RTS type multiplayer for RIMWORLD suggestions.

[keylocke]

first off, my influence for these suggestions are based upon starcraft/warcraft and black&white. so feel free to search the gameplay on youtube if you're interested.

anyways, without further ado..

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my suggestion for multiplayer rimworld is based upon "influence" range.

influence = colony wealth (ie : resource value + structures built value) + colony combat value (ie : total melee & ranged skill + total dps of equipped weapons + total armor value + total bionics value)

when a new multiplayer map is generated (or perhaps premade maps like in RTS games like starcraft) each player faction is spawned somewhere in the map, with each player having access to the same amount of resources nearby. (check starcraft/warcraft and how they strategically distribute minerals and vespene gases across the maps, this can probably be incorporated in the terrain generation algorithm or just create premade maps or the ability to create custom maps)

influence rings are designed to prevent build-mode "griefing", like constructing/deconstructing walls deep inside enemy territory. while a "contested area" is an area where two or more influence rings from different factions are overlapping on top of each other.

griefing is normal strategy in contested areas and the easiest solution is to just attack/sabotage the enemy to lower their influence ring for that area.

edit :

anything within influence range is "actively" viewable through fog-of-war. sending a colonist to scout around the map gives a "passive" view of the area. (active = you can see units/structures/terrain, passive = you can only see terrain) typical RTS fog-of-war feature.

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a steam geyser will serve as the origin point of influence for each colony, so think of steam geysers scattered across the map as power node/control points that can eventually be captured by any colony by placing a steam generator on top of it. this allows players to create annex bases that are outside of their main base's influence rings. (steam generators are the only structures you can build outside of your influence ring. however, it can only be placed on top of an unoccupied steam geyser)

annex bases are counted as a separate colony belonging to the same faction. in the overview, you can assign which colonists are part of which colony. and each colony generates it's own influence ring and operates separately. (ie : colonists from colony 1 will not haul/take stuff from colony 2's stockpile and vice versa)

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the rest of it plays like how RTS games normally play + how rimworld normally plays.

so, there will be random raider/mechs attacking at random,  crashed spacers, animal psychic waves, etc.. loads of fun. 

i think a rimworld multiplayer can easily redefine how people think about RTS games. it's gonna be totally badass.

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edit :

[bullwinkle]

That's a good idea, but how do you incorporate "pause", "fast forward" into multiplayer? Also, If anyone plays like me, I tend to take a few real life days to play a colony and not a few hours. Just wondering how that would impact multiplayer? Not trying to bash or anything just curious. I would enjoy multiplayer if it was co op but that's just my 2 cents.

You also have the issue of players using mods, which i would assume would cause compatibility issues between the two or more players.

[keylocke]

sorry for the late reply, kinda busy here.

anyways, as for your question, i was just thinking of using the same standards as most multiplayer RTS games. pause and other time controls are only for single-player campaigns. mods can be used, but every player for that session must have the same mods active. (not that hard to enable/disable mods anyways)

so for example : a player hosts the game and posted on the server list, clicking on info button can show what mods (or no mods) are to be expected to be active/inactive to join that host.

perhaps people can also post their preferred schedules. so the format could be something like this

ie: (edit : added max amount of players expected and the total of players already in queue)

host name / session name / mods list / 3 players out of 5 slots / game span total of 3 days, 4 hrs each day, starts at 8 PST, ends at 12 PST

this allows people to coordinate games that could last for days or even weeks. so there's no need to rush a game session.

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edit : the game span total is arbitrary. the host can expand this indefinitely whenever necessary. it mostly just hints on whether the host is expecting a fast "blitzkrieg" game or a prolonged campaign.

so an example of a blitzkrieg schedule could be : game span total of 1 day, 3 hrs each day, 2 players out of 3 slots, starts at X PST, ends at Y PST.

and so on and so forth..

[Coenmcj]

For the pause/fastforward etc. you could do something such as DEFCON's time controls, whereas the slowest player's speed is the speed everyone goes at, so if said player decides to go to fast forward where everyone else is set at, the game is set to fast forward until someone pauses or drops back to regular speed.

However if one was to do it like this I would probably not have the pause function as part of it, Increases the micro-skills needed and whatnot.

[keylocke]

yea. the DEFCON time controls is a good suggestion. it would be cool if tynan can pull it off smoothly and keep the framerates decent. but if not, then i guess it would be more simple to just remove the time controls for multiplayer.

i think it's fine either way. whichever option works best for rimworld.

[TomZabMoo]

I believe that with this one.
Of course, I usually find it very difficult to do this.

[keylocke]

er.. anyways.

now that ownership is getting more fleshed out for A8. i was thinking of having functions for "dynamic ownership" of structures/stockpiles between factions.

to illustrate :



the stockpile and the wall in the contested area was created by Faction A.

however, due to "reasons" (colonist death, sabotage, etc) Faction A's influence has grown smaller and has been encroached by Faction B's influence.

what does this mean? :
-the ownership of the parts of the wall that are inside the contested area now belongs to both Factions, even if it was Faction A that originally built it. which means that Both Factions can order it to get deconstructed, etc..
-"energy leech" tactics can also be employed inside contested areas connected to an energy grid. this tactic can be used to drain an outpost's energy reserves and disable their turrets.
-as for stockpiles that are inside contested areas or shared areas (shared areas : are areas that are inside the influence range of different outposts from the same faction). the owner of the stockpile is also shared. that means both factions/outpost can haul/take from that stockpile or disable/modify it as they see fit.
-edit : ownership of turrets inside contested territory is also shared. that means it will not attack both factions that owns it.

this is why expanding your influence range while lowering the influence range of your enemies is paramount to victory, since the bigger your influence range the more area you got for construction and the bigger buffer you have against enemy "encroachment tactics".

edit : however, be aware that the bigger your colony wealth, raiders become more likely to attack it.

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as for active and passive views :
-i added a colonist's active view range to illustrate, that anything within a faction's influence and their colonist's view range, is considered as "active views" (players can see structures, pawns, items, etc..).
-in passive views : you can only see terrain. that's why you need to send out scouts or build more outposts to expand your active views, so you get a better view of the "events" that are happening around you.

[Halinder]

Shared ownership of turrets is iffy, but shared ownership of stockpiles is downright exploit territory. If one faction keeps turning 'medicine' on for example, the other faction misses this and a colonist ends up picking up some medicine and handing it over to the enemy. Perhaps make contested areas 'allowed' or 'disallowed', in that if they are disallowed non-militarized colonists will seek to evade that area constantly.

Also, what's to keep people from walling off all areas save for that facing the enemy faction, forcing raiders to attack them?

[keylocke]

Q : Shared ownership of turrets is iffy, but shared ownership of stockpiles is downright exploit territory. If one faction keeps turning 'medicine' on for example, the other faction misses this and a colonist ends up picking up some medicine and handing it over to the enemy. Perhaps make contested areas 'allowed' or 'disallowed', in that if they are disallowed non-militarized colonists will seek to evade that area constantly.

A : shared ownership only applies to "contested areas" (a contested area is an area that's within the influence of 2 or more Factions.) think of this as a "warzone" area. so yea, griefing tactics are totally expected in these areas if the factions occupying the contested area are enemies. (think of palestine and israel borders)

area types :

-your faction's influence range area for an outpost (you can only build within this area. in the picture, it's the huge circle originating from the steam gen)
-enemy's influence range area for their outpost (enemies can only build within this area)
-contested area (areas within the influence range of different factions. different factions that occupy this area, shares ownership of structures/stockpiles within this area)
-shared area (areas within the influence range of different outposts from the same faction)
-neutral area (areas outside the influence range of any faction)

edit : even though you can only build within your influence range. your colonists are free to wander off the entire map, so they can attack and harass enemy outposts.

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Q: Also, what's to keep people from walling off all areas save for that facing the enemy faction, forcing raiders to attack them?

A : each faction can only build within their own influence range. (see pictures) they cannot "wall off all areas" unless they can increase their influence range to occupy "all areas".

also..

-influence range size formula is : colony wealth + colony combat value (see first post) : that means destroying structures, killing members of that colony, and stealing valuable items from their stockpiles, will decrease the size of their influence range.

-raiders will also prioritize attacking the wealthiest colony so : if you build your colony wealth too high, then more raiders will attack you. and if your structures and colonists are killed/destroyed, this will make your influence range smaller. so nope, it's practically impossible to increase a faction's influence range to occupy  "all areas" and wall off the entire map.

[Anduin1357]

Let us not try to change Rimworld into an RTS, It would be plain stupid to change what is designed solely for a completely different purpose.
I made a suggestion on https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=8891.0 that may suit this thread better.

[Professor Cupcake]

It sounds like you want to turn Rimworld into a competitive RTS.

I could not be more against this idea.

[Anduin1357]

It sounds like you want to turn Rimworld into a competitive RTS.

I could not be more against this idea.

Why? Expand your points and be constructive. Being against my idea is meaningless, placing (valid) points on the table is.

[arodian]

I would prefer co-op so that a friend and I could manage the same colony.

[Anduin1357]

Frankly, congrats to you. You have changed the topic from RTS to Management game issue.
Try to be on topic with your reasons.
btw, I am not *even* trying to make Rimworld a competitive RTS, I'm just merely expanding the game into multiplayer mode.
Fact is, you can then use any mod you like on the game so long as you are allowed to change the gameworld mod list.
Whatever genre you want to make it into is up to you.

[Syvera]

I agree that turning Rimworld as a whole into an RTS would ruin the existing games charm, because it already has a great system. However, having an alternative RTS-based game MODE as an option would be great! I grew up playing RTS games, so I do have a soft spot for them. It would be VERY interesting to see a faster paced, larger scale RTS mode. Roll some tanks out of war factories and have colonists drive them! Call in tactical air strikes! You know those Ocean biomes that arent currently used? Naval warfare anyone? Who knows! It is an awesome concept worth pondering, and if it isn't something that would ever be implemented, i'm certain it will be produced as a mod.

At any rate, I fully support this idea.