WIP: Cloning Chamber - Ideas needed

[Tgr]

fast production of humans maybe requires concentrated human genetic material to work, X-COM 2 style ... so you have to render down raiders into meat, or just give it corpses, to accelerate the process.

[Skcuske_Lobuk]

Status update:

I've adapted the blood sample from the CTS mod and have code for 1:1 copies.

I agree, cutting off limbs is not really how cloning works nowadays. But just grabbing a hair or a drop of blood is some kind of lazy.

My current plans (for now to get a full cloning cycle prototype)

• Gather blood samples; every time a sample is collected, only a small, randomized amount of information is saved. Meaning multiple samples are needed to have all the information to fully clone an individual. Collecting samples counts as an operation and the donor will need to rest for a while.
• You will need at least 80 % sample quality for trying to clone an individual, the rest of the information will be filled by the sequencer,
  but only if you have fully deciphered the genome (i.e. by collecting samples from the same species).
• Clone will grow within 3 hours for testing purposes (I don't wait 7 days for results )
• Mod options via XML and/or cloning UI: clone has deadly disease and dies within 1 year, clone needs drug to stay alive ...
• Future plans: multiple cloning devices via research; artificial womb ...

[dyl000]

will the genetic samples be reusable? because I was hoping to make essentially a clone army of expendables to use as a main line of defence, that way I can mess around with different tactics and such rather than just hiding in a bunker because im afraid a raider will put a hole in my colonists skull

[Skcuske_Lobuk]

It's not fully fleshed out yet, but I plan to make a genetic database. Samples will be analyzed and added to the database, thus allowing easy cloning of individuals multiple times, and also combining samples.

[SpaceDorf]

Since everybody has so many AI Cores lying around  ..
the gene sequencer and maybe the cloning chamber surveilance machine seem like a good place to store some of those.

[Orpheus]

I'm really glad somebody's working on this.  I was talking to people on the Steam forums about exactly this, how to implement it, and was starting to suspect that I'd have to do it myself (starting from NO modding knowledge!).  So it's quite a relief that somebody's already started on it!

A couple of thoughts:

First, age.  I'd strongly suggest that, rather than making the age selectable, you just force it to 20 years old (ie, JUST old enough to have an adult backstory).  This way you don't have issues with clones becoming adult and either having no adult backstory or a nonsensical one.  Just assume that RNA and neural networks got copied along with DNA, so the clone has the same memories as the 'parent'.  Though, this could get weird if you cloned somebody younger than that.
There's no real reason to make age selectable, it just adds complexity both for you and for players.

Quality of cloning.  I would say that, in line with other stuff in Rimworld, the quality of the cloning job should be largely determined by the Medical skill of whoever is operating the cloning machine.  You could also perhaps have the machine require medicine as 'fuel', consuming one unit per X amount of time.  Decide when initiating a specific cloning job, whether to use herbal, standard or glitter medicine - you are then committed to sticking with that type until the clone is ready.  In this case, perhaps medical skill could determine how closely the clone's attributes match the original, and medicine quality could affect the risk of flaws.

Non-humans.  Cloning animals should be technically pretty trivial since they don't have traits or skills to copy but are just generic 'templates' of a species.  BUT if the cloning device can copy animals, it should also be able to clone "alien" races (to follow Rimworld canon, EVERY 'alien' race mod I have seen claims that its species is actually either a branch of humanity or engineered from Earth animals.  So they would be genetically compatible and able to be cloned without trouble).  As such, you ideally should set this up so that either it easily integrates modded species and recreates the proper race without a fuss.  OR at least try to implement it in such a way that creators of alien race mods can easily patch your mod to work with theirs.

[AngleWyrm]

I agree, cutting off limbs is not really how cloning works nowadays. But just grabbing a hair or a drop of blood is some kind of lazy.

The information coded into a single microscopic strand of DNA is the complete description of a life form's development, from birth to death. It's the how-to recipe to turn ingredients into a creature, including the construction of all the little factories it takes to make that happen. We discovered some of our compression algorithms from DNA, because it's pretty amazing stuff.

Raw materials that get converted into the history of a life are what we call food.

[Dragoon]

I'm really glad somebody's working on this.  I was talking to people on the Steam forums about exactly this, how to implement it, and was starting to suspect that I'd have to do it myself (starting from NO modding knowledge!).  So it's quite a relief that somebody's already started on it!

A couple of thoughts:

First, age.  I'd strongly suggest that, rather than making the age selectable, you just force it to 20 years old (ie, JUST old enough to have an adult backstory).  This way you don't have issues with clones becoming adult and either having no adult backstory or a nonsensical one.  Just assume that RNA and neural networks got copied along with DNA, so the clone has the same memories as the 'parent'.  Though, this could get weird if you cloned somebody younger than that.
There's no real reason to make age selectable, it just adds complexity both for you and for players.



Quality of cloning.  I would say that, in line with other stuff in Rimworld, the quality of the cloning job should be largely determined by the Medical skill of whoever is operating the cloning machine.  You could also perhaps have the machine require medicine as 'fuel', consuming one unit per X amount of time.  Decide when initiating a specific cloning job, whether to use herbal, standard or glitter medicine - you are then committed to sticking with that type until the clone is ready.  In this case, perhaps medical skill could determine how closely the clone's attributes match the original, and medicine quality could affect the risk of flaws.

I disagree on these two points

First off.
This mod was made with RW in mind(which has children). Of course, if they do make it standalone which he or she could easily decide it do. Picking age is still something that should be decided by the player. It in no way cause anything bad, "There's no real reason to make age selectable, it just adds complexity both for you and for players.". Complexity is not a bad thing, it's a great thing if used right and making a decision for the age of something is a good way. I'm pretty sure to decide the age of the clone is not going to be the hard part. And if the author is able to do it, I say go for it. We would all appreciate it.

As for the players not having a reason. You might want a clone of a certain age because you may have a mod that effects age checks. it could be because maybe you want the rng as your way of balancing it out. Plus many of the players that are vocal say they like to have their base go on for years because they don't want it to end.  Or simply want to have the age in mind that you want. There are many reasons why players should have the choice.

They should not have the same memories if anything that would be a choice between a generic clone or a "perfect clone" which would decide whether or not they had the same backstories as the original. Realistically they would have the backstory vat clone, for both childhood and adult. While a "perfect clone" would retain such things.

Second off.
I disagree it should be based on medical skill. If it was skilled based it should be reliant upon research skill, rather than medical skill. The machine is not exactly a medical one, just because it has to do with the human body does not mean, that a doctor would be the best for it. A scientist working in this field would be better than a doctor, as they would know the proper amounts of whatever is needed for a clone. While a doctor would know what a human needs, they would be more useful after the clone comes out, rather than during the creation of the clone.

I don't think it taking medicine is a proper fuel. I just don't believe that it makes sense as fuel for this machine. I feel as though that is a balancing act it could work. If the author decides to do this, then we'll have to go with it. However, it will be purely just to balance.
Idk about how I feel about it being medicine based.



Honestly, I think you should make your own cloning mod, NOT because your suggestions are bad, but because you seem to have a real passion for it. And I know there would be people looking for a mod exactly like yours. I think it would be nice to have variety. Maybe even both. Different cloning ways from different worlds. Like in star wars how you have kaminioan cloning and skitarri.

[Orpheus]

Yeah, I may end up making my own version.  But I already have a pretty long list of things that I want to make, should already be making, or have said that I will make.  Given that somebody's already working on this, the deciding factor for me will be whether, in the end, I disagree with his interpretation enough to add another job to my list.
That said, I'm also vaguely looking into the possibility of a mod to resurrect dead pawns.  As part of that, I think I'd need to either borrow this mod's method of copying their attributes, or else write my own code to do the same thing.  In which case, I might get bored and extend it to include cloning as well.
Or, just as possibly, I may get distracted, abandon both ideas and do something completely different instead...

[Skcuske_Lobuk]

I like all your ideas, very well-thought and I understand all aspects.
In A17, I saw a new mod menu, which could be used to make the player decide if either medical or research skill will be used, same for needed resources and added complexity.

A working A16 prototype which clones humans can be found here. Other species currently not working, something wrong with the pawn generation?

[Mr. Dominix]

I know this is a triviality, but what of moods?

What if witnessing a clone working about the colony made colonist uncomfortable, resulting in poor mood (piticulerly for the person they were cloned from!)

[iyedmoto]

How about cloning the dead ?  that would be exciting

[AngleWyrm]

How about cloning the dead ?  that would be exciting From a wikipedia article on Ancient DNA According to their model, mitochondrial DNA is degraded to an average length of 1 base pair after 6,830,000 years at −5 °C

[iyedmoto]

How about cloning the dead ?  that would be exciting From a wikipedia article on Ancient DNA According to their model, mitochondrial DNA is degraded to an average length of 1 base pair after 6,830,000 years at −5 °C

good to know 

[Wishmaster]

I think closing this way even with drawback will break the game.
I would rather do "medical clones" like in Eve Online.

When a character dies, his consciousness is transferred to a clone of him.
In RW, making those clones would cost human meat, plasteel, perhaps gold or components ?