Unstable build feedback thread

[Gfurst]

Regarding the multianalyzer, remember that this is something unaffected by difficulty settings, and so you have to treat this in a more casual way.  It is a bit too hardcore to lock out someone playing on basebuilder from most of the research tree for a potentially very long time.  So I consider it a good change.

Not sure where you're finding all these advanced components. I've never seen a single one even on my colonies that have made it an entire year ( I restart a lot, trying different stuff.) I think that was a good change.

Like it was said, you can get one easy from mechanoids ships (and maybe disassembly). One year is indeed way too early, unless you're beelining for the higher techs. Besides mechs, I'm pretty sure you can get them other ways, like trades and quests.

In fitness there is something people call "ego lifting", that is the act of lifting more weights than you should, while sacrificing proper form and repetitions, possibly leading to injury. This is kinda the same as "ego playing", that is to play something on the hardest difficulty just because you think you can do it.

That's pretty disingenuous.  There's a difference between loading one plate too many and the machine electrocuting you when you sit down.  If the game is lifting weights, you expect to lift weights, not to wear insulation/run a marathon/engage in underwater horseback riding.

Same goes with Rimworld.  Events that are the gym equivalent of a dude running up and belly flopping onto the bar while you're trying to do bench press are out of place.  That's not the kind of game Rimworld is .

But it is, you shouldn't be going into the higher difficulty expecting to have a grand'ol time. People playing on normal difficulties are already under constant threat of something going awfully wrong, and not only that there are degrees of difficulty, but you shouldn't be going into the worst possible difficulty settings, on the worse possible biome, with the worse starting conditions, and expecting anything but dread. And I can see how some people will like playing the game this way, but just don't go higher difficulty just because its there, pick something you will actually enjoy.

[x7GoSu]

On my current start of naked brutality day 6 of Cass/Hard a refugee was chased in incapable of violence. Raider spawned in with a normal flak vest plainleather pants and patched leather cowboyhat/buttondown shirt. I had a short bow and some regular clothing taken from a previous raid. Took close to 20 mins IRL of kiting trying to kill this guy. The flak has 100% sharp protection. I'm assuming that's what kept this guy alive for so long. I saved before the raid and replayed it a 5 times. Each time taking roughly the same amount time. Although I lost once due to a misclick and another time due to hitting an emu and it going manhuter on me lol. Some other things I've noted is that the passive cooler still says it will vanish after several days which is no longer the case. None of the power generators list their output. As a "new player" I would like to know their output w/o having to build each one. Also with gutworms (or any disease) possibly showing the info about treatmeants until healed, so new players don't feel like "is this crap ever going to go away" and they have a sense of making progress toward it.

[Lanilor]

I like how you simplified the leather system, but I think I would actually preffer having just 4 types - light, medium, hard and humanoid. The leathers are still too many (for my taste) and clutter the stockpile unnecesarily.

I also dont see why we shouldnt have just three types of meat - animal meat, human meat and insectoid meat. It would again reduce the amount of clutter in stockpiles and simplify our lives on the Rim. If you want to have more types of meat for feeding the animals, you could make a bill in the butchering table that would make meat just for animal consumption.

If something like this is changed, please do it as a pre-game choice in the options, maybe require a custom scenario option, 'simple leather', 'simple meat', like Masterwork Dwarf Fortress does.

I like the variety, and the different types of leather and so on. I like the blue fur flavor.. homogenization is anti-fun. I like having a large stockpile and seeing all the different material types.

Also, perhaps let pawns use multiple leather types for one clothing piece?

You can craft patchwork leather (or how it is called now) at the tailor bench. Using multiple leathers would be too complicated and negates the use of patchwork leather as a mixed but weaker type.

Otherwise I agree with you. A bit abstrahation like the lightleather and plainleather are nice to keep quantity down, but variety is nice and gives it more depth. I think the current leather system is ok It could be a few less, but it doesn't have to. Something like this for meat would be nice. Like we have birdmeat and in addition to that there could be a meat type for small game like squirrels and rats, maybe even raccons and so on. Just to get a number of roughly around 10 or 15 different type sounds fine.

Btw, I like the new fixed faction colors on the world map. It's just a minor detail, but it was a bit annoying when the random generator picked almost similar colors for different factions.

[Serina]

On my current start of naked brutality day 6 of Cass/Hard a refugee was chased in incapable of violence. Raider spawned in with a normal flak vest plainleather pants and patched leather cowboyhat/buttondown shirt. I had a short bow and some regular clothing taken from a previous raid. Took close to 20 mins IRL of kiting trying to kill this guy. The flak has 100% sharp protection. I'm assuming that's what kept this guy alive for so long. I saved before the raid and replayed it a 5 times. Each time taking roughly the same amount time. Although I lost once due to a misclick and another time due to hitting an emu and it going manhuter on me lol. Some other things I've noted is that the passive cooler still says it will vanish after several days which is no longer the case. None of the power generators list their output. As a "new player" I would like to know their output w/o having to build each one. Also with gutworms (or any disease) possibly showing the info about treatmeants until healed, so new players don't feel like "is this crap ever going to go away" and they have a sense of making progress toward it.

Yeah, I was surprised after crafting my first pieces of flak armor. Didn't expect it to have so much sharp armor %. Of course after crafting 3 sets, I got a pirate raid of 18 people vs my 5 guys. I kind of chose to get raided since I gave safe haven to one of my colonist's mother (she was a refugee asking for help through the radio). No casualties, so the flak vest and pants seem pretty useful. I only had to kill about 8 raiders before the rest ran away, which was nice. I chased down 2 more raiders out of spite and killed them before they ran off the map. 

Lol, you hit an emu during fighting and it went manhunter? That's pretty funny. Power generators listing their output before it's built would be very handy. Same with gutworms treatment info. When I first started playing rimworld, I had quite a few browsers opened for rimworld wiki and alt tabbed a lot during gameplay just to search for something that didn't have the info I was wondering about in game. It's not too big of a deal for me since I'm used to doing so from previous games anyway but it would be a nice addition.

[ReZpawner]

Can we get like an animal shrink or something to stop by? Every two minutes, another animal goes nuts. I'm starting to get worried about their mental health.

[Greep]

Had another raid, 8 gun raiders vs 4 my guys in steel/plasteel with plasteel gladiuses.  Repelled, but two guy kidnapped.  I didn't really use any strategy other than surprise jumping them, although it was raining.  I think crafting uber plasteel armor made the raid unusually big, though.

It still kind of feels like bruising is too strong: You're going to be dumping 2k+ steel/plasteel into gear, which means you're not going to have much in the way of security or tech.  I think at the very least you should be able to easily repel the first couple raids thrown at you, even using no strategy at all, snice you're set back a lot.

Upon thinking about this further, I think a good balance would be to have the adjusted armor after weapons subtract from bruising chance.  Something like, 100% - the adjusted amount/1.5

E.g.  if you have 90% sharp resist, and someone attacks you with something that has 30% piecing, you'd have a 100 - (90-30)/1.5 = 60% chance of bruising on deflection.  This counters the somewhat silly situation of revolvers bruising you always with high end plasteel plate.  Or perhaps just reducing said bruising damage rather than as a chance of bruising or not.

Ultimately a more effective strategy is having enemies shoot at a turret while you snipe them at range and repair your turret behind a wall, so it's not like this would be powerful anyways. 

Plate with current bruising balancing would probably just have a niche role of repelling melee tribal swarms or something, although they tend to have a lot of blunt.  And probably decent for early caravans.

Anyways, I think I've got a good feel for banzai attacking.  I'll check out the autoturrets now.

[Robc]

@1.0 standard scenario, Cassandra "rough"  re: taming regression experience

Had a polar bear and wolf go wild on me in tundra in middle of first winter, ok, those little emergencies are exactly what keeps this game interesting.  I applaud that the animal tame regress mechanic now provides for overall better game balance. I thought perhaps rescuing and then feeding them after I downed them would give me a chance to retame.  No luck.  Two less mouths to feed and a little more meat on the table then I guess. 

The sad part was that before going feral they were very well fed in an otherwise completely barren environment.  After going wild they were starving and stalked my pawns rather than take a little hand out food.  I never had a chance to even try to tame them again, they were too ravenous and just attacked the nearest pawns.  I think a higher chance to revert back to tamed should be considered after going wild.  If they keep their per pawn social preference stats after reverting to wild then a previous well loved master approaching with food should quickly bring them back into the fold imo.  Next time I might also try leaving some meat on the doorstep until they are less ravenous and less likely to attack first... learning by experience, the gold standard for RW.  I still hope the animals retrain somewhat easier then a fully wild animal, perhaps that is already incorporated and working as designed.  I thought the story worth relating.

Love the game, particularly the difficulty, don't love everything about 1.0 but on whole it is going in right direction, same comment on recent adjustments.  Thank you!

[TheMeInTeam]

But it is, you shouldn't be going into the higher difficulty expecting to have a grand'ol time. People playing on normal difficulties are already under constant threat of something going awfully wrong, and not only that there are degrees of difficulty, but you shouldn't be going into the worst possible difficulty settings, on the worse possible biome, with the worse starting conditions, and expecting anything but dread. And I can see how some people will like playing the game this way, but just don't go higher difficulty just because its there, pick something you will actually enjoy.

Always good advice to play where you enjoy...but I actually *like* playing around raid sizes of 15+ by 5501, or floundering trying to live 3 vs 8.  The complaints in this thread weren't about that, but rather about pure RNG death...which has subsequently been largely mitigated in the 1.0 iterations following.

In essence, it's fine to punish someone for loading too many weights, but that game should still be about lifting.  In Rimworld, your outcomes are almost solely contingent on how well you prepare before events and how well you execute during them.  Even when it's unfair.  Even when the smallest mistake can end your run. 

In this regard, stuff that TRULY kills you or punishes you without counterplay is extremely rare and runs counter to 99% of what makes up playing Rimworld.  There is almost always a way out, had you prepared in advance.  The argument before was more "the game tells you not to push for the ideal pawn, but some of these new implementations require that"...Tynan acknowledged this and tuned the game.

Basically, if you die it's your fault again, and that's the way it should be .

The principle misconception is that lack of agency = challenge.  It's the opposite: lack of agency is a skill equalizer and antithetical to challenge.  Challenge arises when the agency you do have is non-trivial to identify and/or execute.

[fritzgryphon]

Bug:  Turbulence penalty from other watermill persists after the interfering watermill is removed.

[Teleblaster18]

Subjective impressions of last night's gameplay (NB/Boreal Forest/Cassandra Rough - completed game Year 1 into Year 2):

-Having Non-Tribal Outlander factions being Hostile with each other is great for memorable events in a way that I don't remember B18 being;  I had two factions with Caravans show up almost simultaneously, and had an unexpected firefight with each other.  One faction guard was toting an Incendiary Launcher, and lit parts of my 2-Pawn Base on fire...hilarity ensued.

The final casualty toll was 7 dead Faction members from both sides, 2 wounded (who were from the same faction - these were patched up, and faction relations improved), with tons of dropped loot from both caravans. 

A note about this: grabbing the dropped weaponry they left upgraded my ranged capability in a way that I probably wouldn't have been able to do for at least another 2 game years at my current tech/research rate.  I went from 2 Short Bows to enough Chain/Pump Shotguns, Machine Pistols and Incendiaries (Molotovs and Launchers) to equip an 8-Pawn Colony.  I'm not complaining, and will happily accept the upgrade...it just felt like something for nothing:  I saved my wooden base and crops from burning down, and got an unexpected and significant windfall of material and weaponry.



-The map on my biome is *loaded* with predators...more than I've ever seen in B18: I love this. At one point, I think there were 3 Grizzlies, 2 Wargs, 2 Lynxes, and at least another 2-3 Wolves on the map (a Warg and a Lynx both attempted to hunt my colonists when I got careless, and forgot to check the map beforehand for danger).

An observation: it feels like Predators are dying of infection too easily.  I just completed my first game year, and didn't have to hunt for food once:  I scavanged the dead bodies of animals exclusively to survive the first winter, and a significant, maybe even a majority amount were large predators who died of infections from their hunts.  The result is that I have a substantial surplus of meat, and a surplus of leathers/furs for extreme temperatures.  Even if my colony size increases from 2 to 6 very rapidly, no one is going to starve for a while...and, most significantly, there was very little to no risk involved.

None of these are complaints in any way: just observations about how gameplay feels up to this point.  I'm having a blast with this current game.  And I still have only 4 Herbal Medicine.

[klun]

Randy/extreme swamp biome - Rich explorer

hostiles Pawns moving at same speed no matter the tile /marsh - Even when I was walking for the path and they were chassing me

Ancient cryptobasket with a hive inside  megaspider pretty much ignored the slaves pawn inside (1 was dead ,1 downed the other one escaped)

Since now we have the armor system / it would be kind of nice to have a more dynamic stats for weapons/armors defletc- perhaps as your shoooting skills advance or with some advance helmets

so far 3 raids and Im still alive,I report later perhaps with some new armor/turret feedback.

[NagashUD]

Hmmmm my dog got the plague, and i can't use first aid until the dog goes to the animal bed; what i mean is it loses so much time before i can treat the dog. Maybe  an action "goes to your bed" (being the owner of the dog could be an idea) could fix some pets problems ?

[attachment deleted due to age]

[Teleblaster18]

Hmmmm my dog got the plague, and i can't use first aid until the dog goes to the animal bed; what i mean is it loses so much time before i can treat the dog. Maybe  an action "goes to your bed" (being the owner of the dog could be an idea) could fix some pets problems ?

I've yet to tame my first animal in 1.0, but the old solution to this was to set up a medical bill for that animal (Anesthetize), and then order a pawn to take it to an Animal Bed/Sleeping spot so the animal would stop walking around.  You'd then cancel the "Anesthetize" order on the Medical Bill, and order a colonist to treat the now-stationary animal.  My guess is that this would still work with 1.0.

[Crow_T]

Some random thoughts:
Legendary/Masterwork change is good IMO, logic behind it is sound.

Animals: I feel as though the different training categories could have different variables. Obedience could fade away slowest and/or only require trainer time* as opposed to food. The other categories would require food/ more upkeep. Perhaps a system where animals with multiple skills, or each more important skill, requires a higher level trainer.

* have animal play time as both a joy source and obedience recharge.

[Crow_T]

Some random thoughts:
Legendary/Masterwork change is good IMO, logic behind it is sound.

Animals: I feel as though the different training categories could have different variables. Obedience could fade away slowest and/or only require trainer time* as opposed to food (play experience- early food going to starting animals for training is a bit rough). The other categories would require food/ more upkeep. Perhaps a system where animals with multiple skills, or each more important skill, requires a higher level trainer.

* have animal play time as both a joy source and obedience recharge.