zzzt can happen under floors?

[Alenerel]

I was wondering if this event can happen if you have all your cables under a floor, for example a wooden, paved or stone one. I tried to have all my cables under a 3 tile wide roof but it still triggered the event.

If it can happen then Id suggest that it shouldnt happen if you have the cable roofed or under a built floor (or smoothed stone).

[Lys]

Yes it can. Can even happen inside a wall.

[Alenerel]

Suggestion time then...

[Zhentar]

There's no way to prevent Zzzzt in Vanilla (other than not using batteries or conduit at all), because making Zzzzt preventable defeats the purpose of it. Zzzzt exists because otherwise large banks of batteries could completely negate some events & gameplay challenges without any real cost, and Zzzzt restores that balance with a new hazard. Without that hazard, you might as well just remove the event entirely.

[Alenerel]

Not necessarily, you could build smart to avoid zzzt, the same way people buy smart so that they can defend way easier in raids.

I think that it would be interesting to have a long road roof from the base to the geothermal plant.

[erdrik]

There's no way to prevent Zzzzt in Vanilla (other than not using batteries or conduit at all), because making Zzzzt preventable defeats the purpose of it. Zzzzt exists because otherwise large banks of batteries could completely negate some events & gameplay challenges without any real cost, and Zzzzt restores that balance with a new hazard. Without that hazard, you might as well just remove the event entirely.

I don't think Zzzzt should be completely preventable, but I think it there is room for it to be more manageable.
I mean I put all my conduit in walls because then even if a Zzzzt happens the resulting boom is lessened.
But I think it would be possible to strike a balance if walls and floors fully prevented the boom.
Mainly because there is still one area that cant ever be fully covered.
The batteries themselves.
If a conduit grid is fully covered and prevents a boom in the conduit, then maybe the batteries explode.
They can't be covered as easily(and never fully technically) and cost way more to rebuild, so would provide natural incentive to create a "ground"(purposefully exposed conduit) somewhere in the grid.
Which battery explodes could even be modified such that only "grounds" close to the battery are guaranteed to work. Randomizing which battery is effected if there is not a nearby "ground".

[Zhentar]

Not necessarily, you could build smart to avoid zzzt, the same way people buy smart so that they can defend way easier in raids.

I think that it would be interesting to have a long road roof from the base to the geothermal plant.

You already can do that, by using few batteries (or none) along with careful conduit placement, almost completely eliminating the hazards of Zzzzt... but at the same time constraining your ability to use batteries to bypass power management challenges.

There's no way to prevent Zzzzt in Vanilla (other than not using batteries or conduit at all), because making Zzzzt preventable defeats the purpose of it. Zzzzt exists because otherwise large banks of batteries could completely negate some events & gameplay challenges without any real cost, and Zzzzt restores that balance with a new hazard. Without that hazard, you might as well just remove the event entirely.

I don't think Zzzzt should be completely preventable, but I think it there is room for it to be more manageable.
I mean I put all my conduit in walls because then even if a Zzzzt happens the resulting boom is lessened.
But I think it would be possible to strike a balance if walls and floors fully prevented the boom.
Mainly because there is still one area that cant ever be fully covered.
The batteries themselves.
If a conduit grid is fully covered and prevents a boom in the conduit, then maybe the batteries explode.
They can't be covered as easily(and never fully technically) and cost way more to rebuild, so would provide natural incentive to create a "ground"(purposefully exposed conduit) somewhere in the grid.
Which battery explodes could even be modified such that only "grounds" close to the battery are guaranteed to work. Randomizing which battery is effected if there is not a nearby "ground".

So then the only purpose of Zzzzt is to force players to spend an extra dozen steel putting a bit of sacrificial conduit in a fireproof chamber next to their batteries, or to punish newbies who haven't figured out this strange system yet.

If you want to turn off Zzzzt, but you won't disable the event in your scenario because that would be cheating and you want to pretend you're maintaining balance and just making it "fair", there's a fuse mod for you: https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=11272.0
But I very much doubt that kind of thing will go into Vanilla unless Tynan thinks up something else just as dangerous (or worse) to replace it.

[Supert]

So then the only purpose of Zzzzt is to force players to spend an extra dozen steel putting a bit of sacrificial conduit in a fireproof chamber next to their batteries, or to punish newbies who haven't figured out this strange system yet.

Can you explain it further, please? I found random Zzzzts so frustrating so I always go into fueled generators since their appeared in the game. Stockpile of wood replaces battery room for me.

[jmababa]

So then the only purpose of Zzzzt is to force players to spend an extra dozen steel putting a bit of sacrificial conduit in a fireproof chamber next to their batteries, or to punish newbies who haven't figured out this strange system yet.

Can you explain it further, please? I found random Zzzzts so frustrating so I always go into fueled generators since their appeared in the game. Stockpile of wood replaces battery room for me.

Just don't get battery wet and keep it out of bedrooms - beauty and keep it out of sunlight too sunlight and rain can trigger zzzt. Its not an storyteller event, its like your ancient danger its a triggered event by you

Edit: I forgot lightning too can trigger zzzt if it hits any and I mean any power plant including fueled one

[carbon]

That is not true. Although batteries can explode due to fire (or rain?), a true Zzzttt... event is completely random.

EDIT: Just checked and it seems the rain-induced short-circuiting is a red card event is indeed called Zzzttt... as well. My comment above refers to the yellow card Zzzttt... which is in fact random.

Zhentar's point, as I understood it, was that the current system is random, but simple to compensate for (i.e. don't go crazy with having 30 batteries). If you add a bunch of constraints of when Zzzttt... can happen, then it becomes trivial for everyone in the know. Effectively reducing it to a punishment for new players who don't understand it and nothing more.

[Supert]

I'm talking about http://rimworldwiki.com/wiki/Events#Faulty_Conduit_Explosion
I don't know, maybe Tynan reduced chances of this happening, but it was greatly frustrating in 0.9.x-0.11.x versions. I am pretty sure about two things:
1) It is totally random and happens in random conduit of powered grid with even partly charged batteries connected.
2) Explosion radius depends on power stored.
Before fueled generators, I was dividing my base in three power grids separated by switches:
Main grid: solar panels, electrical devices like stoves and heaters/coolers and few batteries just enough to cover day/night cycle of charging/discharging.
Security grid: Sentry guns. Lot of them.
Power bank: something like 10-20 of batteries in separate stone block building.
Power bank was usually disconnected from grid, unless I had to power security grid or charge it back.

I wasn't really happy using it because of some annoying routine of switching grids and, mainly, because it isn't really prevent Zzzzts but is simply reducing it to 3 or 4 flames.

3 or 4 fueled generators generate enough power to research steam generators (it's power equivalent to 1 cooler, few heaters, about 6 or 7 sentries and workbenches). Since they have stable power output, no batteries needed => no Zzzzts will happen.

[Zhentar]

Zhentar's point, as I understood it, was that the current system is random, but simple to compensate for (i.e. don't go crazy with having 30 batteries). If you add a bunch of constraints of when Zzzttt... can happen, then it becomes trivial for everyone in the know. Effectively reducing it to a punishment for new players who don't understand it and nothing more.

Yes, perfectly summarized.

[erdrik]

So then the only purpose of Zzzzt is to force players to spend an extra dozen steel putting a bit of sacrificial conduit in a fireproof chamber next to their batteries, or to punish newbies who haven't figured out this strange system yet.

As far as sacrificing conduit how is that different from now?
Either way you are still going to end up sacrificing steel to replace burned out conduit.
Still being careful and using extra steel for out of the way paths to keep them under walls.

And punishing newbies also happens now. Granted the consequence would be heavier(due to the battery cost), but even in vanilla the idea that you can lessen the boom by covering the conduit with walls is still "in the know" information that newbies won't have.
And there is a real simple solution that would give my suggestions info to newbies.
Include the cause in the Zzzzt Event Description. IE:
"A battery was destroyed when it discharged it's energy through a faulty ground that directly touched the battery. An exposed nearby conduit connected to the grid could safely discharge that energy."

If you want to turn off Zzzzt, but you won't disable the event in your scenario because that would be cheating and you want to pretend you're maintaining balance and just making it "fair", there's a fuse mod for you: https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=11272.0
But I very much doubt that kind of thing will go into Vanilla unless Tynan thinks up something else just as dangerous (or worse) to replace it.

I don't want to turn it off. And to be honest I don't have any problem with it as is.

I just wanted to point out that it is possible to strike a balance if walls and floors actually did fully insulate against Zzzzt events.
Its purpose would not be defeated.

[zandadoum]

why all this concern with zZZZzttt?

http://imgur.com/a/ghKOl

set it up like this, never a problem again.

situation 1) a zzzZZttt elsewhere empties your batteries? turn on pack #2. next morning recharge the empty pack
situation 2) a zzzZZttt in here blowing up one of your batteries? firefoam will inmediately take care of it, turn on pack #2 and rebuild the broken one with minimum effort. next morning recharge the empty pack

[Alenerel]

I thought about that too. And also having a secondary power conduit so you never run out of power while rebuild that 1 tile.

Then I thought... What about blight? -.-