causes to like people as well? 'Cooked the colony a meal', 'Tended to me skillfully', 'Is holding X pawns weapon(excellent quality), surely, people would respect a doctor a little extra. If they're an actually good at it.

Combined with the Apparel social chat impact bonus idea, someone that eats people, butchers them himself, and wears Human skin, they will guaranteed to be disgusted and treated as an outcast unless they actually become buddies with somebody.

This is a suggestion I've had since ages, there should be variants to a 'Social fight'. Either they are triggering longer-lasting debonuses when it comes to interacting with the other pawn, or snapping and doing something short like a social fight. Some ideas could be:

Heated argument where they stand to argumentate for a bit, which has two possible results, they get on better terms with eachother, or it gets even worse.
Maybe this guy gets a mood debonus whenever he is in presence of the person they hate for a week(So having seperate Dining halls and rec rooms could be helpful)
Perhaps the person now simply will refuse to heal/rescue the other person?

This could also happen in the opposite way, where good friends may get beneficial bonuses from being pals. Such as sometimes inspiring a little XP boost in things they got passion in, Recreation gain from speaking with eachother, blabla. You get the idea.

---

Phew. That was a lot to write. It has been ideas I've been thinking of for a long time that touches less looked at parts of the game, in my opinion.

(Also, minor thing. The mace sprite still looks a bit out of place and a little too small. Now when there's so many sprite changes, the mace could definitely need one.)

[XeoNovaDan]

What is really interesting is power armor/helmet plus devilstrand underwear (heavy armor class, major investments into research and production) against devilstrand duster/shirt with flak vest/pants and advanced helmet (medium armor class, moderate stuff and research investments) against devilstrand everything (no movement penalties, no steel needed, minor research).

Ask and you shall receive! I only did a total of 90 trials (900 battles) rather than 120 since we were talking 3 teams rather than 2. Methodology remains mostly the same as last time, except all gear was of good quality (realistic for when you'd consider producing these things ingame), and the melee weapons were made out of plasteel. Advanced helmet was still made out of steel, but as you'll see, power armour was unsurprisingly largely dominant so plasteel probably wouldn't have made a huge difference.

Heavy armour vs. medium:



Medium armour vs. light:



And, last but not least, heavy vs. light:



The blunt melee results were quite interesting, with all of them probably being within test variance (which is particularly large with melee). Also interesting that there were 15 ties in ranged testing between medium and light. Out of the 2 wins that light got against heavy, one was actual pain shock and the other was a lucky brain shot.

Not going to do any more 1v1 testing on this thread though since it is somewhat off-topic.

The thing is, bearskin is a lot harder to come by than flak jacket ingredients.

You'll be surprised. Although it is a bit of a playstyle thing admittedly, I don't start producing armour until the mid-game since that's when it's the most viable stage to start doing it, and by mid-game there's normally a decent amount of leather (in this case, bearskin and better) in storage, and the fact that mid-game is possibly the most steel-intensive stage of the game (at least relative to supply) means that there's not a huge amount of steel to spare for flak jackets. Right now, flak vests and bearskin (or better) dusters are just the more logical investment to go for.

Plus going into the later mid-game, manhunter packs of bears soon start happening, and that's an easy way to get hundreds of the stuff in storage. Although the steel supply problem gets alleviated since I tend to do deep drilling by late-game, I'd already be considering power armour anyway.

[Lech]

What about other materials for building bridge? Steel or stones maybe I'm playing on desert right now and I have no wood to build bridges.

[robno]

Scythers are just right, they go down reasonably easily if you have a decent amount of ranged dps.

[erdrik]

...
To be perfectly frank I'm of the opinion that weapon quality should probably only increase the damage of Masterwork/Legendary ranged weapons.
Being able to reasonably consistently churn out good/excellent quality weapons currently makes the game exponentially easier. The fact that both Damage and AP are increased in addition to the accuracy bonus is.. a freakin' doozy.
There are also some important break points, like (Good) Bolt Action Rifles being able to destroy someone's liver in a single shot which generally makes combat a bit more volatile.

I like the idea behind high quality weapons being better in ways beyond simple accuracy bonuses (after all, the gun can only be as good as the pawn if only accuracy is affected) but as it stands the current changes make virtually all player-used weaponry ~15-30% better and it's really noticeable.
...

I think one of the things that quality should have an impact on is down time between shots.
A poorly constructed gun is more likely to jam in some manner. I dunno if it would be good to implement an actual "jammed gun" mechanic or just abstract it with increased cool down/reload times for lower quality weapons, but it makes more sense to me than damage and AP bonuses...

[ChJees]

A awful gun doing less damage do i hand wave as it coming with really poorly hand loaded ammunition and a warped barrel slowing the projectile down.

Besides i noticed that even with just a good quality minigun it now did 1 more damage than its normal counterpart .

[Boboid]

I hate to say this but - Plasteel Plate Armor has 810 durability making it almost indestructible in a normal time scale. While it's really nice to be able to make an expensive piece of armor that will - for all intents and purposes - last forever, it's probably a bit much.
Power armor has 340 durability, steel plate armor 290. Just for reference.

Have to say that the plate armor speed penalty is quite noticeable in my melee colony - mostly in terms of manpower. It's manageable but noticeable when 70% of your colonists are wearing it. Certainly increases the bionic leg priority which (amusingly) wasn't super high on my list for general pawn use.
Also makes me particularly glad that I'd already invested in lots of dogs for animal hauling.

Unfortunately the "This armor is really reducing my total productivity but it's too fiddly to put it on when raids happen" feeling isn't super pleasant. Particularly because it's downright dangerous for anyone who's a reasonable distance from your base.
I think in terms of game balance it's fine, armor is absolutely worth using.
I just feels bad - If the experience of switching equipment was a bit smoother it might be a different story, a sort of " Press this to force everyone to switch to this preset loadout " function would almost certainly change my mind about it overall. Even with the significant time required to equip it.

^Edit:It's worth noting that you can to some extent do this with the loadout system, unfortunately it requires you to set each colonist individually and it's not always a colonist's first priority to don new attire. It's obviously time consuming as well.


It's also not particularly pleasant to have armoured pawns slowing down caravans.
It's really bad to be under-armoured if you're ambushed and just a pain in the ass if you're going to somewhere with a known enemy presence.
The optimal way to play is to remove the armor, wait for it to be stored, find it in the caravan list, add it to the caravan, travel to the location, search through everyone's backpacks and pack animals for the armor, drop it, and manually equip it.
An inconvenience for 1 person, a fiddly mess for 10+. Don't even get me started on my current 34 person colony

Drop pods certainly alleviate one half of a trip but.. a round trip typically requires walking home unless you're willing to burn a lot of steel and chemfuel on building transport pods in the landing area.
It's by no means a deal breaker, simply an annoyance.

[Dashthechinchilla]

It is tough to quantify, but it feels like preferred name generation is turned down in 1.0. I have a preferred name I had put in the game that I entered on the menu. In B18 it felt like it spawned about every 2 pawn events (raids, traders, ect). Now it seems like 5+ before it appears again.

[Sirsir]

Seeking other feedback on the scythers, if anyone has some experience. Too easy? Too hard? Just right?

They are a bit too tanky I feel. When you have 6 guys with LMGs spraying one of them down, starting from about half LMG max range, and they still get to you and get a hit or two off...

That and I keep getting drop raids of all of the same type of... (is there a term for 'scyther+lancer'? Droid? I'm gonna call them droids until someone comes up with something better) Not sure if thats intended or not. I would think there should be a mix.

On the whole I really like the droid changes, Lancers are weak to melee, and Scythers are weak to range, but neither completely fall over when faced with their weakness.

[PleaseBro]

Last 5 or so raids I had there have been no survivors even if I beat them down in melee without bleeding them.

At 5 pawns on rough. I got like 3 of those "refugee is running" alerts that I declined cause I don't letting in complete strangers I know nothing about. I ended up almost losing 2 pawns saving one of those injured pawns on the world map. I should of stayed on the land I found her and healed her there while collecting food but I thought I had enough food for the 3 of them to get back not knowing it would take ages cause of injury.

Anyways I am at 5 pawns 160 days in on rough Cass Naked brutality. I lost 2 so far. Seems a lot lower than before when I would have prisoners I would take time to either convert or sell or release for relations. Now I get 0 prisoners in 5 raids, I feel bad I wasted steel on making my prison. A single pawn I got was from a raid and it was one of the ones who died (he was missing an arm cause I had to cut it to save him from infection when he was a prisoner, and too bad I got an archo tech arm now).

Also steel is kinda rare, maybe buff Steel Slag Chunks to 15 or something? I think that would make a big difference I haven't smelted any yet but I got about 50 slag chunks so far. Only 500 steel for the effort I took to haul them all to my electric smelter I finally built (cause low on components). I was planning to research up component manufacturing  and make components but wow that's a lot of research points. Good thing I am not a tribe like I usually like to play.

Also love how boomalopes drop chem fuel. I got one from event and was getting chem fuel from thin air and realized the new mechanic. Now I love taming and getting boomalopes. Free energy.


Also to everyone talking about bear stuff I made full bear / heavy fur / Rhino skin for my dudes now to see if it's good. I got flak researched but not enough resources to make them. I got simple helmets for everyone tho. I easily have enough leather to deck them out in all that and can easily 5 man down a rhino or bear. I even had 2 manhunter polar bears come and I have a fully trained pet bear No idea what drops heavy fur but I imagine it's defense is as good as bear I think.

Can someone explain to me the difference between the hats and the difference between jackets, dusters, and parkas?

Are jackets for cold weather, dusters for warm, and parkas both or something? That's what I always thought I assume the jackets and dusters are stronger defense cause specialized. I never bothered to press i ingame tho and read and still wont.

[2slowman]

Hey all,

Found the 1.0 build on steam and started playing.  Excellent, excellent.  Two quick pieces snagged my attention so far. 

1.  I have a healing room, and wounded dogs.  In the room is a small stockpile of kibble.  When feeding the wounded dogs, my healer runs all of the way across the base to grab kibble from the freezer rather than picking it up from 4 spaces away.  This happens every time. 

2.  The romance dialog is recorded in the social tab for both characters, but in one dialog, there is an error in the text.  In this game, Iselle is married to David, but MJ is trying to get some at a party even with David standing right there.  So rude, but not the issue.  The text error is in Eselle's dialog, it notes that "MJ courted MJ".  The text in MJ's dialog is correct, "MJ courted Iselle". 

And just a note, there has clearly been significant effort making these dialogs entertaining.  Hilarious.  David and Iselle clearly have a fine time between the sheets, at least so the dialog indicates. 

[attachment deleted due to age]