What is your opinion on the somewhat recent Simplified Leather Change to Vanilla

[viperwasp]

So now there are only what 3-4 types of Leather? I heard of this change in one of the change logs. But this is my first time really playing since than. I liked how it was before because it was more interesting. I could be like oh this person has Hare Skin pants. This person has Bear Parka etc... Or more so couches and other objects made out of it.

It seems you can still spawn in all the types of leather using Dev Tools or God Mode. But that's not fun etc. And it feels like cheating. Plus enemy spawn won't get it.

Do most of you like this new change? I imagine there are upsides? Is it more balanced in terms of stats? And of course it causes less clutter. Still are there any good mods that sort of revert it to the old way? Even if I a mod did make every animal produce it's own leather. The new vanilla recipes would still not support it right? So the mod would have to change a fair bit I imagine. Is there such a mod? Basically I don't like this new change overall as I feel it kind of dumbs down Rimworld a tiny bit.

[fritzgryphon]

The first time I saw the leather list I loled.  They are mostly the same.

I just want to know which is the warmest one and which is the armorest one.

Then once you get strand or flak, leathers become trivial.  Each is just another arrow to click on the trading screen.  Pro change.

[B@R5uk]

My thoughts are it's beautiful!!!

There is still a lot of leather types and at the same time it has become much more manageable. I don't agree with both of you as every biome has it's own leather portrait and flak with devilstrand cannot solve all the problems especially in extreme temperatures.

And I don't approve selling leather as is. It will fetch much better price should it be turned into dusters. Well, that reqires time and time is a scarce resource. But making dusters train crafting and high crafting skill is a good thing in mid and late game.

Table below may be a little bit outdated as it was done for v1.0.1972.

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[Serenity]

I like it a lot. There were way too many leathers before

And there are some differences I pay attention like making warm dusters from bluefur

[viperwasp]

Owe so it's not just three or four types of leather? It's that whole list? That is better than I thought. Thanks for posting that list. lol Saving it for use. So thanks again B@R5uk. By the way B@R5uk that looks like an awesome excel doc. You made that yourself? Does anyone know how I can get a copy?

And there were at least three player made mods that condensed leather before Tynan came up with a system himself that means that more people like this new way than before I think. Okay I kind of still miss the old way. But I hate change. lol Still this change has it's upsides.

[Shurp]

The main reason I like this change is that I no longer have scraps of leather lying around from a dozen different animals which are all too small to make anything with.  Now if I have 30 beaver pelts and 30 cougar pelts I can make a pair of pants (assuming they fit into the same category; if not, mix and match with something else). 

[Drakkenstien]

My thoughts:

Thank god. No longer does it clutter up my storage, and I can now reasonably expect to be able to make use of rat, rabbit and squirrel leathers, and any other creature that gives <25 leather per butcher. No longer do I have to hold onto it until I can be bothered to form a caravan or one wanders by to get rid of the massive stockpile of different leather types that basically required its own storage area due to the vast variety of animal types.

Great change.

[zgrssd]

So now there are only what 3-4 types of Leather? I heard of this change in one of the change logs. But this is my first time really playing since than. I liked how it was before because it was more interesting. I could be like oh this person has Hare Skin pants. This person has Bear Parka etc... Or more so couches and other objects made out of it.

It seems you can still spawn in all the types of leather using Dev Tools or God Mode. But that's not fun etc. And it feels like cheating. Plus enemy spawn won't get it.

Do most of you like this new change? I imagine there are upsides? Is it more balanced in terms of stats? And of course it causes less clutter. Still are there any good mods that sort of revert it to the old way? Even if I a mod did make every animal produce it's own leather. The new vanilla recipes would still not support it right? So the mod would have to change a fair bit I imagine. Is there such a mod? Basically I don't like this new change overall as I feel it kind of dumbs down Rimworld a tiny bit.

I think it was overdue. With 40+ there were just way to many Leathers types to bother about. And half of them even had the same values. But only in most stuff. So picking the right leather was such a chore, I often ended up just not caring at all.

If anything I feel it did not go far enough. A lot more options could have been pruned without loosing anything relevant. It is still almost 20 different types of leather afterwards. And most stuff can use Leather or any of the 4 cloth types. That is 23 Material Options.

[5thHorseman]

I'd be happy with leather, fur, and cotton.

[AileTheAlien]

devilstrand cannot solve all the problems especially in extreme temperatures

Actually, looking closely at your chart, it seems like devilstrand strictly outperforms about a third to a half of leathers. It's beaten in armor, heat, or cold insulation by a few leathers, but only by a little bit, and at the expense (usually) of the other two attributes. Once I'm growing devilstrand, I usually only bother with Thrumbofur as a replacement, since everything else is too much micromanagement for my tastes.

[B@R5uk]

Actually, looking closely at your chart, it seems like devilstrand strictly outperforms about a third to a half of leathers...

Sorry. I just checked it out and it seems devilstrand armor stats has been changed to 140%/36%/300% recently, so now it does solve all the problems except cold and heat insulations in extreme temperatures. The best apparel for cold regions is megasloth wool parka and the one for extreme heat is camelhair duster, which I like very much due to its manufacture accessibility. Also I like elephant leather pants and rhinoceros leather button-down shirts because of the same reason. You see, I prefer high temperature biomes. And these animals are good stuff for storing meat in form of corpses due to their huge body size.

Thanks for posting that list. lol Saving it for use. So thanks again B@R5uk. By the way B@R5uk that looks like an awesome excel doc. You made that yourself?

No need to thanks, really. This chart is outdated and it's very much possible I have missed a leather type or two. Yeah, I made it myself, but it seems I have to remake it from scratch as soon as I get my hands on a newest version. You see, I got doublefire in my intellectual skill, I like studying stuff. And this game is very satisfying in this regard.

[bigheadzach]

So I asked this in Reddit and no one's replied yet, but is there a place to explain how the stats of a material get applied to the stats of an apparel piece?

[Golden]

My opinion is that there are still too many types of leather, since several are almost the same and should be combined into one.

[B@R5uk]

...is there a place to explain how the stats of a material get applied to the stats of an apparel piece?

Not sure if this is the place, but it's easy to explain. Materials have stats like armor and insulation. When certain type of apparel piece is made, these stats is multiplied by factors specific for chosen type. Then this product is further multiplied by quality factors. I don't have all the factors, but for poor/norm/good/exc armor factors are 80%/100%/115%/130%, insulation factors are 90%/100%/110%/120% and price factors are 75%/100%/125%/150%.

For example, we have excellent megasloth wool parka, armors for megasloth wool are 36%/0%/36% and insulations are 34.0C/12.0C, parka factors for armor is 20%, for
cold is 200% and for heat is 0%. Now we have:

Sharp armor: 36% * 20% * 130% = 9.36% (which will be shown as 9.4%)
Blunt armor: 0% * 20% * 130% = 0%
Heat armor: 36% * 20% * 130% = 9.36%
Insulation - cold: 34.0C * 200% * 120% = 81.6C
Insulation - heat: 12.0C * 0% * 120% = 0.0C

Also parka base HP is 180 and megasloth wool HP multiplier is 100%, so it will be 180, quality doesn't matter. And parka needs 80 units of material and 8000 ticks to be produced, so its price will be (80 * 2.70 + 8000 * 0.0036) * 1.50 = 367.20. This value will be further multiplied by wearness factor for which I don't now the formula except it's 1.00 unless wearness dropped below 90%. And as long as result is greater then 200.00 price is rounded up to nearest multiple of 5. So if our parka is new its market value should be 370.00.

Two simple conclusions from price calculation are:
1) the cheaper the materials the greater part of larbor price in total market value is.
2) skilled craftsman can easily multiply materials value by producing high quality items.
This is why useless leather should be turned into dusters and only after that sold.

Another example with legendary hyperweave duster. Hyperweave stats are 200%/54%/288%/26.0C/26.0C and HP multiplier is 240%. Duster multipliers for armor, cold and heat are 30%/60%/85% accordingly, base HP is 200 and to make one you will need 80 units and 10000 ticks. Legendary factors are 180%/180%/500% for armor, insulation and price, if this values are the same as the one applied to marine armor. (The price factor is the same even for sculptures anyway).

Thus we have:
Sharp armor: 200% * 30% * 180% = 108%
Blunt armor: 54% * 30% * 180% = 29.16% -> 29.2%
Heat armor: 288% * 30% * 180% = 155.52% -> 155.5%
Insulation - cold: 26.0C * 60% * 180% = 28.08C -> 28.1C
Insulation - heat: 26.0C * 85% * 180% = 39.78C -> 39.8C
HP: 200 * 240% = 480
Price: (80 * 9.00 + 10000 * 0.0036) * 500% = 3780.00


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[zgrssd]

My opinion is that there are still too many types of leather, since several are almost the same and should be combined into one.

I did update the wiki one I noticed those changes in 1.9. See Apparell