"Construction failed" is getting ridiculous now

Started by Listy, June 04, 2017, 05:40:18 AM

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Perq

Quote from: Seriously Unserious on June 05, 2017, 12:17:00 PM
Quote from: Perq on June 05, 2017, 07:25:13 AM
Which is left to RNG. :V

Being stoned, sure. Poisoning, yeah. But missing an eye is hardly enough of a reason to FAIL building a brick wall. :P Especially given how frequent it is, recently.
More so - poisoning and being stoned are pretty temporary statuses that can be dealt with quickly. If you notice your builder being poisoned, you can stop him from building for the time being (and potentially wasting tons of resources).
If your builder lose an eye in the middle of the game, and then game decides to not spawn an bionic eye on vendors for ages, you are pretty much fighting a war of frustration.

Might be A17 tendency to cut off things, tho. I mean, survival rifle is capable of shooting of an arm with a single shot.
Fingers are flying left and right. Missing eyes, ears and noses are almost natural state of every pawn. :@
At this point I'd prefer to pawns simply die more, really.
There is a mod, I think called "Advanced Prosthetics" which allows you to build more advanced prosthetic parts, including bionic eyes. You have to put in extra research and build a more advanced prosthetics bench to be able to do them, so there is an added cost to gaining this ability to balance it out. I've been using this mod right from the start of my Rimworld adventures and it's a godsend, especially if missing body parts are more common then in the past.

I've been using this mod, but there is one thing that I don't like about that mod - the extra resource added. I think I've seen other mod which doesn't add anything like that, but I lost it somewhere. :P
I'm nobody from nowhere who knows nothing about anything.
But you are still wrong.

hoffmale

Quote from: Listy on June 06, 2017, 03:55:24 AM
Quote from: eadras on June 05, 2017, 12:06:59 PM
Checked a few of my healthy constructors' success rates.  Skill 13 was 100%, skill 5 was 93%.  So yeah, the issue the OP seems to be having is the weighting of manipulation, sight, and consciousness into the failure rate.  That's a valid argument, especially given how easily and frequently fingers and eyes are damaged in A17.

I think the issue here is failure rate. I mean the Screen shot I posted earlier, two builders with a failure rate of 90% and 93% building a 17 tile long wall and they failed six or so times. That looks like there's something messed up in the code.

Guess I'll have to test it.
6 failures over 17 tiles (assuming no retries) with a 90% construction success rate should happen in around 2.34% of all cases (if my math is correct), so it's definitely plausible (especially with such a low sample size).

The screenshot in that post only shows 5 failures, assuming no retries on failure that works out to a chance of around 5.75%.

Those numbers (5 or 6 out of 17) don't feel like a 90% success rate, but it's possible that these results are just a stroke of bad luck.

Antaios

Quote from: Perq on June 06, 2017, 04:21:34 AM
I've been using this mod, but there is one thing that I don't like about that mod - the extra resource added. I think I've seen other mod which doesn't add anything like that, but I lost it somewhere. :P

EPOE is the mod I see mentioned most often, and it doesn't add any 'resources', everything gets made from vanilla stuff. Maybe that's what you're thinking of?

One idea is to make the construction skill based success chance go above 100% before the manipulation and sight modifications are added.

So 5 skill is 93%, 10 or so is 100% (or wherever it hits 100% currently), but skills like 15 go up to 120%, 20 would be something in the realm of 150-200%.

Then you add the manipulation and sight modifiers, so if your constructor only has one eye, for instance, the value goes to 90% at 10, but at skill 15, its still at 108%.

Then you just cap it at 100% (since 118% chance to succeed makes no sense), after the modifiers.

Modo44

Quote from: YokoZar on June 05, 2017, 04:46:56 AM
Vision and manipulation should probably affect construction speed, not success chance.
Exactly. Skill can then limit what a pawn can build at all, like it already does with many advanced crafting bills.

hoffmale

Quote from: YokoZar on June 05, 2017, 04:46:56 AM
Vision and manipulation should probably affect construction speed, not success chance.
They already do affect both speed and chance.

Funny trivia: Even a totally blind colonist with no arms can still have up to 49% construction chance (he just can't build anything...). Give him 1% manipulation, and he can build something with a chance of up to 49.21% (depending on skill level), but it will take him ages to do so (125 times as long as if he were completely healthy).