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Author Topic: New wealth system in B19  (Read 9646 times)

BLACK_FR

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New wealth system in B19
« on: September 01, 2018, 01:16:15 PM »

In bug section Tynan said that wealth system (and raid strength) was changed (at least there was added threshold for wealth of buildings). Does anyone know how this new system works? Only information that I have is here https://rimworldwiki.com/wiki/Raider .
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bbqftw

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #1 on: September 01, 2018, 02:13:22 PM »

https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=43206.msg427423#msg427423

good discussion here, with the code analysis

basically - pawn contribution to raid point is now dependent on wealth, bionics + flooring now counts, release-capable animals get additional raid point contribution. Also, on merciless, the lowered raid strength you get from suffering downs/deaths has been severely blunted.

Its kind of funny, I and some other players actually thought you went overkill on wealth control in b18, but it turns out with b19 its more important than ever. You were a prophet in that regard!
« Last Edit: September 01, 2018, 02:24:02 PM by bbqftw »
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BLACK_FR

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #2 on: September 01, 2018, 03:40:23 PM »

Surprised that someone still remember my post about naked brutality that included wealth control.
I thought it would be fun to do it in b19 because there were quite a lot of changes.

I read that discussion. So wealth before 14k is not considered at all, after 14k it starts to affect raids. Guess I should remove and sell all floors when I'm near 14k).

Regarding maximum wealth control. I used it just because it's an easiest way to play on Naked Brutality on merciless. May be it's the only way)
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MarvinKosh

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #3 on: September 01, 2018, 03:50:38 PM »

If you don't like the vanilla threat points system, I have a mod called Combat Readiness Check that you could try.

BLACK_FR

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #4 on: September 01, 2018, 05:34:01 PM »

Thank you for information but it seems to me that your mode makes raids easier overall (even though I really like idea not to count disabled pawns into raid strength). And as you can guess that if I play on naked brutality on merciless with most of the good events disabled then I search for as hard challenge that I can think of.
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zizard

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #5 on: September 01, 2018, 06:16:04 PM »

Regarding maximum wealth control. I used it just because it's an easiest way to play on Naked Brutality on merciless. May be it's the only way)

It's the only way to play extreme at all now, along with having low colonist count. Less than 10 colonists + wealth control makes extreme more like medium.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2018, 06:29:43 PM by zizard »
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MarvinKosh

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #6 on: September 01, 2018, 10:00:04 PM »

Thank you for information but it seems to me that your mode makes raids easier overall (even though I really like idea not to count disabled pawns into raid strength). And as you can guess that if I play on naked brutality on merciless with most of the good events disabled then I search for as hard challenge that I can think of.

I wouldn't say it was easier, just finely tuned.

It means that (for example) you can spend less time thinking about how to minimise your wealth, and more on actually fighting the raids that the system generates.

It also has mod options that can be adjusted to make things harder.

vampiresoap

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #7 on: September 02, 2018, 06:41:28 PM »

Hey guys, can you please link the previous discussion of wealth control here? I'm super curious to know how that's done.
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BLACK_FR

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #8 on: September 04, 2018, 01:36:24 PM »

https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=41992 (I played Naked Brutality on max difficulty before it became one of default scenarios. I even disabled some of events to make it more brutal (no wandere join in, chased refugee, self-tame, farm animal joins or resource pod crash).
It's for b18 so some advices from my collection are not relevant for b19 (shooting training for example), some aspects were rebalanced and were made more difficult (which is good!).
But I just started new game on merciless naked brutality with disabled good incidents above and using that knowledge I'm doing just fine in my second run (first run I checked how wooden traps work and 1 attacking pirate went over all of them and killed my only pawn; only steel traps in the future).
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bbqftw

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #9 on: September 04, 2018, 04:44:59 PM »

Wonder what your thoughts are on using dead guy power armor, since mood punishment is now -5.

Manhunter now requires a little brain to deal with since they can run through door if incautious.

I think shooting training is actually easier if time isn't a concern (hunting xp is buffed, though admittedly you can't farm manhunter with ease anymore. Keep in mind xp gain now scaled to weapon stats so sniper will give more xp per shot than autopistol) and we are in no rush, so who cares about time inefficiency anyways.

If you care about fast shooting xp, can fight infestations.

Feels like some of the worst things you can do this patch is accept a subpar pawn because you got impatient, since the per pawn raid point contribution is now dependent on wealth, and in general scales much harder than the flat contribution from b18
« Last Edit: September 04, 2018, 04:54:32 PM by bbqftw »
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BLACK_FR

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #10 on: September 05, 2018, 04:30:25 AM »

I basically used dead's man armor all the game (from vests to power armor). Specifically because of wealth management.
You can control mood easily, -5 debuff is nothing, you wear armor only for fights, you can use mood buffers for that time, so dead's man armor is a way to go.

I didn't saw changes to shooting yet, is hunting the best safe way to go now?
Also I DO care about time, it's always an issue. If you are doing shooting training you are NOT doing some other useful stuff. So efficiency matters (in real life to, by the way).

I was very picky in the b18 about new pawns (accepted only two before made ship and flew away), no reason to change that habit.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2018, 04:32:44 AM by BLACK_FR »
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zizard

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #11 on: September 05, 2018, 03:17:35 PM »

Wearing armour only for fights is a bit harder now that the time to equip was increased a lot.
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vampiresoap

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #12 on: September 05, 2018, 03:23:47 PM »

Wearing armour only for fights is a bit harder now that the time to equip was increased a lot.

Also, too much micro for my taste. I play games to relax, not to agitate myself lol
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bbqftw

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2018, 08:20:34 PM »

I basically used dead's man armor all the game (from vests to power armor). Specifically because of wealth management.
You can control mood easily, -5 debuff is nothing, you wear armor only for fights, you can use mood buffers for that time, so dead's man armor is a way to go.

I didn't saw changes to shooting yet, is hunting the best safe way to go now?
Also I DO care about time, it's always an issue. If you are doing shooting training you are NOT doing some other useful stuff. So efficiency matters (in real life to, by the way).

I was very picky in the b18 about new pawns (accepted only two before made ship and flew away), no reason to change that habit.
but really what is 'useful'?

Besides stuff that is survival critical and periodic (food), stuff that progresses you combat-wise in a way that justifies wealth increase (dead guys armor), and research (which you are not penalized in terms of raid point), there's no rush to really do anything.

With your wealth control tactics properly applied, merciless raids are far, far less scary than wealth uncontrolled games, so there's not a huge amount of pressure on that axis either.
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BLACK_FR

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Re: New wealth system in B19
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2018, 03:24:04 PM »

Wearing armour only for fights is a bit harder now that the time to equip was increased a lot.

I'll see how it goes. Basically when any fighting event is started I hit pause and start micromanaging. I don't know if it will be enough.

Also, too much micro for my taste. I play games to relax, not to agitate myself lol

Then Naked Brutality on Merciless is not best option for you) But even on lower diffuculties I think it's good idea to micromanage fights because consequences are so much higher.

but really what is 'useful'?

Besides stuff that is survival critical and periodic (food), stuff that progresses you combat-wise in a way that justifies wealth increase (dead guys armor), and research (which you are not penalized in terms of raid point), there's no rush to really do anything.

With your wealth control tactics properly applied, merciless raids are far, far less scary than wealth uncontrolled games, so there's not a huge amount of pressure on that axis either.

First of all, every raid has a chance to screw you. Even if you are fully prepared there is always a chance that something goes wrong. Also there can be conjunction of events that will lead to your end.
Secondly, there is ramping of raids with the time.
Thirdly, there are always things you need asap for you survival. You need complex clothing and furniture, you need penoxyline, you need to tame and train animals (for fighting purposes), you need to make outer wall, you need to make your defences ready, you need to be ready for the AI quest (b18), you need to make decent guns for mechs and sieges, you need armor to reduce chance of random deaths (vests and advanced helmets that are not masterwork or legendary are good even if they are not from deadman), you need turrets in mid- and lategame, you need to make money for neirotamine and for the materials, you need to acquire tons of materials for ship and other purposes and you need to make advanced components.
So there is a lot to do.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2018, 03:32:02 PM by BLACK_FR »
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If you have idea how make merciless naked brutality run more challenging and fun - tell me
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