On the upcoming Steam release

[Vas]

In actual sense, Banished wasn't abandoned or anything then. The game was essentially released as a complete state. And since its not a subscription based game or stated as an alpha, the developer had no real obligation to continue working on the game or tweaking it. Therefore, we can't really go out and say that its abandoned or unfinished.

In that sense, I could release a game, promise some things, fail to deliver in time for "release", then abandon the game after I publish it as a 1.0 version, and have no obligation to continue.
KSP did something like this, I'm not sure if they abandon it yet, because it recently happened but the game was still early in alpha with little content, then there was this sudden push from a very early alpha to 1.0 immediately, it's like going from version 0.2 to 1.0 in a single update, then you quit and leave.  That's likely what happened with Banished.

As I stated though, I know that Rimworld, is not one of the games that this will happen to. 

[akiceabear]

I stand by my earlier comment that A11 is worth the money. Also, that if you don't plan on solidly committing to regular updates its best to just go 1.0 now. Delaying 6 months or a year for updates you might make seems silly to me and might not only let your game collect dust before release, but also sour some of the community - regardless of your expectations management. When you go to Steam you should be decisive, either to develop further (in alpha) or release now (with no promises about future development - which doesn't tie your hands if you change your mind).

That said, I do relate with others that the game would be strengthened considerably if more content was added within the existing systems. I don't think more weapons/items are necessary, as I view that as spammy, but more events would enrich the game substantially. There are many threads on this forum and in Reddit, including posts for me, on suggestions, which I'm sure you've thought plenty about yourself.

As others mention, I think ultimately the problem is there is little to differentiate biomes besides reskinned animals and temperatures that tend to be solved pretty quickly, given immediate access to relevant tech. Moreover, the game stabilizes a bit too quickly into a degenerate gameplay - raid after raid as the only real threat/disturbance. As some say with the easiest example, you plant a giant potato field on day 1, build a greenhouse around in on day 60, and then never worry about food again.

There are two "easy" ways to solve this - make the tech progression slower by padding the early and middle game - Superior Crafting does this excellently and after playing a few rounds of vanilla I'm eager to switch to that (although I adored vanilla for many many months!). I wouldn't mind a shift to early colonies being close to imbeciles with regards to available tech. Or 1 initial tech being randomly drawn based on colonist average skills. There are many other approaches in this vein that would help considerably.

The other is to differentiate gameplay throughout the arc of a game with events. For an example of how one event can radically improve the game, see Crash Landing. For me that completely changes the normal boring start to teeth-gritting experience which varies widely on each and every start! And completely shapes the early months of my colony in a deep way! We need many more of those type of story-rich events. There should be a pool of hundreds of events that could fire with probabilities varying based on:
- storyteller
- biome
- time of year
- temperature
- colony time
- faction relations
- terrain type
- rainfall
- colony population
- colony wealth
- skill set within colony
- recent actions of a colony
- etc.
Moreover, the probabilities of these firing should be conditional on multiple factors. This would make the set of events one receives from biome to biome (for example) vary widely, and each playthrough more unique.

In addition to varying inputs to cause an event, events should have a wide range of scale, duration and style (e.g. raid, environmental, within colony, between colony, etc). Ideally combining the input conditions and possible outputs a designer (not player) could see a matrix of all the possible configurations a see that each biome and colony type combination would have a handful of events unique to it, plus others that overlap.

I think the natural response to this is "Yes, that's what the existing game systems are for - to create emergent gameplay across all the variations so I don't have to!". Fair point, but as the systems stand now I think it is still a bit too easy to "wash rinse repeat" strategies (habits), given the one random factor - events - tends to be so consistent game to game. The emergence and mechanics could really shine if there was a deep pool of events to push us players out of our comfort zones, away from our degenerate strategies, and into new territory.

So where does that put you? Again, I think it is fair to release as 1.0 right now - but there are a few suggestions that may line up with your doubts and could help push this game from "worth it" towards "epic":
- Crush out as much content (events, not mechanics) before the vacation - if you are dedicated full time to events (which I assume are mostly self contained), how many could you complete before September?
- Release on Steam now as EA, and contract a top notch modder to populate events full time during your vacation - I know there is a matching/management issue you've mentioned before, but perhaps you could tap some of the existing talent with a short-term contract. I guess this would depend on your expected profit from the Steam release, but my guess is it should be able to cover a contractor for a few months (maybe I'm optimistic) and still be profitable for you. Have that person scheduled to release an ever growing "official" event pack every month during your holiday, and integrate it fully into vanilla upon your return. This at least guarantees a set level of new content will make it more palatable under the Early Access banner (I think), admittedly at some cost to you.
- Release as EA with a event/mod contest - I'm not sure how this would fly with the community, but what about a contest for the best original mod every week with prizes (e.g. $100 per week)? Judging/voting would be an issue (I guess you need at least a handful of trusted community members to moderate entries to avoid dups), but this could also generate good buzz (perhaps). I think this probably isn't good enough on its own, but could perhaps compliment to another option.
- Delay Steam (EA or 1.0) until after your vacation, when your head is clear and you can commit solidly to one path - probably the easiest choice, but it does risk disappointing some of the Steam holdouts and others that you've excited this week with the thought of Workshop integration.

[RickyMartini]

Another option is to just not release on Steam this summer and delay until, say, some time in 2016.

I'm now considering this and would love to hear any thoughts on it. I'll be adding more stuff to the game either way on pretty much the same schedule; it's just about timing and presenting the Steam release the right way.

I don't think you'll have too much problems with negative reviews if you go on vacations right after releasing it on steam. However, if you wan't to complete eradicate criticism, you better go do your vacations and then come back to see if anything has changed in your mind. That's how I see it.

[andyprogrammer]

Thank you so much for a wonderful game, Tynan. I am one person who rarely plays with mods and I've still put in hundreds of hours. I'm also concerned about a Steam release getting too many negative reviews for lack of content and hurting your business long term.

I know that I don't make great decisions when I'm in burnout. I've been there and it's hard to see the forest through all the trees. Mostly I just want it all to be over and done with and move on.

I personally would love to see the modders go crazy with a stable release for six months, then see a release on Steam.

But you've also made much better decisions about rimworld than I would have made, so I will also trust and respect your judgement.

[RickyMartini]

Thank you so much for a wonderful game, Tynan. I am one person who rarely plays with mods and I've still put in hundreds of hours.

I feel you, I ignored most of the mods that changed much and still played solid 200 hours. ^^

[TLHeart]

The backlash Tynan is receiving is being driven by the simple fact that the public will see the release to steam, and then a 6 month vacation as a money grab... true or not. Perception is reality.

Release this rimworld as 1.0, with all the glitches and bugs in the UI, and the reviews will be about how unpolished the UI is, and what does that mean for the game code.  And the UI bugs have been reported and blown off as not important. The mouse focus not working consistently is the largest problem.

from a consumers point of view;

Alpha implies constant updates and added content.

Beta implies updates with balance changes and bug fixes.

Released implies finished game. A great studio releases hotfixes for major problems discovered after release.

Rimworld needs to have the UI bugs fixed. It also has some balance issues that need addressed.  Tynan does not want to add more content at this time, that is his choice.  Any release at this time, with a planned 6 month hiatus will be viewed very negatively.

As is evident in the responses to the blog post, and this thread. And these response are from people who enjoy the game, play the game, and support the game.

[SSS]

Ok. Well we can agree to disagree on this specific point. In any case, I appreciate the thoughts.

at my view, most people mistake "buying into an alpha" for "buying a share". spending the money to a developer and getting into early access does not mean that you buy some power of decision. It's like ordering a dish - if the roundness of a potato does not match to your expectations, you can't blame the cook for chosing it.

If you're implying that's what I think, I don't. I never used the phrase "buying into", and I also made it clear that I wasn't trying to make Tynan do anything. I just believe that releasing a game as an alpha carries an inherent implication that there is meant to be more than there currently is. To the say that you shouldn't buy whilst taking this implication in account is unfair in my opinion: If you could stop developing at any point, then you have no business marketing your game as an alpha in the first place, or, rather, you should be setting an appropriate measure of expectation of the final product so you don't have people who misinterpret any such implication. (Also, personally, I find it mildly surprising if even Tynan thought this was worth $30 back during the early alphas, which is what "you should buy what's in front of you" would imply.)

I'm not trying to vilify Tynan, so please don't try to marginalize me. Thanks.

Edit: To make this more constructive, though I personally have qualms with Tynan calling the game complete now (and therefore preferring that he wait to decide whether to release on Steam until after his break), if he is to release the game on Steam now, I think he would be better off calling it a complete game: If there is any possibility that he will not continue working on the game and it's released as early access, the game will probably garner a poor reputation. If the game should be bought as is, then it should be presented as is.

[TLHeart]

additional thoughts;

What is a story teller? there is NO tag or search on steam for a story teller. What are you competing against? I found rimworld via survival simulation.  Story teller met nothing to me, and still means very little today. It is about growing a survivable community, for as long as possible. The stories that do happen are nice window dressing.

This game will be found on steam from the survival tag, or simulation tag. Both  tags imply the type of game one is purchasing. 

I purchases Banished, for $7.99, which also met my price expectations of a few afternoons of fun, and then on to the next game. I played more than a few afternoons.

Price also sets expectations. And a $30 price sets those expectations high.

Terrira is a fun little game, also with a price point of $10.... Also about survival, and building a base. Can also be played co-op. This is your competition.

Now onto the issue of mods... to the modding community they love to tinker with games, change the game, and have fun programming.

There are consumers that look at a game that is highly modded, as a BAD thing. Means the game is broken, and that the programmer did a horrible job.  Many mods are broken, or so horribly unbalanced as to make the game a horrible experience.

Not saying the base game of rimworld is horrible, far from it, but again talking perception of the every day consumer, that is searching to spend $30, a price point that is HIGH for an indie game. Sets expectations high.

Tynan says the game is  "done". He is satisfied with it. As an alpha game I can agree with that statement. As a beta game, it needs some Tender Loving Care. (balance & bugs)
As a 1.0 release, questionable.

[Vas]

Another option is to just not release on Steam this summer and delay until, say, some time in 2016.

I'm now considering this and would love to hear any thoughts on it. I'll be adding more stuff to the game either way on pretty much the same schedule; it's just about timing and presenting the Steam release the right way.

I don't think you'll have too much problems with negative reviews if you go on vacations right after releasing it on steam. However, if you wan't to complete eradicate criticism, you better go do your vacations and then come back to see if anything has changed in your mind. That's how I see it.

I would rather see the game on steam sooner, and you can use the steam news system to post that you are going on a break and list whatever details you wish to, and it will appear there on the steam library for every user who wants to launch the game so they'll always know and can't claim they didn't know.

These news things also appear on the store page too, so there's that too.

The backlash Tynan is receiving is being driven by the simple fact that the public will see the release to steam, and then a 6 month vacation as a money grab... true or not. Perception is reality.

-- and more stuff --

This is one reason I think it should still be released as an Alpha game, so people can't complain that a "finished game" is "full of bugs" or "feels unfinished".  People pay more attention to news postings on Alpha games too and people also add a game to their wishlist if they'd rather wait till it comes out of Alpha.

[Tynan]

TLH, what UI bugs are you talking about? If you're aware of UI bugs, could you report them? I'm not seeing anything significant in Mantis and I haven't seen anything while playing the game.

--

Thanks for the ongoing responses everyone. I actually may end up just not doing Steam release now and leaving it for next year when I'm back and can be more on top of it. On the one hand, I want to get it done and I also want to provide Steam access for all of you for your convenience. On the other hand, I don't want to harm the game's biggest launch and make it worse than it could be.

Still considering options here.

[JimmyAgnt007]

Personally I would do the steam launch in Early Access.  Let it go for a month.  Then fix all the bugs reported and tweak stuff.  Then release 1.0 and do a bugfix patch a week or so later.  Then take your break.  During the break, Id do some tiny updates so it doesnt seem like its being ignored but mostly enjoy your time off.  After 6 months come back with a bigger update taking care of the things you didnt want to spend the time fixing during your time off and then announce your plans for the future.

[RemingtonRyder]

Well, Steam's auto-update is very useful for making sure that testers are testing using the latest version. Perhaps leave it in testing on Steam, so you can work all the kinks out.

On the other hand, having your own launcher to conveniently supply updates to everyone who's bought a copy would mean you could get that advantage without having to do a Steam release yet.

I mean no offence to Steam, but it's a game launcher and updating tool with a whole bucket of extras. Just need the first two things!

[Cdr.Keen]

[...]

I'm not trying to vilify Tynan, so please don't try to marginalize me. Thanks.

[...]

it wasn't my intention to marginalize anyone, don't take it personal . i just talked about the "trend" many ea titles got to deal with. feel yourself hugged

i also think (and as many wrote) that a steam release at this time will stir up the community. no one of the new users knows about the evolution the game made during last updates. we know that a11 comparing to other alphas is the best so far, but they will see the game only at it's current state and surely cry for more.

[TLHeart]

TLH, what UI bugs are you talking about? If you're aware of UI bugs, could you report them? I'm not seeing anything significant in Mantis and I haven't seen anything while playing the game.

--

Thanks for the ongoing responses everyone. I actually may end up just not doing Steam release now and leaving it for next year when I'm back and can be more on top of it. On the one hand, I want to get it done and I also want to provide Steam access for all of you for your convenience. On the other hand, I don't want to harm the game's biggest launch and make it worse than it could be.

Still considering options here.

Many text box don't have focus, when trying to type into them. a couple of reports below.
https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=1078
https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=1595


Having to click on the UI, then  click again to get it to accept the commands. IE the first mouse click sets the focus to the UI, then I can interact with the UI. Anytime I go to click on menu, it takes two clicks. Same with the architecture menu. Takes two clicks on the reverse designators also.
https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=1923

The drop down of two rows on the trade screen interface after scrolling up or down, reported many times.

here is the first report,
http://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=8241.msg81983#msg81983
Still happens today.
and here it is in mantis https://ludeon.com/mantis/view.php?id=1569
and another thread,
http://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=12895.0

Right click does not respond the first time, takes two right clicks to get the game to respond.

All which you have dismissed since you can not replicate them. But many people see them have, and are just tired of reporting them.

[Tynan]

TL, none of those bugs are "dismissed". All but one are open and in Mantis, which means they're currently competing for my attention with every other Mantis bug and every other feature request or idea ever presented. Just because I didn't fix them yet doesn't mean I never will. If I was never going to fix them I'd close the bugs.

The only one that is closed is the third one reported once by Semmy, who himself said there was no repro. If there is a repro, that's news to me. In that case, please reopen it. That's what I need you testers for.